Post-Game Talk: Blues undefeated no more, Jets win 4-0

[Jetfaninflorida]

Any win is a good win. St Louis looked a bit slower than usual, not sure if they were slow or the Jets just overwhelmed them. Probably somewhere in between.

Kind of reminded me of a game early last season, might have been against Edmonton. Not sure about the team, but it was a dominating win early in the 2021-22 campaign. A very complete game, solid all around. And I remember feeling like the season would be a good one if what I saw that night was the Jets. It wasn't.

I hope I don't have to look back on last nights game the same way next year.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

It's okay to give the guy some credit for having such a solid game. If he can play like that consistently that is a big add for the team.

If it takes playing with DeMelo to get that out of him, that's OK. As long as DeMelo can be spared to play with him. It is the result that counts.

But in evaluating him compared to the alternative it needs to be taken into account. When Samberg is healthy, he needs to be given the same support if we are to choose between the 2.

 

[voyageur]

So when Ehlers comes back does that make Wheeler a little redundant on this team.
Appleton plays well on the 1st. Ehlers on the 2nd. Leave the 3rd line alone and Wheeler doesn’t really fit on the 4th line. All though it would allow Wheeler to eat up lower competition. Would the Jet’s be better without him? Is having Wheeler on the 4th line a luxury we can afford? Can we move him realistically? He has played well but he is being passed by younger cheaper players.

First you have to convince Dan Robertson that Wheeler is not on the ice all the time. At least twice he was talking about Wheeler being out with Scheifele's line, and when the player in question finally did get a touch it was Appleton. 22 and 26 don't look all that similar.

Answer to your question is there is no redundancy on this team. Ehlers goes back to top line, which hopefully would spark Connor. Appleton 3rd line, which is a more suitable role. Gagner 4th line, which offers hope of a 4th line goal.

This is Wheeler's last year, it's rather obvious, let him go out on a strong note. He doesn't even look miserable this year.

 

[Adam da bomb]

First you have to convince Dan Robertson that Wheeler is not on the ice all the time. At least twice he was talking about Wheeler being out with Scheifele's line, and when the player in question finally did get a touch it was Appleton. 22 and 26 don't look all that similar.

Answer to your question is there is no redundancy on this team. Ehlers goes back to top line, which hopefully would spark Connor. Appleton 3rd line, which is a more suitable role. Gagner 4th line, which offers hope of a 4th line goal.

This is Wheeler's last year, it's rather obvious, let him go out on a strong note. He doesn't even look miserable this year.

You don't really need someone to spark KFC, KFC will spark himself. If he is going through a rough stretch that happens. It's better to have Ehlers and KFC on different lines and come at opponents in waves than a super line. Apples is great at puck retreival to get puck to Schief or KFC and better at D than both. He also brings that net presence. Perfetti needs someone who can score to set up.

 

[FlappyGiraffe]

So when Ehlers comes back does that make Wheeler a little redundant on this team.
Appleton plays well on the 1st. Ehlers on the 2nd. Leave the 3rd line alone and Wheeler doesn’t really fit on the 4th line. All though it would allow Wheeler to eat up lower competition. Would the Jet’s be better without him? Is having Wheeler on the 4th line a luxury we can afford? Can we move him realistically? He has played well but he is being passed by younger cheaper players.

Wheeler would absolutely feast on the 4th line. Like 4th line Perreault on steroids

 

[surixon]

First you have to convince Dan Robertson that Wheeler is not on the ice all the time. At least twice he was talking about Wheeler being out with Scheifele's line, and when the player in question finally did get a touch it was Appleton. 22 and 26 don't look all that similar.

Answer to your question is there is no redundancy on this team. Ehlers goes back to top line, which hopefully would spark Connor. Appleton 3rd line, which is a more suitable role. Gagner 4th line, which offers hope of a 4th line goal.

This is Wheeler's last year, it's rather obvious, let him go out on a strong note. He doesn't even look miserable this year.

Not that I disagree with your roster configuration but Blake still has another year on his deal after this one. So I don't see him going anywhere unless a team will pay Chevy's asking price or Blake retires.

 

[sipowicz]

First you have to convince Dan Robertson that Wheeler is not on the ice all the time. At least twice he was talking about Wheeler being out with Scheifele's line, and when the player in question finally did get a touch it was Appleton. 22 and 26 don't look all that similar.

Answer to your question is there is no redundancy on this team. Ehlers goes back to top line, which hopefully would spark Connor. Appleton 3rd line, which is a more suitable role. Gagner 4th line, which offers hope of a 4th line goal.

This is Wheeler's last year, it's rather obvious, let him go out on a strong note. He doesn't even look miserable this year.

Sadly its not Wheezers last year, Jets have this flailing senior locked up until the end of 24'!

You could have two decent players in the lineup with his ridiculous contract!

Blake Wheeler | NHL | Spotrac.com

Blake Wheeler contract and salary cap details, full contract breakdowns, salaries, signing bonus, roster bonus, dead money, and valuations.

www.spotrac.com

 

[KingBogo]

If it takes playing with DeMelo to get that out of him, that's OK. As long as DeMelo can be spared to play with him. It is the result that counts.

But in evaluating him compared to the alternative it needs to be taken into account. When Samberg is healthy, he needs to be given the same support if we are to choose between the 2.

Why do we need to choose between the 2? Not just you Mort but a lot of people are always in a rush to set the defense pairs. There is a reason NHL teams fought hard to have the ELC player movement rules they have, so they can have long term flexibility. It is very unlikely that Dillion and Schmidt play past their current contracts or even throughout them with the Jets at age 31. And they are already at the higher range of pay for their skill sets. Very likely in a couple years are pairings are:

Morressy-Heinola
Samberg-Pionk
Stanley-DeMelo

Chevy and Bones just don't need it to happen today like HFBoards fans want because they have player movement control over their ECL players and can bring them along so they can step into roles as needed. Bottom line is they don't need to choose between their prospects, and very likely the organization has it mapped out on how they will move up the roster.

 

[Skidooboy]

You don't really need someone to spark KFC, KFC will spark himself. If he is going through a rough stretch that happens. It's better to have Ehlers and KFC on different lines and come at opponents in waves than a super line. Apples is great at puck retreival to get puck to Schief or KFC and better at D than both. He also brings that net presence. Perfetti needs someone who can score to set up.

"spark" "rough patch"?

3 points in 6 games, 20 shots... a ton of shots and driving play all nite every nite ....


hmmm. not sure what we are talking about.

 

[Skidooboy]

Sadly its not Wheezers last year, Jets have this flailing senior locked up until the end of 24'!

You could have two decent players in the lineup with his ridiculous contract!

Blake Wheeler | NHL | Spotrac.com

Blake Wheeler contract and salary cap details, full contract breakdowns, salaries, signing bonus, roster bonus, dead money, and valuations.

www.spotrac.com

umm you said that last year.

4 points in 6 games this year.....

17-43 for 60 points in 65 games last year?

you also said it the year before....
15-31 for 46 points in 50 games...

so when is this flailing senior actually gon start to "flailing"?

Because i doubt we could replace a near ppg player for less than we play wheels. especially at the rates paid over the last 2-3 years.

 

[voyageur]

Why do we need to choose between the 2? Not just you Mort but a lot of people are always in a rush to set the defense pairs. There is a reason NHL teams fought hard to have the ELC player movement rules they have, so they can have long term flexibility. It is very unlikely that Dillion and Schmidt play past their current contracts or even throughout them with the Jets at age 31. And they are already at the higher range of pay for their skill sets. Very likely in a couple years are pairings are:

Morressy-Heinola
Samberg-Pionk
Stanley-DeMelo

Chevy and Bones just don't need it to happen today like HFBoards fans want because they have player movement control over their ECL players and can bring them along so they can step into roles as needed. Bottom line is they don't need to choose between their prospects, and very likely the organization has it mapped out on how they will move up the roster.

In a couple of years both Dillon and De Melo's contracts run out, and I see little chance De Melo re-signs. What's maybe less known by fans is that Pionk, Schmidt's contracts and Stanley's RFA years run out at all the same time.

So that makes for some long term planning. Morrissey is guaranteed a spot, Samberg and Heinola should still be here. After that in a couple of years it's hard to say. All depends on performance and who steps up from the Moose. It's really hard to see Chisholm getting past both Samberg and Stanley, not to mention Dillon, does he get traded? Does Dillon get traded to give him the # 7 spot next year?

I think the Jets do have to choose between their prospects. This year appears to present Samberg with a potential platoon scenario. Heinola is still only an injury replacement in his d+4, which is actually in sync with the rest of his draft class. If Heinola and Lundmark seem to be complimentary do you work towards
Morrissey-Pionk, Samberg-Schmidt, Heinola-Lundmark by 2024-25, with Stanley in the mix? I don't think it's sorted out yet.

 

[nobody imp0rtant]

22 and 26 don't look all that similar.

Maybe on an 80" 4K TV they don't. Between sensibly sized TV's, old worn out eyes and that horrible red on blue of the Heritage jerseys the numbers are practically unreadable to me.

 

[KingBogo]

In a couple of years both Dillon and De Melo's contracts run out, and I see little chance De Melo re-signs. What's maybe less known by fans is that Pionk, Schmidt's contracts and Stanley's RFA years run out at all the same time.

So that makes for some long term planning. Morrissey is guaranteed a spot, Samberg and Heinola should still be here. After that in a couple of years it's hard to say. All depends on performance and who steps up from the Moose. It's really hard to see Chisholm getting past both Samberg and Stanley, not to mention Dillon, does he get traded? Does Dillon get traded to give him the # 7 spot next year?

I think the Jets do have to choose between their prospects. This year appears to present Samberg with a potential platoon scenario. Heinola is still only an injury replacement in his d+4, which is actually in sync with the rest of his draft class. If Heinola and Lundmark seem to be complimentary do you work towards
Morrissey-Pionk, Samberg-Schmidt, Heinola-Lundmark by 2024-25, with Stanley in the mix? I don't think it's sorted out yet.

Agreed nothing is sorted out, just the organization would have mapped out a development path for their prospects and after that it is up to each of them to prove they belong. I just don't see a need to choose between any prospects when they are on ELC's. You don't need to make that decision now between Samberg and Stanley, you just need to get a better handle on where Samberg is development wise, which will happen. Heinola will get injury replacement time, but the organization has historically had year 3 of the ELC, be the year a prospect is put into a bigger role with the exception of their 2 highest drafted defenseman prospects of Trouba and Morrissey.

Teams hold on to as many prospective defenseman as they can for as long as they can since development is so uneven and there are so many injuries at that position. I just forecasted what I see as the Jets defense in a couple years. After that it is up to each prospect to push their way in.

In terms of DeMelo I think it is very likely he re-signs. The Jets have given him a role that can extend his career into his mid to late 3o's.

 

[surixon]

Why do we need to choose between the 2? Not just you Mort but a lot of people are always in a rush to set the defense pairs. There is a reason NHL teams fought hard to have the ELC player movement rules they have, so they can have long term flexibility. It is very unlikely that Dillion and Schmidt play past their current contracts or even throughout them with the Jets at age 31. And they are already at the higher range of pay for their skill sets. Very likely in a couple years are pairings are:

Morressy-Heinola
Samberg-Pionk
Stanley-DeMelo

Chevy and Bones just don't need it to happen today like HFBoards fans want because they have player movement control over their ECL players and can bring them along so they can step into roles as needed. Bottom line is they don't need to choose between their prospects, and very likely the organization has it mapped out on how they will move up the roster.

Sure but there is that pesky thing called waiver eligibility that prevents teams from hoarding great talent in the AHL.

Samberg and Chisholm are both waiver eligible next season and Heinola the year after. I also can't see Heinola still here if he's not on the team full time by next year.

The glut of vet dmen we have is preventing us from really knowing what we have in some of these youngsters heading into the time period where you are forced to make a call on them.

 

[KingBogo]

Sure but there is that pesky thing called waiver eligibility that prevents teams from hoarding great talent in the AHL.

Samberg and Chisholm are both waiver eligible next season and Heinola the year after. I also can't see Heinola still here if he's not on the team full time by next year.

The glut of vet dmen we have is preventing us from really knowing what we have in some of these youngsters heading into the time period where you are forced to make a call on them.

But we don't have this huge glut. We have established players as starters and prospects we are watching develop. If Heinola is going to be the player we need him to be he needs to make quicker and better decisions defensively. You develop that with time and space not with elite NHL forwards pickpocketing you. Samberg will have a role this year if he stays healthy and after that he will need to cement it with his play. Chisholm might make it, but he needs to start jumping off the page otherwise their are dozens of similar players floating around the league looking for work. I don't fall in "love" with prospects as most don't make it and in reality we may have some quantity at the moment but we really don't have much compared to other teams that are game changers for an organization. We have a couple 2-5 range prospects and a couple bottom 6-7 prospects.

 

[sipowicz]

umm you said that last year.

4 points in 6 games this year.....

17-43 for 60 points in 65 games last year?

you also said it the year before....
15-31 for 46 points in 50 games...

so when is this flailing senior actually gon start to "flailing"?

Because i doubt we could replace a near ppg player for less than we play wheels. especially at the rates paid over the last 2-3 years.

Oooh.. another empty net assist, what a player...seriously have you watched his play this season, can't skate, can't shoot, can't accept a pass, but yeah touching the puck on the PP usually nets some points when the team scores~!

 

[Inanna]

Maybe on an 80" 4K TV they don't. Between sensibly sized TV's, old worn out eyes and that horrible red on blue of the Heritage jerseys the numbers are practically unreadable to me.

Agreed, those horrible red on blue jerseys are terrible. My eyes aren't old or worn out, but I have trouble reading Heritage numbers and we have a 60" TV.

 

[Duke749]

Good win. Scheif and Connor took over at times as did our bottom six. Also very pleased with Stanley having a very solid game. Was good to see.

 

[Skidooboy]

Oooh.. another empty net assist, what a player...seriously have you watched his play this season, can't skate, can't shoot, can't accept a pass, but yeah touching the puck on the PP usually nets some points when the team scores~!

so we scored 43 empty netters last year? no wait that's not right...ok well Wheels scored ever point on the Power play?

hmm... seems only 1/3 of his points were on the Power play.....


and isn't that what you are supposed to do on the PP unit? score? so again I'm not sure what you are on abvout.

but do go on and give us a list of players who are better and we could have got who could put in near a point per game for his same salary...around 4.1 mill....

so what you are saying is a couple of Devon Toews types is gonna get us to the cup burt Wheels can't?

 

[surixon]

But we don't have this huge glut. We have established players as starters and prospects we are watching develop. If Heinola is going to be the player we need him to be he needs to make quicker and better decisions defensively. You develop that with time and space not with elite NHL forwards pickpocketing you. Samberg will have a role this year if he stays healthy and after that he will need to cement it with his play. Chisholm might make it, but he needs to start jumping off the page otherwise their are dozens of similar players floating around the league looking for work. I don't fall in "love" with prospects as most don't make it and in reality we may have some quantity at the moment but we really don't have much compared to other teams that are game changers for an organization. We have a couple 2-5 range prospects and a couple bottom 6-7 prospects.

I mean Chisholm has been a ppg in the AHL as a dmen going back to last seasons playoffs. He does this while showing excellent mobility, good defense and some physicality. How much more off the page can you really expect?

Heinola is not going to learn better defensive decisions when he is head and shoulders above most of his comp that he is almost able to do whatever it is he wants to do with the puck at that level. Go watch a game if you haven't seen him yet this year, he spends next to no time in his end defending. Playing against NHL speed where he is forced to make quicker decisions and adapt is exactly what he needs.

My point is that we have a number of players who have earned opportunities down there and aren't getting them because they are being blocked and we are running out of time to get those players opportunities before we are forced to risk loosing them for nothing. Let's also face it the established players blocking them aren't exactly all that amazing.

I don't actually think this org has a good plan with regards to integrating their prospect dmen. We've seen what two successfully developed d prospects in 11 years.

 

[LowLefty]

"spark" "rough patch"?

3 points in 6 games, 20 shots... a ton of shots and driving play all nite every nite ....


hmmm. not sure what we are talking about.

He's been snake bit lately - he had a spell like that LY -
I have no doubt that KC will start scoring soon - he's getting his chances and you know they will eventually start going in. Way too much talent to be concerned 6 games in.

 

[Mud Turtle]

Yeah, I've looked at some of Sipowitz' constant nasty sniping and wondered what happens in someone's life to make them turn out like that?

I think Sip’s a big softy underneath all that bluster.
I actually get a kick out of his crankiness because he’s so dependably cranky. I don’t know how he does it.

 

[Jets 31]

so we scored 43 empty netters last year? no wait that's not right...ok well Wheels scored ever point on the Power play?

hmm... seems only 1/3 of his points were on the Power play.....


and isn't that what you are supposed to do on the PP unit? score? so again I'm not sure what you are on abvout.

but do go on and give us a list of players who are better and we could have got who could put in near a point per game for his same salary...around 4.1 mill....

so what you are saying is a couple of Devon Toews types is gonna get us to the cup burt Wheels can't?

Isn't Wheeler's salary 8.25 million this season and next?

 

[snowkiddin]

I mean Chisholm has been a ppg in the AHL as a dmen going back to last seasons playoffs. He does this while showing excellent mobility, good defense and some physicality. How much more off the page can you really expect?

Re: Chisholm — he’s a year older than Heinola but IMO he outplayed him last season and is off to another great start this year. His last two years of junior were superb as well. The only thing holding him back from being higher on people’s prospect lists, IMO, is his draft position. It’s hard to look at a guy drafted in the fifth round and see them as something special until they make it. I’m not saying he’s a future #1 or anything but I have full confidence that he can be a top four D. It would really suck if we use him in a trade for a rental or if we trade him because we don’t have room for him, without giving him a real shot.

 

[Stumbledore]

I think Sip’s a big softy underneath all that bluster.
I actually get a kick out of his crankiness because he’s so dependably cranky. I don’t know how he does it.
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Yeah, but it does tend to drive away the female posters in here.