Player Discussion: Barzal Fined for Diving/Embellishment

[MJF]

That was a 1,000% a cross check on Maysy lol

Ohhhh welllll. Sometimes the refs miss one.

 

[xECK29x]

Maybe he's whiny because he never gets calls? Not advocating for crying to the refs but it is bullshit how other players get more than him.

Star players getting calls over grinders or rookies is the dumbest f***ing thing in sports. I hate it across the board, a penalty is a penalty no matter who took it or drew it.

He draws penalties when he is on his game, when he isn't he gets chippy and he CONSTANTLY is chirping the refs.

 

[Mr Misunderstood]

He draws penalties when he is on his game and even then the officials still miss a ton, when he isn't he gets chippy and he CONSTANTLY is chirping the refs.

Fixed.

He doesn't get nearly as many calls as he should.
He is far too mouthy.

 

[JKP]

Fixed.

He doesn't get nearly as many calls as he should.
He is far too mouthy.

Yeah. I’ve said before if he shut up a bit more he’d probably start getting more calls.

 

[PK Cronin]

Yeah. I’ve said before if he shut up a bit more he’d probably start getting more calls.

It also means more to a referee when a guy who doesn't complain says something. Puts a make up call in their mind.

 

[NC 1972]

Peculiar move by the NHL for all the fouls that are not called on him. If this is the case, then Mathew should wear it proud since Gretzky used to dive too. But more times than not, he would get the call. I think the Isles need to hire Bill Barber and work on their techniques better, from what I see around the league, there are teams interfering and getting away with it, and some players are better at drawing penalties than others.

Bill Barber was a gold medal diving champion!

 

[MattMartin]

Yup. As much bullshit as it is, he’s gotta suck it up and kiss their rings since no one is gonna step in and stop them from being biased pieces of shit

Basically become Crosby, everything I loathe.

 

[scottywiper]

Incredible..
I guess we should be thankful he didn't get a fine when he put his crown jewels in the way of a deliberate stick lift last season.

 

[ScaredStreit]

Barzal needs to grow up and keep his mouth shut to the refs.

 

[Tres Peleches]

Barzal needs to grow up and keep his mouth shut to the refs.

By the same token, the referees should also grow up and not let words affect their judgement

but sadly, that’ll never happen

 

[13th Floor]

Barzal needs to grow up and keep his mouth shut to the refs.

Yea basically this. People here just watch Barzal the most. McDavid is obstructed all the time because their style of play leads to that. Barzal needs to shut the f*** up.

The other biggest takeaway from this is... the league needs to start cracking down on the chicken wing. Start calling it when it's obvious as hell. This clip is a penalty on Barzal.

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

but sadly, that’ll never happen

Someday, when robots rule the world.

 

[ScaredStreit]

By the same token, the referees should also grow up and not let words affect their judgement

but sadly, that’ll never happen

The refs don't assign fines.

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

Can the league fine him every time he does some stupid shit like a behind the back blind pass at the blue line?

 

[Tres Peleches]

The refs don't assign fines.

True, but he’s also not yelling at the league office on the ice either

 

[Seph]

Barzal needs to grow up and keep his mouth shut to the refs.

Not that this applies to the fine, but the refs shouldn't be letting what he says affect how they call penalties regarding him. If it's such a problem then give him an unsportsmanlike penalty and be done with it. Letting their bias affect their calls is the opposite of what they should be doing, and is dangerous when they are letting other players get away with taking liberties against him.

 

[Tres Peleches]

Not that this applies to the fine, but the refs shouldn't be letting what he says affect how they call penalties regarding him. If it's such a problem then give him an unsportsmanlike penalty and be done with it. Letting their bias affect their calls is the opposite of what they should be doing, and is dangerous when they are letting other players get away with taking liberties against him.

THANK YOU

 

[ScaredStreit]

Not that this applies to the fine, but the refs shouldn't be letting what he says affect how they call penalties regarding him. If it's such a problem then give him an unsportsmanlike penalty and be done with it. Letting their bias affect their calls is the opposite of what they should be doing, and is dangerous when they are letting other players get away with taking liberties against him.

The thing is they don't let people get away with things against Barzal because he's Barzal. Watch games from teams with similar players in terms of a combo of skill and speed (that aren't necessarily the biggest guys): they get the same stuff done to them. That's hockey.

Plus when you whine about everything and dive at times...it becomes harder to give you the benefit of the doubt. I like Barzal like the rest of us but let's not wear orange and blue filtered sunglasses when we're analyzing this.

This dive is actually a great example. He literally holds the guy's stick for a few seconds, falls down while flailing around, then looks straight at the refs looking for a call. He could have gotten an embellishment call right there but the refs didn't call one.

 

[Seph]

The thing is they don't let people get away with things against Barzal because he's Barzal. Watch games from teams with similar players in terms of a combo of skill and speed (that aren't necessarily the biggest guys): they get the same stuff done to them. That's hockey.

Plus when you whine about everything and dive at times...it becomes harder to give you the benefit of the doubt. I like Barzal like the rest of us but let's not wear orange and blue filtered sunglasses when we're analyzing this.

This dive is actually a great example. He literally holds the guy's stick for a few seconds, falls down while flailing around, then looks straight at the refs looking for a call. He could have gotten an embellishment call right there but the refs didn't call one.

So if it has no effect on the fines or the calls, what does it matter what he says to the refs?

 

[13th Floor]

So if it has no effect on the fines or the calls, what does it matter what he says to the refs?

I'm not exactly sure how you got that from what he said, and I don't want to speak for him, but I disagree. These are humans. And I don't mean that in the sense that we should excuse them for making mistakes nor should we be OK with them managing the game and calling things differently at different times and different players.

But the problem right now is Barzal is a cocky whiny bitch. I'll give you an example just because it's top of mind from something I was just watching. Mike Trout almost never argues strikes and balls. But the one time he does... you listen. You wonder if you are seeing something wrong. It makes a different impression than the hot head who's always complaining. Trout obviously doesn't get the call changed. But he gets the benefit of the doubt and could have a minor subliminal affect on the calls moving forward.

It's not that because Barzal is whining that the refs then don't make future legitimate calls on him out of spite. (I mean, maybe, but that's not what me or others are arguing.) It's that when they go look at the replay of this exact play we are discussing, and they see him bitching when the infraction was actually on him, they will tune out his whining on what could end up being legitimate infractions and holding. If I'm an opposing team, I am purposely getting under his skin, make him complain, and then continue to do the same infractions to him that aren't getting called because the refs won't listen to him. Why wouldn't they?

And so here's the two problems I have with Barzal. First, is shut the f*** and play so your gripes become more legitimate. Second, he is operating in a league in which we know that the refs tend to do this bullshit management, whether we think it's right or not... so play the game. Be smarter about it. It's like Butch talks about all the time with faceoffs - he bitches about the lack of rules enforcement while also saying to go be friends with the linesman. Do you want to win or do you want to be righteous? Go join the NHLPA and fight for change in the offseason. We're paying you to win hockey games now and not have 46 PIM in 50 games, which is f***ing absurd.

 

[ronsatter]

Not that this applies to the fine, but the refs shouldn't be letting what he says affect how they call penalties regarding him. If it's such a problem then give him an unsportsmanlike penalty and be done with it. Letting their bias affect their calls is the opposite of what they should be doing, and is dangerous when they are letting other players get away with taking liberties against him.

As long as humans are involved, bias is going to enter into it. If people want to keep highlighting the unfairness of it all, it's a free country. None of it is going to help Barzal, who has made his bed by being not only a whiner, but a player who takes a ton of really stupid penalties. If you think the refs don't notice, they do, and now they have their eyes on him. Refs are like elephants, they might not see everything and sometimes they get in the way, but they never forget.

 

[Seph]

I'm not exactly sure how you got that from what he said, and I don't want to speak for him, but I disagree. These are humans. And I don't mean that in the sense that we should excuse them for making mistakes nor should we be OK with them managing the game and calling things differently at different times and different players.

But the problem right now is Barzal is a cocky whiny bitch. I'll give you an example just because it's top of mind from something I was just watching. Mike Trout almost never argues strikes and balls. But the one time he does... you listen. You wonder if you are seeing something wrong. It makes a different impression than the hot head who's always complaining. Trout obviously doesn't get the call changed. But he gets the benefit of the doubt and could have a minor subliminal affect on the calls moving forward.

It's not that because Barzal is whining that the refs then don't make future legitimate calls on him out of spite. (I mean, maybe, but that's not what me or others are arguing.) It's that when they go look at the replay of this exact play we are discussing, and they see him bitching when the infraction was actually on him, they will tune out his whining on what could end up being legitimate infractions and holding. If I'm an opposing team, I am purposely getting under his skin, make him complain, and then continue to do the same infractions to him that aren't getting called because the refs won't listen to him. Why wouldn't they?

And so here's the two problems I have with Barzal. First, is shut the f*** and play so your gripes become more legitimate. Second, he is operating in a league in which we know that the refs tend to do this bullshit management, whether we think it's right or not... so play the game. Be smarter about it. It's like Butch talks about all the time with faceoffs - he bitches about the lack of rules enforcement while also saying to go be friends with the linesman. Do you want to win or do you want to be righteous? Go join the NHLPA and fight for change in the offseason. We're paying you to win hockey games now and not have 46 PIM in 50 games, which is f***ing absurd.

I mean, you are saying you think what he says to refs affect how they make calls regarding him, but with more words.

As long as humans are involved, bias is going to enter into it. If people want to keep highlighting the unfairness of it all, it's a free country. None of it is going to help Barzal, who has made his bed by being not only a whiner, but a player who takes a ton of really stupid penalties. If you think the refs don't notice, they do, and now they have their eyes on him. Refs are like elephants, they might not see everything and sometimes they get in the way, but they never forget.

Of course bias will always exist, not trying to say otherwise, and I also don't expect refs to get every call right. But if the point of your position is to decide things fairly, you should do your best to keep bias out of your judgements. Obviously at times unconscious bias will happen, but if you're calling things differently because a player chirps too much, that seems pretty conscious and intentional. If a court judge was say, making decisions with a race based bias, I think it'd be valid to say that's not how it should be, rather than just saying humans will always have some bias. And all I'm saying here, is that this isn't how it should be either (though, obviously the other example I gave is far more egregious).