Avs at the deadline

[Drury_Sakic]

I don't know who these players would be but there's gotta be someone younger, better, and cheaper than Holden/McLeod. Holden has been one of the worst defensemen in the league and McLeod one of the worst forwards. They're both terrible and I still can't believe they got extensions.

No one is going to trade for them though so I guess it's a pointless discussion. We're probably stuck with them until (hopefully) the Avs buy them out.

I would guess that a contender that is not a cap spender might take a chance on McLeod to add 4th line depth and character. He also might fit on a team rebuilding, Buffalo as an example, to help build character. I honestly think McLeod could find a few more years in the league with a change of location --- but I think his time in Denver is done and he needs a shakeup.

Holden, well. The contract is at least not horrible. Depending on how the next month or two goes, I would not have a problem with Roy sending a message and demoting him to the AHL for the rest of the season. His cap hit is nothing really if he is buried in the AHL and maybe he has a hell of a summer and comes back ready next year.


On the trade market, Stuart, McLeod, Briere, Hejda, O'Reilly, and Tanguay are probably the most interesting questions the Avs have going into the deadline...

Hejda and Tanguay being easy players to move who would both probably fetch a good to great return. -- but both players could also be very important to next years roster..so you never know.

Briere and McLeod are both probably easier to move than anyone thinks if the Avs give them away -- a bit harder if they look for something in return of any real value.

Stuart and O'Reilly are harder sells, but both could happen. O'Reilly is a easy sell, but might be hard to get a comparable value to what the Avs want/need to move him. Stuart, much like McLeod, is probably an easier sell than we think...but it would take the right situation/team and Stuart MIGHT have to waive his no trade again.

 

[shadow1]

Move Iginla back to Calgary for their playoff run.

Oh wait, the first 20 games was a flash in the pan, shocker.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

The more I think about it, the more I hope the Avs sell off a couple pieces regardless of where we are in the standings.

We need to build up our prospect pool for sure. Its probably bottom 5 in the league right now, and we don't have any major potential players(Maybe Bigras, but even he is probably only a #2/3 potential guy).


We need to pick up a few more picks and start drafting some solid prospects. I think the 2013 and 2014 drafts, although only early have shown some strong signs from the scouting department. As of right now I think the Butcher, Geertson, Wood, Bigras, and Nantel picks are looking like pretty solid picks. They've all shown good signs of development this year.



But at the same time, none of them are even close to being a sure thing(Bigras the closest), and they also don't have elite potential.


We need to add some boom or bust prospects to our system. Particularly on offense. If we could move Hejda for a 2nd+ at the deadline, I really hope Roy and Sakic make the trade, even if we are still in the playoff race. I also think we should really look at moving Briere and Talbot.


I doubt they would, but I think it'd be good to get the extra picks to stock up on more draft picks.

If we did end up with a Top 10 pick this year, then having 2 Top 40 picks, and another Top 60 pick(From a Hejda trade) would certainly give us a big boost to our prospect pool, which is IMO the biggest weakness for the team in general.

 

[tigervixxxen]

Don't forget about Bleackley, he's a very nice prospect. I'd put him second to Bigras.

TBH I'm not really sure when Roy is going to waive the white flag. If things keep going the way they are now, which I pretty much believe they will then they are never going to obviously be out of reach for quite a while. I do think they have a long range plan and will not sacrifice the future to squeeze a few more wins out of this year but I'm not sure I can see the fire sale happening either. The team needs to end the season with some semblance of dignity intact. I understand WHY they should sell as much periphery as they can I just don't know if they'll do it. Although I think they will do something before the season is over, can't see absolutely zero moves made.

 

[bohlmeister]

I think we add Kulikov for sure. Gets us over the hump and we pick up a top 9 forward that is good on draws for some depth.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Don't forget about Bleackley, he's a very nice prospect. I'd put him second to Bigras.

TBH I'm not really sure when Roy is going to waive the white flag. If things keep going the way they are now, which I pretty much believe they will then they are never going to obviously be out of reach for quite a while. I do think they have a long range plan and will not sacrifice the future to squeeze a few more wins out of this year but I'm not sure I can see the fire sale happening either.

Ya, I'm a big fan on Bleackley too.

I just didn't list him cause he was a 1st rounder. Was mostly focusing on the 2nd-7th round picks.


I also still like Siemens. I think our prospect pool is a little underrated around the rest of HF Boards. I don't think its good by any means. But I do think guys like Bleackley, Bigras, Butcher, etc. are a little unknown/Underrated around the league.



But it would certainly help a lot to add a forward or too with huge potential. I like Bleackley, but I think he's likely more of a 2nd/3rd liner in the NHL then he is a Top line guy. His two way game is probably his biggest asset(His shot is great too though).


I'm actually comfortable with our Defense for the most part. Obviously the NHL level sucks, but I think we've got good help on the way in Bigras next year, and I have a lot of confidence in Butcher right now as well(3 years away still, but I think he'll turn out to be a Top 4 guy in the NHL). I don't know as much about Geertson, or Wood but from what I've read, they've taken some huge strides as well this year.


Offensively, outside of Bleackley we really don't have much unfortunately. Hishon and Sgarbossa are looking more and more like AHL scorers then NHL players. Rendulic, and Everberg have both looked good at times this year, but they're both pretty unknown at this point, and I don't think either will be any more then a 3rd line guy in the NHL. After that, the only other guy with NHL potential from the forward group IMO is Colin Smith.


We really need a good forward prospect in the system, especially in a couple years when Mackinnon, EJ, and Barrie all get the big contracts. We'll need a few good young forwards on ELC's to help with the Salary Cap. Right now we don't have anyone able to fill that role IMO.


Adding a couple more picks in this draft would help us a lot. Especially considering the depth this draft is supposed to have.

 

[tigervixxxen]

Gotcha, I hear ya and really can't disagree with much of all that.

If we could get some additional 2/3 round picks that would be fantastic. I think we will get a good forward/D punch with our 1/2 this year. I agree the perception is that we have nothing. I'm really liking what we did with 2013 and 2014 is still pretty unknown outside of Bleackley but agree Wood and Nantel look promising. If we can get a D high this year that doesn't need a lot of development time then I'm all for that but if they need to develop then I'm comfortable with them finding another D like Bigras in the second.

It is frustrating watching the Monsters and wishing there was more offense. They can create but there isn't enough talent there to be a threat to score. I like Bourke a lot though if we are choosing one of the smaller forwards, he's looked good for a rookie. It will take time but we'll build up our forward pool too.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

I came here as a Ducks fan to ask about the availability of Tanguay, and after a very interesting 5 page read, I see you guys are pretty split on the issue!

Just for the sake of curiosity, what type offer would it take from Anaheim to get the ball rolling on a Tanguay trade?

 

[henchman21]

I came here as a Ducks fan to ask about the availability of Tanguay, and after a very interesting 5 page read, I see you guys are pretty split on the issue!

Just for the sake of curiosity, what type offer would it take from Anaheim to get the ball rolling on a Tanguay trade?

Honestly more than he is worth. He has been the best forward for the Avs and that is hard to give up for a team still fighting.

 

[RockLobster]

I came here as a Ducks fan to ask about the availability of Tanguay, and after a very interesting 5 page read, I see you guys are pretty split on the issue!

Just for the sake of curiosity, what type offer would it take from Anaheim to get the ball rolling on a Tanguay trade?

Kind of what Henchy said...he's worth more to the Avs than another team would give in a trade...surely the Ducks have players in that category? I mean he could be traded, he's not really part of the "Core" of the team, doesn't fit the age range or anything...but he's been playing tremendous hockey, is easily our best and most consistent forward, and he's been a huge part of a team that's still fighting for a playoff spot.

To put it another way, the Avs wouldn't accept fair market value for him, the only way he's moved is if a team offers something so ridiculously above market value that the Avs would be stupid to say "No".

 

[PAZ]

Honestly more than he is worth. He has been the best forward for the Avs and that is hard to give up for a team still fighting.

Not only that, even if we were in a worse position, he's the only forward that constantly shows up (ignoring first 5-10 games due to rust), has chemistry with Iggy, can play with anyone and have some sort of chemistry, and has a history with the Avs.

 

[Colorado Avalanche]

Tanguay and Iggy are good together. No way I would trade only part of the team, which is actually clicking/working, especially now that we still have a playoff chance.

 

[PAZ]

Honestly more than he is worth. He has been the best forward for the Avs and that is hard to give up for a team still fighting.

Not only that, even if we were in a worse position, he's the only forward that constantly shows up (ignoring first 5-10 games due to rust), has chemistry with almost every forward, and has a history with the Avs.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Ya, when it comes to both Iggy and Tanguay, I think they're Avs until they say otherwise at this point. I think Tanguay wants to and probably will retire with the Avs. I highly doubt Roy or Sakic go about trading him unless he comes to them first. And the same thing applies for Iggy.




For discussions sake, the conversation would start with the Ducks 1st round from my perspective. 1st + B level Forward prospect would be the asking price for me. Tangs is still only 35, and he's showing this year that he's still very capable of playing great hockey. He can play a Top 6 role on almost any team in the league, but he's also versatile enough to play a 3rd line role if needed as well.

Pretty much the exact type of player cup contending teams would want to add. If he were made available,I think the bidding would start at a 1st rounder, and whatever team adds the most to that would get him.

 

[agentblack]

Briere has to return at least a 2nd right??, if he can get to 10 goals by the deadline. That would be stellar to me. Great asset mgmt to go from PAP to Briere and cap space to a 2nd rd pick to a nice young juicy player for our future.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

A late 2nd maybe, but I think Briere would have to pick up his pace a bit for him to be worth a 2nd rounder.


If a cup contending team has itself an early 3rd rounder somehow, that's more what I'd expect for him. Still a pretty good pick and great asset management. But I don't think he's worth a 2nd yet.


Although, if we retained 50% of his cap, that'd be a whole different story.

 

[agentblack]

A late 2nd maybe, but I think Briere would have to pick up his pace a bit for him to be worth a 2nd rounder.


If a cup contending team has itself an early 3rd rounder somehow, that's more what I'd expect for him. Still a pretty good pick and great asset management. But I don't think he's worth a 2nd yet.


Although, if we retained 50% of his cap, that'd be a whole different story.

Whatever it takes imo. But yeah even a 3rd would be pretty dope.

 

[Foppa2118]

I came here as a Ducks fan to ask about the availability of Tanguay, and after a very interesting 5 page read, I see you guys are pretty split on the issue!

Just for the sake of curiosity, what type offer would it take from Anaheim to get the ball rolling on a Tanguay trade?

I haven't been paying a great deal of attention to this thread, but is it really split on whether to give up Tanguay? Maybe I misunderstood you but I can't imagine that's the case. I don't see how it makes any sense to move him, whether they're in last place or first. He helps the team so much on the ice, has become very sound defensively, he's Iggy's buddy and a big reason he signed here, and he's a great calming presence for the young guys. They all love him on the team. Plus he's Roy's guy.

Pretty sure he'll retire here.

 

[tigervixxxen]

Depending on what the offer is I'd listen. Tanguay has been great for us but if we can do something to really help our future you have to consider it. Some people even think the core is available at the right price (which is ridiculous). I wouldn't hang on to Tanguay just for sentiment. But, we need him and we'd like to have him next year so it's a little hard to part with him when there is still hope. Ideally I'd like a close to NHL ready D prospect as the main piece.

 

[Foppa2118]

Depending on what the offer is I'd listen. Tanguay has been great for us but if we can do something to really help our future you have to consider it. Some people even think the core is available at the right price (which is ridiculous). I wouldn't hang on to Tanguay just for sentiment. But, we need him and we'd like to have him next year so it's a little hard to part with him when there is still hope. Ideally I'd like a close to NHL ready D prospect as the main piece.

IMO Tanguay's even less likely to move than Hejduk his last few years when he was still playing ok. It's just not gonna happen. He talked Iggy into playing here and Jarome probably doesn't sign without him on the team. That alone means he's not going anywhere.

There's just a million reasons why he wouldn't be traded. Iggy's buddy. Roy's former tenant and first trade. Always acts committed to the team, and handles himself with class and that makes him a great role model for the younger players who all love him. Has developed into a very good PKer. He's cheap at $3.5M. Wouldn't be out of place if he transitions into a 3rd line role because he's good defensively. He's probably the teams best player this year. He's playing a big role on the only line with chemistry. He's got a ton of history with the team and was brought back to retire here.

Plus he had a limited no trade clause (10 team list he's willing to go to) that may or may not have transferred with him from Calgary. It's never clear if those clauses stay intact after players waive them once.

They can't afford to keep losing top 6 wingers either. They lost Staz for free. PAP and Downie were both top 6 capable players (not saying they should have been kept) and moved for non top 6 players. McGinn can play in the top 6 but has some serious degenerative back issues. O'Reilly isn't likely to stay long term, and may bring back a D man not another top 6 forward.

I would be absolutely shocked if he was traded.

 

[tigervixxxen]

I'd be shocked too if it happened. But there have been some ideas thrown around lately that I'm much less comfortable with. I'm just saying in a practical sense they should be open to it. In reality they probably aren't but it wouldn't be in my top 3 of the most horrifying trades they could make.

 

[Colorado Avalanche]

IMO Tanguay's even less likely to move than Hejduk his last few years when he was still playing ok. It's just not gonna happen. He talked Iggy into playing here and Jarome probably doesn't sign without him on the team. That alone means he's not going anywhere.

There's just a million reasons why he wouldn't be traded. Iggy's buddy. Roy's former tenant and first trade. Always acts committed to the team, and handles himself with class and that makes him a great role model for the younger players who all love him. Has developed into a very good PKer. He's cheap at $3.5M. Wouldn't be out of place if he transitions into a 3rd line role because he's good defensively. He's probably the teams best player this year. He's playing a big role on the only line with chemistry. He's got a ton of history with the team and was brought back to retire here.

Plus he had a limited no trade clause (10 team list he's willing to go to) that may or may not have transferred with him from Calgary. It's never clear if those clauses stay intact after players waive them once.

They can't afford to keep losing top 6 wingers either. They lost Staz for free. PAP and Downie were both top 6 capable players (not saying they should have been kept) and moved for non top 6 players. McGinn can play in the top 6 but has some serious degenerative back issues. O'Reilly isn't likely to stay long term, and may bring back a D man not another top 6 forward.

I would be absolutely shocked if he was traded.

I agree completely. Very good post. Tanguay is certainly someone we have to keep.

 

[tigervixxxen]

Let me ask this, should we extend Tanguay?

 

[Skip2myBordyloo]

Let me ask this, should we extend Tanguay?

Let's wait and see how he does next year before we start thinking extension.

I'd trade him for an overpay at this trade deadline, but only for an absurd price, not a best offered scenario.

 

[Iceberg]

I would guess that a contender that is not a cap spender might take a chance on McLeod to add 4th line depth and character. He also might fit on a team rebuilding, Buffalo as an example, to help build character. I honestly think McLeod could find a few more years in the league with a change of location --- but I think his time in Denver is done and he needs a shakeup.

Holden, well. The contract is at least not horrible. Depending on how the next month or two goes, I would not have a problem with Roy sending a message and demoting him to the AHL for the rest of the season. His cap hit is nothing really if he is buried in the AHL and maybe he has a hell of a summer and comes back ready next year.


On the trade market, Stuart, McLeod, Briere, Hejda, O'Reilly, and Tanguay are probably the most interesting questions the Avs have going into the deadline...

Hejda and Tanguay being easy players to move who would both probably fetch a good to great return. -- but both players could also be very important to next years roster..so you never know.

Briere and McLeod are both probably easier to move than anyone thinks if the Avs give them away -- a bit harder if they look for something in return of any real value.

Stuart and O'Reilly are harder sells, but both could happen. O'Reilly is a easy sell, but might be hard to get a comparable value to what the Avs want/need to move him. Stuart, much like McLeod, is probably an easier sell than we think...but it would take the right situation/team and Stuart MIGHT have to waive his no trade again.

Forget about trading McLeod and Stuart... Roy signed them to extensions before the season, their new contracts haven't even started yet.

So, just forget about that!