Avalanche draft record has been surprisingly disappointing for many years

[Skinnyjimmy08]

So I was looking through Avs draft record and I honestly had no idea how terrible it has been for many years. They've always been a team ive kinda enjoyed watching but I didn't realize how rough of a go they've had come draft day....

I wont touch on 2015 cause its still pretty early, although Rantanen does look like the real deal.

I just saw an article that Avs 2014 draft was pretty much a huge swing and miss. Their first 2 picks Bleackley and Wood were traded away, and their next 2 picks weren't signed and put back in draft. They did sign their 5th and 7th round from that draft.

in 2013 Mackinnon was obviously a good choice and we are still waiting to see what Bigras can do... everyone else in that draft hasn't panned out

in 2012 it looks like a swing and miss... Blandisi has started to do well, but not with the Avs

2011 was another obvious good high choice Landeskog, but they crapped the bed with their other 1st Siemens. .. and nobody else has done anything

2010 the only significant piece was Pickard in the 2nd... and still, we are waiting to see what happens there although he does look good

2009 was a good year... Duchene, Oreilly, Barrie

2008 bad

2007 Shattenkirk but bad after that

2006 only person to play in NHL is Stewart

2005 Stastny was good and with the exception of a few others that had a few games, turned out not good too

2004 Wolski is only significant name

and then so on and so on... even before those years there weren't many

Im unsure what their management situation is... like if they have hired/fired many scouts over the years and all that? I know they've gone through 3 different GM's since 2006 but it seems like each GM has drafted poorly.

I am shocked to have seen this!!!

Click to read more...

 

[slobbergob]

Seems a bit early to say "everyone else hasn't panned out" from 2013. Martin, Geersten and Butcher are all promising picks in relation to where they were drafted. Just 'cause you don't know anything about them, doesn't mean they haven't panned out.

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

Seems a bit early to say "everyone else hasn't panned out" from 2013. Martin, Geersten and Butcher are all promising picks in relation to where they were drafted. Just 'cause you don't know anything about them, doesn't mean they haven't panned out.

haha ya my bad... I should have thrown in "yet" afterwards. Ofcourse they can still turn into something. I do know Geertsen quite well from his time in WHL

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

haha ya my bad... I should have thrown in "yet" afterwards. Ofcourse they can still turn into something. I do know Geertsen quite well from his time in WHL

... actually I should have put that its still up in the air for them... I apologize!!

 

[tigervixxxen]

We obviously know they haven't drafted well but not sure why the need for a thread on it. There's a few other teams out there who deserve the same treatment.

2014 didn't have to be that way, they didn't have to trade their first two selections. Plus it's tough for a draft to look good picking in the bottom half and not having a second round pick. A lot of teams chose not to sign guys taken from the bottom half of that draft but I like Nantel, he was a good choice in the 7th and was actually signed. Lindholm from the 5th was signed too.

As already said 2013 actually was pretty good, not that anyone outside Colorado is aware of this. MacKinnon, Bigras, Martin, Geertsen were all signed and have had good pro careers thus far. Bigras got 31 NHL games this season, people might not know.

The 2015 draft is one we are excited about. Rantanen, Greer, Meloche and Beaudin all had solid seasons. They already signed Boikov, 6th round pick from it. Mironov would step into the NHL tomorrow if he came over.

Before that yeah we know drafting has been a mess, that's why the Avs have had trouble with their organizational depth. They don't tend to try and obtain more picks and they are very stingy with the ELCs they give out too. It's going to be a long road to revamp their drafting and development system.

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

We obviously know they haven't drafted well but not sure why the need for a thread on it. There's a few other teams out there who deserve the same treatment.

2014 didn't have to be that way, they didn't have to trade their first two selections. Plus it's tough for a draft to look good picking in the bottom half and not having a second round pick. A lot of teams chose not to sign guys taken from the bottom half of that draft but I like Nantel, he was a good choice in the 7th and was actually signed. Lindholm from the 5th was signed too.

As already said 2013 actually was pretty good, not that anyone outside Colorado is aware of this. MacKinnon, Bigras, Martin, Geertsen were all signed and have had good pro careers thus far. Bigras got 31 NHL games this season, people might not know.

The 2015 draft is one we are excited about. Rantanen, Greer, Meloche and Beaudin all had solid seasons. They already signed Boikov, 6th round pick from it. Mironov would step into the NHL tomorrow if he came over.

Before that yeah we know drafting has been a mess, that's why the Avs have had trouble with their organizational depth. They don't tend to try and obtain more picks and they are very stingy with the ELCs they give out too. It's going to be a long road to revamp their drafting and development system.

Ya I was just shocked to see it... people always point out the same teams always that have always seemed to draft poorly for years but never mentioned Avs. It was just shocking to me cause they've always been a fun exciting young team to watch it seems

 

[Nalens Oga]

2014's picks were a miss. Hishon and Siemens weren't good picks in hindsight before either (Hishon had bad luck with injury but still probably not the safest pick to go at with 17 and a reach).

Overall though it's not just poor drafting, our development kinda sucks. We aren't a high-end team when it comes to scouting because of money nor do we have moneyball going, it's gonna take a while. Tyson Barrie though flawed, is the only dman that's developed into a regular since I don't know when (and Bigras looks like he will but still, that's a huge gap between 2008-2012 with just Barrie in there until you get Bigras after or Shattenkirk before). Screwing up in 2014 would actually not be so bad it's just that the bad drafting from all the years before failed to provide the three high-end picks and O'Reilly/Barrie with the rest of the support cast.

 

[slobbergob]

... actually I should have put that its still up in the air for them... I apologize!!

No worries.

Pracey, the former head scout, was fired after the 2014 draft at some point (I don't know if anyone really knows for sure when. His name just kind of disappeared from the Avs website) and at least part of it is his tendency to draft small, skilled players with "leadership". He had a type of player he liked and would often stick too heavily to it.

That's not to say he was all bad, because 2009 was a home run. Duchene, Barrie, ROR all came from that draft.

Since then there's been an obvious organizational philosophy to get bigger. Not only that, but to branch out to Europe for not only draft prospects, but FA signings as well. Where before I'd say we did a lot of drafting out of the OHL, now we tend to lean more to the Q and some European leagues.

I actually am pretty happy with Sakic's drafting overall, although 2014 is a big fail, mostly compounded by Bleackley. Although we traded away Wood, he was a guy that took huge strides after being drafted and had a lot of promise. Nantel in the 7th is looking like a great pick as well. Lindholm I can't speak on 'cause I've seen almost none of him but he's coming over to SA.

I loved our 2015 draft. Rantanen, Meloche, Greer, and Beaudin are all great picks. A lot of people were unhappy with the Greer picks but the huge strides he's shown since leaving BU at least point to Avs scouts seeing untapped potential in him.

Overall, Sakic's done a good job of restocking what was clearly the worst prospect pool in the league, turning it into merely a mediocre prospect pool.

 

[HarryLime]

they hit on their high picks and were able to get some gems in ROR, Stastny, Barrie, etc. Not the best but not terrible by any means. Rantanen is gonna be very good also.

 

[MS]

2010-2014 is as legitimately awful as you'll see.

They hit on a #1 overall pick (who is currently the 3rd-best player of the top 6 in that draft) and hit on a #2 overall pick but have literally nothing else to show for those 5 drafts. Basically Edmonton-esque.

 

[tigervixxxen]

2010-2014 is as legitimately awful as you'll see.

They hit on a #1 overall pick (who is currently the 3rd-best player of the top 6 in that draft) and hit on a #2 overall pick but have literally nothing else to show for those 5 drafts. Basically Edmonton-esque.

You don't know anything about our 2013 draft then

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

2010-2014 is as legitimately awful as you'll see.

They hit on a #1 overall pick (who is currently the 3rd-best player of the top 6 in that draft) and hit on a #2 overall pick but have literally nothing else to show for those 5 drafts. Basically Edmonton-esque.

ya its funny cause those years were bad, 2009 was a random great draft, and then from 2003-2008 only significant names drafted were Shattenkirk, Stewart, Stastny and lesser names Richardson, Jones and Wolski

 

[Jumptheshark]

every team goes through stretches

 

[KingsFan7824]

It's what makes the draft fascinating and frustrating. Back to the 2009 draft for Colorado, and they have 4 of the top 64 picks. That's great! Then it worked out. Back to 2007, 4 of the top 55 picks. Even better! Didn't work out a well.

Why does a 5th round pick ever have a better career than a 1st or 2nd rounder? How does one of the best players from the famous 2003 draft only get taken in the 7th round? How can so many people that are paid to know this stuff miss as often as they do? Sort of like life in general I suppose. Are you doing something right? Are you doing something wrong? Where is any of it going to go? You do the best you can and just hope.

 

[tigervixxxen]

It's what makes the draft fascinating and frustrating. Back to the 2009 draft for Colorado, and they have 4 of the top 64 picks. That's great! Then it worked out. Back to 2007, 4 of the top 55 picks. Even better! Didn't work out a well.

Why does a 5th round pick ever have a better career than a 1st or 2nd rounder? How does one of the best players from the famous 2003 draft only get taken in the 7th round? How can so many people that are paid to know this stuff miss as often as they do? Sort of like life in general I suppose. Are you doing something right? Are you doing something wrong? Where is any of it going to go? You do the best you can and just hope.

It's not just the picks. It's development, opportunity, luck to some extent too. I hate it when people evaluate picks, especially the later ones, based on who the guys taken after them are. They had to get in the right org and developmental system for them, they had to have an opportunity to have a chance to show what they can do. There's timing and injury luck. It's everything.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

Pracey, the former head scout, was fired after the 2014 draft at some point (I don't know if anyone really knows for sure when. His name just kind of disappeared from the Avs website) and at least part of it is his tendency to draft small, skilled players with "leadership". He had a type of player he liked and would often stick too heavily to it.

The Flyers picked him up shortly after he left Colorado. He primarily scouts the OHL for them. He only has Konecny to his name at this point but he'd fit that bill of that type of player.

 

[PAZ]

The Flyers picked him up shortly after he left Colorado. He primarily scouts the OHL for them. He only has Konecny to his name at this point but he'd fit that bill of that type of player.

For the record, I don't think many Avs fans think he's a bad scout, but he's not the guy you want in charge helping make decisions.

 

[tigervixxxen]

The Flyers picked him up shortly after he left Colorado. He primarily scouts the OHL for them. He only has Konecny to his name at this point but he'd fit that bill of that type of player.

The second the Flyers picked him Avs fans had a chuckle. And I like TK, he was a good pick there. But we knew that Pracey smile was present then.

 

[KingTux]

They are pretty average TBH. Not as bad as you think

 

[Machinehead]

Why is it surprising? They kinda stink...

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Meh.


We missed on a lot of picks sure, but we also absolutely smashed some picks(Barrie and Oreilly) as well to help make up for it.


Also the jury is not out on Bigras at all. The kid is already established as an NHL Dman and he just turned 21. He's an extremely safe be to be at least a Top 4 Dman, and the potential is there to be a #2.


Our drafting has been much better of late as well. Avs fans are pretty excited about the likes of Geertson, Beaudin, Boikov, Nantel, Martin, and Meloche just to name a few.

2010-2014 is as legitimately awful as you'll see.

They hit on a #1 overall pick (who is currently the 3rd-best player of the top 6 in that draft) and hit on a #2 overall pick but have literally nothing else to show for those 5 drafts. Basically Edmonton-esque.

Its way to early to be judging 2012, 2013, and 2014 drafts though. Especially the last 2. Its only been a couple of years for a lot of those guys and it takes more time for picks outside of the first round to develop and have an impact.



This is also some extremely flawed logic. Chris Bigras is one of the top D prospects in the league. Calvin Pickard is well on his way to becoming a quality starter in the league.


Its not completely wasted picks outside of Mackinnon and Landeskog.



Honestly our drafting hasn't been perfect, buts its nowhere near bottom 5 in the league or anything. It's fairly average and getting better.

 

[Beukeboom Fan]

every team goes through stretches

And after those stretches, the teams typically crater. Hawks drafting from 95-05 resulted in terrible teams from 06-08. Same thing from the Flames or Oilers from late 90's to 2010.

 

[lawrence]

So I was looking through Avs draft record and I honestly had no idea how terrible it has been for many years. They've always been a team ive kinda enjoyed watching but I didn't realize how rough of a go they've had come draft day....

I wont touch on 2015 cause its still pretty early, although Rantanen does look like the real deal.

I just saw an article that Avs 2014 draft was pretty much a huge swing and miss. Their first 2 picks Bleackley and Wood were traded away, and their next 2 picks weren't signed and put back in draft. They did sign their 5th and 7th round from that draft.

in 2013 Mackinnon was obviously a good choice and we are still waiting to see what Bigras can do... everyone else in that draft hasn't panned out

in 2012 it looks like a swing and miss... Blandisi has started to do well, but not with the Avs

2011 was another obvious good high choice Landeskog, but they crapped the bed with their other 1st Siemens. .. and nobody else has done anything

2010 the only significant piece was Pickard in the 2nd... and still, we are waiting to see what happens there although he does look good

2009 was a good year... Duchene, Oreilly, Barrie

2008 bad

2007 Shattenkirk but bad after that

2006 only person to play in NHL is Stewart

2005 Stastny was good and with the exception of a few others that had a few games, turned out not good too

2004 Wolski is only significant name

and then so on and so on... even before those years there weren't many

Im unsure what their management situation is... like if they have hired/fired many scouts over the years and all that? I know they've gone through 3 different GM's since 2006 but it seems like each GM has drafted poorly.

I am shocked to have seen this!!!

don't feel bad buddy, I know a team that plays in the north west that drafted 9 out of 10 years in the top 10, 4 1st overall picks, and nothing to show for 9 years later, and they are a still a bottom feeder, and probably going to be a bottom feeder again.

that's bad.

 

[tucker3434]

What sucks the most are the ones we barely missed. I think we missed tarasenko by a couple picks. Got Hishon instead. Missed Dougie Hamilton by a couple picks. Got Duncan Siemens instead.

But yeah. We've never been a good drafting team. We pull an occasional gem from the 2nd round, but we might as well just flush rounds 3-7 down the toilet.

 

[Ivan13]

Not surprising to those who are familiar with Pierre Lacroix and his approach to the draft and especially lower development leagues. Having said that, it's not terrible, but it's not good either. It's barely passable, thanks in large to the 2009 draft, Shatty and Stastny.

Also, FTR Martin is a terrific goalie prospect.