Post-Game Talk: Auston Matthews. Leafs win 6-4!

[Confucius]

Hockey is a crazy game.

NHL hockey is draft luck plus puck luck plus or minus your city is warm and sunny with low taxes.

Devils knock off Colorado 5-3, in the short term anything can happen. It is why you need a long season to balance all these outliers, streaky luck and unlucky circumstances. It is why the playoffs are exciting and I would love us to win but you have to be lucky in that format.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Devils knock off Colorado 5-3, in the short term anything can happen. It is why you need a long season to balance all these outliers, streaky luck and unlucky circumstances. It is why the playoffs are exciting and I would love us to win but you have to be lucky in that format.

I don't think luck had anything to do with TB winning the last two cups myself. Playoff hockey is also different than regular season hockey, but we've been over that already so I'll just stop there.

 

[Confucius]

I don't think luck had anything to do with TB winning the last two cups myself. Playoff hockey is also different than regular season hockey, but we've been over that already so I'll just stop there.

Yep we've been over it and you no doubt know along with those two wins, they were swept round 0ne by a team that just squeaked in. twice lucky once unlucky. Maybe it all balances out this season.

 

[kb]

Hockey is a crazy game.

NHL hockey is draft luck plus puck luck plus or minus your city is warm and sunny with low taxes.

Truth.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Yep we've been over it and you no doubt know along with those two wins, they were swept round 0ne by a team that just squeaked in. twice lucky once unlucky. Maybe it all balances out this season.

IMHO there was no luck involved at all. That one time they didn't play well as their opponents, that's why they lost. The last two years, they outplayed everyone and won.

 

[ACC1224]

Is Spezza hurt or was he a healthy scratch last night?

 

[Azail]

You are right.

Seattle 5 - Florida 3
Seattle 4 - Florida 1
Seattle 4 - Minnesota 1
Seattle 2 - Carolina 1
Seattle 2 - Pittsburgh 1

Leafs 6 - Seattle 2
Leafs 6 - Seattle 4

But that doesn't fit his narrative. Shhh with your facts.

 

[ACC1224]

Since Feb. 1st:

The Leafs beat the Kraken twice by a combined score of 12-6

the Kraken beat the Panthers 5-3.
The Flames beat the Kraken 2-1
The Bruins beat the Kraken 3-2 and 2-1 in OT
The Kraken beat the Pens 2-1 in OT
The Rangers beat the Kraken 3-2
The Canes beat the Kraken 3-2

Looking at our fellow competitors in the east, I'd say we looked the best against them.

Not sure what the point is of showing how other teams played against them.

 

[Zybalto]

IMHO there was no luck involved at all. That one time they didn't play well as their opponents, that's why they lost. The last two years, they outplayed everyone and won.

They got completely outplayed by the Panthers in the first round last year.

Having the best goalie in every series you play is pretty important.

 

[Zybalto]

Not sure what the point is of showing how other teams played against them.

To refute the silly point that was made....which I did.

 

[Once]

Is Spezza hurt or was he a healthy scratch last night?

I think with Kase back they had to scratch someone and wanted to keep Robertson in the lineup.

One poster postulated that Simmonds will be the odd man out moving forward. Obviously he had to play with last night being his 1000th game celebration.

Now we need Spez to hit his 1000th point this year and hopefully well before the playoffs so that he too can rest down the stretch.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Not sure what the point is of showing how other teams played against them.

Looking at what the rest of the league experiences is important for understanding the level of concern one should have about the things that we experience. Completely ignoring other teams would mean having no baseline or frame of reference for anything, which would just lead to people wildly overreacting to any remotely negative thing that happe... Oh wait, this explains a lot.

 

[Gary Nylund]

They got completely outplayed by the Panthers in the first round last year.

Having the best goalie in every series you play is pretty important.

Not true at all, if the Panthers had "completely outplayed them", they would have won.

 

[ACC1224]

To refute the silly point that was made....which I did.

I guess in your opinion. I had expected a more dominating win myself, so I guess I agree that it shouldn't have been that close.

IMO, just posting a bunch of scores without context is kind of silly.

 

[TGB]

Another dirty game.

It's nice to see the Leafs getting more high effort goals lately, they've been way too dependent on finesse goals this season, but these "outscore the mistakes" games won't work in the playoffs.

 

[GrizzGreen]

Shesterkin says hi

goalies aren't hockey players

 

[keonsbitterness]

They got completely outplayed by the Panthers in the first round last year.

Having the best goalie in every series you play is pretty important.

Early on, okay. Tampa neutralized Florida as they got deeper into the series and Florida couldn't adjust.

 

[Zybalto]

Not true at all, if the Panthers had "completely outplayed them", they would have won.

I watched the series and it was the first big reason Mr. Conn Smyth won his award.

Average shots in the series: 37-31 Florida
Average Scoring Chances in the series: 36-24 Florida


Team save%:
Tampa: 92.51%
Florida: 87.17%

Switch the goalies and I'm pretty sure I know who wins.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I watched the series and it was the first big reason Mr. Conn Smyth won his award.

Switch the goalies and I'm pretty sure I know who wins.

That's 100% irrelevant because that's just not the way it works. It seems like you keep evaluating teams as if they don't have goalies which makes no sense whatsoever. Tampa Bay was the best team, and the fact that their goalie was one of their best players doesn't change that fact one bit.

This seems like a Leaf fan thing - oh look at all these stats, expected this is so good and expected that is even better, we just keep running into hot goalies or it's our goalie who let in a bad goal or two at the worst possible time ... it doesn't work that way, it just doesn't.

Instead of showing a bunch of numbers to show how great our team is (if we take goaltending out of the equation that is), maybe we should consider that the way this team is built isn't likely to lead to playoff success. Most of the money gone on a few forwards and we're skimping on the rest.

Ever heard the saying "build from the net out"? There's a reason people say that.

 

[Zybalto]

That's 100% irrelevant because that's just not the way it works. It seems like you keep evaluating teams as if they don't have goalies which makes no sense whatsoever. Tampa Bay was the best team, and the fact that their goalie was one of their best players doesn't change that fact one bit.

This seems like a Leaf fan thing - oh look at all these stats, expected this is so good and expected that is even better, we just keep running into hot goalies or it's our goalie who let in a bad goal or two at the worst possible time ... it doesn't work that way, it just doesn't.

Instead of showing a bunch of numbers to show how great our team is (if we take goaltending out of the equation that is), maybe we should consider that the way this team is built isn't likely to lead to playoff success. Most of the money gone on a few forwards and we're skimping on the rest.

Ever heard the saying "build from the net out"? There's a reason people say that.

What you are doing here is a classic pivot move or what many here call "moving the goal posts"....and this isnt a Leaf fan thing.

You claimed Tampa outplayed Florida. I just proved to you they didnt is all......but that doesnt mean I think the better team lost. Vasy is 100% part of Tampa and if he played for Florida, we may be talking them as the champs. You just have a really flawed way of looking at the value of playoff goaltending and also how insane it is to both acquire.....and made even worse by the fact it can disappear faster than any position in hockey (the voodoo aspect a la everyone from Jim Carey to Matt Murray). Goalies are almost a separate entity from the team that make or break all the effort put forth in front of them. You could outshoot a team 50-1 and still lose due to goaltending but you can also get fooled by apparent good goaltending as well as they can crack under pressure in big games (the biggest problem this team has faced IMO).

I don't think budget has much to do with it at all. You have to find that great goalie before you sign him to big dollars and the Leafs havnt. If you see a team with a big budget goalie, that goalie has already proved himself....and thats why the Leafs dont have one (and havnt had one for decades). Campbell looked good last playoffs until he didnt.....and looked good until mid Jan. until he didnt. You didnt see me really singing his praises that often because he has to prove himself, especially after wearing the goat horns last year...which he did. Can he turn it around? Maybe?....and it would be great to see a nice guy like him get it done too but in the end, he needs to perform. It's literally the most important position in the playoffs. The MVP position and the final fortress. If the Leafs are to win, it's going to be because their goalie finally stepped up and played like a winner....and I'm sick of seeing the ones playing like winners being in the opposition nets.

 

[Gary Nylund]

What you are doing here is a classic pivot move or what many here call "moving the goal posts"....and this isnt a Leaf fan thing.

You claimed Tampa outplayed Florida. I just proved to you they didnt is all......but that doesnt mean I think the better team lost. Vasy is 100% part of Tampa and if he played for Florida, we may be talking them as the champs. You just have a really flawed way of looking at the value of playoff goaltending and also how insane it is to both acquire.....and made even worse by the fact it can disappear faster than any position in hockey (the voodoo aspect a la everyone from Jim Carey to Matt Murray). Goalies are almost a separate entity from the team that make or break all the effort put forth in front of them. You could outshoot a team 50-1 and still lose due to goaltending but you can also get fooled by apparent good goaltending as well as they can crack under pressure in big games (the biggest problem this team has faced IMO).

I don't think budget has much to do with it at all. You have to find that great goalie before you sign him to big dollars and the Leafs havnt. If you see a team with a big budget goalie, that goalie has already proved himself....and thats why the Leafs dont have one (and havnt had one for decades). Campbell looked good last playoffs until he didnt.....and looked good until mid Jan. until he didnt. You didnt see me really singing his praises that often because he has to prove himself, especially after wearing the goat horns last year...which he did. Can he turn it around? Maybe?....and it would be great to see a nice guy like him get it done too but in the end, he needs to perform. It's literally the most important position in the playoffs. The MVP position and the final fortress. If the Leafs are to win, it's going to be because their goalie finally stepped up and played like a winner....and I'm sick of seeing the ones playing like winners being in the opposition nets.

Nope, you did no such thing. You are evaluating how the teams played without factoring in goaltending which makes zero sense. Flip the goalies and get a different result, so what? That's like saying that flip the QB's in the super bowl and you'd get a different result but again, so what? Brady played for NE and he's a big part of why they won so many titles. Vasi plays for TB and he's a big part of why they won the cup the last two years, same thing.

 

[Mr_Fun]

It feels like everything is going in for the opposition right now. Whether it is bad goaltending, poor defensive lapses or perfectly executed plays by the other team, they are just all going in. All the tips, all the odd man rushes. While the goaltending and defence need to improve big time, I think eventually just the law of (normalcy?) will also average itself out. Like not every tip or odd man rush goes in. The tip may miss the net or get blocked. The pass on the 2on1 may get missed or get flubbed. While it is our side to blame mostly, it does feel like our opposition is executing on their end perfectly as well. Hopefully it all gets corrected.

 

[Zybalto]

Nope, you did no such thing. You are evaluating how the teams played without factoring in goaltending which makes zero sense. Flip the goalies and get a different result, so what? That's like saying that flip the QB's in the super bowl and you'd get a different result but again, so what? Brady played for NE and he's a big part of why they won so many titles. Vasi plays for TB and he's a big part of why they won the cup the last two years, same thing.

"They got outplayed but still won".

I'm sure you heard this before. Don't act like it isnt a true statement and don't act like it doesnt happen. Generally the best team, the one that dominates the stats, wins the game. If they don't win the game, theres a reason why and in hockey, that reason is usually a difference in goaltending. We literally have an offbeat description of it called "getting goalied". It's not the only way and some can even be self inflicted (like taking too many stupid penalties) but to sit there and tell me it doesnt exist and then throw poor NFL analogies at me isnt a great strategy. The quarterback/goaltending value level might be up there but it's hard to quantify and not even a game like soccer is a great comparisan as the level of shots is skewed. Hockey is hockey and theres no sport like it.

You don't even need to have the best goalie in the world. You just need one that isnt going to let in the beer league shots our keepers have in big games.

Like I said, maybe Campbell can be the man this year....or maybe grabbing Varlamov might be an answer.....I dunno.

 

[djdev]

Exactly why the Leafs will win

lol its funny, with this team that logic actually makes sense

 

[Gary Nylund]

"They got outplayed but still won".

I'm sure you heard this before. Don't act like it isnt a true statement and don't act like it doesnt happen. Generally the best team, the one that dominates the stats, wins the game. If they don't win the game, theres a reason why and in hockey, that reason is usually a difference in goaltending. We literally have an offbeat description of it called "getting goalied". It's not the only way and some can even be self inflicted (like taking too many stupid penalties) but to sit there and tell me it doesnt exist and then throw poor NFL analogies at me isnt a great strategy. The quarterback/goaltending value level might be up there but it's hard to quantify and not even a game like soccer is a great comparisan as the level of shots is skewed. Hockey is hockey and theres no sport like it.

You don't even need to have the best goalie in the world. You just need one that isnt going to let in the beer league shots our keepers have in big games.

Like I said, maybe Campbell can be the man this year....or maybe grabbing Varlamov might be an answer.....I dunno.

Sure I've heard it but if the reason they "still won" was the goaltending, then it makes no sense because they didn't get outplayed.

We got out-goalied - I'm sure you've hear that before, many people here (including you) have said that's why we've been on the losing end in a few playoff series. But it's not like forwards and Dmen play, and goalies goalie, they're all playing hockey. And since playing goal is as much a part of playing hockey as playing forward, being out-goalied is just a part of being outplayed.