ATD10-ML Round 1: #4 Dayton Ohio Mincer Rays vs. #5 Yaroslavl Manglers
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MXD
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VanIslander
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Kyle McMahon
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That's odd, I do distinctly remember typing his name in, but you're correct. Glitch I guess.
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I'll start by comparing forward lines
-The Manglers talent on the 1st line is there, but whether or not they can get solid production every night from their top guys is a big question mark. Nash has the makings of an elite goal scorer, but has never been able to maintain that status on a consistent basis. After sharing the lead league in goals in ’03-04, he has yet to place in the top 10 again. Oilver is another good goal scorer but was never elite, he was quick, but also quite small and didnt have elite passing abilities, I honestly cant see Nash and Oliver hooking up effectively. Cloutier is probably the best scorer on the team and the only player on the 1st line with good passing ability, but he seemed to have a history of off ice isues that got in the way of his commeitment to the game. Throwing him off his game wont be the hardest challnge for our team.
-Our 1st line meshes well together. Having a multi-time top ten goal scorer Camille Henry getting pucks fed to him by Marc Savard is a recipe for success. Combine that with Bill Goldsworthy game-breaking speed and shot makes this line a hard one to defend.
-We have hom-ice advantage and we feel that our third line matches very well against the Manglers top line. Zezel has the speed to shadow the strong skating Oliver, Larose has enough muscle and physicality to handle Nash, and Nemchinov’s defensive intelligence is enough to take on Cloutier offensive skill which is all he really has to offer. We will also play Fraser on the 2nd line somtimes to get in the face of Cloutier.
-I don’t know much about your 2nd line, cant find anything on Kerr or Ridpath, and Ronan just seemed to be a prolific scorer in the NHA but that only last a few seasons. What can you tell me about them?
-On the 3rd line- McVeigh was very small, I know he played in the 1930’s but 5’6 145 is still verysmall for that time period. His work ethic will help but I doubt it will be enough against our scoring line wingers. Pronovost is possibly the best checker on the team who has big game experience, we will try to avoid having Henry and the 1st line against the Pronovost line, so we will let Pronovost take on Ogrodnick and the 2nd line instead.
-Overall I think we have superior defense, although its hard to make a judgement your 2nd paring. Van Boxmeer and rautikallio have comparable offensive numbers, but I think Van Boxmeer was a little better in that regard and was also better defensively. Yushkevich was tough and was a good leader, but Randall still trumps him on both categories, and had great offensive numbers to boot. Jarrett and Ohlund are similar defensive defensmen, I give Jarrett the edge as he was bigger, more physical and just as clean.
-In terms of golatending, it could go either way.
-In all I think The Mincer Rays clearly have more firepower and have enough toughness and defensive ability to take care of the manglers good but volitile offensive threat.
-The Manglers talent on the 1st line is there, but whether or not they can get solid production every night from their top guys is a big question mark. Nash has the makings of an elite goal scorer, but has never been able to maintain that status on a consistent basis. After sharing the lead league in goals in ’03-04, he has yet to place in the top 10 again. Oilver is another good goal scorer but was never elite, he was quick, but also quite small and didnt have elite passing abilities, I honestly cant see Nash and Oliver hooking up effectively. Cloutier is probably the best scorer on the team and the only player on the 1st line with good passing ability, but he seemed to have a history of off ice isues that got in the way of his commeitment to the game. Throwing him off his game wont be the hardest challnge for our team.
-Our 1st line meshes well together. Having a multi-time top ten goal scorer Camille Henry getting pucks fed to him by Marc Savard is a recipe for success. Combine that with Bill Goldsworthy game-breaking speed and shot makes this line a hard one to defend.
-We have hom-ice advantage and we feel that our third line matches very well against the Manglers top line. Zezel has the speed to shadow the strong skating Oliver, Larose has enough muscle and physicality to handle Nash, and Nemchinov’s defensive intelligence is enough to take on Cloutier offensive skill which is all he really has to offer. We will also play Fraser on the 2nd line somtimes to get in the face of Cloutier.
-I don’t know much about your 2nd line, cant find anything on Kerr or Ridpath, and Ronan just seemed to be a prolific scorer in the NHA but that only last a few seasons. What can you tell me about them?
-On the 3rd line- McVeigh was very small, I know he played in the 1930’s but 5’6 145 is still verysmall for that time period. His work ethic will help but I doubt it will be enough against our scoring line wingers. Pronovost is possibly the best checker on the team who has big game experience, we will try to avoid having Henry and the 1st line against the Pronovost line, so we will let Pronovost take on Ogrodnick and the 2nd line instead.
-Overall I think we have superior defense, although its hard to make a judgement your 2nd paring. Van Boxmeer and rautikallio have comparable offensive numbers, but I think Van Boxmeer was a little better in that regard and was also better defensively. Yushkevich was tough and was a good leader, but Randall still trumps him on both categories, and had great offensive numbers to boot. Jarrett and Ohlund are similar defensive defensmen, I give Jarrett the edge as he was bigger, more physical and just as clean.
-In terms of golatending, it could go either way.
-In all I think The Mincer Rays clearly have more firepower and have enough toughness and defensive ability to take care of the manglers good but volitile offensive threat.
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raleh
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This is a matchup of teams I had ranked higher than they ended up, so I think it's a shame that these two have to go at it in the first round. But I guess that's what happens in the MLD. Everyone's good, and there's holes on every team. Kinda cool.
Anyways, I think Pekka Rautakallio is the clear cut best Dman in this series and I think it's criminal that he wasn't given the other all star spot next to Owen. But maybe that's just me.
On the other hand, and this sounds weird for me to say about a team managed by Evil Speaker, the top two offensive lines for the Mincer Racers are my favourite in the draft. I also think they have a definite edge in goal tending.
Nash and Cloutier leading the offensive charge scares me a bit. Which Nash is going to show up?
I'm going to follow the discussion pretty closely in this one. Two teams that I really liked with GMs who I think are the most underrated in any ATD.
Anyways, I think Pekka Rautakallio is the clear cut best Dman in this series and I think it's criminal that he wasn't given the other all star spot next to Owen. But maybe that's just me.
On the other hand, and this sounds weird for me to say about a team managed by Evil Speaker, the top two offensive lines for the Mincer Racers are my favourite in the draft. I also think they have a definite edge in goal tending.
Nash and Cloutier leading the offensive charge scares me a bit. Which Nash is going to show up?
I'm going to follow the discussion pretty closely in this one. Two teams that I really liked with GMs who I think are the most underrated in any ATD.
Kyle McMahon
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Know Your Enemy
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What makes Pekka better than Ken Randall? Not only was Randall just as good if not better offensively than him (Pekka was more talnted, but his NHL production doesnt compare favorably to Randall, or ever Van Boxmeer for that matter), he also brings alot of toughness, leadership and agression when gaurding his own zone. People might think than Randall was just a big brute with a bad temper, but he was a great all-around hockey player. During his peak offensive years his point production was on pace with the likes of Harry Cameron, Georges Boucher and Sprague Cleghorn. He was also quoted by Ultimate Hockey as "A good puckhandler with a hard shot" and "the kind of bull-dog every coach wants in the lockerroom" which sheds light on his leadership abilities.
I know Pekka was an amazing talent with great size, but what els can you say about him?
seventieslord
Student Of The Game
ES, are you sure that Randall was a defenseman when he had point totals similar to Cleghorn, Boucher, and Cameron? We know he played some RW, I just can't recall exactly when, although The Trail might shed some light on that.
Not that I want to bring him down or anything, but that might be just "too good to be true". I seriously considered him as a spare in the ATD before settling on Jimmy Roberts, and I voted for him as an all-star. (at least I'm pretty sure I did, I've already recycled my notes
)
Not that I want to bring him down or anything, but that might be just "too good to be true". I seriously considered him as a spare in the ATD before settling on Jimmy Roberts, and I voted for him as an all-star. (at least I'm pretty sure I did, I've already recycled my notes
)
Kyle McMahon
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I think the second line could be the strength of our team, if that makes sense. We expect good chemistry between the three. They all played for Ottawa during the same era, and Kerr and Ridpath were linemates at one time.
In fact, their line proved to be a lethal combination, as their scoring enabled the Senators to romp to the Cup in 1911. Kerr was possibly the best player in the league that year (described as "a sensation of the league" in the Trail if I recall), scoring in 12 consecutive games and finishing second only to his center Marty Walsh for the scoring title, with 32 goals (Walsh had 37). Ridpath was fourth with 22. Only Don Smith and our coach, Odie Cleghorn topped 20 that year. 1911 was pre-PCHA, so all of the top talent was consolidated in this season for those wondering.
Skene Ronan arrived in Ottawa next season (1912) and lead the league in scoring (35 goals, well ahead of the field) with Kerr on his LW (Kerr was fourth in scoring with 25 goals). This was the inaugural season of the PCHA, so there were some good players absent from the league in this year.
This was Kerr's last year in Ottawa. He went on to have several strong years in the PCHA, and was an all-star LW at least once. Ridpath had his career ended by injuries from an automobile accident after the 1911 season. He didn't play long, but his exemplary performance during his brief career and the Ottawa connection made him an easy choice for our second line.
Ronan was thought highly enough of that he was offered in a trade for the great Cyclone Taylor right before the 1912 season, in which he lead the league in goals (the Wanderers declined the trade). Ronan was primarily a defenseman before coming to Ottawa, but was given a chance at center after Marty Walsh struggled. (Interestingly, this struggle is attributed to the loss of Ridpath in The Trail. He reamined a productive center for a few more years, but never quite reached the level he did in 1912. He subbed at center behind Newsy Lalonde in the playoffs of 1916, as the Canadiens won their first Stanley Cup.
To touch on Ken Randall's position. He appears to have been mostly a defender up to and including 1917. To quote the Trail: "He was on a Cup-winner in 1918 when he also played RW on a line with Corb Denneny and Reg Noble." ... "He was on a Cup winner again in 1922, playing defense with Cameron and also RW on a line with Noble and Babe Dye. He was an even more chunky player than Pitre and it was remarkable that he could still hustle as a forward." ... "He and Charlie Langlois became the regular defense for Hamilton and he had two of his best years with the Tigers." By looking at game logs available in the book, Randall seems to have been used mainly or entirely as a forward in both the 1918 and 1922 playoffs.
I'll try to post more later on.
In fact, their line proved to be a lethal combination, as their scoring enabled the Senators to romp to the Cup in 1911. Kerr was possibly the best player in the league that year (described as "a sensation of the league" in the Trail if I recall), scoring in 12 consecutive games and finishing second only to his center Marty Walsh for the scoring title, with 32 goals (Walsh had 37). Ridpath was fourth with 22. Only Don Smith and our coach, Odie Cleghorn topped 20 that year. 1911 was pre-PCHA, so all of the top talent was consolidated in this season for those wondering.
Skene Ronan arrived in Ottawa next season (1912) and lead the league in scoring (35 goals, well ahead of the field) with Kerr on his LW (Kerr was fourth in scoring with 25 goals). This was the inaugural season of the PCHA, so there were some good players absent from the league in this year.
This was Kerr's last year in Ottawa. He went on to have several strong years in the PCHA, and was an all-star LW at least once. Ridpath had his career ended by injuries from an automobile accident after the 1911 season. He didn't play long, but his exemplary performance during his brief career and the Ottawa connection made him an easy choice for our second line.
Ronan was thought highly enough of that he was offered in a trade for the great Cyclone Taylor right before the 1912 season, in which he lead the league in goals (the Wanderers declined the trade). Ronan was primarily a defenseman before coming to Ottawa, but was given a chance at center after Marty Walsh struggled. (Interestingly, this struggle is attributed to the loss of Ridpath in The Trail. He reamined a productive center for a few more years, but never quite reached the level he did in 1912. He subbed at center behind Newsy Lalonde in the playoffs of 1916, as the Canadiens won their first Stanley Cup.
To touch on Ken Randall's position. He appears to have been mostly a defender up to and including 1917. To quote the Trail: "He was on a Cup-winner in 1918 when he also played RW on a line with Corb Denneny and Reg Noble." ... "He was on a Cup winner again in 1922, playing defense with Cameron and also RW on a line with Noble and Babe Dye. He was an even more chunky player than Pitre and it was remarkable that he could still hustle as a forward." ... "He and Charlie Langlois became the regular defense for Hamilton and he had two of his best years with the Tigers." By looking at game logs available in the book, Randall seems to have been used mainly or entirely as a forward in both the 1918 and 1922 playoffs.
I'll try to post more later on.
seventieslord
Student Of The Game
There was still another league, though, was there not? Sorry to not be 100% sure of this but I'm at work and don't have Volume 1 here with me (I have volume 3 here though!
)As for Randall, I think that confirms what I thought when I said his offensive numbers were too good to be true, as in, he must have been a forward when posting such good numbers. I assume that ES was referring to the 1918-1922 period when referring to his "peak offensive years".
Kyle McMahon
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Yes, the OPHL did exist, but clearly this was a minor league. Only a handful of recognizable names (and I mean recognizable to the posters in here of course) can be found when looking over the scoring chart. Ottawa defeated the champion of this league, Galt, en route to the Cup. The score was 7-4, but it is said that only the great goaltending of the Galt keeper kept it respectable.
To elaborate on the match-up some more:
I like the situation between the pipes, and I think we have the edge. Both Kolzig and Burke had good, but not HOF-calibre careers. But at Kolzig's peak he was one of the top netminders in the game, something that really can't be said about Burke. With all due respect to Burke, who did play some great hockey in Phoenix, he was never really a threat to the "Big 4" of goaltending in the 90's. Kolzig in fact was, leading his team to the Cup final in 1998, and winning a Vezina in 2000.
Outside of 2000, (ironically his Vezina year) Kolzig was usually very good in the playoffs, but was let down by the under-achievers in front of him. Burke never usually had great teams in front of him either, but his playoff performances, at least from a numbers standpoint, were often mediocre to poor. The sample size is rather small for Burke though, as despite playing 820 regular season games, he had just 21 playoff appearances in his whole career outside of his rookie season (clearly his best playoff outing in nearly leading the under-dog devils to the 1988 final).
I agree with you, ES, that our first line is a bit of a question mark. To look at, it's a bit of a hodge-podge, with players from three distinctly different eras. What I like is the talent that's there. All three players were legitimate stars. If Nash is at his best, we have a great blend of size and scoring ability on LW. Oliver has the ability to be primarily a goal scorer, but he's a little more balanced than his stats would indicate. While not an elite playmaker, I think he should be able to get the puck to Nash.
Oliver is also a leader with lots of big-game playoff experience, something that he can hopefully pass along to Nash, who has no post-season experience to speak of. Oliver was a key component of the early Bruins teams that enjoyed good success.
Real Cloutier had his off ice issues, but if he can stay focussed, he can be a dynamic producer for us. Two WHA scoring titles, and he was able to maintain well over a point per game average in his best two NHL seasons before he faded from the scene.
I'd say the bottom-six forwards on both teams are pretty much a wash. On your side, Zezel has the ability to bring better-than-expected offense if needed in that role. He could be valuable in the face-off dot late in a game whether you're down by a goal or leading by a goal. The tenacious McVeigh is IMO the best pure checker/energy guy on either side. Despite his pedestrian 10 goals in 30 games, he was a Western league 1st AST slection in 1922-23. He was considered one of the Americans' steadiest and most relaible forwards during his time spent in New York. He did manage to hit double-digits in goals a few times as well, in an era where that wasn't exactly an unimportant accomplishment.
Our defense is made up of guys who could all log top-paring minutes. I feel this could be to our advantage in a long series or long OT situation. We don't need to grind 25+ minutes out of our top pairing, beacuse even our third paring could easily handle 20 minutes if called upon.
In general, our number one and number three pairings feature one more offensive-minded defender and one more defensive-minded defender. Our second pairing of Lake and Shore should have no problem meshing with each other, as they manned to Ottawa defense together for a few years. Both enjoyed their best years clearing the crease for Ottawa goalie Percy LeSueur, and played very solid defense in spite of the forwards (our second line to be exact) garnering more of the attention.
The Mincer Rays might have a slight edge in the offense their blueline corps will produce. Rautikallio is clearly our best offensive rearguard, but could be offset by Van Boxmeer. Souray can produce as well, but his prowess is usually restricted to the powerplay, so it's more situational.
I do feel that Yushkevich can be a key factor in the series. A gritty, physical guy who can play those tough defensive minutes. He's the guy on our team that opposing forwards will dread having to go up against. I'm not sure if he has an equivalent on the Mincer Rays' blueline (Marois looks to be the closest) that can be asked to play that specific role, which could perhaps be the edge we need in what should be a tight series.
As far as coaching goes you can't argue with the success Kilrae's had. When you've been around that long, clearly you have the ability to adapt to changes. That being said, Cleghorn was a bit of an innovator himself, being the first coach to change lines on the fly. An old era coach should also suit the large amount of old era players we have on our roster.
seventieslord
Student Of The Game
I must concur. The OPHL wasn't that great in comparison. I see 7 drafted players and 5 more that I'd consider going forward in the AAA. I see about 32 players in the NHA that year who are drafted, and about 5 more I'd consider.
It was probably further from the NHA, than the WHA was from the NHL.
Know Your Enemy
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ES, are you sure that Randall was a defenseman when he had point totals similar to Cleghorn, Boucher, and Cameron? We know he played some RW, I just can't recall exactly when, although The Trail might shed some light on that.
Not that I want to bring him down or anything, but that might be just "too good to be true". I seriously considered him as a spare in the ATD before settling on Jimmy Roberts, and I voted for him as an all-star. (at least I'm pretty sure I did, I've already recycled my notes
Randall played most of career at defense. He played RW exclusively in 1917-1918 and he and Reg Noble alternated from D to forward for couple of seaons afterwards with Toronto. I have him listed as a D from 1919 on. My sources are the same as pnep's which are very thorough so if you ask him he'll probably say the same thing. Wanst there a thread on the History forum about players who played forward and D featuring pneps statistics?
The fact is Randall is a great offensive player no matter which way you want to look at it, if he wasn;t runing the show on D, he was playing on the top line for the St.Pats. So he was always called on to be one of the offensive leaders on the team. Ultimate hockey mention his as "one of the best players in the NHL" you can be that if youre not a great offensive player, they also make mention his stickhandling skills and hard shot. If you're still skeptical Randall offensive abilities look at his years as a Tiger where he defenitiely exclusively played D he still was one of the top offensive defensemen in the game and outscored and tied Sprague Cleghorn.In 1924 Randall outsocred Cleghorn. In 1925 they both tied for 3rd in scoring with 18 points, this was Cleghorns 3rd most prodcutive season, and Randall's 2nd most productive season, too good to be true? yeah, right.
lol
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seventieslord
Student Of The Game
"lol"? Calm down, there's no need for harsh words like that.
Did you mean to say that your sources are the same as pnep, or your source is pnep? And didn't you refer to pnep as a "crazy person" earlier in this draft?
The Trail has Randall listed as a forward in all games in the 1921 and 1922 playoffs in which he is not just a sub, which is four of eight games. Not that that is definitive proof that he was a forward all season, but it stands to reason that he was likely a forward all regular season if he was a forward all playoffs.
the rest of what you say is valid, even if randall was a forward those seasons, but even more so if he was a defenseman.
I'm just looking for the truth, like everyone else. I'm not on anyone's side.
Did you mean to say that your sources are the same as pnep, or your source is pnep? And didn't you refer to pnep as a "crazy person" earlier in this draft?
The Trail has Randall listed as a forward in all games in the 1921 and 1922 playoffs in which he is not just a sub, which is four of eight games. Not that that is definitive proof that he was a forward all season, but it stands to reason that he was likely a forward all regular season if he was a forward all playoffs.
the rest of what you say is valid, even if randall was a forward those seasons, but even more so if he was a defenseman.
I'm just looking for the truth, like everyone else. I'm not on anyone's side.
Know Your Enemy
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Thanks for the info.
We feel that we have one of the most dangerous 2nd lines in the draft. You talk about your 2nd liners having strong playoff performance and impressive peak years, which are characteristics similar to our 2nd line players.
-Pudd Glass won 5 Stanley Cups with the great Montreal Wanderes teams, and captained the team that won the cup in the NHA's first ever season. Glass was basically the glue the held those great teams together. He was a tireless worker that did everything for the team, whether it be setting up or scorng goals, or making room for his star linemates, or tirelessly checking his opponents at both end of the ice. Glass scored 22 goals in 16 career Stanley cup games. Ultimate Hockey named Glass the most consistent and hardest working forward of his era. We feel that Glass is the perfect compliment to Ogrodnick and Taylor
I noticed that Glass played a few seasons at the same time as Ridpath and Kerr. Kerr has the best numbers, Glass' goal totals were more similar to Ridpaths, but still weaker, however Glass has the advantage over both in intangibles and all-around play.
-Our set up man Billy Taylor finished 1st,3rd,4th in assists. In 1947 when he led the league in assists he beat great HHOF players like Milt Schmidt, Max Bentley, Doug Bentley, Syd Abel and Ted Kennedy. He was a huge part of the 1942 Cup winning Toronto Maple Leafs finishhing 2nd on the team in scoring behind Syl Apps with 10 points in 13 games. Taylor is described by legends of hockey as a fine facoff man, having both Zezel and Taylor gives me confidence that our team will be on the winning end of alot of key faceoffs.
-Ogrodnick was a 1st team all-star in 1985 and finished 4th in scoring behind Gretzky Kurri and was just 3 goals behind Mike Bossy, without having any elite supporting cast. Ogrodnick had 3 other 40 goal seasons. Ogrodnick was no slouch in the playoffs either, once scoring 17 goals in a stretch of 26 playoff games.
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Know Your Enemy
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Sorry, I dont mean to be a jerk, although I know I can be when defending my players, espcially right when I get home from work, sorry
. My source is a file that was given to be by pnep. The crazy person comment was just me being sily, I especially take it back since upon further reveiew, his stats were actually identical to mine in regards to whatever it was we were talking about at that time.
Know Your Enemy
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Regarding Sean Burke, if you ignore his play in international competition then you are being very unfair. Burke has played superb for team canada on more than one occasion, there is not doubt in my mind that he can be a big game player. It's interesting that raleh says i have the advantage in goal, I say its a wash and you say you have the advantage, maybe we all saw different Burke's.
The thing is there are alot of "if's", and you can't count on that. With our top lines you know what you're going to get.
And how exactly do you pass on big game experience?
McVeigh is solid, I think he and Goldsworthy are actually very similar.
I agree that Yushkevich will be big for your team. Just tlike Jarrett on our team, as he will have to be the best defensive player on our blueline. I think Jarrett is one of the most underrated players in the ATD, his towering size and the fact that he can play a physical but clean game can make him one of the more valuble defensive defensmen in the draft. He was a pretty efficient passer as well.
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seventieslord
Student Of The Game
Sorry, I dont mean to be a jerk, although I know I can be when defending my players, espcially right when I get home from work, sorry
No problem. lol's not a harsh word anyway, I'm just being silly too. The "crazy person" comment I knew was meant in jest, but I did take it as meaning "take pnep's numbers with a grain of salt, they're not always right".
Anyway, about Randall, there's no doubt either way that he was a very good player. My only question is whether he definitely did what he did, from the blueline. If it turns out that he didn't, well, he was still a good forward, and performed well from both positions.
I have an online subscription to the NY times so I can read their archives. I can search 100 articles per month so I'll use up a few of them to check up on Randall. I'll look for some games from the 1918-1925 period and see what position they list him as. (they used a Trail Of the Stanley Cup-style system that lists all players in the lineup by position in each game summary)
seventieslord
Student Of The Game
There is actually a lot less out there on him than I thought. Usually the NY times is a goldmine, and not only on NY teams, either - see my Paul Haynes bio.
- In the 1925-26 season I found a summary listing Randall as a Defenseman with New York.
- Later on in that same season I found another summary listing him as a Defenseman again.
- Another article from the same season mentioned he was a defenseman.
That's all I got. LOL, sorry, doesn't prove much other than that he was a defenseman in 1925-26.
- In the 1925-26 season I found a summary listing Randall as a Defenseman with New York.
- Later on in that same season I found another summary listing him as a Defenseman again.
- Another article from the same season mentioned he was a defenseman.
That's all I got. LOL, sorry, doesn't prove much other than that he was a defenseman in 1925-26.
MXD
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And as far as checkers are concerned, none should forget about centers Dalhstrom and Blair. Dalhstrom was the checking/PK C of the Blackhawks for quite a few years. Offensive stats are not bad, but he was a pretty consistent 20+ points during his career, except for a 40+ season in 43-44. (which is pretty much worth a 20+ season...). Playoff stats are pretty decent, with close to 0.5 PPG's.
Same thing for Andy Blair, who is more of a pesk than a pure defensive player. 2nd in assists and 3rd in points in 28. Doesn't make him an elite playmaker, but you don't get lots of those guys in MLD's either. He was also pretty huge for his era, clocking at 6'1 or 6'2. He was also used as a 3rd line Center for a while, and still managed to earn decent scoring totals.
Same thing for Andy Blair, who is more of a pesk than a pure defensive player. 2nd in assists and 3rd in points in 28. Doesn't make him an elite playmaker, but you don't get lots of those guys in MLD's either. He was also pretty huge for his era, clocking at 6'1 or 6'2. He was also used as a 3rd line Center for a while, and still managed to earn decent scoring totals.
VanIslander
A 19-year ATDer on HfBoards
Keep those votes coming in!
the absolute DEADLINE for voting is Friday at noon eastern
PM me the winner of the series, in how many games, and the three stars of the series
pnep
Registered User
Sorry, I dont mean to be a jerk, although I know I can be when defending my players, espcially right when I get home from work, sorry
Data from North American Pro Hockey site (http://www.ottawavalleyonline.com/sites/tomking_01/tkpage2.html)
SEASON|POS
1917-18|RW/D
1918-19|RW/D
1919-20|D
1920-21|D/RW
1921-22|RW
1922-23|D/RW
1923-24|D/RW
1924-25|D
1925-26|D
1926-27|D
Data from old Hockey Research site (not sihrhockey.org)
SEASON|POS
1917-18|R/D
1918-19|D
1919-20|D
1920-21|D
1921-22|D/R
1922-23|D/R
1923-24|D
1924-25|D
1925-26|D
1926-27|D
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VanIslander
A 19-year ATDer on HfBoards
Pee Wee vs. Pud in Game 1
(VI) The two team captains shined in the opening game of the best-of-3 first round affair. Manglers captain Harry Oliver recorded a hat trick and Mincer Rays captain Frank Glass recorded a goal and two assists in a seesaw contest to the very end.
Camille Henry opened the scoring for the home team on a shovel in over a sprawled Kolzig of a Goldsworthy rebound from Marois at 11:48 of the first. It awoke a stunned crowd that had seen the visitors from Yaroslavl outshoot the home boys 7-0 until that point, with the best chance coming from Kerr and Ridpath undressing Sydor on a 3-on-2 break which saw Ronan taken out by a Marois open ice hit. The Manglers defense kept the Rays shooters to the perimeter, coach Cleghorn scrambling to get his third and fourth lines out against Dayton scorers, resulting in a botched line change breakaway by Savard but he shot wide.
A powerplay at 13:02 saw the Manglers even things up on a set play to Oliver from Cloutier and Souray, five hole on Burke who was screened by his own defenseman van Boxmeer. The visitors quickly added another to go ahead 2-1 on the next shift as Oliver smoothly swept past Randall and scored on a nice feed from Yushkevich on an Ogrodnick turnover shortly after Taylor had won the face-off.
Ohioans were happy to see the opening frame end all tied up 2-2 on a late marker by Glass from Taylor. Rays winger Fraser left the game after a hard check from Lake.
The second period began much as the first had, with the visitors displaying a willingness to pay the price physically and be sound positionally. The Dahlstrom line faced the Savard line at every opportunity and it clearly was frustrating the impatient fans who booed all three times the Manglers took pucks away and surged up ice, up 17-5 in shots through two periods, the 14th shot beating Burke gloveside from Oliver unassisted.
The third period began with a fight as Marois and Shore squared off following a hipcheck of Nash by Jarrett which sent the Manglers winger flying into the boards face first. With Marois serving at extra two minutes for instigating, Randall scored with the man advantage from Glass and Morrison to quickly even the score 3-3.
At 14:50 of the final frame Ogrodnick scored the winner on his only shot of the game, from Glass and Sydor. It was an innocent looking shot which deflected off Ohlund's skate and over Kolzig's stick. Larose got an empty netter as the home team won 5-3. Taylor led the team in shots with 4 of their 13, though both Oliver and Ronan led with 6 apiece on 27 by the Manglers.
Fraser is questionable for game two with an undetermined upper body injury and Ron Sutter is expected to suit up.
(VI) The two team captains shined in the opening game of the best-of-3 first round affair. Manglers captain Harry Oliver recorded a hat trick and Mincer Rays captain Frank Glass recorded a goal and two assists in a seesaw contest to the very end.
Camille Henry opened the scoring for the home team on a shovel in over a sprawled Kolzig of a Goldsworthy rebound from Marois at 11:48 of the first. It awoke a stunned crowd that had seen the visitors from Yaroslavl outshoot the home boys 7-0 until that point, with the best chance coming from Kerr and Ridpath undressing Sydor on a 3-on-2 break which saw Ronan taken out by a Marois open ice hit. The Manglers defense kept the Rays shooters to the perimeter, coach Cleghorn scrambling to get his third and fourth lines out against Dayton scorers, resulting in a botched line change breakaway by Savard but he shot wide.
A powerplay at 13:02 saw the Manglers even things up on a set play to Oliver from Cloutier and Souray, five hole on Burke who was screened by his own defenseman van Boxmeer. The visitors quickly added another to go ahead 2-1 on the next shift as Oliver smoothly swept past Randall and scored on a nice feed from Yushkevich on an Ogrodnick turnover shortly after Taylor had won the face-off.
Ohioans were happy to see the opening frame end all tied up 2-2 on a late marker by Glass from Taylor. Rays winger Fraser left the game after a hard check from Lake.
The second period began much as the first had, with the visitors displaying a willingness to pay the price physically and be sound positionally. The Dahlstrom line faced the Savard line at every opportunity and it clearly was frustrating the impatient fans who booed all three times the Manglers took pucks away and surged up ice, up 17-5 in shots through two periods, the 14th shot beating Burke gloveside from Oliver unassisted.
The third period began with a fight as Marois and Shore squared off following a hipcheck of Nash by Jarrett which sent the Manglers winger flying into the boards face first. With Marois serving at extra two minutes for instigating, Randall scored with the man advantage from Glass and Morrison to quickly even the score 3-3.
At 14:50 of the final frame Ogrodnick scored the winner on his only shot of the game, from Glass and Sydor. It was an innocent looking shot which deflected off Ohlund's skate and over Kolzig's stick. Larose got an empty netter as the home team won 5-3. Taylor led the team in shots with 4 of their 13, though both Oliver and Ronan led with 6 apiece on 27 by the Manglers.
Fraser is questionable for game two with an undetermined upper body injury and Ron Sutter is expected to suit up.
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One Kid gets kicked out, another Kid scores
(VI) Pee Wee Oliver again makes an impact early scoring two goals in the opening period of a run-and-gun contest which sees each team take 30+ shots at the opposing goalie. Rautakallio set up both and clearly ran the Manglers offense after a pretty muted first game. Henry lessens the gap to one from Randall at 19:07.
No scoring in the middle frame despite three powerplays for the home team, two for the visitors. For the first time the Mincer Rays lead in shots, 13-11 in the period, 25-20 heading into the third.
Dayton alternate captain Randall ties the game on a give-and-go surge with Zezel, Larose dropping back to cover for the rushing defender. The Pepper Kid shakes Kolzig with a head fake before blasting a shot top shelf. Three minutes later Randall is ejected from the game after he hit Ridpath from behind, sending the Manglers winger through the glass and to the hospital. The home crowd erupted in cheers as Randall raised his fist as he walked off.
At 16:42 of the third, Billy "The Kid" Taylor scores the go ahead goal on the transition from Morrison after catching Souray pinching. A breakaway from Oliver on a sweet Rautakallio pass almost ties it for the boys from Yaroslavl as the shot rings off the post with just over a minute remaining. Then Cloutier and Oliver each get another shot at Burke to no avail and the game ends with Yushkevich slapping one last attempt from fifty feet. The game ends 3-2 and the two-game sweep for Dayton. Oliver is named the series first star in a losing effort, Randall and Taylor named second and third stars for the victors.
Mincer Rays assistant coach Kromm is credited by the players and head coach with helping re-write their game plan to open things up after a tight game one but Kromm praises Burke for holding the fort and Sutter for limiting Ronan to one shot.
Dayton heads next to the Mickey Ion semifinals to meet a yet to be determined opponent. If Adirondack defeats Tidewater, then the Mincer Rays head to New York to take on the divisional champs in a best of seven series, if Tidewater upsets Adirondack, then the boys from Ohio head to Oxford.
(VI) Pee Wee Oliver again makes an impact early scoring two goals in the opening period of a run-and-gun contest which sees each team take 30+ shots at the opposing goalie. Rautakallio set up both and clearly ran the Manglers offense after a pretty muted first game. Henry lessens the gap to one from Randall at 19:07.
No scoring in the middle frame despite three powerplays for the home team, two for the visitors. For the first time the Mincer Rays lead in shots, 13-11 in the period, 25-20 heading into the third.
Dayton alternate captain Randall ties the game on a give-and-go surge with Zezel, Larose dropping back to cover for the rushing defender. The Pepper Kid shakes Kolzig with a head fake before blasting a shot top shelf. Three minutes later Randall is ejected from the game after he hit Ridpath from behind, sending the Manglers winger through the glass and to the hospital. The home crowd erupted in cheers as Randall raised his fist as he walked off.
At 16:42 of the third, Billy "The Kid" Taylor scores the go ahead goal on the transition from Morrison after catching Souray pinching. A breakaway from Oliver on a sweet Rautakallio pass almost ties it for the boys from Yaroslavl as the shot rings off the post with just over a minute remaining. Then Cloutier and Oliver each get another shot at Burke to no avail and the game ends with Yushkevich slapping one last attempt from fifty feet. The game ends 3-2 and the two-game sweep for Dayton. Oliver is named the series first star in a losing effort, Randall and Taylor named second and third stars for the victors.
Mincer Rays assistant coach Kromm is credited by the players and head coach with helping re-write their game plan to open things up after a tight game one but Kromm praises Burke for holding the fort and Sutter for limiting Ronan to one shot.
Dayton heads next to the Mickey Ion semifinals to meet a yet to be determined opponent. If Adirondack defeats Tidewater, then the Mincer Rays head to New York to take on the divisional champs in a best of seven series, if Tidewater upsets Adirondack, then the boys from Ohio head to Oxford.
