ATD Poll: Should we have bio threads instead of posts?

[jarek]

The details are laid out here: http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=2184717

In essence, the idea would be to move from a system of individuals creating bios to pooling our collective knowledge to get the best picture possible of each player through public threads.

Pros:
Very little information would get missed on each player.
Group effort means the onus on any single person probably won't be too high.
No (ideally) players would get drafted in the ATD without a bio.
Centralized, constantly updated - easy to find information.

Cons:
A LOT of up front work to move all the current knowledge to the threads.
A lot of maintenance - likely would require several mods keeping track of the threads to ensure relevant information is concentrated in the first few posts. This will become especially challenging for threads that get to 100+ posts.
Potentially this may deaden active discussion in the ATD sub-forum.

Thoughts?

Click to read more...

 

[ResilientBeast]

Because of the cons I'm inclined to say no.

1) I have no trouble finding anything I need using the search function already
2) The threads would damper actual conversations and arguments in the draft threads
3) This would be a non issue if people condensed previous bios when making a new one

 

[jarek]

Because of the cons I'm inclined to say no.

1) I have no trouble finding anything I need using the search function already
2) The threads would damper actual conversations and arguments in the draft threads
3) This would be a non issue if people condensed previous bios when making a new one

No arguments there.

 

[JFA87-66-99]

Is there a way to take an already created bio and just simply add on to it without all the copy and paste

 

[ResilientBeast]

Is there a way to take an already created bio and just simply add on to it without all the copy and paste

It requires mods to do it

 

[jarek]

It requires mods to do it

Couldn't there be a mod dedicated to doing this? That would pretty much eliminate the need for bio threads to begin with.

 

[ResilientBeast]

Couldn't there be a mod dedicated to doing this? That would pretty much eliminate the need for bio threads to begin with.

That's a lot of work for that task, I live on the site some days but even then. I think the onus should fall on the people drafting to condense information not on the mods. Better bios help everyone

 

[jarek]

That's a lot of work for that task, I live on the site some days but even then. I think the onus should fall on the people drafting to condense information not on the mods. Better bios help everyone

I 100% agree, but expecting that is not realistic.

 

[ResilientBeast]

I 100% agree, but expecting that is not realistic.

The delegating the task to someone else isn't something I think is fair/realistic. I don't see why we need to try and reinvent the wheel, the information is all here for the most part, and understandably some people don't have time for extensive research but there are already several bios that are more than sufficient

 

[jarek]

The delegating the task to someone else isn't something I think is fair/realistic. I don't see why we need to try and reinvent the wheel, the information is all here for the most part, and understandably some people don't have time for extensive research but there are already several bios that are more than sufficient

Well I wouldn't want to force anyone to do this. It's just an idea I threw out there. Probably not a great one though.

 

[Leaf Lander]

Secret ballot poll

 

[bluesfan94]

I'm an off-and-on ATDer depending on what's going on at the time (at this point I'm in my first year of law school and don't have time to devote to the ATD) so take my opinion with that caveat.

Personally, making the bios is a big part of why I like the ATD. Especially towards the end of the draft, but really throughout, I would lean towards drafting a player that is bioless such that I can create a bio. I also do the baseball ATD (I'm currently in it) and I wish there was more of an emphasis on making and maintaining bios. On the other hand, the lack of bios does make it less time consuming and I actually have time to do it because of that.

However, getting to how I actually feel about the question, I don't necessarily think that having a thread per player is better. I think you'd still have to have a master key like you do now. While it would be useful to be able to contribute random quotes you find here and there, I think the benefit of that ability is offset by the difficulties facing the mods in keeping that information in the opening post(s). Further, I think there's a bit of a strategy involved in creating bios, based on what attribute of a player you want to highlight for your team. Sure, having the other bios in a master thread allows people to do their own research, but you can definitely focus on certain characteristics for the design of your team. Having a "master bio" takes away from that.

Accordingly, I lean towards not being a fan of this idea, although I'm willing to be swayed in a different direction

 

[jarek]

So I found the perfect compromise which was actually suggested a long time ago and never seemed to get off the ground: an ATD bio wiki.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=862885

 

[ResilientBeast]

I am definitely against moving the draft itself off of hfboards - we do that and it becomes incredibly inaccessible for new people, even farther removed from the History of Hockey board, and very much an "insider's club." It also makes it much easier to forget about and not really follow if you aren't involved in that particular draft.

However, I absolutely see the value of using the wiki for bios and perhaps roster threads. I love the idea of doing up bios in wikis and then linking them here.

my attitude

 

[jarek]

my attitude

Right. We wouldn't move the draft itself. However, the idea of having an ATD BIO wiki where people can add information on the fly quickly and easily should be appealing to just about everyone.

 

[seventieslord]

what are the pros for this compared to just threads?

 

[jarek]

what are the pros for this compared to just threads?

Anyone can edit them.

To the issue of someone adding "bad" information, we can create a template that can make all the bios look consistent, and in that template, add a section people can put their own stuff in. As the information gets scrutinized, it can then be transferred to the main bio.

Also, we don't need HFBoards approval to go ahead with this.

 

[seventieslord]

Anyone can edit them.

To the issue of someone adding "bad" information, we can create a template that can make all the bios look consistent, and in that template, add a section people can put their own stuff in. As the information gets scrutinized, it can then be transferred to the main bio.

Also, we don't need HFBoards approval to go ahead with this.

Do we actually need approval to start a bunch of threads?

Anyone can "edit" a thread by posting in it as well. I don't see the difference.

 

[jarek]

Do we actually need approval to start a bunch of threads?

Anyone can "edit" a thread by posting in it as well. I don't see the difference.

Yes, we actually do need approval to start something as massive as bio threads for every player. This was already discussed in this thread.

Additionally, I also pointed out the problem with people just randomly dumping stuff into bio threads as well. In very long threads, the information may get very disjointed, and if nobody is actively consolidating all the information then it can get very frustrating to find the useful stuff.

 

[seventieslord]

Yes, we actually do need approval to start something as massive as bio threads for every player. This was already discussed in this thread.

It has? Someone has actually confirmed we need permission to start threads when there are a dozen "GDT" threads created every single day of the NHL season for the purpose of inane chatter?

Additionally, I also pointed out the problem with people just randomly dumping stuff into bio threads as well. In very long threads, the information may get very disjointed, and if nobody is actively consolidating all the information then it can get very frustrating to find the useful stuff.

Frustrating to find all the useful stuff when it's all in one thread? WE SHOULD BE SO LUCKY! - right now you have to search the player's name and pull 3-5 posts where there might be something useful.

 

[jarek]

It has? Someone has actually confirmed we need permission to start threads when there are a dozen "GDT" threads created every single day of the NHL season for the purpose of inane chatter?

What RB said earlier in the thread is as much confirmation of that as anything. Do those GDT threads not get deleted after the fact?

Frustrating to find all the useful stuff when it's all in one thread? WE SHOULD BE SO LUCKY! - right now you have to search the player's name and pull 3-5 posts where there might be something useful.

Fair point, it would be much easier than it is at the moment. However, a wiki would make it even easier than that.

 

[seventieslord]

What RB said earlier in the thread is as much confirmation of that as anything. Do those GDT threads not get deleted after the fact?

Not to my knowledge.

And what did RB say exactly that you're taking as confirmation that we need permission? I must be missing it.

 

[jarek]

Not to my knowledge.

And what did RB say exactly that you're taking as confirmation that we need permission? I must be missing it.

Strange.. seems the posts got deleted for some reason. Or they were in another thread entirely.

The condensed version is that the site is undergoing some significant infrastructure changes soon and RB himself mentioned that, due to the sheer size of this endeavor in terms of how much server space it would require, we would need to speak to an HFBoards supervisor for permission.

 

[seventieslord]

Strange.. seems the posts got deleted for some reason. Or they were in another thread entirely.

The condensed version is that the site is undergoing some significant infrastructure changes soon and RB himself mentioned that, due to the sheer size of this endeavor in terms of how much server space it would require, we would need to speak to an HFBoards supervisor for permission.

that's true about the infrastructure changes, but threads themselves don't take up server space. it's all just text and html code, right?

 

[jarek]

that's true about the infrastructure changes, but threads themselves don't take up server space. it's all just text and html code, right?

Everything takes up server space. Every single text character will take up 1-4 bytes of server storage, sometimes more, depending on the encoding (read up on UTF if you're more interested in how this works).

Each individual thread won't represent significant storage space, but the collective absolutely would.