ATD Chat Thread XIX

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The Macho King

Back* to Back** World Champion
Jun 22, 2011
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So, this thought just came to me: Does anyone know if any of the players we draft have ever been aware of this?
I know we've had some fairly notable hockey historians participate that may have told people, but I can't imagine Brian Leetch or whomever is looking on the most obscure part of a hockey forum for their name.

I always thought a hockey writer like Sean McIndoe may think this is a cool project though.
 

Habsfan18

The Hockey Library
May 13, 2003
30,699
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Ontario
So, this thought just came to me: Does anyone know if any of the players we draft have ever been aware of this?

Not a player, but I’m still working on Stan Fischler being my co-GM one year. :laugh:

But seriously, I did tell Stan about our ATD drafts a few years back and he thought the concept was pretty neat.
 

jigglysquishy

Registered User
Jun 20, 2011
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It'd be really neat to bring actual players in and compare notes.

Sights&Sounds does top movie lists and includes both critics and filmmakers. You get some really interesting results. The absolute best lists and discussions come from filmmakers, but it also comes out that a lot of filmmakers don't put a lot of thought into it.

The logistics of tracking down Scott Stevens and Sergei Makarov are immense and the likelihood is you would only get a handful of players interested in the entirety of the history. I think hockey historians/journalists would be more interested, but then again we already have some of them here.

We would get better reception for an ATD than a top players list.
 

BenchBrawl

Registered User
Jul 26, 2010
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It's possible one of us is actually a NHL superstar and is hiding his identity.

Not me though lol I wish
 

Hockey Outsider

Registered User
Jan 16, 2005
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So, out of curiosity, how did you guys get into the ATD?

I had a member of the board that I don't think is around anymore recommend that I try it, and so I decided to give it a shot. I found it a little stressful, but highly enjoyable, so I'm still at it.
This is probably a much longer response than what you're looking for, but quoting myself from another thread (I think I wrote this in 2020):

My first ATD was on another site - I think it was called Metro Boards. It's been offline for at least 15 years. I was able to find an old Word doc with a partial roster. I won't post it now because many of the players haven't yet been drafted, but it was a ridiculously good team (even taking into account the fact that it was a ~12 team draft, from what I recall). I found that draft through Darryl Shilling (fifteen years ago, he had a great website with all kinds of ambitious and interesting articles that married hockey history with stats - it's a shame he never got a wider audience).

My first ATD on HFBoards was #3, which ran in the spring of 2005. I had just joined HFBoards that January. I took over from a GM who dropped out after four (?) picks. He gave me a pretty good start - Howe, Dionne, Coffey and Kharlamov. Back then, it was easy to get pre-expansion stars late into the draft. The challenge was then convincing people that these players were actually great (and everyone else had underrated them). I had a good team, but @BM67 was probably the strongest (he used the same strategy as me), and @dirt 101 would have been right behind (Clarke, Messier and Yzerman up the middle).

I skipped ATD #4 (fall 2005) - I can't remember why. Then I put together a tough, physical team for ATD #5 (spring 2006). It was quite a bit weaker offensively than most of my other teams, but they would have been a pain to play against. That was the last draft before we had playoffs.

ATD #6 (fall 2006) was the first HFBoards draft to feature playoffs. I won that draft after a close, hard-fought series against BM67. I've had lot of successes and good memories throughout my life - and I'm not saying that this is near the top, but winning ATD #6 is somewhere on that list. It was important for me to do well in this draft because I didn't want to be seen as just a "numbers guy" - I wanted to show everyone that I also understood hockey strategy and roster management, beyond simply reading a spreadsheet. I think I achieved that. Over fourteen years later, I still love how this team was constructed - incredibly well balanced.

Next was ATD #7 (spring 2007). I don't remember too much about this draft. The team was focused too heavily on defense, but still managed to make it to the ATD semi-finals. @pitseleh (one of my all-time favourite HOH posters - who I don't think has been active for many years) beat me in a seven game series - his team had a bit more firepower and was the rightful winner. (Note - ATD #7 features my all-time favourite team. @Nalyd Psycho had the 3rd pick, and selected Howe, then traded up to get the 4th pick as well, to get Lemieux. I can't tell from the draft thread what it cost him - it certainly was a lot - but it was an incredibly ambitious strategy. He was eliminated early in the playoffs, but I have a ton of respect for someone who used such a bold, unconventional approach).

I won ATD #8 (fall 2007), after another seven-game finals series against pitseleh. It was redemption for the previous draft. He made a bold move, trading picks 4 and 165 for 1 and 225 - giving up 60(!) spots to get Orr instead of Lemieux - and it very nearly paid off. My team was pretty similar to the one from the previous year - great goaltending and defense, but not a ton of offensive depth. I really enjoyed building around Potvin. Note that pitseleh's team had Frank Nighbor on the second line. Back then, far less was known about Nighbor's greatness. If the ATD community voted on the matchup today, based on what we've learned over the past 13 years about Nighbor (and everyone else), I think his team would (rightfully) win.

It's still painful for me to think about ATD #9 (winter 2008). I was eager to defend the title, but I had to back out after my father died unexpectedly. It was just a few days after the draft began, and fortunately @The Mighty Duck Man stepped in to take over my team. The next year was very tough for me, but I wanted to return to my routine (in all aspects of life) as soon as possible. pitseleh was very kind in letting me co-GM a team with him. I don't recall exactly when I teamed up with him - maybe it was two-thirds of the way through the draft. Our team was knocked out by @shawnmullin strong, balanced team in the quarter-finals (ie eight teams left). "Only" making it to the quarter-finals was a disappointing result given that pitseleh and I had won the past three ATD's - but, vastly more important than that, it allowed me to get back into my normal routine.

ATD #10 (winter 2009) was also tough. I was trying to balance the draft while working 80+ hour weeks. I wish that were an exaggeration, but it isn't. I remember the frustration I felt in trying to squeeze in a bit of research at 1AM each night before heading back for another grueling 15 hour day. I was so tired and unfocused that some of my posts didn't make any sense (I remember stating, in one of the playoff matchups, that I'd play my 4th line ~20 minutes a game because they're good defensively - not exactly a winning strategy). For some time I wondered if my team advanced to the finals (for the fourth time in five drafts) simply due to my reputation. Looking back on the roster 11 years later, it's stronger than I remembered, but @Sturminator rightfully beat me in the final as I just didn't have enough offensive depth.

I also participated in a few MLD's - I teamed up with @dirt 101 for at least one of them. I enjoyed those as well (even if they're not quite as memorable as the main ATD's).

I haven't participated in an ATD since 2009. I'm not quite working 80 hours a week anymore, but I'm usually working ~60 hours a week January through April, and I keep remembering how frustrating ATD #10 was for me (despite my team finishing second - which tells me that the process is more important than the result). I'm fairly sure I could put together an above-average team without a huge time commitment, but that's not how I do things. If I'm going to play, I want to win, and probably one of the reasons I was successful in the past was I had much more free time than I do now. I haven't ruled out the possibility of returning one day - though I might feel like a 52 year old Gordie Howe in 1980, returning to the NHL after nearly a decade.
 

Professor What

Registered User
Sep 16, 2020
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I was looking over the draft history some the other day and I noticed that there were a couple of drafts that had 40(!) teams in them. How long did those drafts take?
 

ImporterExporter

"You're a boring old man"
Jun 18, 2013
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Oblivion Express
View attachment 819455

Kucherov in the scoring race seeing McDavid


NK just keeps scoring. Should be a wild race between Kuch, Mac, and McD


1708051061017.png
 

BenchBrawl

Registered User
Jul 26, 2010
30,902
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I red many people last year starting to claim that McDavid was at Lemieux' level. This year confirms he's not.

Lemieux would not lose an Art Ross to Kucherov/MacKinnon at 27 years old, or at least, he wouldn't have a lower PPG.

McDavid can peak at Lemieux level but he cannot maintain it consistently like Mario did.
 
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VanIslander

A 19-year ATDer on HfBoards
Sep 4, 2004
35,338
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South Korea
Does anyone around here play Wordle?

Every day I do it and Quordle (four words at the same time - a bit different strategy).

And yesterday was the hardest Quordle in years. It usually takes under 10 minutes, or 5 minutes here, 5 there, 5 later in the day. But it took almost an hour of my day! (No research, just mentally trying letter combos; i am an English language teacher so word patterns is part of my job).

I got it eventually.

The four words were:

Snaky, talon, weedy (i sometimes overlook double letter combos) and..

Hint: i had four of the letters: eauh
Guess what the 4th word was. :)
 

Hawkey Town 18

Registered User
Jun 29, 2009
8,257
1,651
Chicago, IL
Does anyone around here play Wordle?

Every day I do it and Quordle (four words at the same time - a bit different strategy).

And yesterday was the hardest Quordle in years. It usually takes under 10 minutes, or 5 minutes here, 5 there, 5 later in the day. But it took almost an hour of my day! (No research, just mentally trying letter combos; i am an English language teacher so word patterns is part of my job).

I got it eventually.

The four words were:

Snaky, talon, weedy (i sometimes overlook double letter combos) and..

Hint: i had four of the letters: eauh
Guess what the 4th word was. :)

I had the first 3 words in only 5 guesses and then busted trying to get weedy. I was running late for something, so I did the whole thing in a matter of a couple minutes, but yep, the double E got me.
 

ImporterExporter

"You're a boring old man"
Jun 18, 2013
18,871
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Oblivion Express
I’m still waiting for McDavid to casually put up 25 points in a 6 game stretch, simply because he feels like it. :laugh:

But in all seriousness, it’s probably Kuch’s to lose at this point. But I’d never count out McDavid.

4 points puts a bit more separation but there is indeed far too much hockey left to count McDavid out. Mac can't be overlooked, especially with that roster around him. Should be a fun finish.

Sid with another marker in the early going today against Philly (he absolutely owns that franchise). Would be neat to see the old fart make a run at 50.

Speaking of 50. Matthews only 5th in the NHL shots but blowing everyone away in goal output. 70+ seems quite realistic. He's a sniper of the highest order. Just needs some playoff meat on the resume.
 
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Voight

#winning
Feb 8, 2012
40,745
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Mulberry Street
So, out of curiosity, how did you guys get into the ATD?

I had a member of the board that I don't think is around anymore recommend that I try it, and so I decided to give it a shot. I found it a little stressful, but highly enjoyable, so I'm still at it.

Can't remember but I think I was invited via PM from someone who also posts on the HOH forum.
 

BenchBrawl

Registered User
Jul 26, 2010
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13,701
Problem is Crosby is wasting the rest of his career if he stays in Pittsburgh.

He should go to Colorado.
 

Johnny Engine

Moderator
Jul 29, 2009
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Problem is Crosby is wasting the rest of his career if he stays in Pittsburgh.

He should go to Colorado.
I can't deny that I've messed around with Capfriendly to see how that exact trade would work. Ryan Johansen is obviously a guy who 1) costs too much 2) would have his lineup spot replaced outright and 3) would not be missed, but obviously it also has to be worth Pittsburgh's while too. Girard's a guy who could be spared now that Byram's around, and isn't totally without value, so he might be a better fit for the biggest cap-removal. And of course the amount of prospect and pick value would have to be astronomical. In some ways, it should have been Newhook, but that ship sailed.

The two things I do know are 1) this isn't happening and 2) this exact thought process has been covered on the trade board and I don't want to ever go there or read any of it.
 

BenchBrawl

Registered User
Jul 26, 2010
30,902
13,701
I can't deny that I've messed around with Capfriendly to see how that exact trade would work. Ryan Johansen is obviously a guy who 1) costs too much 2) would have his lineup spot replaced outright and 3) would not be missed, but obviously it also has to be worth Pittsburgh's while too. Girard's a guy who could be spared now that Byram's around, and isn't totally without value, so he might be a better fit for the biggest cap-removal. And of course the amount of prospect and pick value would have to be astronomical. In some ways, it should have been Newhook, but that ship sailed.

The two things I do know are 1) this isn't happening and 2) this exact thought process has been covered on the trade board and I don't want to ever go there or read any of it.

I don't even bother looking at such level of details about the current NHL anymore. Whatever happens, happens. Just sad that Crosby will waste his last years on a non-contender.

Pittsburgh itself would do well to start rebuilding asap and grab another bunch of young superstars. The Crosby/Malkin era is done.
 

Hockey Outsider

Registered User
Jan 16, 2005
9,177
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I still have Beliveau ahead of Crosby, but this season is pretty much the exact thing Crosby needs to do to move ahead.
I know I've mentioned this a few times, but once he retires, I want to do a deep dive on Crosby vs Beliveau. I've ranked Beliveau 5th all-time for at least a decade now but there's very little separating them at this point. (Of course, McDavid could end up passing them both - but that discussion is premature by at least five years, and perhaps a full decade).
 

BenchBrawl

Registered User
Jul 26, 2010
30,902
13,701
I know I've mentioned this a few times, but once he retires, I want to do a deep dive on Crosby vs Beliveau. I've ranked Beliveau 5th all-time for at least a decade now but there's very little separating them at this point. (Of course, McDavid could end up passing them both - but that discussion is premature by at least five years, and perhaps a full decade).

Béliveau being much taller and bigger than Sid is a very good reason to favor him as a tiebreaker.
 
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