Atd#8-ML 1st Round: #2 New York Americans vs. #7 Belleville Bulls

[VanIslander]

Sir Montagu Allan Division Playoffs


New York Americans

coach: Frank Patrick
captain: Hobey Baker
alternates: Boris Mayorov, Jeff Beukeboom
team MVP: Hobey Baker

Boris Mayorov (A) - Billy Taylor - Rick Kehoe
Alex Shibicky - Bill Thoms - Harry Oliver
Louis Berlinquette - Bruce MacGregor - Anders Kallur
Ethan Moreau - Stephane Yelle - Bobby Gould
Shawn Burr

Hobey Baker (C) - Battleship Leduc
Jeff Brown - Jeff Beukeboom (A)
Bert Marshall - Robyn Regehr
Bert McCaffrey

Paddy Moran
Henrik Lundqvist



vs.



Belleville Bulls

coach: Al MacNeil
assistant coach: Marc Habscheid
captain: Gord Fraser
alternates: Georges Mantha, Wade Redden
team MVP: Pierre Mondou

Petr Nedved - Craig H. Janney - Todd Bertuzzi
Alex Tanguay - Pierre Mondou - Pavol Demitra
Georges Mantha (A) - Orest Kindrachuk - Leroy Goldsworthy
Danny Grant - Cal Gardner - Willy Lindstrom
Hank Goldup

Wade Redden (A) - Gord Fraser (C)
Dana Murzyn - Muzz Patrick
Anton Volchenkov - Dale Rolfe
Mike Komisarek

Felix Potvin
Arturs Irbe​

Click to read more...

 

[VanIslander]

New York Americans

PP1: Mayorov - MacGregor - Kehoe - Baker - Taylor
PP2: Shibicky - Thoms - Oliver - Brown - Leduc

PK1: Yelle - Gould - Marshall - Beukeboom
PK2: MacGregor - Moreau - Leduc - Regehr

vs.

Belleville Bulls

PP1: Grant - Janney - Bertuzzi - Redden - Mantha
PP2: Tanguay - Mondou - Demitra - Rolfe - Fraser

PK1: Mantha - Mondou - Redden - Fraser
PK2: Goldsworthy - Kindrachuk - Volchenkov - Rolfe

 

[Diving Pokecheck*]

This seems to me to be a battle of the modern and the old-timey in every aspect-goal, defense, forward. This will be a very interesting contest.

In goal, I think that the Americans have an advantage, with an acception-Potvin is streaky, and may have a good series, or a bad series.

I would also give defense to the Americans. Hobey Baker is arguably the best defenseman, and is also a great captain.

I would say that the offense is more even. The Bulls have a more talented first line, but it is depending on two malcontents. Janney has a very good 86 assists and 110 points in 120 playoff games, but the other two-Nedved (42 in 79) and Bertuzzi (21 points in 40) have a much lower ppg in the playoffs then in the regular season.
It should be a good and entertaining series.

 

[The_Hockey_Guy18]

Will post more on the match up later, looks to be a good series though.

 

[chaosrevolver]

On behalf of Nate and the rest of the Belleville Bulls organization, we would like to wish good luck to the New York Americans, and heres to a great series.

Wed also like to thank everyone who will give their opinions as you are the ones that decide the series and we love to hear your opinions.

 

[chaosrevolver]

The Belleville Bulls were built with three offensive lines. Our first line which we will admit is iffy on defense but the offensive aspect is definetly there. The sniper in Nedved, playmaker in Janney and big-body physical presence in Bertuzzi. Our second line is more responsible defensively but doesnt give up too much on offence with Mondou, Tanguay and Demitra. Our 4th line is what we conisder our secret line. It contains speed (Lindstrom), scoring ability (Grant who had a 50 Goal-Season) and another good two-way player in Gardner. We also have in our opinions one of the more dynamic shut down lines as not only do they provide physical fore and back checking but also some pretty solid offence.

The Bulls defense is built tough. No other way to put it. Other than Redden, all of our defenseman are known to be defensively responsible hard-hitting, fighting, defenseman. And thats the way we like it. We also have some good offensive players in Rolfe (Final three playoff performances, recorded 21 points in 37 games) and Gord Fraser (solid puckmover, had a 20 and 10 point seasons as a 2nd pairing d-man) who is also our captain.

In net we have a solid one, two in Felix Potvin and Arturs Irbe. We might play eachother atleast once in the first three games and see who performs better before deciding who the number one is, ofcourse thats depending on how we perform.

Anyway, we know we are facing a great team. There is a reason that we voted them #1 in this division. We once again wish goodluck and hopefully this will be a great and entertaining matchup.

 

[papershoes]

This is going to be an interesting series.

I thought Belleville built a really solid team. And, despite finishing 7th in the division on paper, this was a really strong division.

New York has a strong advantage in goal with Paddy Moran. That said, if the Felix Potvin of 92-93 shows up this series could get very interesting. Potvin, though streaky, has the ability to steal some games.

What concerns me about Belleville's top-line is the Bertuzzi that decides to show up. I've been frustrated beyond belief waiting for Bertuzzi to play his 'A' game with the 'nucks in the playoffs. He has the ability to dominate games (we've seen it in the regular season) but, can completely disappear in the playoffs. Janney could offset this slightly but, if Bertuzzi disappears, that is a huge hit to the first line.

Nedved can be streaky as well. I might consider giving Tanguay increased minutes on left wing. Tanguay has performed admirably in the playoffs, and was great in Colorado's 2000-2001 Stanley Cup win (21 points in 23 games, including 2 goals in game seven).

I'll try to post more soon...

 

[God Bless Canada]

I think Belleville has the potential to ice a more offensively dangerous team. The Americans might be the most well-balanced team in the draft. They don't really have that guy who stands out as a potential superstar for this level, but they have tremendous depth and a strong team game.

Two things stand out as the differences: goaltending and character. The over-under for a Felix Potvin meltdown is two games. He has the potential to be an ATD back-up, but lacks the mental edge and the consistency. Irbe's the better goalie, and even Irbe wasn't always the most consistent guy. A big edge to the Americans.

As for character, you might as well label Belleville's first line the "Cancer Line." All three players developed a well-earned reputation for being locker room malcontents. There is some character elsewhere in the line-up, but nothing compared to the Americans.

Worth watching will be Hobey Baker's reaction to the Belleville forecheck, especially Bertuzzi. Baker was a sensational offensive talent, but he liked a good clean game. The ultimate sportsman, he was known to walk into the opponents' locker room after the game to shake the opponents' hands. He's never faced a forechecking force like Big Bert.

 

[seventieslord]

The first thing I noticed when I saw Belleville's forwards was how much character there is not in the top three. Janney, Bertuzzi, and Nedved would all be guys skilled enough to go in the MLD as below average second-liners or extra forwards if they were known as good team guys. I worry greatly about that line's ability to produce in the playoffs, although soft Janney's playoff numbers are surprisingly good. Tanguay is an underachiever, but there is no denying his playoff success. Demitra is another one who sees a 30% drop in his playoff production. I wonder if Redden is the right guy to wear an 'A' on an all-time team, but I suppose he is liked by his teammates. Potvin and Irbe are both decent, but solid all-around goalie and person Paddy Moran is much better. I think Volchenkov and Komisarek have no place in this draft, considering they have been playing at their current levels for just two seasons now. Give Volchenkov another decade and he's Yuchkevich or better, but right now he's very unproven. And Danny Grant on the 4th line is a head scratcher. He's got talent. Not to say he's entirely a pansy or a defensive nightmare, but you'd want a better defensive player down there and Grant in the top-6 or not at all. You do have guys I considered, namely Mantha, Lindstrom, and Bertuzzi (you taking him made the decision to grab Kovalev easier, and considering the difference in playoff production, I'm glad I got Kovy) Your lineup isn't extremely bad, but I thought I'd outline the reasons why I like the NYA so much more in this series.

Bill Thoms on the NYA second line, makes me wonder how people would have seen my own team had I stuck with that pick. I changed my mind right after PMing VanIslander mainly due to size and playoff production.

 

[chaosrevolver]

I had NYA rated significantly higher than Belleville and that isn't changing in the playoffs either. The first thing I noticed when I saw Belleville's forwards was how much character there is not in the top three. Janney, Bertuzzi, and Nedved would all be guys skilled enough to go in the MLD as below average second-liners or extra forwards if they were known as good team guys. I worry greatly about that line's ability to produce in the playoffs, although soft Janney's playoff numbers are surprisingly good. Tanguay is an underachiever, but there is no denying his playoff success. Demitra is another one who sees a 30% drop in his playoff production. I wonder if Redden is the right guy to wear an 'A' on an all-time team, but I suppose he is liked by his teammates. Potvin and Irbe are both decent, but solid all-around goalie and person Paddy Moran is much better. I think Volchenkov and Komisarek have no place in this draft, considering they have been playing at their current levels for just two seasons now. Give Volchenkov another decade and he's Yuchkevich or better, but right now he's very unproven. And Danny Grant on the 4th line is a head scratcher. He's got talent. Not to say he's entirely a pansy or a defensive nightmare, but you'd want a better defensive player down there and Grant in the top-6 or not at all. You do have guys I considered, namely Mantha, Lindstrom, and Bertuzzi (you taking him made the decision to grab Kovalev easier, and considering the difference in playoff production, I'm glad I got Kovy) Your lineup isn't extremely bad, but I thought I'd outline the reasons why I like the NYA so much more in this series.

Bill Thoms on the NYA second line, makes me wonder how people would have seen my own team had I stuck with that pick. I changed my mind right after PMing VanIslander mainly due to size and playoff production.

Trust me when I say, Grant could very well be finding his way onto the first line if we struggle offensively. As for the Volchenkov part. Ive been defending this pick all along. The fact is, he wont play too much and we want a guy who will just blockshots all night long. Now I cant find a single guy available who could block shots with proof (numbers). So we took the guy we knew could. Judging a player on his rookie year is just unfair. Ever since the lockout he has been a monster and no one can deny that.

Considering Nate and I are both new GM's and we couldnt reasearch before the draft we feel we did fine.

 

[seventieslord]

No question, as new GMs you did great and should not be ashamed of anything. Guys like Janney, Bertuzzi, and Nedved all have a place in this draft, but it was a risky move having them all together, a risk that doesn't appear to have paid off. As for Volchenkov, I know what you're saying, but then again you don't need a guy who specifically blocks shots. (how about long-time Sabre ### ##### if you need one?) just getting a guy who is known as a defensive star would do the trick, and it can be assumed that if he's known for being so good defensively, he's going to be blocking some shots. If you really need a shot blocker, you could always search google or legendsofhockey for shot blockers... searching is a skill, it will take time to get good at finding what you're looking for. Also, for modern players they kept shot blocking stats from 98-02, they can be found in the THN yearbooks and NHL GARBs from those years, and post-lockout stats on this are on the NHL website. Many of the best ones have been taken, like Ludwig and Svehla, but I am sure you'd find a couple more.

Just my opinions, I'm certainly no expert as this is my 2nd draft.

 

[chaosrevolver]

No question, as new GMs you did great and should not be ashamed of anything. Guys like Janney, Bertuzzi, and Nedved all have a place in this draft, but it was a risky move having them all together, a risk that doesn't appear to have paid off. As for Volchenkov, I know what you're saying, but then again you don't need a guy who specifically blocks shots. (how about long-time Sabre ### ##### if you need one?) just getting a guy who is known as a defensive star would do the trick, and it can be assumed that if he's known for being so good defensively, he's going to be blocking some shots. If you really need a shot blocker, you could always search google or legendsofhockey for shot blockers... searching is a skill, it will take time to get good at finding what you're looking for. Also, for modern players they kept shot blocking stats from 98-02, they can be found in the THN yearbooks and NHL GARBs from those years, and post-lockout stats on this are on the NHL website. Many of the best ones have been taken, like Ludwig and Svehla, but I am sure you'd find a couple more.

Just my opinions, I'm certainly no expert as this is my 2nd draft.

Well thanks for the advice. We came into this league thinking Demitra and Gaborik would be steals

Also if we struggle we are considering moving Grant up to the top-6 and Nedved down to the bottom-3.

Something like:
Tanguay - Mondou - Bertuzzi
Grant - Janney - Demitra

Thats a possibility. But thats just off the top of my head without thinking really.

 

[VanIslander]

...if the Felix Potvin of 92-93 shows up this series could get very interesting. Potvin, though streaky, has the ability to steal some games.... the Bertuzzi that decides to show up. I've been frustrated beyond belief waiting for Bertuzzi to play his 'A' game with the 'nucks in the playoffs. He has the ability to dominate games (we've seen it in the regular season) but, can completely disappear... Nedved can be streaky as well.

My thoughts exactly.

If all of Belleville's players are ON they can win the series. But the Bulls have major consistency problems.

Potvin, Bertuzzi, Nedved all have had great moments and mediocre-at-best periods. Two first liners and the starting goalie! And Redden should be added to that list.

And having inexperienced Komisarek and Volchenkov was just too much. Volchenkov on the third pairing with a talented veteran to step in as the extra d-man would have been much better.

Here is the line-up that could win the series!

Alex Tanguay - Craig H. Janney - Pavol Demitra
Danny Grant - Cal Gardner - Todd Bertuzzi
Georges Mantha (A) - Pierre Mondou - Leroy Goldsworthy
Hank Goldup - Petr Nedved - Willy Lindstrom

Orest Kindrachuk - Gord Fraser (C)
Wade Redden (A) - Dana Murzyn
Anton Volchenkov - Muzz Patrick

bench: Dale Rolfe, Mike Komisarek

Felix Potvin
Arturs Irbe​

Kindrachuk played forward and defense and given his defensive ability he is needed on the blueline so move him back there, and Fraser needs a more stay at home partner anyway. Bench Rolfe because he is too punch-happy and very inconsistent, offers no stability, is a good extra defenseman to see minutes on a team with six solid starters. On the Bulls he stays on the bench.

Three-cup, two-all-star game offensive pivot Gardner has the experience and ability to run an offensive line, with 7-year 30-goal scoring Grant on his left.

Mondou is a great third line center in an all-time context and he makes your third line a two-way shutdown line that could see heavy minutes when your team gets the lead.

Cup-winning left winger Goldup was almost a point per game in the 1940s, certainly has the talent to start and he was also known to be hard working, perfect for a fourth line, moving Nedved to centre, the position I think he played his best two-way years as a NYR.

Keep Potvin as the starter but Irbe knows how to come in and steal a game or two. Remember when the 'Canes made their first cup run? Young Ward was inconsistent in the early rounds, was pulled, and Irbe stepped in cold and was hot! He had at least one shutout. I personally would start Irbe because I remember his early Sharks days when for years he was the Wall. And he was MVP of the World Championships, he backstopping two golds for the Soviet Union team. But as backup, your coach can make game time decisions.

 

[Diving Pokecheck*]

Alex Tanguay - Craig H. Janney - Pavol Demitra
Danny Grant - Cal Gardner - Todd Bertuzzi
Georges Mantha (A) - Pierre Mondou - Leroy Goldsworthy
Hank Goldup - Petr Nedved - Willy Lindstrom

Orest Kindrachuk - Gord Fraser (C)
Wade Redden (A) - Dana Murzyn
Anton Volchenkov - Muzz Patrick

bench: Dale Rolfe, Mike Komisarek

Felix Potvin
Arturs Irbe

I actually think that the line-up may have been better as is. Tanguay-Janney-Demitra will run into troubles against a physical checking line without a physical presence.

 

[Diving Pokecheck*]

Keep Potvin as the starter but Irbe knows how to come in and steal a game or two. Remember when the 'Canes won the cup? Young Ward was inconsistent in the early rounds, was pulled, and Irbe stepped in cold and was hot! He had at least one shutout I recall in the stanley cup winning drive and really played quite well.

I think you may be remembering Carolina's playoff run that culminated in a defeat by the Red Wings in the finals. The goaltending tandem of the cup-winning Carolina team was Ward backed up by Martin Gerber.

 

[VanIslander]

I think you may be remembering Carolina's playoff run that culminated in a defeat by the Red Wings in the finals. The goaltending tandem of the cup-winning Carolina team was Ward backed up by Martin Gerber.

that's right.... memory

 

[chaosrevolver]

I actually think that the line-up may have been better as is. Tanguay-Janney-Demitra will run into troubles against a physical checking line without a physical presence.

I also felt that with Janney and Tanguay both being playmakers that it wouldnt be a good idea to put them on the same line and instead spread them out. And I remember someone giving me advice on not using Janney and Demitra together as they were too soft. Thats why I did not put either together. Though I agree with Kindrachuk possibly be moving back, but why Rolfe instead of Volchenkov. Once Rolfe turned his career around he was a great playoff performer in terms of points and hes a DEFENSIVE DEFENSEMAN who wasnt known for his offence.

 

[chaosrevolver]

that's right.... memory

Yep however it was Irbe who lead Carolina past Montreal and Toronto to get to the finals against Detroit only to be swept in 4.

 

[VanIslander]

Yep however it was Irbe who lead Carolina past Montreal and Toronto to get to the finals against Detroit only to be swept in 4.

I didn't watch those finals because Carolina (blah) versus Detroit (ugh) just doesn't compare to a week at the cabin by the lake.

As for Tanguay playing with Janney I think they would have passing chemistry. with Demitra, that line can play a puck possession game, a wise strategy to eat time against a much higher seeded team.

 

[chaosrevolver]

I didn't watch those finals because Carolina (blah) versus Detroit (ugh) just doesn't compare to a week at the cabin by the lake.

As for Tanguay playing with Janney I think they would have passing chemistry. with Demitra, that line can play a puck possession game, a wise strategy to eat time against a much higher seeded team.

However weak as hell and easy to knock off the puck.

 

[pitseleh]

A couple of thoughts:

Bertuzzi is the only physical player in the top-6 that our defense has to handle, and I think that guys like Leduc, Beukeboom and Regehr match up well against him. We also have good size and/or grit down the left side that will be lining up across from him.

Our third line is also fairly capable of putting the puck in the net. MacGregor topped out at 4th in the league in goals and was consistent scorer while Kallur was a fairly strong goal scorer before becoming a defensive specialist (I'd imagine that he'd average out to a good defensive player who can put a couple away). Matched up against the relatively weak defensive forwards of the Bulls should give them opportunities to score (especially when Baker/Brown are catalyzing the transition).

 

[chaosrevolver]

A couple of thoughts:

Bertuzzi is the only physical player in the top-6 that our defense has to handle, and I think that guys like Leduc, Beukeboom and Regehr match up well against him. We also have good size and/or grit down the left side that will be lining up across from him.

Our third line is also fairly capable of putting the puck in the net. MacGregor topped out at 4th in the league in goals and was consistent scorer while Kallur was a fairly strong goal scorer before becoming a defensive specialist (I'd imagine that he'd average out to a good defensive player who can put a couple away). Matched up against the relatively weak defensive forwards of the Bulls should give them opportunities to score (especially when Baker/Brown are catalyzing the transition).

Ouch, atleast I complimented your team lol jk

 

[seventieslord]

Yep however it was Irbe who lead Carolina past Montreal and Toronto to get to the finals against Detroit only to be swept in 4.

Five!

 

[chaosrevolver]

Five!

Eh it was off the top of my head

 

[MXD]

A couple of thoughts:

Bertuzzi is the only physical player in the top-6 that our defense has to handle, and I think that guys like Leduc, Beukeboom and Regehr match up well against him. We also have good size and/or grit down the left side that will be lining up across from him.

Our third line is also fairly capable of putting the puck in the net. MacGregor topped out at 4th in the league in goals and was consistent scorer while Kallur was a fairly strong goal scorer before becoming a defensive specialist (I'd imagine that he'd average out to a good defensive player who can put a couple away). Matched up against the relatively weak defensive forwards of the Bulls should give them opportunities to score (especially when Baker/Brown are catalyzing the transition).

I'd take away Beukeboom from the first paragraph, but Battleship and Reghyr can get the job done.