ATD 2015 - Random Draft Order vs. Pick Your Spot

[Hawkey Town 18]

Please vote on whether you would like the ATD draft order to be determined randomly or if you would like to be able to pick your own spot.

*Please only vote if you are a participating GM (GM's that are "maybes" should also vote)

**If you are Co-GMing please only submit one vote between the two of you.


Please find below the process that was used for selecting the draft order last year. For now assume the same process will be used again should that choice win the poll; however, you are encouraged to post suggestions for changes to be made to improve the process.

First a mass lottery was held for the first 4 draft spots in which every GM could participate...wrongfully assuming that "The Big 4" would be taken with the first 4 picks

Next everyone who voted in each playoff round the previous draft was rewarded by getting first priority to pick their draft spot (obviously not including the top 4 which had already been determined). Those people all submitted lists of their top x choices for draft spot (i wanna say it was 5 but I don't remember for sure)...if two people picked the same spot as their first choice then a coin flip determined the winner.

After all of those GMs' draft spots were determined and announced, the remaining GMs then submitted their own lists ranking their top x spots and the same process was used to determine their draft positions,

I quite enjoyed being able to have a say in where I picked in the draft and would be for it again. It isn't very much fun ending up near the same position multiple times. Also, we did say last year that the GMs who voted every round would be rewarded, so something has to be done for those guys. If it's not draft position then what is it?

Click to read more...

 

[jarek]

For what it's worth, I'd be happy to help with administering a GM's choice draft order as much as I'd be allowed to.

 

[VanIslander]

What ever happened to giving those of us who voted EVERY single playoff round the option of choosing our draft spot?

**** it, eh?

 

[jarek]

What ever happened to giving those of us who voted EVERY single playoff round the option of choosing our draft spot?

**** it, eh?

If you have a suggestion for modifying the draft rules, it can certainly be taken into consideration, no?

 

[ResilientBeast]

I won't vote I have no preference either way as someone who voted on every round last year.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

What ever happened to giving those of us who voted EVERY single playoff round the option of choosing our draft spot?

**** it, eh?

I suggest you re-read the OP

 

[ted2019]

Choice sounds good, but the guys that were involved in every detail last year should get 1st dibs.

 

[jarek]

Choice sounds good, but the guys that were involved in every detail last year should get 1st dibs.

I agree.

 

[Rob Scuderi]

edit: caught up with the other thread nevermind asking about if we have the list.

 

[Leaf Lander]

Random with a preference listed.

 

[GFS]

Here is the average draft position for the first 60 picks of last year's ATD. The average was calculated using only the last five drafts.

Player​

|

Pos​

|

Avg​

|

#1​

|

#2​

|

#3​

|

#4​

|

#5​

|

#6​

|

#7​

|

#8​

|

#9​

|

#10​

|

#11​

|

#12​

|

'10​

|

'11​

|

'12​

|

'13​

|

'14​

Bobby Orr |

D​

|

1.0​

|

1​

|

2​

|

2​

|

1​

|

2​

|

1​

|

1​

|

1​

|

1​

|

1​

|

1​

|

1​

|

1​

|

1​

|

1​

|

1​

|

1​

Wayne Gretzky |

C​

|

2.4​

|

2​

|

3​

|

1​

|

2​

|

1​

|

2​

|

2​

|

2​

|

2​

|

2​

|

3​

|

2​

|

2​

|

3​

|

2​

|

3​

|

2​

Gordie Howe |

RW​

|

2.8​

|

3​

|

1​

|

3​

|

5​

|

3​

|

3​

|

3​

|

3​

|

3​

|

3​

|

2​

|

3​

|

4​

|

2​

|

3​

|

2​

|

3​

Mario Lemieux |

C​

|

4.8​

|

4​

|

4​

|

4​

|

3​

|

4​

|

4​

|

4​

|

4​

|

5​

|

4​

|

4​

|

4​

|

3​

|

5​

|

4​

|

4​

|

8​

Doug Harvey |

D​

|

4.8​

|

5​

|

9​

|

12​

|

13​

|

9​

|

9​

|

10​

|

9​

|

4​

|

8​

|

5​

|

5​

|

6​

|

4​

|

5​

|

5​

|

4​

Ray Bourque |

D​

|

7.6​

|

8​

|

8​

|

6​

|

4​

|

12​

|

11​

|

12​

|

11​

|

12​

|

10​

|

8​

|

7​

|

8​

|

8​

|

8​

|

9​

|

5​

Eddie Shore |

D​

|

7.6​

|

10​

|

15​

|

15​

|

15​

|

8​

|

8​

|

8​

|

7​

|

6​

|

5​

|

6​

|

6​

|

5​

|

6​

|

7​

|

11​

|

9​

Jean Beliveau |

C​

|

8.2​

|

7​

|

6​

|

10​

|

6​

|

5​

|

6​

|

9​

|

8​

|

9​

|

7​

|

9​

|

9​

|

9​

|

9​

|

6​

|

6​

|

11​

Bobby Hull |

LW​

|

9.0​

|

12​

|

11​

|

5​

|

9​

|

10​

|

12​

|

6​

|

5​

|

8​

|

6​

|

7​

|

8​

|

7​

|

7​

|

9​

|

12​

|

10​

Nicklas Lidstrom |

D​

|

10.2​

|

47​

|

42​

|

34​

|

33​

|

35​

|

37​

|

29​

|

19​

|

24​

|

16​

|

18​

|

22​

|

14​

|

12​

|

11​

|

7​

|

7​

Maurice Richard |

RW​

|

10.4​

|

6​

|

10​

|

11​

|

8​

|

7​

|

5​

|

5​

|

6​

|

10​

|

9​

|

10​

|

10​

|

10​

|

11​

|

12​

|

13​

|

6​

Denis Potvin |

D​

|

11.0​

|

23​

|

16​

|

14​

|

18​

|

19​

|

14​

|

15​

|

14​

|

15​

|

12​

|

11​

|

11​

|

11​

|

10​

|

10​

|

10​

|

14​

Stan Mikita |

C​

|

11.8​

|

25​

|

25​

|

26​

|

26​

|

17​

|

22​

|

22​

|

20​

|

21​

|

11​

|

12​

|

14​

|

12​

|

13​

|

13​

|

8​

|

13​

Dominik Hasek |

G​

|

16.0​

|

22​

|

28​

|

20​

|

19​

|

16​

|

21​

|

24​

|

22​

|

14​

|

26​

|

26​

|

20​

|

13​

|

16​

|

14​

|

19​

|

18​

Bryan Trottier |

C​

|

16.4​

|

21​

|

21​

|

23​

|

17​

|

29​

|

20​

|

23​

|

33​

|

30​

|

31​

|

27​

|

15​

|

17​

|

15​

|

15​

|

14​

|

21​

Red Kelly |

D/C​

|

16.6​

|

36​

|

30​

|

39​

|

30​

|

31​

|

27​

|

20​

|

18​

|

20​

|

23​

|

19​

|

13​

|

15​

|

20​

|

18​

|

15​

|

15​

Howie Morenz |

C​

|

17.6​

|

29​

|

23​

|

16​

|

42​

|

27​

|

16​

|

16​

|

23​

|

17​

|

17​

|

13​

|

16​

|

18​

|

17​

|

19​

|

18​

|

16​

Bobby Clarke |

C​

|

17.8​

|

40​

|

35​

|

36​

|

32​

|

26​

|

25​

|

25​

|

25​

|

23​

|

19​

|

15​

|

19​

|

20​

|

18​

|

16​

|

16​

|

19​

Patrick Roy |

G​

|

18.8​

|

11​

|

7​

|

8​

|

10​

|

14​

|

10​

|

7​

|

15​

|

7​

|

20​

|

20​

|

12​

|

22​

|

14​

|

21​

|

25​

|

12​

Guy Lafleur |

RW​

|

20.6​

|

9​

|

20​

|

13​

|

12​

|

11​

|

13​

|

11​

|

10​

|

11​

|

13​

|

16​

|

17​

|

16​

|

21​

|

20​

|

22​

|

24​

Larry Robinson |

D​

|

21.4​

|

33​

|

14​

|

17​

|

21​

|

25​

|

26​

|

19​

|

24​

|

28​

|

22​

|

22​

|

24​

|

19​

|

23​

|

23​

|

20​

|

22​

Jaromir Jagr |

RW​

|

23.4​

|

26​

|

34​

|

35​

|

38​

|

18​

|

28​

|

34​

|

28​

|

41​

|

45​

|

23​

|

30​

|

29​

|

30​

|

24​

|

17​

|

17​

Slava Fetisov |

D​

|

24.6​

|

35​

|

36​

|

37​

|

35​

|

36​

|

46​

|

38​

|

32​

|

33​

|

32​

|

28​

|

27​

|

28​

|

22​

|

25​

|

23​

|

25​

Mark Messier |

C/LW​

|

25.0​

|

13​

|

5​

|

7​

|

7​

|

6​

|

17​

|

13​

|

12​

|

16​

|

14​

|

14​

|

18​

|

26​

|

27​

|

28​

|

24​

|

20​

Jacques Plante |

G​

|

25.0​

|

31​

|

27​

|

25​

|

24​

|

23​

|

18​

|

21​

|

13​

|

13​

|

21​

|

21​

|

23​

|

24​

|

19​

|

22​

|

27​

|

33​

Phil Esposito |

C​

|

26.8​

|

24​

|

18​

|

22​

|

14​

|

13​

|

15​

|

17​

|

16​

|

26​

|

29​

|

30​

|

25​

|

25​

|

25​

|

26​

|

28​

|

30​

Ted Lindsay |

LW​

|

27.6​

|

20​

|

51​

|

45​

|

46​

|

22​

|

23​

|

18​

|

30​

|

18​

|

15​

|

17​

|

21​

|

21​

|

26​

|

31​

|

29​

|

31​

Mike Bossy |

RW​

|

29.2​

|

14​

|

12​

|

9​

|

11​

|

15​

|

19​

|

14​

|

17​

|

19​

|

24​

|

25​

|

29​

|

23​

|

32​

|

27​

|

38​

|

26​

Terry Sawchuk |

G​

|

30.4​

|

19​

|

17​

|

18​

|

25​

|

20​

|

7​

|

26​

|

21​

|

25​

|

28​

|

32​

|

28​

|

32​

|

24​

|

17​

|

31​

|

48​

Chris Chelios |

D​

|

31.6​

|

28​

|

45​

|

38​

|

45​

|

38​

|

38​

|

31​

|

41​

|

39​

|

30​

|

29​

|

35​

|

38​

|

37​

|

30​

|

26​

|

27​

Cyclone Taylor |

C/D​

|

31.6​

|

100​

|

90​

|

109​

|

83​

|

67​

|

97​

|

84​

|

80​

|

57​

|

18​

|

34​

|

31​

|

30​

|

29​

|

29​

|

35​

|

35​

Brad Park |

D​

|

32.6​

|

50​

|

55​

|

46​

|

40​

|

34​

|

43​

|

35​

|

39​

|

36​

|

38​

|

31​

|

32​

|

35​

|

35​

|

34​

|

30​

|

29​

Steve Yzerman |

C​

|

33.4​

|

39​

|

22​

|

24​

|

22​

|

30​

|

34​

|

30​

|

26​

|

32​

|

27​

|

40​

|

41​

|

37​

|

33​

|

35​

|

39​

|

23​

Joe Sakic |

C​

|

33.6​

|

49​

|

40​

|

30​

|

37​

|

37​

|

48​

|

27​

|

36​

|

50​

|

41​

|

36​

|

33​

|

40​

|

36​

|

32​

|

32​

|

28​

Pierre Pilote |

D​

|

35.6​

|

72​

|

72​

|

69​

|

53​

|

41​

|

47​

|

44​

|

47​

|

44​

|

42​

|

37​

|

39​

|

34​

|

39​

|

36​

|

33​

|

36​

Paul Coffey |

D​

|

36.6​

|

18​

|

29​

|

33​

|

31​

|

33​

|

36​

|

46​

|

42​

|

40​

|

56​

|

41​

|

42​

|

31​

|

44​

|

33​

|

37​

|

38​

Frank Nighbor |

C/LW​

|

38.6​

|

NL​

|

NL​

|

289​

|

254​

|

339​

|

266​

|

167​

|

150​

|

136​

|

103​

|

68​

|

60​

|

41​

|

43​

|

41​

|

36​

|

32​

Milt Schmidt |

C​

|

38.8​

|

53​

|

33​

|

53​

|

62​

|

44​

|

40​

|

57​

|

37​

|

37​

|

49​

|

44​

|

37​

|

39​

|

38​

|

40​

|

34​

|

43​

Newsy Lalonde |

C​

|

39.4​

|

101​

|

85​

|

57​

|

74​

|

75​

|

75​

|

72​

|

70​

|

55​

|

39​

|

33​

|

26​

|

27​

|

34​

|

38​

|

45​

|

53​

Glenn Hall |

G​

|

40.0​

|

32​

|

32​

|

29​

|

27​

|

28​

|

24​

|

28​

|

31​

|

27​

|

34​

|

38​

|

34​

|

43​

|

31​

|

37​

|

42​

|

47​

Scott Stevens |

D​

|

42.0​

|

54​

|

52​

|

43​

|

49​

|

62​

|

44​

|

39​

|

35​

|

43​

|

54​

|

69​

|

47​

|

54​

|

48​

|

48​

|

21​

|

39​

Tim Horton |

D​

|

42.6​

|

44​

|

78​

|

51​

|

55​

|

47​

|

49​

|

43​

|

44​

|

47​

|

46​

|

48​

|

46​

|

36​

|

41​

|

43​

|

49​

|

44​

Al MacInnis |

D​

|

43.2​

|

43​

|

57​

|

42​

|

48​

|

52​

|

42​

|

40​

|

40​

|

49​

|

55​

|

58​

|

56​

|

51​

|

28​

|

52​

|

40​

|

45​

Bill Cook |

RW​

|

44.2​

|

82​

|

101​

|

102​

|

98​

|

68​

|

65​

|

75​

|

54​

|

66​

|

44​

|

52​

|

51​

|

47​

|

45​

|

46​

|

41​

|

42​

Ken Dryden |

G​

|

45.4​

|

37​

|

39​

|

21​

|

28​

|

32​

|

29​

|

33​

|

27​

|

29​

|

35​

|

39​

|

40​

|

45​

|

42​

|

42​

|

44​

|

54​

Valeri Kharlamov |

LW​

|

46.0​

|

27​

|

38​

|

50​

|

16​

|

21​

|

31​

|

36​

|

34​

|

53​

|

43​

|

35​

|

45​

|

52​

|

47​

|

39​

|

58​

|

34​

King Clancy |

D​

|

47.4​

|

94​

|

96​

|

93​

|

89​

|

80​

|

68​

|

62​

|

72​

|

67​

|

58​

|

51​

|

48​

|

55​

|

54​

|

45​

|

46​

|

37​

Syl Apps |

C​

|

48.0​

|

79​

|

88​

|

55​

|

52​

|

60​

|

58​

|

63​

|

66​

|

62​

|

53​

|

43​

|

38​

|

46​

|

40​

|

44​

|

54​

|

56​

Earl Seibert |

D​

|

48.8​

|

108​

|

106​

|

113​

|

70​

|

84​

|

79​

|

53​

|

52​

|

46​

|

36​

|

45​

|

49​

|

42​

|

60​

|

49​

|

47​

|

46​

Sprague Cleghorn |

D​

|

48.2​

|

180​

|

142​

|

105​

|

104​

|

116​

|

114​

|

78​

|

59​

|

63​

|

52​

|

54​

|

50​

|

49​

|

56​

|

47​

|

48​

|

41​

Chris Pronger |

D​

|

53.4​

|

63​

|

56​

|

52​

|

64​

|

74​

|

59​

|

58​

|

56​

|

75​

|

78​

|

74​

|

70​

|

83​

|

51​

|

50​

|

43​

|

40​

Frank Boucher |

C​

|

54.0​

|

NL​

|

182​

|

NL​

|

127​

|

85​

|

105​

|

94​

|

108​

|

116​

|

79​

|

66​

|

62​

|

61​

|

52​

|

51​

|

56​

|

50​

Bill Gadsby |

D​

|

56.0​

|

204​

|

119​

|

123​

|

105​

|

76​

|

92​

|

79​

|

78​

|

82​

|

65​

|

55​

|

53​

|

56​

|

62​

|

60​

|

53​

|

49​

Frank Mahovlich |

LW​

|

56.4​

|

41​

|

46​

|

49​

|

56​

|

50​

|

32​

|

50​

|

61​

|

31​

|

33​

|

56​

|

69​

|

64​

|

59​

|

57​

|

50​

|

52​

Jari Kurri |

RW​

|

61.2​

|

38​

|

53​

|

40​

|

41​

|

48​

|

39​

|

48​

|

51​

|

51​

|

62​

|

53​

|

63​

|

59​

|

72​

|

63​

|

57​

|

55​

Henri Richard |

C​

|

63.6​

|

42​

|

65​

|

60​

|

71​

|

65​

|

73​

|

68​

|

63​

|

58​

|

37​

|

57​

|

58​

|

60​

|

70​

|

65​

|

64​

|

59​

Brian Leetch |

D​

|

65.0​

|

87​

|

60​

|

54​

|

54​

|

54​

|

71​

|

65​

|

55​

|

54​

|

76​

|

73​

|

74​

|

77​

|

65​

|

66​

|

59​

|

58​

Sergei Makarov |

RW​

|

67.4​

|

71​

|

58​

|

77​

|

79​

|

71​

|

64​

|

86​

|

88​

|

109​

|

106​

|

85​

|

79​

|

70​

|

75​

|

61​

|

71​

|

60​

Alexander Ovechkin |

LW​

|

84.4​

|

NL​

|

NL​

|

NL​

|

380​

|

202​

|

190​

|

350​

|

356​

|

335​

|

241​

|

139​

|

123​

|

86​

|

92​

|

99​

|

94​

|

51​

Zdeno Chara |

D​

|

100.6​

|

207​

|

194​

|

119​

|

161​

|

177​

|

178​

|

182​

|

264​

|

264​

|

250​

|

177​

|

131​

|

125​

|

152​

|

90​

|

79​

|

57​

 

[BraveCanadian]

Picking was nice because then you don't get stuck in the same spot.

I have been in the middle, last and first over the past few drafts and it mixes it up a bit.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Lemieux in 8th

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Lemieux in 8th

I applaud those GM's who had picks 4-7 for sticking to their guns

 

[tony d]

Yeah, my not picking Lemieux last year was the top story of the draft's early going wasn't it?

 

[ResilientBeast]

Yeah, my not picking Lemieux last year was the top story of the draft's early going wasn't it?

I think an entire page or two was strictly our shock

 

[VanIslander]

Why not have it both ways?

If you want your place randomized then it could be done for you after those who want to pick their spot get it.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Why not have it both ways?

If you want your place randomized then it could be done for you after those who want to pick their spot get it.

Yes, this would always be a choice...no need to force someone to pick their spot

 

[Dr Pepper]

I think it should be completely random.

 

[VanIslander]

I think it should be completely random.

Nobody should be allowed to choose their draft position? .... 8 agree, 8 disagree (50%, 50%) to date...

How authoritarian do you feel today?

 

[ImporterExporter]

Well I'm not sure of any sport that allows you to pick your own position freely

Being completely random should almost always give you a different spot, as that is a criticism I've heard from a few people.

Being able to come up with a very specific plan should happen AFTER the order is determine IMO.

 

[jarek]

Well I'm not sure of any sport that allows you to pick your own position freely

Being completely random should almost always give you a different spot, as that is a criticism I've heard from a few people.

Being able to come up with a very specific plan should happen AFTER the order is determine IMO.

The whole reason this choosing your draft order thing came about, apparently, is BECAUSE people were complaining the random order kept putting them in a similar spot.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Well I'm not sure of any sport that allows you to pick your own position freely

Being completely random should almost always give you a different spot, as that is a criticism I've heard from a few people.

Being able to come up with a very specific plan should happen AFTER the order is determine IMO.

The complaint isn't about getting the EXACT same spot, it's about being in the same general area, and therefore having the same group of players as options to build your team around. If you pick 10th one year and 12th the next, you will be researching the exact same guys for your 1st pick. If the number of teams are similar this will happen for subsequent rounds as well.

Also, picking towards the end of the draft order every year makes it so you never have an elite player to build around, of course your depth will be better, but some people want to try both.

 

[ImporterExporter]

How is that possible? Literally the same spot? I highly doubt it happened more than a few times. And with different GMs from year to year the players will change, sometimes even drastically.

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

Why not have it both ways?

If you want your place randomized then it could be done for you after those who want to pick their spot get it.

Thats not really random though. Thats random biassed towards unwanted spots.