ATD #11, Foster Hewitt Quarterfinals. Anyang Halla (4) vs. Boston Braves (5)
- Thread starter EagleBelfour
- Start date
seventieslord
Student Of The Game
Interesting that a series with the potential to be one of the closest, has received no comments so far.
There is lots to like on both rosters, and certainly some valid concerns.
For one thing, how can you not love Anyang's first line? Mario is Mario. Then he's got two elite goal scorers, backcheckers, and corner men on his flanks. This line just plain works.
The second line, though, concerns me. I think Armstrong and Backstrom are a tad miscast there. An elite second liner could help carry the line offensively, but Gottselig is only a middling second line player. This line will play a conscientious game but will likely have trouble scoring.
I like all the players on the third line, but it sort of looks "thrown together" to me. What's its role?
The D-corps is adequate. Salming is a legit #1 but I'm not prepared to give too much credit to Pospisil. it's only fair considering how hard I am on Bobrov, who played at the same time. Korab and Iafrate are decent third pairing guys. Kasparaitis would be way out of his depth here; you better say your prayers that Big Al doesn't get injured.
I like Holecek, he made my top-120 players and top-20 goalies, just barely. Hainsworth did not, though he was close. So you have a minor edge there.
Boston's first line obviously needs no introduction. The second line features top-end second liners at each position, and I think Drillon has good, conscientious linemates there, and he needs that. I love the third line as a gritty, hard to play against shutdown line - there are no questions about their roles. I like Boston's defense just a little bit more, and their goaltending just a little bit less. Inevitably, this one will come down to the debates. So, get to it, fellas!
There is lots to like on both rosters, and certainly some valid concerns.
For one thing, how can you not love Anyang's first line? Mario is Mario. Then he's got two elite goal scorers, backcheckers, and corner men on his flanks. This line just plain works.
The second line, though, concerns me. I think Armstrong and Backstrom are a tad miscast there. An elite second liner could help carry the line offensively, but Gottselig is only a middling second line player. This line will play a conscientious game but will likely have trouble scoring.
I like all the players on the third line, but it sort of looks "thrown together" to me. What's its role?
The D-corps is adequate. Salming is a legit #1 but I'm not prepared to give too much credit to Pospisil. it's only fair considering how hard I am on Bobrov, who played at the same time. Korab and Iafrate are decent third pairing guys. Kasparaitis would be way out of his depth here; you better say your prayers that Big Al doesn't get injured.
I like Holecek, he made my top-120 players and top-20 goalies, just barely. Hainsworth did not, though he was close. So you have a minor edge there.
Boston's first line obviously needs no introduction. The second line features top-end second liners at each position, and I think Drillon has good, conscientious linemates there, and he needs that. I love the third line as a gritty, hard to play against shutdown line - there are no questions about their roles. I like Boston's defense just a little bit more, and their goaltending just a little bit less. Inevitably, this one will come down to the debates. So, get to it, fellas!
Nalyd Psycho
Registered User
You've got your wires crossed.
Pospisil was the top Czech defenceman of the 1970's. He was their answer to Vasiliev. Not as good mind you, but his competition was not weak.
The Mighty Duck Man
R-E-L-A-X
I'm going to make a couple of changes for this one, I'm thinking. Eddie Shack and Mike Keane are gonna sit this one out, with Nilsson and Hejduk coming in at their respective positions and Drury sliding over to the left side. I think that if I'm to win then I've gotta do some major damage offensively, and having a third scoring line should do wonders in that regard.
My other change is just a shuffling of the top-4 defensemen, with Robinson and Talbot now being paired up, while Lapointe and Pratt are together. I do this because I want to have a very difficult pairing to go up against that top line, and I think Robinson and Talbot are a very difficult tandem to play against. Not as difficult as, say, Robinson and Lapointe, but I've never been a big believer in putting your eggs in one basket, and I want to spread the wealth defensively. Lapointe's a great guy to have, and I want him to be able to make that impact when the big line's not out there. Should it come down to it and that line appear too formidable, I wouldn't hesitate to put Robinson and Lapointe together to oppose them, but I have a certain level of confidence that my defense can get the job done as they are now. As for the forwards, there won't be much matching going on, but I'll try my damndest not to have them match up against my second line. Despite their defensive shortcomings, I don't think it would be a total tragedy, but for obvious reasons I'd much rather have that grind line, or the defensive excellence of the Soviets. I'm not worried much at all about matching up forward units with defensive pairings, as I think I have a great balance of offense and defense on all three. That, and all three are, IMO, wonderful pairings. I'm not certain that I'd trade this defense, that is to say, 1-through-6, for any other, but maybe that's just me. I have the utmost confidence that all three pairings can play in any situation, and that's a tremendous luxury.
In terms of overall offense, I think we're pretty close, especially with my last line-up change. He obviously has that great top line, but I would like to think my own is a dandy in itself. After that, I think I have a very good second line as well, one that brings a lot to the table and IMO is a great fit for all three. My third line won't do a ton offensively, although ruling them out should not be done, and I think my fourth line can definitely do some damage. Drury is awesome come playoff time, and some tend to overlook just how good Milan Hejduk has been. I think Nilsson can bring some great things to the table as well. Comparitively, past his amazing first line, I don't think he has all that much, but again, maybe that's just me.
Defensively, I think he's got a very good unit, but like I said, I like to think of mine as one of the absolute best in the draft. On top of the big two, which need no explanation, I think it's an absolutely great bottom four. Babe Pratt wasn't the best #2 and probably went too high in previous drafts, but as a #3 I think he's great. Jean-Guy Talbot is one of my favorite players in an all-time context, and I absolutely love him as a #4. And then you have both Morrow and Persson, both of which can probably put in a claim as a top-4 defenseman(although Persson might be better suited as a #5), who make up my bottom pairing. Everyone brings a lot to the table and overall I absolutely love it.
I give him the edge in net, but I do think it's close. And not close in the "the difference between #1 and #28 are close" sense, but simply a very close goaltending match-up. I've made my case for Hainsworth, I think he's an absolutely fantastic goaltender. I really like Holecek, but I view them as fairly comparable. The thing I love most about Hainsworth is his laid-back and seemingly effortless style of playing, something I really cherish in a goaltender. If he gets into a groove, it's not a stretch to suggest that he could definitely begin frustrating opponents more than usual with that demeanor. But, that's simply a hypothetical scenario for the voting public to think about.
My other change is just a shuffling of the top-4 defensemen, with Robinson and Talbot now being paired up, while Lapointe and Pratt are together. I do this because I want to have a very difficult pairing to go up against that top line, and I think Robinson and Talbot are a very difficult tandem to play against. Not as difficult as, say, Robinson and Lapointe, but I've never been a big believer in putting your eggs in one basket, and I want to spread the wealth defensively. Lapointe's a great guy to have, and I want him to be able to make that impact when the big line's not out there. Should it come down to it and that line appear too formidable, I wouldn't hesitate to put Robinson and Lapointe together to oppose them, but I have a certain level of confidence that my defense can get the job done as they are now. As for the forwards, there won't be much matching going on, but I'll try my damndest not to have them match up against my second line. Despite their defensive shortcomings, I don't think it would be a total tragedy, but for obvious reasons I'd much rather have that grind line, or the defensive excellence of the Soviets. I'm not worried much at all about matching up forward units with defensive pairings, as I think I have a great balance of offense and defense on all three. That, and all three are, IMO, wonderful pairings. I'm not certain that I'd trade this defense, that is to say, 1-through-6, for any other, but maybe that's just me. I have the utmost confidence that all three pairings can play in any situation, and that's a tremendous luxury.
In terms of overall offense, I think we're pretty close, especially with my last line-up change. He obviously has that great top line, but I would like to think my own is a dandy in itself. After that, I think I have a very good second line as well, one that brings a lot to the table and IMO is a great fit for all three. My third line won't do a ton offensively, although ruling them out should not be done, and I think my fourth line can definitely do some damage. Drury is awesome come playoff time, and some tend to overlook just how good Milan Hejduk has been. I think Nilsson can bring some great things to the table as well. Comparitively, past his amazing first line, I don't think he has all that much, but again, maybe that's just me.
Defensively, I think he's got a very good unit, but like I said, I like to think of mine as one of the absolute best in the draft. On top of the big two, which need no explanation, I think it's an absolutely great bottom four. Babe Pratt wasn't the best #2 and probably went too high in previous drafts, but as a #3 I think he's great. Jean-Guy Talbot is one of my favorite players in an all-time context, and I absolutely love him as a #4. And then you have both Morrow and Persson, both of which can probably put in a claim as a top-4 defenseman(although Persson might be better suited as a #5), who make up my bottom pairing. Everyone brings a lot to the table and overall I absolutely love it.
I give him the edge in net, but I do think it's close. And not close in the "the difference between #1 and #28 are close" sense, but simply a very close goaltending match-up. I've made my case for Hainsworth, I think he's an absolutely fantastic goaltender. I really like Holecek, but I view them as fairly comparable. The thing I love most about Hainsworth is his laid-back and seemingly effortless style of playing, something I really cherish in a goaltender. If he gets into a groove, it's not a stretch to suggest that he could definitely begin frustrating opponents more than usual with that demeanor. But, that's simply a hypothetical scenario for the voting public to think about.
Sturminator
Love is a duel
He was likely thinking of Tikal. Pospisil is a stud, and a guy I've come to appreciate after doing deeper research into the Czech league. Strong 2-way #3 D, IMO.
I'd keep Eddie Shack in the line-up. No secret that I'm a big Eddie Shack fan. His speed and his toughness could come in really handy in this series. I can understand why Leo wants a third scoring line, since Annyang has two lines that really play well defensively. But Shack's the type of player who could cause some fits for the opposition, especially at playoff time, with his speed, size and physical play. (And I'm just a big fan of the "go with the guys who got you there" philosophy).
Wiser's definitely taken a different approach. His second line would normally be a third line, his third line would normally be a fourth line, and his fourth line would normally be a second line. (Although Kozlov on a second line would be even worse than Kozlov on a fourth line). Incidentally, Annyang's second line is one of the best defensive lines in the draft.
I think a big part of this series is whether Annyang can get enough goals beyond their first line to win a best-of-seven. Boston has lots of talent. Goal-scoring shouldn't be an issue, with or without a third scoring line. And we know Annyang's top line will be an offensive juggernaut. But the Braves will need a couple goals a night from the supporting cast in order to win the series. And it doesn't help that they're facing a team that has two-thirds of the fabled Montreal 1970s Big Three, and two guys from the Islanders dynasty of the 80s on the third pairing.
For what it's worth, I had Hainsworth and Holocek very close together in my HOH Top 120.
Wiser's definitely taken a different approach. His second line would normally be a third line, his third line would normally be a fourth line, and his fourth line would normally be a second line. (Although Kozlov on a second line would be even worse than Kozlov on a fourth line). Incidentally, Annyang's second line is one of the best defensive lines in the draft.
I think a big part of this series is whether Annyang can get enough goals beyond their first line to win a best-of-seven. Boston has lots of talent. Goal-scoring shouldn't be an issue, with or without a third scoring line. And we know Annyang's top line will be an offensive juggernaut. But the Braves will need a couple goals a night from the supporting cast in order to win the series. And it doesn't help that they're facing a team that has two-thirds of the fabled Montreal 1970s Big Three, and two guys from the Islanders dynasty of the 80s on the third pairing.
For what it's worth, I had Hainsworth and Holocek very close together in my HOH Top 120.
Sturminator
Love is a duel
He was likely thinking of Tikal. Pospisil is a stud, and a guy I've come to appreciate after doing deeper research into the Czech league. Strong 2-way #3 D, IMO.
seventieslord
Student Of The Game
I wasn't thinking of Tikal. Who the heck was I thinking of?.................
I got it. Sologubov.
Sorry, ignore my comment about Pospisil. Completely baseless. Mistaken identity.
I got it. Sologubov.
Sorry, ignore my comment about Pospisil. Completely baseless. Mistaken identity.
Sturminator
Love is a duel
How on earth did I do a double post with a 3+ hour time difference between posts? My iphone is playing tricks on me.
Wisent
Registered User
Hockey Outsider
Registered User
- Jan 16, 2005
- 9,171
- 14,530
Unsolicited advice for Wisent: I would consider switching Blake and Gottselig. As great as the top line is, the second unit is weak offensively by ATD standards.
Gottselig is a clear step down from Blake offensively, but he was known as a fast skater and was a good defensive player. Thus, if Gottselig gets a spot on the top line, Lemieux will still be surrounded by two speedy wingers who can keep up with him, and the Kurri/Gottselig duo will take of the defensive zone and digging along the boards.
If the second line is built around Blake, you immediately have a line featuring a tough, aggressive, goal-scoring LW. I'm not sure if Backstrom is a sufficiently good playmaker to maximize Gottselig's value, but a Backstrom/Blake duo could be dangerous. Armstrong and Blake would provide some toughness (more than the Braves feature on their second line) and Backstrom/Armstrong provide a strong defensive consciousness.
Unsolicited advice for Leopold: I don't think it's necessary to bench Keane and Shack. Although you don't have anybody quite as explosive as Shadrin or Starshinov among your bottom six forwards, you already have a clear advantage in offense from your second line (though this would decrease if Wisent takes me advice from above). Due to his toughness and strong two-way play, I would imagine Keane would get a fair amount of ice time against Blake. (And to be honest it's questionable how many goals he could score, at the ATD level, if he were centred by a merely decent playmaker like Drury).
I like the idea that Robinson and Lapointe are split up. Lapointe's rushing ability makes an already fast, talented second unit even more dangerous (that is, assuming you play your 2nd forward line and 2nd defense pair together). In contrast, Anyang has two exceptionally good shutdown blueliners on their second pair, but they will struggle to produce offensively.
Gottselig is a clear step down from Blake offensively, but he was known as a fast skater and was a good defensive player. Thus, if Gottselig gets a spot on the top line, Lemieux will still be surrounded by two speedy wingers who can keep up with him, and the Kurri/Gottselig duo will take of the defensive zone and digging along the boards.
If the second line is built around Blake, you immediately have a line featuring a tough, aggressive, goal-scoring LW. I'm not sure if Backstrom is a sufficiently good playmaker to maximize Gottselig's value, but a Backstrom/Blake duo could be dangerous. Armstrong and Blake would provide some toughness (more than the Braves feature on their second line) and Backstrom/Armstrong provide a strong defensive consciousness.
Unsolicited advice for Leopold: I don't think it's necessary to bench Keane and Shack. Although you don't have anybody quite as explosive as Shadrin or Starshinov among your bottom six forwards, you already have a clear advantage in offense from your second line (though this would decrease if Wisent takes me advice from above). Due to his toughness and strong two-way play, I would imagine Keane would get a fair amount of ice time against Blake. (And to be honest it's questionable how many goals he could score, at the ATD level, if he were centred by a merely decent playmaker like Drury).
I like the idea that Robinson and Lapointe are split up. Lapointe's rushing ability makes an already fast, talented second unit even more dangerous (that is, assuming you play your 2nd forward line and 2nd defense pair together). In contrast, Anyang has two exceptionally good shutdown blueliners on their second pair, but they will struggle to produce offensively.
seventieslord
Student Of The Game
The Anyang Halla (4) vs. The Boston Braves (5)
Game Results:
Anyang Halla: 3 - Boston Braves: 2
Anyang Halla: 1 - Boston Braves: 2 OT
Boston Braves: 4 - Anyang Halla: 2
Boston Braves: 1 - Anyang Halla: 5
Anyang Halla: 3 - Boston Braves: 1
Boston Braves: 2 - Anyang Halla: 1
Anyang Halla: 4 - Boston Braves: 1
The Anyang Halla (4) defeats The Boston Braves (5) in 7 games.
Series Three Stars
1: Mario Lemieux - Anyang Halla
2: Larry Robinson - Boston Braves
3: Valeri Kharlamov - Boston Braves
Series Recap:
- Mario Lemieux was phenomenal in this series. He was the game breaking player everyone love to watch. Although surrounded with strong linemate, Lemieux seemed to be alone on his line and was definitely the charter member of his team.
- The famous Kharlamov-Petrov-Mikhailov, again reunited, were smoking hot. The Duo of Pospisil-Salming tried all series to contain them, but it seems only Jiri Holecek had the answer for them.
- Although they played a sound defensive game, second trio of Halla, consisting of Johnny Gottselig-Ralph Backstrom-Georges Armstrong didn't do much offensively. Even the fourth line of Kozlov-Starshinov-Balderis had more offensive chances.
- Interestingly, after losing game 2 in overtime, coach Tarasov decided to go with Vladimir Dzurilla for game #3. After losing that game, he went back to Holecek, who was brilliant until the end of the series.
Game Results:
Anyang Halla: 3 - Boston Braves: 2
Anyang Halla: 1 - Boston Braves: 2 OT
Boston Braves: 4 - Anyang Halla: 2
Boston Braves: 1 - Anyang Halla: 5
Anyang Halla: 3 - Boston Braves: 1
Boston Braves: 2 - Anyang Halla: 1
Anyang Halla: 4 - Boston Braves: 1
The Anyang Halla (4) defeats The Boston Braves (5) in 7 games.
Series Three Stars
1: Mario Lemieux - Anyang Halla
2: Larry Robinson - Boston Braves
3: Valeri Kharlamov - Boston Braves
Series Recap:
- Mario Lemieux was phenomenal in this series. He was the game breaking player everyone love to watch. Although surrounded with strong linemate, Lemieux seemed to be alone on his line and was definitely the charter member of his team.
- The famous Kharlamov-Petrov-Mikhailov, again reunited, were smoking hot. The Duo of Pospisil-Salming tried all series to contain them, but it seems only Jiri Holecek had the answer for them.
- Although they played a sound defensive game, second trio of Halla, consisting of Johnny Gottselig-Ralph Backstrom-Georges Armstrong didn't do much offensively. Even the fourth line of Kozlov-Starshinov-Balderis had more offensive chances.
- Interestingly, after losing game 2 in overtime, coach Tarasov decided to go with Vladimir Dzurilla for game #3. After losing that game, he went back to Holecek, who was brilliant until the end of the series.
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