Player Discussion Artturi Lehkonen

[Sysez]

He'll be our Jere Lehtinen. He's working on his game, relax guys.

 

[The Great Weal]

I haven't seen a 26 years old Lehkonen, so I can't answer your question. But when speaking of established players, I'd generally take the younger one.

Which is why I said right now. There is no reason to take the 26 year old even if he is better since that 23 year old will become 26 years old and better.

 

[The Great Weal]

Danault at 23 was playing as a winger on the 4th line...

Do you really think this is the end product with Lehkonen?

I seriously doubt it.

And one of the reasons he's not producing more, in my opinion, is because he focuses too much on being great defensively.

You will never see this guy float or cheat to be able to score.

Instead of getting open in the slot or somewhere around the net for a shot he will go dig the puck in the corners just to keep the offense going.

Danault has been getting better every year whereas Lehkonen hasn't.

I don't really see much potential with Lehkonen which is why I'd like a player who would help out the defense instead of putting Lehkonen on the 4th line.

That's absolute bs and you know it. If he scored on like a quarter of those golden opportunities he gets every period nobody would complain about his offensive game. At some point, it's not you can't call him unlucky and realize that he might not be that good.

That's great and all, but that's nothing unique for our team. Kotkaniemi-Armia-Shaw-Byron are bottom 6 players who bring a lot more than Lehkonen.

 

[Belial]

Which is why I said right now. There is no reason to take the 26 year old even if he is better since that 23 year old will become 26 years old and better.

Who are you even trading for? Who's available out there?

It has to be a young LD with potential, no rental stuff.

 

[le_sean]

He'll be our Jere Lehtinen with more offensive potential. He's working on his game, relax guys.

Jere Lehtinen won 3 Selkes and scored 20+ goals 5 times and 30+ goals 2 times. Lehkonen is not going to do that.

 

[Belial]

Danault has been getting better every year whereas Lehkonen hasn't.

I don't really see much potential with Lehkonen which is why I'd like a player who would help out the defense instead of putting Lehkonen on the 4th line.

That's absolute bs and you know it. If he scored on like a quarter of those golden opportunities he gets every period nobody would complain about his offensive game. At some point, it's not you can't call him unlucky and realize that he might not be that good.

That's great and all, but that's nothing unique for our team. Kotkaniemi-Armia-Shaw-Byron are bottom 6 players who bring a lot more than Lehkonen.

He scored 18 as a rookie man! and scored 2 more in 6 PO games!

This guy clearly can score goals at this level.

He has one of the best shots on the team IMO if not the best...

He's just not playing like a goalscorer out there right now, it's like he puts the team ahead of his personal statistics or something.

 

[The Great Weal]

He scored 18 as a rookie man! and scored 2 more in 6 PO games!

This guy clearly can score goals at this level.

He has one of the best shots on the team IMO if not the best...

He's just not playing like a goalscorer out there right now, it's like he puts the team ahead of his personal statistics or something.

And he has done absolute f*** all since then. His shot was a threat in his first year but he has whiffed on pretty much everything since the playoffs. 2 seasons is not just a "bad stretch".

Ya I'm sure he puts team success ahead of personal statistics when he is receiving a pass for a one-timer and decides to fall as if he slipped on a banana peel. Real team player not to score on golden opportunities he gets every damn period.

 

[Rapala]

Danault has been getting better every year whereas Lehkonen hasn't.

I don't really see much potential with Lehkonen which is why I'd like a player who would help out the defense instead of putting Lehkonen on the 4th line.

That's absolute bs and you know it. If he scored on like a quarter of those golden opportunities he gets every period nobody would complain about his offensive game. At some point, it's not you can't call him unlucky and realize that he might not be that good.

That's great and all, but that's nothing unique for our team. Kotkaniemi-Armia-Shaw-Byron are bottom 6 players who bring a lot more than Lehkonen.

Danault was not better last year so no he isn't getting better every year. Many were also questioning his play earlier this year. There is no reason to jump to conclusions on Lehkonen based on this recent stretch of games. You must be totally blind if you don't see his offensive upside. He'd have plenty more points if they had left him with Drouin and Domi and that should be evident to most here.
It looks like we are playoff bound and we should base some of our assessment on performance towards the end of the calendar year and the frenetic pace of the playoffs and what his role is.

 

[The Great Weal]

Danault was not better last year so no he isn't getting better every year. Many were also questioning his play earlier this year. There is no reason to jump to conclusions on Lehkonen based on this recent stretch of games. You must be totally blind if you don't see his offensive upside. He'd have plenty more points if they had left him with Drouin and Domi and that should be evident to most here.
It looks like we are playoff bound and we should base some of our assessment on performance towards the end of the calendar year and the frenetic pace of the playoffs and what his role is.

Danault has not gotten better than last year? Strongly disagree. Recent stretch of games? It's been 2 seasons now. Totally blind? I have seen many many people sharing the same concerns about his offensive game. What do you think his offensive upside is? I see it as a 3rd liner. How is that being totally blind? He had played with the best players last season and this season for a good bit of games and wasnt good enough.

 

[montreal]

He's got better linemates this year. Kotkaniemi is much better than Plekanec last year, that will certainly help him out.

Nobody knows if it's selling low. He could honestly not get any better than what he is right now and his stats still look good for a 3rd liner. The Habs are known to hold on to young players for way too long since they think the player is better than they actually are. For instance, Tinordi when Bergevin wanted 2 2nd rounders at one point. Scherbak, when Bergevin refused to trade him for actual help instead of garbage players like Ott. McCarron, same thing as Scherbak. Beaulieu, waited way too long and I've been asking for Beaulieu to be traded way before he actually got traded.

Those guys all suck and our LHD is ridiculously thin. We have 3 defensemen that are signed for next year and the others could very well not come back. That's awful. Give me a LHD for something around Lehkonen and it makes a lot more sense.

With Byron back, I would have no issue trading Lehkonen for a similar aged LHD. We have better young players on the team, some coming up in the future and maybe even an elite forward in Free Agency.

When you have someone that was putting up points consistently, on pace for a career year (and still is) but then goes 23 games and gets only 5 pts, before that getting 19 pts in 33 games, you are likely selling low. He went from a .58 ppg to a .22 ppg. If next year or the year after he ends up with say a .45 ppg that's 37 pts and very solid production. You would get a better offer then you would while he's had just 5 pts in the last 23 games and struggling to score goals.

We don't need a LD today, we need a quality one for when we contend. A year or two shouldn't change much. It's a gamble but that's why you have people that are supposed to be good at evaluating talent. The other prospects they were handled very poorly in the AHL so their development was impacted. I think getting a 3rd round pick for Beaulieu was solid, don't think they would have gotten much more since GM's likely saw the same thing we did.

 

[Belial]

And he has done absolute **** all since then. His shot was a threat in his first year but he has whiffed on pretty much everything since the playoffs. 2 seasons is not just a "bad stretch".

Ya I'm sure he puts team success ahead of personal statistics when he is receiving a pass for a one-timer and decides to fall as if he slipped on a banana peel. Real team player not to score on golden opportunities he gets every damn period.

His stats are pretty much the same this year compared to his rookie year.

He shoots ~ 2 times per game on the net.

The difference is that in his rookie year he had a shooting % of 11.39 and this season he's at 5.98.

Did he forget how to shoot a puck? Goals will come!

 

[Rapala]

Danault has not gotten better than last year? Strongly disagree. Recent stretch of games? It's been 2 seasons now. Totally blind? I have seen many many people sharing the same concerns about his offensive game. What do you think his offensive upside is? I see it as a 3rd liner. How is that being totally blind? He had played with the best players last season and this season for a good bit of games and wasnt good enough.

Danault didn't get better last year vs the previous year so you are disagreeing about the wrong year to year assessment. He was clearly good enough that line had it's hottest stretch with him on it. It started tapering off when they moved Shaw to it. Lehk could possibly be a second liner depending on the make up of the line. His role on the team will determine where he is most useful. I have him as a third liner ideally but also prefer him over some of the players we've used ahead of him like Byron and Shaw. I don't think we have a strong enough team to claim he is strictly a third liner at this point. It will be interesting to see how it plays out this season.

 

[Archijerej]

Which is why I said right now. There is no reason to take the 26 year old even if he is better since that 23 year old will become 26 years old and better.

I don't follow the logic here. Maybe we should trade all established players below the age of 26 then? What if Lehkonen's value doubles in 3 years?

 

[Sorinth]

But his value will not decrease, that's the whole point. He is already an established, middle of the lineup player with some room to improve. Contrary to players you mentioned, he doesn't have to prove himself to anyone. He's one of our most trusted forwards.

There is value in the "some room to improve" label. If he does improve his value will go up, if he doesn't then it will go down simply because the question of whether he'll improve has already been answered as a no.

Personally I'd bank on Lehkonen continuing to improve so I'd rather wait in any case, but as a general statement it's not wrong to suggest the young guy with potential to be more could lose value.

 

[The Great Weal]

Danault didn't get better last year vs the previous year so you are disagreeing about the wrong year to year assessment. He was clearly good enough that line had it's hottest stretch with him on it. It started tapering off when they moved Shaw to it. Lehk could possibly be a second liner depending on the make up of the line. His role on the team will determine where he is most useful. I have him as a third liner ideally but also prefer him over some of the players we've used ahead of him like Byron and Shaw. I don't think we have a strong enough team to claim he is strictly a third liner at this point. It will be interesting to see how it plays out this season.

How did he not get better? If you are solely going by points, Pacioretty sucked that year and we had no replacement for Radulov. I also have him as a 3rd liner, how does that make me totally blind? Shaw has been excellent this season and Byron is undoubtedly better.

 

[The Great Weal]

I don't follow the logic here. Maybe we should trade all established players below the age of 26 then? What if Lehkonen's value doubles in 3 years?

No because those guys are key players for us right now. Kotkaniemi is our most valuable piece, Armia brings something nobody else brings...etc. I dont see Lehkonen as someone we have to keep and it makes a lot more sense to trade him for defense help instead of putting him on the 3rd/4th line where we have much better players. What if he shows no improvement and is still the same struggling player at 26? We would be regretting that we didnt trade him earlier.

 

[montreal]

No because those guys are key players for us right now. Kotkaniemi is our most valuable piece, Armia brings something nobody else brings...etc. I dont see Lehkonen as someone we have to keep and it makes a lot more sense to trade him for defense help instead of putting him on the 3rd/4th line where we have much better players. What if he shows no improvement and is still the same struggling player at 26? We would be regretting that we didnt trade him earlier.

it goes both ways, they could regret trading him in a few years as well, especially if they didn't give him another year at RW instead of LW. Why not trade Tatar, or Drouin? Surely they would have some value, especially if we retain. For me I would be building this team for years down the road when Kotka hopefully turns into a #1 center. Hope that guys like Brook, Suzuki, Poehling, Romanov, Harris, Fleury, Mete, Juulsen, Leks, etc... that enough of them can step up or reach their expected level of play that they can help turn us into a legit contender if we can get other assets to go along with them.

 

[Archijerej]

What if he shows no improvement and is still the same struggling player at 26?

The problem is in perception. To you, Lehkonen's play is underwhelming and you want to liquidate a diminishing asset. To me, he's an excellent young player and one of the core pieces today, and going forward. I don't see him as struggling. He's a better player every year if you look beyond goalscoring.

 

[1909]

At worst, you play him on the 4th line (LW or RW) when Byron will be healthy again.

 

[Runner77]

The problem is in perception. To you, Lehkonen's play is underwhelming and you want to liquidate a diminishing asset. To me, he's an excellent young player and one of the core pieces today, and going forward. I don't see him as struggling. He's a better player every year if you look beyond goalscoring.

MB believes Lehkonen has untapped offensive potential. He's not going to sell that off now, since he'd be selling low. Lehkonen is not going anywhere unless a player with a similar profile is available to play LHD.

 

[Archijerej]

MB believes Lehlonen has untapped offensive potential. He's not going to sell that off now, since he'd be selling low. Lehkonen is not going anywhere unless a player with a similar profile is available to play LHD.

Yeah, pretty much. But I'd still move picks and prospects for a defenceman rather than someone from the roster.

 

[Belial]

MB believes Lehlonen has untapped offensive potential. He's not going to sell that off now, since he'd be selling low. Lehkonen is not going anywhere unless a player with a similar profile is available to play LHD.

And Julien trusts him a ton! If he gets moved it will be for something big.

 

[CauZuki]

MB believes Lehlonen has untapped offensive potential. He's not going to sell that off now, since he'd be selling low. Lehkonen is not going anywhere unless a player with a similar profile is available to play LHD.

Let's not forget Claude loves Lekhonen (although I think he has come to like Armia more).

 

[The Great Weal]

The problem is in perception. To you, Lehkonen's play is underwhelming and you want to liquidate a diminishing asset. To me, he's an excellent young player and one of the core pieces today, and going forward. I don't see him as struggling. He's a better player every year if you look beyond goalscoring.

That's an insanely low standard for excellence. But sure, I think Lehkonen is struggling and dont think will be more than a 3rd liner, you think hes excellent.

 

[angusyoung]

That's an insanely low standard for excellence. But sure, I think Lehkonen is struggling and dont think will be more than a 3rd liner, you think hes excellent.

Bob Gainey

Foward
Born Dec 13 1953 -- Peterborough, ONT
[65 yrs. ago]
Height 6.02 -- Weight 190 [188 cm/86 kg]
Drafted by Montreal Canadiens
- round 1 #8 overall 1973 NHL Amateur Draft
Drafted by Minnesota Fighting Saints
- round 1 #7 overall 1973 WHA Amateur Draft

Regular Season	Playoffs
Season	Team	Lge	GP	G	A	Pts	PIM	+/-	GP	G	A	Pts	PIM
1971-72	Peterborough Petes	OHA	1	0	0	0	31
1972-73	Peterborough Petes	OHA	52	22	21	43	99
1973-74	Nova Scotia Voyageurs	AHL	6	2	5	7	4		--	--	--	--	--
1973-74	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	66	3	7	10	34		6	0	0	0	6
1974-75	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	80	17	21	38	49		11	2	4	6	4
1975-76	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	78	15	13	28	57	20	13	1	3	4	20
1976-77	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	80	14	19	33	41		14	4	1	5	25
1977-78	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	66	15	16	31	57	11	15	2	7	9	14
1978-79	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	79	20	18	38	44	11	16	6	10	16	10
1979-80	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	64	14	19	33	32	-2	10	1	1	2	4
1980-81	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	78	23	24	47	36	13	3	0	0	0	2
1981-82	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	79	21	24	45	24	37	5	0	1	1	8
1982-83	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	80	12	18	30	43	7	3	0	0	0	4
1983-84	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	77	17	22	39	41	10	15	1	5	6	9
1984-85	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	79	19	13	32	40	13	12	1	3	4	13
1985-86	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	80	20	23	43	20	10	20	5	5	10	12
1986-87	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	47	8	8	16	19	0	17	1	3	4	6
1987-88	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	78	11	11	22	14	8	6	0	1	1	6
1988-89	Montreal Canadiens	NHL	49	10	7	17	34	13	16	1	4	5	8
	NHL Totals		1160	239	263	502	585		182	25	48	73	151

[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TFOOT] [/TFOOT]

Embed Bob Gainey stats! | View as text

Just thought I'd show a career 3/4th liners stats for fun, not sure,but I thought he was helpful without scoring a lot in an era of a lot of goals.