Arizona (Phoenix) Coyotes 1996-2024

[barkovcanfinnish]

Has to be a bit on the market just in terms of it not being able to attract someone who saw the opportunity that the nhl believed was there and buy the team and build an arena.

Something about the situation there didn’t lend itself to be attractive enough for some billionaire good owner to want to buy the team.

Whether it was politics or that after Glendale there’s now 2 indoor arenas in the area the economics didn’t make sense for another one or whatever….

There’s a reason why the nhl had to settle for the likes of Leblanc, Barroway, and AM as owners.

Non-traditional markets are not easy to win over. A lot of things need to go right. On-ice success, good marketing, competent ownership, good front office, etc. And all of that needs to be consistently sustained for the market to believe in the product. The hardcore fans will stick with their team but the general public might not invest much time and money if the product constantly sucks. And unfortunately the few years where the Coyotes were good here and there doesn’t outweigh the other 20+ years of mismanagement, cheapness, and poor team performance.

 

[Melrose Munch]

The Coyotes would still have a team if they had a new arena on the way. Not sure what your point is here.

There's one in Glendale they got kicked out of because they didn't want to sign a lease. They rejected an arena they already had and couldn't finance a new one.

but that's water under the bridge.

 

[WarriorOfGandhi]

I can't imagine being emotionally invested in the Coyotes this year, let alone pretty much all of the last 20+ years. Like, I would enjoy seeing success for the Rockies, whose ownership is more or less equally parsimonious, but I'm not going to waste what little time I have on this earth watching their games and keeping tabs on their prospects when all I get in return is misery. For the Coyotes fans who were that dedicated to the logo, I commend your altruism. I hope something good comes out of it for you all.

 

[Stephen]

Weirdly enough, even though the Arizona and or Phoenix Coyotes seem to have been on life support for ages, they did exist for about as long as their predecessor Winnipeg Jets and Winnipeg Jets II have been in the NHL combined.

Can’t say I’m a Yotes supporter or anything… the way its myriad ownership groups have run things has been pretty unimpressive to say the least... it’s financial saga has been frustrating to follow even from a distance, but that market has produced some outstanding players, grown at a grassroots level, at the end of the day it’s a sad feeling to see it end up like this.

Hopefully the NHL and Phoenix can make it work properly somewhere down the road.

 

[MessierII]

Respect to the true fans but this should have happened 15 years ago

 

[Stephen]

There's one in Glendale they got kicked out of because they didn't want to sign a lease. They rejected an arena they already had and couldn't finance a new one.

but that's water under the bridge.

I don’t get the Gila River Arena play. I was looking at the scheduled dates for that building and doesn’t seem like there’s too much going on other than arena football. Does it make any kind of sustainable sense they would have this albatross arena not making any money in an out of the way entertainment district (which is also home to an NFL stadium), and then Scottsdale build something across town? Factor in some Arizona water rights issues, I’m just baffled that that region can build so much stuff on a speculative basis…

 

[Rich Nixon]

I mean other than the Rams (and that had more of a case to happen, let's be honest) all those relocations happened 10-20 years ago. The NHL has not been able to go 10 years without one.

The NFL has had 3 relocations in the last decade. The MLB has one on the horizon. The NBA had one in 2008 and another in 2012...before that, 2002 and 2001. The NHL is bad at stuff but they're not some big exception here.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

I mean other than the Rams (and that had more of a case to happen, let's be honest) all those relocations happened 10-20 years ago. The NHL has not been able to go 10 years without one.

San Diego Chagers -> LA in 2017
Oakland Raiders -> Las Vegas in 2020

 

[Skidooboy]

I don’t get the Gila River Arena play. I was looking at the scheduled dates for that building and doesn’t seem like there’s too much going on other than arena football. Does it make any kind of sustainable sense they would have this albatross arena not making any money in an out of the way entertainment district (which is also home to an NFL stadium), and then Scottsdale build something across town? Factor in some Arizona water rights issues, I’m just baffled that that region can build so much stuff on a speculative basis…

because they were losing even more money with the coyotes playing there than they are now.
just operating it and keeping the ice in was costing millions a year millions they could ill afford.

 

[Turin]

They had fun jerseys

 

[Satans Hockey]

The NFL has had 3 relocations in the last decade. The MLB has one on the horizon. The NBA had one in 2008 and another in 2012...before that, 2002 and 2001. The NHL is bad at stuff but they're not some big exception here.

The Nets moving to Brooklyn was the end of me watching the NBA, they would have absolutely succeeded in Newark if it was done properly but by the time they actually played a few lame duck seasons there it was already announced that they were moving to Brooklyn and they even took "New Jersey" off their jerseys. Plus we also absolutely didn't need yet another arena in this area too.

 

[Heldig]

They had some of the best jerseys in NHL history IMO.

You’ve got to wonder what might have been different if they ever won a Cup

Or if they won the McDavid lottery.

 

[Boris Zubov]

The chargers literally moved up the highway. 99 percent of their fanbase still has access to them.

If you've ever actually taken that ride on I-5 from San Diego to LA, you'd rethink this. Not many people are doing this drive by choice. There's a good reason people choose to live in SD over LA & they tend to avoid LA like the plaque.

 

[Rich Nixon]

The Nets moving to Brooklyn was the end of me watching the NBA, they would have absolutely succeeded in Newark if it was done properly but by the time they actually played a few lame duck seasons there it was already announced that they were moving to Brooklyn and they even took "New Jersey" off their jerseys. Plus we also absolutely didn't need yet another arena in this area too.

Yeah, the arena hustle is stupid. My wife used to go to Nets games all the time as a kid and followed Brooklyn for a few years after the move, but barely watches the NBA in general at this point. It's a shame when it happens...franchises pursue club boxes and bigger corporate sponsors, and I guess science shows you that it's worth turning tens or hundreds of thousands of existing local fans off the league entirely to get those things. I don't think many Oakland A's fans will be eager to watch pro baseball for a while, let alone follow their fanhood to Vegas. If some locality refuses to build you a sterling new billion-dollar facility, just make a crater in that market and leave.

 

[StreetHawk]

Non-traditional markets are not easy to win over. A lot of things need to go right. On-ice success, good marketing, competent ownership, good front office, etc. And all of that needs to be consistently sustained for the market to believe in the product. The hardcore fans will stick with their team but the general public might not invest much time and money if the product constantly sucks. And unfortunately the few years where the Coyotes were good here and there doesn’t outweigh the other 20+ years of mismanagement, cheapness, and poor team performance.

coyotes couldn’t even begin to get into that because they couldn’t get their arena resolved. Everyone involved from nhl to coyotes knew that they needed a new arena as they couldn’t share long term at footprint.

Didn’t make it happen and when the final 3 owners were who the nhl approved that’s on them for not pulling the plug earlier.

nhl worked in Dallas and Denver because the teams arrived in old arenas nearing their end and could work with nba counterparts to build a new one and share revenue. NBA suns not giving up revenue since the arena was basically new when the coyotes arrived.

 

[Lt Dan]

A toast to you Coyotes fans.

The NHL gave you shit owner after shit owner, but you guys hung in there until the end. Don't listen to a word of the naysayers you guys were and will always be real fans and will always have my respect.

I hope you all keep posting here

 

[StreetHawk]

A toast to you Coyotes fans.

The NHL gave you shit owner after shit owner, but you guys hung in there until the end. Don't listen to a word of the naysayers you guys were and will always be real fans and will always have my respect.

I hope you all keep posting here

NHL approved crappy owner after crappy owner.
Which then begs the question, why didn't the Coyotes attract better potential owners than what they ended up with?
Something kept the good ones away or made them not interested.

 

[jeffff]

There were some emotional fans last night after the game, tough to watch to be honest. Politics, money aside.....it does really suck for them.

Phx to Salt Lake has to be in the 600-700 mile range. A good days drive but doable, I'm sure some fans will make the trek.

 

[Lt Dan]

NHL approved crappy owner after crappy owner.
Which then begs the question, why didn't the Coyotes attract better potential owners than what they ended up with?
Something kept the good ones away or made them not interested.

We will never know the answer to that. who was approved and who was denied because the NHL often operates in such secrecy.

Let's peak outside of AZ for a second and remember that the NHL approved "Boots" as an owner and backed the hell out of him.

Right or wrong, Bettman also went to war the Ball-Silly . I will attempt to say as politely as possible that Bettman is a shady motherf***er

 

[Boris Zubov]

There were some emotional fans last night after the game, tough to watch to be honest. Politics, money aside.....it does really suck for them.

Phx to Salt Lake has to be in the 600-700 mile range. A good days drive but doable, I'm sure some fans will make the trek.

That's a 10 hour drive without stopping...way easier to fly.

 

[Stephen]

NHL approved crappy owner after crappy owner.
Which then begs the question, why didn't the Coyotes attract better potential owners than what they ended up with?
Something kept the good ones away or made them not interested.

Perhaps there was just no Jeff Vinnik (or Ryan Smith?) in the market who could do for the Yotes as others have done for other southern markets.

Even a Tom Dundon would have made a big difference, though he has a modern arena in Raleigh in a viable location.

 

[Stephen]

There were some emotional fans last night after the game, tough to watch to be honest. Politics, money aside.....it does really suck for them.

Phx to Salt Lake has to be in the 600-700 mile range. A good days drive but doable, I'm sure some fans will make the trek.

I’m sure there will be a sampling of diehards who will do something like that on occasion but if the drive to Glendale was not feasible I’m not sure SLC would be a viable distance to maintain a franchise to fanbase connection on any scale.

 

[Voight]

Feel like they're kinda stuck though as long as Meruelo's the guy with the rights, aren't they? Like it seems like this whole "revival window" is still in his hands; is there a stealthy way for them to try and change that?

The agreement has a bunch of safeguards in it, such as certain criteria he has to meet over the 5 years. So unless hes all-in 100%, its unlikely hell end up owning a future Phoenix team.

 

[StreetHawk]

Perhaps there was just no Jeff Vinnik (or Ryan Smith?) in the market who could do for the Yotes as others have done for other southern markets.

Even a Tom Dundon would have made a big difference, though he has a modern arena in Raleigh in a viable location.

Those are factors that can drop out good candidates as they may have made their money in other industries and construction isn't something they wish to oversee.
The other AZ franchise, Sarver wasn't a good owner for the suns, Bidwell is considered cheap in the NFL, Dbacks, I am not familiar with but they've already gone to PHX for money for a new stadium.

End of the day, this was a situation that required a good owner to step up and get an arena done, otherwise, they couldn't stay there.

Once Sarver and the Suns got their renovations approved, I didn't think the Coyotes were long for AZ. Ideal scenario was for them to share a venue, but with arena management rights, Suns didn't want to give up anything and thus the Suns owner needed to buy the Coyotes and then get a new arena, which was offered by PHX if they would share.

 

[Howboutthempanthers]

All they needed was good ownership.