Are the Wings players too passive?

[Pavels Dog]

But how do prospects become vets then and ouellet has already shown he's better then ericsson

I must have missed that. Remind me, did he show that in the AHL when he's performing worse than Ericsson was there, or when he was in the NHL and playing worse than Ericsson?

 

[RedWingsfan55]

I've felt they've been too passive for years. It's an organizational philosophy.

 

[BinCookin]

I've thought this for awhile myself; there's just no one on the backend that the opposition has to worry about launching missiles from the point. They're too slow at getting effective shots off, and when they do they are, as you say, weak or blocked, or they're a mile wide. The forwards routinely seem to get outnumbered on the boards in offensive zone because the other teams' forwards know they can cheat down to help, because even if the puck does come out to one of our dmen, they'll fumble it, or take fifteen minutes to settle the puck and get their shot off.

I've been unwilling to hop on the Big Buff bandwagon because big bodies with lots of miles on them seem to go off the cliff in a hurry--even physique freaks like Chara, and Buff ain't no Chara; and Holland's recent track record concerning trades has been trending ever further into disappointment-land--but man, does this team need desperately that kind of offensive presence back there.

At this point I think I'm willing to take the risk because watching a team with Nyquist, Tatar, Larkin, Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Richards and Green on it struggle to score even two goals every night is pathetic, and downright boring. Sure the latter four aren't what they used to be, but we've seen all of them are still smart, creative players and if they had just the little more space and time that an extra presence like Buff could afford them, we'd probably see a lot of our current ills resolved. Pulks and Sheahan might start producing, some of our other dmen might even start producing. We know at this point shuffling forwards around like deck chairs on the Titanic isn't going to fix it. And Kronwall returning won't either--so no, Holland, Kronwall isn't our trade-deadline acquisition. Time for a meaningful shakeup.

Sometimes Big shots are nice (Weber) but if you look at the "best" D man in the league for point shots (Burns) I would say alot of his shots are higher floaters, or merely meant to MAKE IT to the net.

Sometimes he gets lucky with those floaters, sometimes they lead to chances. Burns gets like 4-5 shots a game, he has 200 on the year. The skill is getting them on net, I dont think power is honestly that big a deal.

 

[Run the Jewels]

When's the last time a blast from the point just randomly went in? I feel like nearly every shot from a defensemen is a weak shot/easy save for the goalie or it's blocked and never gets through to begin with. I can't remember the last time the Wing just got "lucky" on a shot from the point that bounced off a leg or something.

DeKeyser is our only d-man with a decent shot. I guess that explains why Babs inserted him on the power play last year. Green in theory should have a good shot however he's not burying much of anything.

 

[Run the Jewels]

I've felt they've been too passive for years. It's an organizational philosophy.

I don't think that was the case under Babcock. They didn't fight, however they'd go to the tough areas and do what needed to get done. This is what it looks like when your two elite players are on their last legs, your one big, skill guy in Mule is unofficially done, and the rest of your skill guys other than Larkin are small and don't have an overwhelming advantage in their skating.

I know people think Abdelkader was a great signing, I am looking forward to seeing how that one turns out.

 

[Winger98]

Sometimes Big shots are nice (Weber) but if you look at the "best" D man in the league for point shots (Burns) I would say alot of his shots are higher floaters, or merely meant to MAKE IT to the net.

Sometimes he gets lucky with those floaters, sometimes they lead to chances. Burns gets like 4-5 shots a game, he has 200 on the year. The skill is getting them on net, I dont think power is honestly that big a deal.

Yep. Lids, Rafalski, Murphy, etc. rarely wound up and slammed the thing on net as hard as they could, but they routinely flipped the puck through traffic and put it in on the goalie to cause a havoc and make a mess of things in front of the net (they were also excellent at holding the puck at the blueline and knocking down clearing attempts, but that's another conversation). Honestly, it's something Kindl was pretty good at, but it's too bad the rest of his game was so damn poor.

Getting more skill back there looks to still be a serious problem, though.

I don't think that was the case under Babcock. They didn't fight, however they'd go to the tough areas and do what needed to get done. This is what it looks like when your two elite players are on their last legs, your one big, skill guy in Mule is unofficially done, and the rest of your skill guys other than Larkin are small and don't have an overwhelming advantage in their skating.

I know people think Abdelkader was a great signing, I am looking forward to seeing how that one turns out.

well, you also highlighted why it wasn't a problem on most Babcock teams. Our main guys were younger, and we had guys like Holmstrom, Cleary, Sammy, Bertuzzi, etc. who, while not being a modern incarnation of the Broad Street Bullies, knew their way around the net and were capable of going to the middle of the ice.

With the group we have, as you said, our two elite guys are just getting old, and guys like Helm, Sheahan, and Jurco aren't doing good jobs of being those guys who go to the middle of the ice and make life rough on the other team. Tatar and Nyquist aren't speedsters who can regularly burn the opposition.

I think the negatives of this club are too apparent right now, though, too. There are problems with this club, but I still don't think we're way worse than the majority of other teams fighting for the playoffs in the East.

 

[Hammettf2b]

Maybe I shouldn't say this, as I'm not in the locker room, but I have a hard time believing we have any aggressive leaders in the locker room. I'm talking guys who will be vocal and call teammates out behind closed doors.

I just don't see Datsyuk or Zetterberg being those kinds of players. They seem like quiet guys who lead by example. It feels like this team needs a vocal leader who will get in people's faces when the need arises.

Time to call up Dan Cleary!!!

 

[InjuredChoker]

guys are who willing to go to the net lack the skill to score/get the puck there. guys who have the skill to score/get the puck there lack willingness to go there. wings players aren't particularly well suited for the cycling game and the D lacks skill and mobility to be rush scoring threat.

other teams can collapse in their own zone because there's little to no offensive threats from the blueline.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Time to call up Dan Cleary!!!

Gee i've thought by now that he would've retired by now.

 

[Ennui]

I think european players tend, again tend, to be more skill and less brawn in their approach to the game

that dosen't mean all are or none are ever not that way(just in general terms)

but i do think that they very makeup of our team in that our top guys are all european leads us to being a more passive team on the ice that can only play the game one way, a systems based approach and when its not working we have no ability whatsoever to play any other way

we simply can not play an in your face rough game, we dont have the calibre and style of players to do so

that is an organizational philosophical deliberate plan on the part of the GM

In an ideal world, another Zemgus Girgensons or equally talented Latvian would be developing that we might be able to draft; the national identity of Latvian players, at least the few that make it this side of the pond, seems to be hard-nosed players that take joy in physically dominating the opposing players.