Anyone here have coaching experience?

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

Just looking to learn more about strategies and how coaching can impact the game. I played low level youth hockey, and the coaches didn’t do much beside set lines and call for changes. We worked drills in practice, some of them were good, but there wasn’t much in the way of forecheck strategy or anything. I do remember practicing breakouts a lot.

Anyways, not ragging on my old coaches, they were just dads doing a good thing and I got a lot out of it- but I’m curious what the Coopers of the world bring to the table, or even what a “real” youth coach adds.

I guess I grew up thinking the coach doesn’t do much in terms of Xs and Os, but I’m probably wrong on that. And pp is probably about more than icing the 5 best players, so I’m just looking for some insights on specific strategies.

Also, I played beer league a while back, and our captain gave some odd guidance. Nice guy, but he got into the game as an adult, and it was just amazing to see everyone standing around, unavailable for passes, be praised as “spreading out”. Ok, ya, the guy behind their net and the one behind their d-man are doing a lot for the breakout.. just interesting to see full-grown men who like this sport be so clueless about it at times, and the head guy kinda guiding it.

Click to read more...

 

[Yukon Joe]

I've helped coach minor hockey for the last 6 years. Let me be clear that I'm much more of the "dad doing a good thing" category than some kind of expert coach. I believe there are others here probably with better hockey IQ than me.

Coaching hockey though is like a pyramid, or building a house. You need to work on the foundations. No use working on power play strategies if you can't skate or stickhandle. So when it comes to "low level youth hockey" your time on the ice is so much better spent working on fundamentals. And this is where breakout drills can also come in - it's a fundamental skill.

Even when it comes to power play - at all but the highest levels I do firmly believe that everyone gets a chance, and you just roll the next five players, rather than trying to pick your 5 best.

Now - my oldest kid plays relatively high level, and it's fun to see his coaches (I don't coach him) work on specialized power play strategies. But it's only because they've mastered the more fundamental skills.

As for beer league... I wish we could get regular practice time. I know I could use it. I would definitely love to get the guys I play with to work on a breakout drill for example! But everyone is out there for fun. I know even with the guys I play with I'm very reluctant to tell guys what to be doing out on the ice except for the most basic information (and remember - I coach kids regularly).

so anyways - I would love to work with my kids on more advanced Xs and Os kind of stuff, but when you're still having to say "two hands on your stick" on a regular basis it would be pointless. You need to walk before you can run.

 

[JMCx4]

... I would love to work with my kids on more advanced Xs and Os kind of stuff, but when you're still having to say "two hands on your stick" on a regular basis it would be pointless. You need to walk before you can run.

Or more apropos to the subject: "You need to glide before you stride."

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Coaching can be huge but not so much because of 'strategy' or x's and os'. At the pro level, everyone knows how to play and where to go on the ice, so they are as much leaders of men and voices as they are strategists.

Youth level is different. Coaches are like jack of all trades, they also delve in basic skill development and managing the team and relationships with parents etc.

If you're looking to learn some of the finer points of the game, watching and then rewatching certain sequences and noting what happened, is good. I usually do that a few times per game with NHL, sometimes you need to do it to really understand what happened on a given play with it being so fast and chaotic.

This channel might help you out too, they have a lot of videos covering a lot of aspects and situations of the game, i just picked a random one. The guy knows his stuff and the finer nuances of the game in terms of leverages, stick/body position and player movement etc.

 

[FrankieC]

Just looking to learn more about strategies and how coaching can impact the game. I played low level youth hockey, and the coaches didn’t do much beside set lines and call for changes. We worked drills in practice, some of them were good, but there wasn’t much in the way of forecheck strategy or anything. I do remember practicing breakouts a lot.

Anyways, not ragging on my old coaches, they were just dads doing a good thing and I got a lot out of it- but I’m curious what the Coopers of the world bring to the table, or even what a “real” youth coach adds.

I guess I grew up thinking the coach doesn’t do much in terms of Xs and Os, but I’m probably wrong on that. And pp is probably about more than icing the 5 best players, so I’m just looking for some insights on specific strategies.

Also, I played beer league a while back, and our captain gave some odd guidance. Nice guy, but he got into the game as an adult, and it was just amazing to see everyone standing around, unavailable for passes, be praised as “spreading out”. Ok, ya, the guy behind their net and the one behind their d-man are doing a lot for the breakout.. just interesting to see full-grown men who like this sport be so clueless about it at times, and the head guy kinda guiding it.

What ages/ level are you coaching?
And what specifically are you seeking assistance with?

 

[lokomotiv15]

Just looking to learn more about strategies and how coaching can impact the game. I played low level youth hockey, and the coaches didn’t do much beside set lines and call for changes. We worked drills in practice, some of them were good, but there wasn’t much in the way of forecheck strategy or anything. I do remember practicing breakouts a lot.

Anyways, not ragging on my old coaches, they were just dads doing a good thing and I got a lot out of it- but I’m curious what the Coopers of the world bring to the table, or even what a “real” youth coach adds.

I guess I grew up thinking the coach doesn’t do much in terms of Xs and Os, but I’m probably wrong on that. And pp is probably about more than icing the 5 best players, so I’m just looking for some insights on specific strategies.

Also, I played beer league a while back, and our captain gave some odd guidance. Nice guy, but he got into the game as an adult, and it was just amazing to see everyone standing around, unavailable for passes, be praised as “spreading out”. Ok, ya, the guy behind their net and the one behind their d-man are doing a lot for the breakout.. just interesting to see full-grown men who like this sport be so clueless about it at times, and the head guy kinda guiding it.

I currently coach midget AAA and coached tier 2 Jr A before along with levels leading up. Any specific questions ?

 

[MDCSL]

I coach both my boys, I played fairly high level hockey and the other coach on my older boys team played a bit in the NHL, he was a high draft pick - 70% of our practice time is spent on skating, the rest split between positioning, breakouts, passing/ice awareness depending on the day. We do a little on just hard work and compete drills, but it’s hard to teach and especially at higher levels the kids either just have it or they don’t. It doesn’t matter if it’s timbits or pro hockey, the team that skates better wins.

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

I currently coach midget AAA and coached tier 2 Jr A before along with levels leading up. Any specific questions ?

Ya, two I can formulate/narrow-

1) How much did you work on powerplay strategy? Entry, movement, etc? At my level we rarely even set up the PP properly, so practicing it obviously didn’t really happen. Buffalo currently has no movement and loves the drop pass entry, so I wonder what other options exist.
2) How much did you coach line strategies or individual issues? Like- do players have specific roles on the forecheck, or do you just let ‘em skate for the most part? What about dmen, do they have specific outlets that should be available, or is it again just a natural flow thing?

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

What ages/ level are you coaching?
And what specifically are you seeking assistance with?

Just generally looking for insight- I’m certain Buffalo’s coaches are failing horribly, but I can’t actually say how they might fix things. The meh PP is a start, I guess. Such a big part of the modern game, I guess it gets refined and makes the biggest difference at the highest levels, but how much influence can coaching have there?

 

[JMCx4]

Just generally looking for insight- I’m certain Buffalo’s coaches are failing horribly, but I can’t actually say how they might fix things. The meh PP is a start, I guess. Such a big part of the modern game, I guess it gets refined and makes the biggest difference at the highest levels, but how much influence can coaching have there?

If your intent is to fix the Sabres' coaching, you're gonna need more than this thread.

 

[sdf]

I have cauching experience

 

[Draiskull]

Ya, two I can formulate/narrow-

1) How much did you work on powerplay strategy? Entry, movement, etc? At my level we rarely even set up the PP properly, so practicing it obviously didn’t really happen. Buffalo currently has no movement and loves the drop pass entry, so I wonder what other options exist.
2) How much did you coach line strategies or individual issues? Like- do players have specific roles on the forecheck, or do you just let ‘em skate for the most part? What about dmen, do they have specific outlets that should be available, or is it again just a natural flow thing?

PP strategies are advanced coaching for when you got everything else figured out. Simpler the better for the most part unless you have a creative playmaking QB.

Player roles when checking is basic skills and are taught at U13 and even U11 levels. Same for what Dmen are suppose to do with or without the puck in each zone.

 

[Slats432]

I coach U16AA and have coached U18AA, scout for JR A.

We run specific breakouts. All five players have a certain job.

We have several specific power play break outs. Attached is an outline of one of ours, showing PP1. 18 is a dman, he is our quarterback. 16 is a forward. He is good on the rush. They have the option of the pick up on the breakout. If 16 picks up, 18 follows. If he leaves it, 18 goes opposite. 19 is another dman he can be an outlet, 16 is an outlet, or wheel is possible. 9 and 21 both swing. One guy far blue to spread the PK forecheck. Generally works good except if there is hard pressure behind the net. (Most teams don't) If they do, then it is either a quick rim or automatic wheel by 18.

In zone we run a 1-3-1. 18 quarterbacks. 21 net front, 9 bumper and 16 and 19 flank. There are about 5-8 plays we can run out of the set up. Net front slide. Pass from flank to slide, to bumper. Pass from flank give and go back to flank. Pass to bumper from flank back to flank one time. Flank up high reverse with QB. Flank to flank back door. Flank fade high for slap pass tip by bumper. (The Sedin)

All of those are practiced specifically in systems practice.

We have specific PK forecheck.

We run a PK diamond in zone, if they are running 1-3-1 and a traditional box if they run an overload.

When we do things poorly in a game, that is likely what we focus on next practice. I have about 1000 drills on my drive. So far this year I have probably used 50.

 

[Yukon Joe]

Ya, two I can formulate/narrow-

1) How much did you work on powerplay strategy? Entry, movement, etc? At my level we rarely even set up the PP properly, so practicing it obviously didn’t really happen. Buffalo currently has no movement and loves the drop pass entry, so I wonder what other options exist.
2) How much did you coach line strategies or individual issues? Like- do players have specific roles on the forecheck, or do you just let ‘em skate for the most part? What about dmen, do they have specific outlets that should be available, or is it again just a natural flow thing?

For my U13 team:

No specific Power Play scheme. In the offensive zone we just want them working the standard which should be F1/F2/F3. Also no specific PK scheme as well other then emphasizing "ice the puck", which is the one thing rules-wise which is different about being on the PK.

Generally speaking there's not much to be learned Xs and Os from the pros. At these kinds of levels (or low-level men's league) defensive play is nowhere near as sharp so zones are going to be entered, defensive lapses will occur.

"line strategies or individual issues"? Players are going to rotate lines and partners, even moving from F to D or back, so we don't work on anything particular to a player's line. Like I said in the offensive zone first forward is F1 goes to the corner, second forward is F2 goes to support, third forward in is F3 in front of the net. D on the blue-line. About as fancy as we get is if a D-man winds up rushing we puck we need the third forward to hold the blue line.

Defensive zone, one D in the corner, centre to assist, other D covering the net, wingers on the board or high slot. D are to try to breakout to the winger, rush it themselves, or swing to the other side behind the net(and never, ever pass up the middle). All very very basic stuff and almost certainly nothing new to anyone here, but still things we struggle with.

So I certainly wouldn't say "natural flow", but the structure is basic, and as long as they play within that, they can improvise from there.

 

[jetsmooseice]

For my U13 team:

No specific Power Play scheme. In the offensive zone we just want them working the standard which should be F1/F2/F3. Also no specific PK scheme as well other then emphasizing "ice the puck", which is the one thing rules-wise which is different about being on the PK.

Generally speaking there's not much to be learned Xs and Os from the pros. At these kinds of levels (or low-level men's league) defensive play is nowhere near as sharp so zones are going to be entered, defensive lapses will occur.

I haven't been keeping stats on my kid's U11 team but I swear they have scored at least as many SH goals as PP. Once you eliminate icing from the equation, they are happy to dump and chase with abandon and once in a while they can beat they other team to the puck and get it in.

There is really not a huge disincentive to penalties at that level

 

[Yukon Joe]

I haven't been keeping stats on my kid's U11 team but I swear they have scored at least as many SH goals as PP. Once you eliminate icing from the equation, they are happy to dump and chase with abandon and once in a while they can beat they other team to the puck and get it in.

There is really not a huge disincentive to penalties at that level

I don't know that I'd go that far (or perhaps U13 is just that much older) but yeah definitely shorties are a thing to be worried about. I have cautioned our guys to only send one in on a short-handed rush because otherwise it can turn the other way in a real hurry.

 

[hawksrule]

@Pez68

 

[Another Empty Netter]

Lots of flow drills

Eliminate the standing around in lines waiting your turn to do a thing

 

[Pez68]

Coaching is extremely variable. It all depends on the age groups you are coaching, and their talent level.

Once you get into "high level" coaching, things change.

Specific questions will be the easiest to address.

 

[Yukon Joe]

Lots of flow drills

Eliminate the standing around in lines waiting your turn to do a thing

So question for you (or anyone else).

I love flow drills. It eliminates wasted time just standing around, and more importantly it avoids kids losing attention while standing around and starting to goof off.

BUT - how do you correct a kid who is just doing it wrong? Do you just try and pull the one kid aside? Or do you have to stop the drill to correct everyone?

 

[lokomotiv15]

Ya, two I can formulate/narrow-

1) How much did you work on powerplay strategy? Entry, movement, etc? At my level we rarely even set up the PP properly, so practicing it obviously didn’t really happen. Buffalo currently has no movement and loves the drop pass entry, so I wonder what other options exist.
2) How much did you coach line strategies or individual issues? Like- do players have specific roles on the forecheck, or do you just let ‘em skate for the most part? What about dmen, do they have specific outlets that should be available, or is it again just a natural flow thing?

1:We have 3, some times 2 practices a week depending on games/tournaments, each 90 mins long. We run 30 minutes of pure skating, edgework, skating skill chaining, etc 2 of the 3 or 1 of the 2 practices a week. Usually run flow drills between that and the back end of stuff of our practice. A lot of reps on break out, positioning, zone entry. As a previous poster stated, if we had a game with poor breakout's or where we had issues gaining the zone, we will put an onus on that the next practice.
At this age and level, most of the kids do skills camps and do excess on ice stuff on their own time with skills coaches, but we do have a skills coach that comes out for the off 50 minute skills session.
Long story long, if we only have two practices in that week, we try to mix that in but put down at least 45 mins of those to Powerplay set up, break-out, zone entry, etc... On a controlled PP breakout, our primary option is the Finnish break-out. 3 swinging off the QB (2 and 1 a side) with a stretch player, but varies. We also run a 1-3-1 because it creates tons of "offensive triangles" and are a bit more of a skilled/possession team.

2: When it comes to individual issues, we aren't really at a level where you take a player aside and work on their stick-handling or backwards cross overs. They are on the team because they are highly proficient players and if we say they need to work on their explosiveness, or their shots or their skill chaining, then they are expected to work on it in the off season, and concentrate on these skills during our developmental drills/ skills sessions, etc. Not trying to sound like a dick, but we have more on the docket than taking one player aside for 30 minutes to teach them how to load an outside edge wrist shot properly; We have a few skills sessions for that where the mechanics are taught, and they can put in the time to improve themselves as much as they want to but it bluntly. A lot of the "individual" stuff would be one on one coaching about where to go on a break out, or options on a power play, to clarify or brainstorm with the players constructively.
F1, F2, F3 all have specific roles on the fore-check and player 1 through 5 all have roles on the back-check. D are given options and coached on both controlled and pressure breakouts and presented with different options. Depending on the teams we are playing, how active their D are on the pinch, or if they tend to clog the middle or boards more, or the forecheck they run, we will have different breakouts that we outline. Changes in how or where the center supports, how high or low our wingers support, if they leave the wall and take the middle, etc... There's always room for creativity, but structure is a necessity.

 

[Slats432]

So question for you (or anyone else).

I love flow drills. It eliminates wasted time just standing around, and more importantly it avoids kids losing attention while standing around and starting to goof off.

BUT - how do you correct a kid who is just doing it wrong? Do you just try and pull the one kid aside? Or do you have to stop the drill to correct everyone?

I would never stop a flow drill to correct one player, unless they killed the drill. You see it, you go to the player and talk to them directly. If everyone is making similar errors based on your direction, then you stop to address the group.

I have a warm up flow drill that is a regroup 3-0. I have two keys to the drill. The pass to the regrouping 3 players is crisp and hard and shots have to come between the dots and the ringette line. If I see 2 or 3 touch passes, or back door tap in passes, I stop the drill to remind them what I am looking for.

Depending on the level, a good mix of flow drills, SAG, then higher you need some system work. Don't forget stations and skills. Even at our level we do Rondo passing to warm up sometimes.

 

[RR44]

Just looking to learn more about strategies and how coaching can impact the game. I played low level youth hockey, and the coaches didn’t do much beside set lines and call for changes. We worked drills in practice, some of them were good, but there wasn’t much in the way of forecheck strategy or anything. I do remember practicing breakouts a lot.

Anyways, not ragging on my old coaches, they were just dads doing a good thing and I got a lot out of it- but I’m curious what the Coopers of the world bring to the table, or even what a “real” youth coach adds.

I guess I grew up thinking the coach doesn’t do much in terms of Xs and Os, but I’m probably wrong on that. And pp is probably about more than icing the 5 best players, so I’m just looking for some insights on specific strategies.

Also, I played beer league a while back, and our captain gave some odd guidance. Nice guy, but he got into the game as an adult, and it was just amazing to see everyone standing around, unavailable for passes, be praised as “spreading out”. Ok, ya, the guy behind their net and the one behind their d-man are doing a lot for the breakout.. just interesting to see full-grown men who like this sport be so clueless about it at times, and the head guy kinda guiding it.

First I like that you commended the "hockey dads" who gave their time to coach, in many ways they do it not because they're experts but they are willing to accept the responsibility to coach, they likely enjoy coaching and helps to stay involved.

In my experience coaching...here's what I always had in my practices (competitive senior hockey so geared towards adults but can be used in any sort of hockey):

-every drill involves a handling, passing and shooting the puck...no pucks would be like batting practice without the baseball

-took time to work on the power play...quite often a good power play is the difference in winning or losing a game. The key is for EVERYONE to know how the power play operates from breakout to setting up...that means your go to guys and your 3rd-4th line players because they will at some point get a chance. The umbrella formation is what I normally liked using so that you had three spots to shoot up top and spread the PK'ers out...the one in the slot was an outlet and the one downlow would crash the net for rebound or tip.

-took time to work on 5 on 4 and 5 on 3 PK...there are different formations (box, diamond, switch, overload) and players need to adapt to the PP with the formation that will be most effective

-3 on 2 drills that are continuous...dmen retrive the puck and regroup to go against another set of dmen, keeps players on the ball and helps the dmen to retrieve the puck and make a good first pass

-have some fun...one drill I did was a shootout at the end where you "bet" on the play to score or not, if he scored the ones who bet he'd score would stay off to the side while the ones who lost the bet did hard skate side to side. A fun way to end practice but keep the skating legs and wind up.

 

[RR44]

So question for you (or anyone else).

I love flow drills. It eliminates wasted time just standing around, and more importantly it avoids kids losing attention while standing around and starting to goof off.

BUT - how do you correct a kid who is just doing it wrong? Do you just try and pull the one kid aside? Or do you have to stop the drill to correct everyone?

I would start by quickly reviewing on the whiteboard, I normally stopped the drill if the flow grinded to a slow crawl or the incorrect way in doing the drill properly was a "drill buster". There is nothing wrong with stopping the drill to correct the error...everyone is addressed with the coach demonstrating what he/she wants to see. And I would have them slow the drill down to 75-80% so they do it properly (ie: come down low enough for a short 10-15 ft pass rather than a 40-50ft pass)...once that occurs they will naturally transition into full speed.

It's not about doing it wrong...it is about doing it correctly so it becomes instictive in a game situation. Great question by the way!

 

[Yukon Joe]

First I like that you commended the "hockey dads" who gave their time to coach, in many ways they do it not because they're experts but they are willing to accept the responsibility to coach, they likely enjoy coaching and helps to stay involved.

In my experience coaching...here's what I always had in my practices (competitive senior hockey so geared towards adults but can be used in any sort of hockey):

-every drill involves a handling, passing and shooting the puck...no pucks would be like batting practice without the baseball

I wanted to comment on this - always having a puck. I'm not sure I agree.

Maybe it's because I coach kids, but you give them pucks annd you can start to lose them. Instead of listening some of the kids are going to start stick-handling, or shooting the puck against the board.

And when you think about it - the majority of the time in a game you aren't going to have a puck!