Confirmed with Link: Andrew Shaw, 6 years/3.9M AAV.

[ijuka]

You're talking about the previous managements. The Leafs have a different management team today.

Patches Chucky Gally
****** Pleks ******
Andrighetto DD/Danult Shaw
Byron Mitchell Flynn
Carr

You see those two holes on our second line? Shaw is not suited to fill either one of them. And I'm not all that comfortable with Gallagher on the first line but I can live with it if MB gets two second line wingers. He hasn't to date.

Now, this might be an unpopular opinion but I'd have paid Radulov his asking price and filled one of those roles. Yes, off ice issues and whatnot, but he still has always produced when he's played in NHL, should be in even better form now, and would have filled a role asset-free(So at least 1-2mil of UFA bonus should have been given).

It can be considered risky for sure, but it is a risk I at least would have been willing to take and the absolute worst-case scenario is that you wait 2 years with a bad contract.

Note: I'm a big fan of Radulov's gameplay.

 

[Hope Of Glory]

Price......best goalie in the world
Subban......top 8 defenseman in the world, Norris trophy winner
Paccioretty......top 5 goal scorer in NHL in the last 5yrs
Gallagher........every team dreams of a Gallagher, a 25/30 goal scorer
Galchenyuk.......6'2 #1 centre that scores 30
Sergachev....... Up and coming #1/2 D
Scherbak......promising prospect
McCarron......promising prospect
Shaw.......2 time Stanley Cup champ......15/20 goal scorer

Where is the MEDIOCRITY here???

What?...because the habs had a injury riddled off year, this is who we were the whole time?
There is work to be done, there is no doubt, but to call this team mediocre is a little overboard, actually, it's way overboard.

Great. Outside of Shaw, Bergevin hasn't aqcuired any of those guys (but you forgot to mention Petry, which was a solid acquisition). If you want to credit Bergevin for first round picks (that he didn't get himself), then you got to blame him for the poor drafting in the past years (outside the first round).

Just to be clear, I don't call this team mediocre. We actually have a pretty awesome nucleus to build around. I call Bergevin's body of work mediocre. Outside of Petry, he didn't acquire anything of importance. Shaw is good, but a marginal improvement on Eller. That's it. In 4 years he brought a 2nd pairing defenseman and improved a bit our 3rd line.

That's not enough. That's not how contenders are built. You don't just wait for guys picked late in the 1st round to make the team. Because by that time vets that used to be important (Markov, Plekanec) will be gone and they'll merely replace those guys, which is not even a guarantee. Chicago had to get top players in Hossa and Campbell to win the cup. Even with a lot of top end picks they had to get external help. They didn't just wait around.

But the offseason is not over yet so we'll see. The clock is ticking, though.

 

[Andy]

Good post. I mostly agree with you, except that I don't see him as a gamble at all. It's safe to assume he'll continue to be at least a 15g 15a player if he's in the top 9 and on the PP. Add his grit / intangibles and the fact that he can play shutdown hockey in a one-goal game, and he's worth $3.5m. If he can raise his production as he gets older and maybe even gets near 30 goals one season, then his $3.9m will be worth it.

Well, I think it's more of a gamble in relying on him to break out into a bonafide top 6 forward. I think he will hover around 10-15 goals and 25-35 points, no doubt about it. At the same time, I also believe that MB is gambling here on Shaw breaking out into a 20-25g & 40-50p player.

 

[Habs Icing]

Now, this might be an unpopular opinion but I'd have paid Radulov his asking price and filled one of those roles. Yes, off ice issues and whatnot, but he still has always produced when he's played in NHL, should be in even better form now, and would have filled a role asset-free(So at least 1-2mil of UFA bonus should have been given).

It can be considered risky for sure, but it is a risk I at least would have been willing to take and the absolute worst-case scenario is that you wait 2 years with a bad contract.

Note: I'm a big fan of Radulov's gameplay.

Until Friday I would have said no never. But now I'm hoping MB gets at the very least a Radulov. It's the kind of gamble he's willing to take for a mil or two

 

[jaffy27]

If he's playing with 12 mil and Okposo is asking too much, there are other fishes in the sea. Especially this year. He got rid of Eller. His next trade should have been for a top six winger. It wasn't. His next move was for Shaw. That tells me he sees Shaw as a top six winger. I don't see it but right now I'm hoping I'm wrong and that MB's evaluation is correct.

There is no such thing as fishes.....there are only fish

Like your post though....Bergevin will bring in another top 6, mark my words

 

[OnTheRun]

There is no such thing as fishes.....there are only fish

Like your post though....Bergevin will bring in another top 6, mark my words

Habs are talking to Weise according to LeBrun, so yeah... Buckle up gents the top6 is coming...back.

 

[Habs Icing]

There is no such thing as fishes.....there are only fish

Like your post though....Bergevin will bring in another top 6, mark my words

The plural of fish is usually fish, but fishes has a few uses. In biology, for instance, fishes is used to refer to multiple species of fish. For example, if you say you saw four fish when scuba diving, that means you saw four individual fish, but if you say you saw four fishes, we might infer that you saw an undetermined number of fish of four different species.

I hope you're right. But I want two not one top six and Shaw is not a top six in my books.

 

[Smokey Thompson]

Well, I think it's more of a gamble in relying on him to break out into a bonafide top 6 forward. I think he will hover around 10-15 goals and 25-35 points, no doubt about it. At the same time, I also believe that MB is gambling here on Shaw breaking out into a 20-25g & 40-50p player.

I can agree with that. It's nowhere near the gamble that Semin / Kassian were. Even if Shaw doesn't pan out as a 25g player, he'll still be very useful for us going forward.

 

[jaffy27]

Great. Outside of Shaw, Bergevin hasn't aqcuired any of those guys (but you forgot to mention Petry, which was a solid acquisition). If you want to credit Bergevin for first round picks (that he didn't get himself), then you got to blame him for the poor drafting in the past years (outside the first round).

Just to be clear, I don't call this team mediocre. We actually have a pretty awesome nucleus to build around. I call Bergevin's body of work mediocre. Outside of Petry, he didn't acquire anything of importance. Shaw is good, but a marginal improvement on Eller. That's it. In 4 years he brought a 2nd pairing defenseman and improved a bit our 3rd line.

That's not enough. That's not how contenders are built. You don't just wait for guys picked late in the 1st round to make the team. Because by that time vets that used to be important (Markov, Plekanec) will be gone and they'll merely replace those guys, which is not even a guarantee. Chicago had to get top players in Hossa and Campbell to win the cup. Even with a lot of top end picks they had to get external help. They didn't just wait around.

But the offseason is not over yet so we'll see. The clock is ticking, though.

My post wasn't about who got who, it had to do with mediocrity....habs have many good pieces in place, we'll be fine, but we do have a couple of anchors that need to be cut loose......hoping for some cap dump type trades....As for Markov and Plekanec being gone, I'm not worried, they've had their time to prove themselves and have never raised their game to the occasion. (Although I am a Markov fan)

The core is all in its 20's and the up and comers will be ready within 2 yrs, it's all gonna come together perfectly. I said it here on HF 2yrs ago, this team will win the cup when Scherbak and McCarron are part of this team and DD is gone.

And you're right, absolutely right, the offseason is not over, it's just started, let's see how this next week pans out

 

[ohmyjlord]

If he's playing with 12 mil and Okposo is asking too much, there are other fishes in the sea. Especially this year. He got rid of Eller. His next trade should have been for a top six winger. It wasn't. His next move was for Shaw. That tells me he sees Shaw as a top six winger. I don't see it but right now I'm hoping I'm wrong and that MB's evaluation is correct.

I don't see Shaw as a top-6 either. I just don't give the sequence of event that much importance.

To me, Shaw is just replacing Eller, both of which were third liners. Had we not traded Eller, and not traded for Shaw, everyone here would still have their fingers crossed come July 1st, hoping to see Bergevin to sign one of the top free agent wingers.

Nothing changed for me on that front. One name changed for another one, that's it.

Now if Bergevin fails to attract a top-6 winger, he SHOULD get criticized for that. But I don't think adding Shaw prevented us from adding a second one. Unless Bergevin finds a way to part with Desharnais and Emelin, I think he sees Galchenyuk, Pacioretty, Gallagher, Plekanec and Free Agent #1 as our top-5, and is banking on one of Andrighetto/Carr or one of our prospects to round up the top-6. Or hell, maybe he'll try another Semin-ish move. I think that's his plan...and always have been, with or without Shaw.

Do I agree with this plan ? Lets just say I'm skeptical to say to least. But it doesn't change my opinion on Shaw. Overpaid a bit to acquire him, overpaid by 1y and $150k...but overall, it's really not the end of the world.

 

[Beendair Donedat]

Lot of people dog piling on this trade and subsequent signing of Shaw.

Here are my thoughts on it so far:

Hated that we traded Eller as it indicates that the pro-Desharnais win with an inferior French player mantra is alive and well, and will always be a factor in this regime. Eller was **** on from the beginning by Therrien and Desharnais given every opportunity. It's indicative of everything that is wrong with this organization.

The trade itself wasn't a bad deal. Even though we traded the wrong player, you have to pay to play and Bergevin got a superior player (Shaw) in a postion where we were badly lacking any depth (right wing). We also now have 5 second round draft picks over the next two years to either draft or use to acquire more assets via trade. That's a terrific postion to be in, and he deserves credit for asset management IMO. I'm not sure if Shaw slots in as a second line or third line player now but having Gallagher and Shaw on the right side is an improvement.

Shaw is now a cost controlled asset and a part of the core of this team. He's a proven winner and adds secondary scoring, toughness and leadership, something that is sorely lacking on this team. The term may be too long for some and I appreciate that most feel it's too long. Maybe it is, but Bergevin identified that we needed what Shaw had and paid the market price to keep that asset locked up. I don't have an issue with that, even if he is slightly overpaid.

Overall I think that this trade improved the Habs hockey club. I don't like the pro Desharnais factor that influenced the deal, but it does give the team depth and better leadership, more toughness and skill. It still hasn't addressed the need to acquire to top line talent, which leads to a great deal of frustration from the fan base. We will see what happens with free agency, but we need top end talent to the tune of a 25-30 goal scorer up front badly.

 

[OldCraig71]

Are we really talking to Dale Weise? What a shock!!!! Shaw and Weise are the two top 6 players that we need, we are now contenders!!!!

 

[jaffy27]

The plural of fish is usually fish, but fishes has a few uses. In biology, for instance, fishes is used to refer to multiple species of fish. For example, if you say you saw four fish when scuba diving, that means you saw four individual fish, but if you say you saw four fishes, we might infer that you saw an undetermined number of fish of four different species.

I hope you're right. But I want two not one top six and Shaw is not a top six in my books.

Ah, so you were talking biology?...

Just bugging you...

2 top 6 is pushing it I think, let's start with 1 and I'd be pumped.

 

[jaffy27]

Are we really talking to Dale Weise? What a shock!!!! Shaw and Weise are the two top 6 players that we need, we are now contenders!!!!

It's also reported that we're gonna take a run at Stamkos!.....lets talk about that one!

 

[phoque taupe]

Habs are talking to Weise according to LeBrun, so yeah... Buckle up gents the top6 is coming...back.

our bottom 12 will be amazing

 

[Hope Of Glory]

My post wasn't about who got who, it had to do with mediocrity....habs have many good pieces in place, we'll be fine, but we do have a couple of anchors that need to be cut loose......hoping for some cap dump type trades....As for Markov and Plekanec being gone, I'm not worried, they've had their time to prove themselves and have never raised their game to the occasion. (Although I am a Markov fan)

The core is all in its 20's and the up and comers will be ready within 2 yrs, it's all gonna come together perfectly. I said it here on HF 2yrs ago, this team will win the cup when Scherbak and McCarron are part of this team and DD is gone.

And you're right, absolutely right, the offseason is not over, it's just started, let's see how this next week pans out

I agree that we have a pretty good core. And that is what is the most frustrating to me. We're the closest we've been to actual contender in decades but I don't trust this management to take us to the next level.

I guess we'll see what happens next but we said the same thing at the exact same time last year. The UFA crop is better this year but still, I'm not holding my breath.

 

[cphabs]

5'11 178lbs LMFAO!

3.9? 6 years ?

 

[Paul Dipietro]

our bottom 12 will be amazing

Well played

 

[OldCraig71]

It's also reported that we're gonna take a run at Stamkos!.....lets talk about that one!

I can't wait for July 1st to watch it all unfold.

 

[brian70]

My thoughts on the deal.

https://seamoresports.com/2016/06/28/three-random-thoughts-before-free-agency/

Shaw does not kill penalties.

 

[Habs Icing]

Ah, so you were talking biology?...

Just bugging you...

2 top 6 is pushing it I think, let's start with 1 and I'd be pumped.

Pumped for what....lol? Getting kicked out in the 2nd round? We need two more decent scorers on this team because it's guaranteed that Patches will soil the bed

 

[Hoople]

You're talking about the previous managements. The Leafs have a different management team today.

Patches Chucky Gally
****** Pleks ******
Andrighetto DD/Danult Shaw
Byron Mitchell Flynn
Carr

You see those two holes on our second line? Shaw is not suited to fill either one of them. And I'm not all that comfortable with Gallagher on the first line but I can live with it if MB gets two second line wingers. He hasn't to date.

The problem with your lineup is Carr where he's at.

Carr is a goal scorer. And he will be Top 6 for the Habs sooner than later. Some people prefer Andrighetto. Some say Lekhonen will be the guy. Bringing in two Top 6 UFA (don't see how we fit that with the Cap) stifles the development of our young guys.

Bring in one Top 6 now, and with the talent we have, we will make the playoffs. That's the time to go for it with a Top 6 rental at the deadline.

Because.....if Price goes down with an injury and we are spent to the Cap, it's going to be a struggle, even with the two Top 6 guys. Saving for the playoffs is the wiser choice.

 

[Habs Icing]

The problem with your lineup is Carr where he's at.

Carr is a goal scorer. And he will be Top 6 for the Habs sooner than later. Some people prefer Andrighetto. Some say Lekhonen will be the guy. Bringing in two Top 6 UFA (don't see how we fit that with the Cap) stifles the development of our young guys.

Bring in one Top 6 now, and with the talent we have, we will make the playoffs. That's the time to go for it with a Top 6 rental at the deadline.

Because.....if Price goes down with an injury and we are spent to the Cap, it's going to be a struggle, even with the two Top 6 guys. Saving for the playoffs is the wiser choice.

Problem is I don't want to make the playoffs. I want to win the Cup. Carr/Andrighetto/ Lekhonen on your top six in the next two years will win no such thing.

 

[Price is Wright]

That's simply not true. People gave him credit when he acquired Vanek, same for Petry and Weise before he was overused. And Muller as well.

Weise for Diaz was extremely hated for a while. Even when Weise was a playoff hero you had people criticizing saying just watch, Diaz will come around.

 

[Smokey Thompson]

Problem is I don't want to make the playoffs. I want to win the Cup. Carr/Andrighetto/ Lekhonen on your top six in the next two years will win no such thing.

That's why you add a top6 player at the deadline as a rental or you make a hockey trade in January / February to upgrade your top 6. Signing two top 6 UFAs is an easy way to cripple our cap situation for a long time.

Signing one of Eriksson, Luc, Boedker, etc. would be enough.