Stanger31 said:While i agree with your views on Kastitsyn, You were way off on O'Sullivan. It was not his character that got him drafted that late, but what seemed to be uncertainty. He was abused severly by his father for much of his adolescent life both mentally and physically. Think tough love multiplied by about 100. Getting kicked in the backed, yelled at (not just a little, but extremely) for small mistakes, all while you are in junior hockey and lower. It got so severe to merit restraining orders, and other such measures to keep his father away from him. Had nothing been done, he may have killed him at the rate the "punishment" was escalating. I got to read about the story and it is truly a case of when hockey parents go too far.
Don't put that on him, this kid truly has character, much more than people that spout off without knowing exactly what they are talking about, but decide to throw their 2cents in anyway. If you don't know his story, don't say anything, ask. It took me forever to get ahold of some truly reliable info with actual interviews from him and his mother. You wouldn't be perfect either if you went through what he went through. And if i'm not mistaken, i believe his dad was either a rather large man also, was either very tough, or both. It was one of those options. And Sully isn't a very big guy to begin with, let alone when he's 14 or so.
turnbuckle said:Sorry, but his background has quite a bit to do with his character. You grow up in a tough environment, you sometimes aren't the most well adjusted kid; and that appears to have been the case with O'Sullivan at times in his hockey past.
O'Sullivan has pulled a number of stunts didn't endear him to teammates, coaches, or scouts through the years, in particular his propensity for staying on the ice for two minutes or more when he takes the notion. According to one scout I know quite well, he was sent to the dressing room by Lou Vairo at the last World Junior Championship to the applause of his teammates after staying on the ice for an eternity for an entire power play in a critical match against either the Russians or Swedes (I can't recall exactly). It wasn't the first time either.
Yes; he was abused by his father (I've heard quite a few stories), and obviously swayed in some of his decisions, such as leaving the Ice Dogs; but that doesn't make his behaviour totally excusable.
I talked to three or four scouts about O'Sullivan before last year's draft; his character was a question entering the draft - why the hell else did his stock drop? As I stated before, it wasn't because of a lack of talent, it was mainly because of "character" issues.
Now, if you choose to ignore a person's background when it comes to "character" questions, that's your prerogative. Fact is, that's not always the way NHL teams look at it, in particular the scouting fraternity. Unfortunately, a person's background can be highly scrutinized by the hockey birddogs, particularly if it's checkered.
BTW - I wrote a draft piece for the Ottawa Sun that appeared in the June 20th issue (draft day). They gave me a full-page spread actually.
I'm not saying I'm an expert on O'Sullivan or the draft, but, after accumulating many comments concerning O'Sullivan right before the draft from the fellows about to make the picks, it's my opinion that he was passed over by many teams because of "character" questions.
habdicted said:Bo said:This is the most laughable thing I've ever read, frankly you don't know
s__t about Kosticyn just like the rest of us--so don't pretend you do--
fourth liner ala Jason Ward HA! HA! HA! now thats funny.
So by YOUR logic he COULD turn out to be a fourth rounder or even nothing as well since none of us know anything about him. Dont pretend like YOU do and laugh at someone who has an OPINION which is the only thing alot of us have at this point because NOONE (yourself included) knows what he will turn out to be. In my opinion what is laughable is YOUR post.
turnbuckle said:Sorry, but his background has quite a bit to do with his character. You grow up in a tough environment, you sometimes aren't the most well adjusted kid; and that appears to have been the case with O'Sullivan at times in his hockey past.
O'Sullivan has pulled a number of stunts didn't endear him to teammates, coaches, or scouts through the years, in particular his propensity for staying on the ice for two minutes or more when he takes the notion. According to one scout I know quite well, he was sent to the dressing room by Lou Vairo at the last World Junior Championship to the applause of his teammates after staying on the ice for an eternity for an entire power play in a critical match against either the Russians or Swedes (I can't recall exactly). It wasn't the first time either.
Yes; he was abused by his father (I've heard quite a few stories), and obviously swayed in some of his decisions, such as leaving the Ice Dogs; but that doesn't make his behaviour totally excusable.
I talked to three or four scouts about O'Sullivan before last year's draft; his character was a question entering the draft - why the hell else did his stock drop? As I stated before, it wasn't because of a lack of talent, it was mainly because of "character" issues.
Now, if you choose to ignore a person's background when it comes to "character" questions, that's your prerogative. Fact is, that's not always the way NHL teams look at it, in particular the scouting fraternity. Unfortunately, a person's background can be highly scrutinized by the hockey birddogs, particularly if it's checkered.
BTW - I wrote a draft piece for the Ottawa Sun that appeared in the June 20th issue (draft day). They gave me a full-page spread actually.
I'm not saying I'm an expert on O'Sullivan or the draft, but, after accumulating many comments concerning O'Sullivan right before the draft from the fellows about to make the picks, it's my opinion that he was passed over by many teams because of "character" questions.
Stanger31 said:It sounds like your idea of "character" is a little off. Even from what you said, they seem to have passed over him for uncertainty of his priorities and what he wanted. Not his character. Not knowing what you want does not mean you have a poor character. Especially when you have a very personal crisis you are still trying to deal with almost on your own.
And its people like you that believe that him leaving a team for personal problems is not excusable. Sorry, but there are many many many more important things in life than hockey, especially during tough times. Its not his character. He appears to have tried to deal with these problems alone for many years, and to me that shows true character.
You have to understand, someone can have problems and still be of very high character.
This was O'sullivan's worst part of his life, and will be worse than most of ours, in a common sense view, he handled it pretty damn well. The father you think is supposed to have unconditional love for you, and you thought he did, starts to make your life a living hell. You believe he will KILL you over hockey. Your father. Give me a break buddy, This kid has character. He fought through it. take the golden spoon outta your mouth.
They didn't know what was happening with him, not questions of his character.
stardog said:So by YOUR logic he COULD turn out to be a fourth rounder or even nothing as well since none of us know anything about him. Dont pretend like YOU do and laugh at someone who has an OPINION which is the only thing alot of us have at this point because NOONE (yourself included) knows what he will turn out to be. In my opinion what is laughable is YOUR post.
turnbuckle said:Look BUDDY; dissect my description the word word "character" all you want - FOR WHATEVER REASONS - a player with top ten talent was passed over - If there were not concerns about his past and his behaviour in certain situations (such as his selfishness concerning ice time at the WJC) - then you tell me why he wasn't picked in the first two rounds. YOU give me an explanation. WHY?
Instead of trying to make this a personal thing - let's get back to the jist of the argument here - why wasn't O'Sullivan a top 10 pick if he's "Mr. Character?"
And so to ask the question again, if O'Sullivan has top 10 talent & his character is not in question, why was he not picked until #56 overall??DutchLeafsfan said:Well, according to Stanger31, the reason why he was passed over in the draft was concerns about how his character would develop after all these terrible years with his father, and whether these years had impacted on his character in a negative way. On the other hand you are basically suggesting that O' Sullivan has a bad character, based on some actions of his, while largely ignoring the circumstances of these actions. Personally, based on articles and opinions I have read on the draft, I'd say Stanger31's view is closer to reality than yours.
Spongebob said:After watching several of you butcher his name I wanted to let you know his name is ............. Kostitsyn
not Kastsitsyn or Kastistsyn or Katsisyn or even Kastsitysn.
Duff88 said:It can both be written Kastitsyn and Kostitsyn
Thomas said:On draft day, it was written Kastsitsyn on the back of his jersey, so thats why most of Habs fan spell his name that way.
Spongebob said:That is fine but let us all be consistent.If you scan this thread you will find his name spelled 5 different ways.
In Russian names are written phonetically.On his Russian team CSKA his name is spelled Kostitsyn.So I am making the assumption that it is pronounced that way as well.
Bo said:Kostantin Korneev, who was the Hab's 9th round pick a year ago was a regular last season in the RSL as an 18 year old. This season he has been picked to the Russian national team at 19. Kosticyn has not been able to break in as a regular at 18. Korneev who was drafted about 250th overall has turned out to be a better prospect than Kosticyn who was drafted 10th overall.
Bo said:Kostantin Korneev, who was the Hab's 9th round pick a year ago was a regular last season in the RSL as an 18 year old. This season he has been picked to the Russian national team at 19. Kosticyn has not been able to break in as a regular at 18. Korneev who was drafted about 250th overall has turned out to be a better prospect than Kosticyn who was drafted 10th overall.
Vlad The Impaler said:What do you mean by "has turned out to be a better prospect", exactly?