All-Time Draft #7 Round 2: #2 Trail Smoke Eaters vs. #4 Edmonton Oilers

[God Bless Canada]

The Trail Smoke Eaters will face the Edmonton Oilers in a Jim Robson Division semi-final. Trail dispatched the Winnipeg Jets in the first round in five games, while the Oilers needed six games to defeat the Vancouver Canucks. Trail and Edmonton have engaged in spirited discussions throughout the draft, and they have very similar teams, so this promises to be a hard-fought series on, and possibly off, the ice.

ROSTERS​

TRAIL SMOKE EATERS​

Coach: Punch Imlach
Captain: Clarence "Hap" Day
Alternate Captain: Leonard "Red" Kelly
Alternate Captain: Henri "The Pocket Rocket" Richard
Alternate Captain: Bernie "Boom Boom" Geoffrion


Sweeney Schriner-Henri Richard-Bernie "Boom Boom" Geoffrion
Valeri Kamensky-Duke Keats-Mickey Redmond
Gilles Tremblay-Joel Otto-Claude Provost
Curt Fraser-Dale Hunter-Wilf Paiement
Garry Unger

Leonard "Red" Kelly-Rob Blake
Clarence "Hap" Day-Stefan Persson
Gus Mortson-Brian Engblom
Gary Bergman

Grant Fuhr
Al Rollins
John Ross Roach​

EDMONTON OILERS​

Head Coach: Don Cherry
Captain: Ted Lindsay
Alternate: Bob Gainey
Alternate: Darryl Sittler
Alternate: Scott Stevens

#7 Ted Lindsay - #5 Nels Stewart - #8 Punch Broadbent
#11 Brian Sutter - #27 Darryl Sittler - #9 Glenn Anderson
#23 Bob Gainey - #27 Mike Peca - #12 Duane Sutter
#20 Al Secord - #12 Tom Lysiak - #19 Scott Mellanby
#27 Darryl Sutter

#2 Scott Stevens - #2 Jack Stewart
#4 Craig Hartsburg - #44 Dave Babych
#2 Ian Turnbull - #21 Jason Smith
#5 Phil Russell

#30 Rogie Vachon
#1 Eddie Giacomin
#29 Mike Palmateer​

Click to read more...

 

[God Bless Canada]

I'll post my full series preview later this evening, and will try to respond to any of Murphy's rambling in the mean time.

Looking forward to it, Murphy. I think this is the match-up that everyone has always wanted to see. Just wish we could have done it in the conference final. This series will have a survivor, not a winner.

 

[shawnmullin]

Gotta say this one is absolutely going the distance.

 

[Murphy]

ramblings.....lol

Well off the top, having to go to Trails barn for the first two games. I'm happy with matching up big Nels Stewarts line (from here on in, known as the "hurt" line) with the little pocket rockets line. I'd love to see a picture of the opening faceoff.

Not having to go seven games and coming off three wins in a row the mighty Oil have momentum baby. The physical game plan is going to be stepped up even more and there's not a thing Dale Hunter is going to be able to do about it.

 

[Murphy]

The Edmonton Oilers will open up Rexall Place to view game 1 & 2 on the jumbotron.

A complete sellout is expected.

In further developments a throng of Oiler fans 500 strong, invaded the town of Trail to secure a section of the rink for themselves. At first the Trail box office was hesitant to free up tickets to the unruly group but fearing a riot they soon relented.

 

[shawnmullin]

The Edmonton Oilers will open up Rexall Place to view game 1 & 2 on the jumbotron.

A complete sellout is expected.

In further developments a throng of Oiler fans 500 strong, invaded the town of Trail to secure a section of the rink for themselves. At first the Trail box office was hesitant to free up tickets to the unruly group but fearing a riot they soon relented.

Don't mess with Trail.

500 damn, that's like half the capacity

 

[vancityluongo]

This will be interesting to say the least.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain*]

I know it will be said many times, but this series will be interesting! I hope to face one of these teams in the conference finals!

 

[God Bless Canada]

Don't mess with Trail.

500 damn, that's like half the capacity

Don't worry. After Edmonton fans suspiciously suffer illness and injury, there won't be any coming down for Games 5 and 7.

Trail is a wonderful town, but for the next week, our city has taken a distinct anti-Edmonton policy. Any fans from Edmonton found on the streets after 9 p.m. (unless they're on their way back to the hotel from the arena) will be incarcerated. The Edmonton fans will be relegated to our cheapest hotels, and due to the number of Edmonton fans in Trail for the series (and the amount of media in Trail for the series, which has taken a prize-fight like atmosphere), Edmonton players will have to stay in nearby Rossland. And don't be surprised if Edmonton fans find their cuisine and accommodations to be well, sub-standard.

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

I have to say, as good as this series is going to be, I kind of having the feeling that the winner will just be a lamb heading for the slaughter house...

 

[Murphy]

I have to say, as good as this series is going to be, I kind of having the feeling that the winner will just be a lamb heading for the slaughter house...

Huh? Are you insinuating that the Nanaimo prima donnas are going to be putting up some kind of fight?

 

[God Bless Canada]

Series preview.

OFFENCE: Edge - Edmonton. If the Oilers defence can get the puck to the forwards, Edmonton's forwards will have an offensive edge on Trail. Edmonton has the best forward in this series in Ted Lindsay, although Geoffrion is nearly Lindsay's equal in the playoffs. Edmonton has much better depth up front as well. Both teams have good offensive balance up front, with capable offensive players on all four lines. Nels Stewart was one of the biggest steals in the draft. Trail will get more offence from their defence. Neither team is comfortable playing 6-5 type games, but if it does reach that type of game, Edmonton would be your bet.

DEFENCE: Edge - Trail. If we're talking strictly blue-line vs. blue-line, then Trail has a big edge. All six defencemen can move the puck and take care of their own zone. While Trail doesn't have a true shut-down pairing like Stevens-"Black Jack" Stewart, they have six defencemen capable of playing on a shut-down pairing. Edmonton does not. In terms of team defensive play, it's an almost dead heat. Both teams play an excellent defensive system, both teams have excellent defensive players spread throughout the line-up. Edmonton might have a slightly higher top-end with their defensive players (Gainey, Stevens and Black Jack), but Trail has better depth. As far as defensive ability, Edmonton's fourth line doesn't scare me, they don't have a player as good defensively as Hunter or especially Fraser, and we'll try to exploit that Geoffrion vs. Secord match-up as much as possible.

GOALTENDING: Edge - Trail. This is Grant Fuhr's time of year. Regular season? Shutouts? Goals against average? Who needs that. Wins is what counts. Playoffs count. And how many bad playoffs did Fuhr have from 1984 to 1999? No. 1 goalie for four Cup champs, a non-active roster player for a fifth, and showed in St. Louis late in his career that he could play behind a strong defensive team. Vachon's an excellent goalie, a solid No. 1 who has two rings, including one as a No. 1. He won't cost you a series, but in the clutch, is he the goalie you want ahead of Fuhr? No. Ed Giacomin is the best NHL goalie to never win the Cup.

COACHING: Edge - Trail. This is our biggest edge in the series. Imlach is a much better coach than Cherry. Imlach has four rings. He's not the most popular coach in the history of the game, but on the right team, with the right players, he's outstanding. And we think he's on the right team with the right coach. I think Cherry gets a bad rap from some people, but he's definitely in the bottom five for coaches in the draft. He's got his type of team, but a guy like Roger Neilson would have been perfect for this team. Watch the Imlach vs. Sittler match-up. Both guys will be craving to beat the other. And Imlach knows exactly what it will take to shut Sittler down.

GRIT: Edge - Edmonton. Grittiest team in the draft. This team is loaded with trench warfare guys. Sittler might be the softest guy on the roster. And that's saying a lot, because he wasn't a perennial Lady Byng candidate. Trail's got grit, a much tougher line-up than the last draft, and a guy like Geoffrion has underrated toughness, but Edmonton is loaded with toughness. A guy like Fraser will be key in trying to goad some of Edmonton's players into penalties.

INTANGIBLES - Edge: Trail. I said from the start that I believed my team had the intangibles edge over every team in the draft. So of course I'm going to say that we have the edge in this series. But it's not by much. We have more rings, and lots of guys who played key role on Cup champs. But it's not by much. In typical Edmonton tradition, this team has more captains than any other team in the draft. They're loaded with character. Possibly a couple more free spirits than Trail (a guy like Turnbull comes to mind).

MONSTER MATCH-UP: The GMs. Murphy and GBC have engaged in a war of words since the divisions were announced. It started out as verbal jabs between good friends, but has deteriorated to a war of words. The "same ineffective GM" remark by GBC took the rivalry to a new level. Rumour has it that an entourage of police will be separating the two rivals during the series, to ensure that there isn't a brawl between the two...

Okay, in all seriousness, the big match-up is between Claude Provost and Ted Lindsay. Lindsay is the consensus No. 2 LW of all-time, and one of the top five offensive LW's ever. (His value is augmented by his all-round game). When we nabbed Provost, we said that we got the best defensive RW in the draft, a guy whose value soared in the playoffs. He played a big role in shutting down Bobby Hull. We're confident that he'll do the same against Lindsay.

PREDICTION: Trail in a very tough, gruelling, seven-game series. I was hoping that Siberia would pull it out vs. Saskatoon, since I felt that the match-up vs. Siberia was much better for us. (A huge edge to Trail in defence and intangibles vs Siberia). Plus, we'd get to watch Edmonton grind Nanaimo down in a seven-game marathon. Instead, we get the seven-game war against Edmonton now, the verbal war between the two teams, and likely the most intense series of the second round.

 

[Murphy]

Don't worry. After Edmonton fans suspiciously suffer illness and injury, there won't be any coming down for Games 5 and 7.

Trail is a wonderful town, but for the next week, our city has taken a distinct anti-Edmonton policy. Any fans from Edmonton found on the streets after 9 p.m. (unless they're on their way back to the hotel from the arena) will be incarcerated. The Edmonton fans will be relegated to our cheapest hotels.

In further developments, with tickets in hand and finding accomodations in town less than accomodating, the motley group of 500 strong Oil fans have decide to set up camp in the city campground and christened the park Oiler Central. RCMP have had to call in extra re-inforcements. "by all accounts, its looking like it's going to be a wild week in the town of Trail" staff sargent for the RCMP has been quoted as saying.

 

[God Bless Canada]

In further developments, with tickets in hand and finding accomodations in town less than accomodating, the motley group of 500 strong Oil fans have decide to set up camp in the city campground and christened the park Oiler Central. RCMP have had to call in extra re-inforcements. "by all accounts, its looking like it's going to be a wild week in the town of Trail" staff sargent for the RCMP has been quoted as saying.

Why do I get the feeling that mullin is going to be filing a story on a massive arson at the Trail campground by the end of the week?

 

[Frightened Inmate #2]

With a Special Bulletin...

It appears as though with a new 100 dollar bill and some coins found behind the sofa cushions the Edmonton Oilers organization has purchased the town of Trail... Hotel rooms for all they say.... With the influx of Edmontonians into Trail the question must be asked, how will Fuhr react with snow is blown in his face (in his nostrils in specific)

 

[shawnmullin]

Don't worry. After Edmonton fans suspiciously suffer illness and injury, there won't be any coming down for Games 5 and 7.

Trail is a wonderful town, but for the next week, our city has taken a distinct anti-Edmonton policy. Any fans from Edmonton found on the streets after 9 p.m. (unless they're on their way back to the hotel from the arena) will be incarcerated. The Edmonton fans will be relegated to our cheapest hotels, and due to the number of Edmonton fans in Trail for the series (and the amount of media in Trail for the series, which has taken a prize-fight like atmosphere), Edmonton players will have to stay in nearby Rossland. And don't be surprised if Edmonton fans find their cuisine and accommodations to be well, sub-standard.

Actually hate to ruin your vibe GBC but Rossland is one of the nicest little towns I've been to. I'd CHOSE to stay in Rossland any day over Trail.

Advantage Murphy

 

[Murphy]

DEFENCE: Edge - Trail. If we're talking strictly blue-line vs. blue-line, then Trail has a big edge. All six defencemen can move the puck and take care of their own zone. While Trail doesn't have a true shut-down pairing like Stevens-"Black Jack" Stewart, they have six defencemen capable of playing on a shut-down pairing. Edmonton does not. In terms of team defensive play, it's an almost dead heat. Both teams play an excellent defensive system, both teams have excellent defensive players spread throughout the line-up. Edmonton might have a slightly higher top-end with their defensive players (Gainey, Stevens and Black Jack), but Trail has better depth. As far as defensive ability, Edmonton's fourth line doesn't scare me, they don't have a player as good defensively as Hunter or especially Fraser, and we'll try to exploit that Geoffrion vs. Secord match-up as much as possible.

Trying to pimp Hunter as some kind of defensive dynamo now? Where talking Dave & Marks brother right? At least one part of the fourth line analysis is correct in that Curt Fraser is better defensively than Hunter, and really Fraser was a role player before being counted on as any kind of defensive specialist. Fourth line vs fourth line and the Oilers will outscore them 2 maybe 3 to 1. A 50 goal scorer in Secord, and much tougher than Hunter ever was, 40 goal scorer in Lysiak, and consistant 30 goal guy and two-way player in Mellanby its a matchup the Oil will be looking for to exploit.

In going back and forth between the two rosters I don't see the big edge on defense. Trails is a little more mobile, thanks mostly in part to Kelly but Edmonton's is more physical and better defensively. Just don't see a big edge there, some different skillsets but nothing that puts any team over the top. In fact I can easily imagine the "hurt" line bearing down on Day & Persson and they'd be almost helpless in stopping them.

Gotta say not only does Edmonton have the higher end in defensive depth on the blueline, the forwards have Trail beat in that department as well. Peca, any Sutter, Mellanby and even Lindsay can ba and are strong defensive forwards.

So with defensive depth on the blueline, higher end and more defensive depth among the forwards, I'm not seeing a big edge there at all, other than being a bit more mobile.

I see the game plan shaping up as once the Oil get the lead being deeper and more explosive offensively, there just isn't going to be much that Trail can do about it.

 

[Murphy]

GOALTENDING: Edge - Trail. This is Grant Fuhr's time of year. Regular season? Shutouts? Goals against average? Who needs that. Wins is what counts. Playoffs count. And how many bad playoffs did Fuhr have from 1984 to 1999? No. 1 goalie for four Cup champs, a non-active roster player for a fifth, and showed in St. Louis late in his career that he could play behind a strong defensive team. Vachon's an excellent goalie, a solid No. 1 who has two rings, including one as a No. 1. He won't cost you a series, but in the clutch, is he the goalie you want ahead of Fuhr? No. Ed Giacomin is the best NHL goalie to never win the Cup.

Can't see an edge here either. Trails not the high flyin boys on the bus here. There not going to get you the consistant leads to work with that Fuhr liked to work with. Give up a goal in the first and it might be the last one Trail gets for the game.

Actually I'd be inclined to call Fuhr and Vachon as about as equal as it gets. Both had great glove hands, both very acrobatic, both emerged as starters for Canada Cup and won. Giacomin is better then Rollins period. One is a Hall of Famer and one had a 6 year career with a short peak, in fact Rollins sounds alot like the Oils third stringer.

Fuhr has had to battle injury throughout his career and if something happens to him, and given Edmontons crease crashing style its a possibilty. Then Trail is sunk....

Advantage Edmonton due to depth.

 

[God Bless Canada]

Can't see an edge here either. Trails not the high flyin boys on the bus here. There not going to get you the consistant leads to work with that Fuhr liked to work with. Give up a goal in the first and it might be the last one Trail gets for the game.

Actually I'd be inclined to call Fuhr and Vachon as about as equal as it gets. Both had great glove hands, both very acrobatic, both emerged as starters for Canada Cup and won. Giacomin is better then Rollins period. One is a Hall of Famer and one had a 6 year career with a short peak, in fact Rollins sounds alot like the Oils third stringer.

Fuhr has had to battle injury throughout his career and if something happens to him, and given Edmontons crease crashing style its a possibilty. Then Trail is sunk....

Advantage Edmonton due to depth.

Fuhr also had terrific endurance. He set the record for games played by a goalie in a season in 1987-88, and then broke that record in 1995-96, when he also set the record for consecutive games played by a goalie in a season.

Bottom line is that Fuhr was the No. 1 for four Cup champions, and Vachon was No. 1 for one. That's a huge difference. Watch Fuhr play for St. Louis from 1996-1999. He was playing behind a team that needed to win 3-2 type games. He was past his prime, but he was still terrific. He proved that he could win playing behind a relatively low scoring, tight-checking team.

 

[Murphy]

COACHING: Edge - Trail. This is our biggest edge in the series. Imlach is a much better coach than Cherry. Imlach has four rings. He's not the most popular coach in the history of the game, but on the right team, with the right players, he's outstanding. And we think he's on the right team with the right coach. I think Cherry gets a bad rap from some people, but he's definitely in the bottom five for coaches in the draft. He's got his type of team, but a guy like Roger Neilson would have been perfect for this team. Watch the Imlach vs. Sittler match-up. Both guys will be craving to beat the other. And Imlach knows exactly what it will take to shut Sittler down.

Ugggghhhhh, Trails in trouble if this is theirs biggest edge. Imlach was not inspirational, he wasn't innovative, he ruled with an iron fist and his Leaf teams won in spite of him, not because of him. He sucked as a coach of Buffalo and he sucked even more during his second stint with Toronto. He was Ballards boy and couldn't adapt from the 60's when fear wasn't a motivator anymore.

He doesn't know squat about Sittler other than how to make his life miserable. I think its actually going to be a disadvantage to Trail having Imlach as a coach this series knowing how fired up Sittler will be to face him.

The Oilers have a coach that the players will go through the wall for. Trail has a coach that the players despise (unless you're his buddy or spy as some would say in Carl Brewer)

Imlach is so overrated here it isn't funny, and he didn't allow beer on the bus......

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

You guys have just a few day,s can you get 1000 posts so we have to open a 2nd thread?

 

[Murphy]

Fuhr also had terrific endurance. He set the record for games played by a goalie in a season in 1987-88, and then broke that record in 1995-96, when he also set the record for consecutive games played by a goalie in a season.

Fuhr watched from the bench as Ranford was the man in 1990, due to a shoulder injury which he struggled with at times throughout his career. Of course he also got injured in the infamous Kypreos crash.

And a defensive St Louis team? MacInnis, Oates & Hull? That defensive team?

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

Oates was long gone at that point.

 

[God Bless Canada]

Trying to pimp Hunter as some kind of defensive dynamo now? Where talking Dave & Marks brother right? At least one part of the fourth line analysis is correct in that Curt Fraser is better defensively than Hunter, and really Fraser was a role player before being counted on as any kind of defensive specialist. Fourth line vs fourth line and the Oilers will outscore them 2 maybe 3 to 1. A 50 goal scorer in Secord, and much tougher than Hunter ever was, 40 goal scorer in Lysiak, and consistant 30 goal guy and two-way player in Mellanby its a matchup the Oil will be looking for to exploit.

In going back and forth between the two rosters I don't see the big edge on defense. Trails is a little more mobile, thanks mostly in part to Kelly but Edmonton's is more physical and better defensively. Just don't see a big edge there, some different skillsets but nothing that puts any team over the top. In fact I can easily imagine the "hurt" line bearing down on Day & Persson and they'd be almost helpless in stopping them.

Gotta say not only does Edmonton have the higher end in defensive depth on the blueline, the forwards have Trail beat in that department as well. Peca, any Sutter, Mellanby and even Lindsay can ba and are strong defensive forwards.

So with defensive depth on the blueline, higher end and more defensive depth among the forwards, I'm not seeing a big edge there at all, other than being a bit more mobile.

I see the game plan shaping up as once the Oil get the lead being deeper and more explosive offensively, there just isn't going to be much that Trail can do about it.

If you want to know how good Fraser is defensively, go ask Secord. Secord will tell you all about Fraser's defensive play against Savard and Secord in the 1982 playoffs. Fraser wasn't the perfect solution for our fourth line, but he gives us a combination of physical play, strong defensive play and good offensive ability (a five-time 25-goal scorer).

You want to go goal for goal between fourth lines. We'll trump you. Hunter scored over 1,000 points. He's the only guy with 1,000 points and 3,000 PIMs. He's not the most popular guy in the game, but don't let your personal feelings cloud your judgement of how good he really was. And if you do sell him short, your coach will tell you how good Hunter was. Fraser was a five-time 25-goal scorer. And Paiement had seasons of 41, 40 and 39 goal seasons, and a couple other 30 goal seasons.

Hunter was excellent defensively. Again, if you don't believe me, go ask your coach.

Scott Mellanby a consistent 30-goal scorer? He scored 30 twice. And he never had another pro-rated 30-goal season. If two 30-goal seasons in 20 years is consistent, well, then it's no wonder you expect your fourth line to outscore our fourth line 2 or 3 to 1.

I never said your forwards weren't capable defensively. But our forwards allow us to use four forward units on the penalty kill. We have the best defensive RW in the draft (Provost), a towering, physical defensive centre who dominated the face-off circle (Otto) and a solid two-way winger with a strong defensive presence (Tremblay). Henri Richard was terrific defensively. Keats and Geoffrion had excellent all-round games.

We think our defence is better by your defence, and by a wide margin. Stevens and Stewart are terrific. But after that, it's a drop-off. Your No. 3 (Hartsburg) would be, at best, the No. 5 on our team. Are you going to tell me you'd take Hartsburgh ahead of Day or Mortson? Babych is solid, but he's best-suited to No. 6 minutes. Turnbull's a good puck-mover, but doesn't intimidate anyone. And Jason Smith's a dime a dozen defenceman who should be a No. 7 in this draft.

We don't have the physical dimension that your defence has. That much I agree with. But Blake, Day and Mortson (a four-time PIM king) all brought a physical game. All six of our defencemen are very capable at moving the puck, they can all work a strong transition game (which will work well with our speed on the top two lines), they can all handle a strong forecheck (which will be needed against guys like Anderson, Broadbent, Lindsay and Brian Sutter), and they're all strong defensively. And, if it comes to that point, Gary Bergman is an ideal No. 7.

 

[God Bless Canada]

Fuhr watched from the bench as Ranford was the man in 1990, due to a shoulder injury which he struggled with at times throughout his career. Of course he also got injured in the infamous Kypreos crash.

And a defensive St Louis team? MacInnis, Oates & Hull? That defensive team?

The Blues were last in goals for in the Western Conference in 1995-96, and made the playoffs. They were ninth in the West in GF in 1996-97, first in the West in 1997-98, and fifth in 1998-99, although by the time 1998 rolled around, even high-scoring teams were playing strong defensive systems.

Fuhr's roll was diminishing by the time his last season in St. Louis rolled around, but he was still excellent in the 1999 playoffs, and a key reason that the Blues managed to win a series that year.

Once Quenville arrived midway through the 1996-97 season, the Blues stressed an excellent team game with strong defensive play. They had players who were capable offensively, but their focus was playing a strong defensive that allowed them to win a lot of 3-2 type games.