Boston Bruins After 1/3 of the Season...

[PlayMakers]

Folks let's get this thread get back on topic.

The focus of this thread is how the Bruins have done in the first 3rd and what if any changes they should make going into the second third.

It's one thing to say they should use prospects to get X, Y and Z for the second half and debate that. It's another to turn the thread into another debate about the Bruins drafting successes, failures and strategies. I commented on it as well so mea culpa but let's get back to talking about the topic in the opening post.

If there are people who still want to talk about the Bruins approach to the draft, then start a thread about it (and I'll move some of these posts over there).

 

[PB37]

Is there another team in the league this year that has depended so much on rookies to help win? It feels like every win has our rookies all over the stat sheets in some sort of capacity, which is pretty awesome moving forward in the years to come.

 

[Jean_Jacket41]

Is there another team in the league this year that has depended so much on rookies to help win? It feels like every win has our rookies all over the stat sheets in some sort of capacity, which is pretty awesome moving forward in the years to come.

It's a very good time to be a Bruins fan. A 08-14 great stretch is upon us.

Look out East.

 

[Over the volcano]

Is there another team in the league this year that has depended so much on rookies to help win? It feels like every win has our rookies all over the stat sheets in some sort of capacity, which is pretty awesome moving forward in the years to come.

Some quick math -

Boston's rookies have 26 goals and 44 assists for 70 pts in the first 27 games of the year.
Pasta and Marchand have combined for 25 goals.
The team as a whole has 77 - meaning rookies scored 34% of the team's goals this year Pasta and Marchand scored 33% and the rest of the team has the other 33%.

 

[Mick Riddleton]

So far they have been great dealing with injuries to key guys. The rookies have been excellent, the coaching has done a great job including Dean on the dee. I cannot be happier, looking forward to guys I have thought could elevate and guys that have proven me wrong, glad to be wrong and keep on plugging away.

 

[PlayMakers]

Is there another team in the league this year that has depended so much on rookies to help win? It feels like every win has our rookies all over the stat sheets in some sort of capacity, which is pretty awesome moving forward in the years to come.

I don't have any numbers to back it up but I can't imagine anyone has needed their rookies and young players as much as we have. It's shocking how many games they've lost to injuries.

 

[BruinDust]

Some quick math -

Boston's rookies have 26 goals and 44 assists for 70 pts in the first 27 games of the year.
Pasta and Marchand have combined for 25 goals.
The team as a whole has 77 - meaning rookies scored 34% of the team's goals this year Pasta and Marchand scored 33% and the rest of the team has the other 33%.

Nice work.

Pretty much 1/3 of the offense. I figured it was a lot but would of never said 1/3. Pretty impressive.

 

[Don Cherry]

Nice work.

Pretty much 1/3 of the offense. I figured it was a lot but would of never said 1/3. Pretty impressive.

Beyond impressive actually.

 

[ThomasJ13]

Is there another team in the league this year that has depended so much on rookies to help win? It feels like every win has our rookies all over the stat sheets in some sort of capacity, which is pretty awesome moving forward in the years to come.

When you look at rookies who have played at least 15 games, the Bruins have 3 guys who are in the top 15 when sorted by PPG, and all are at least 0.5 PPG. Not too shabby, and a far cry from a few years ago.

Zach Hamill and Jordan Caron are not walking through that door.

 

[wintersej]

Beyond impressive actually.

I'm unsettled by this streak of positivity. Dare I say I miss the dissenting opinion!

 

[Boston Bruno]

I'm unsettled by this streak of positivity. Dare I say I miss the dissenting opinion!

Well we do have a large amount of Atlantic opponents. Mandatory 8 points to give Montreal still. I am sure we can find away to finish out the the playoffs by a point or two.

Did that help?

 

[Dellstrom]

Is there another team in the league this year that has depended so much on rookies to help win? It feels like every win has our rookies all over the stat sheets in some sort of capacity, which is pretty awesome moving forward in the years to come.

New Jersey is another team this year that's being helped just as much, if not more by rookies. But it is very rare and we're two outliers. Most teams will have one, maybe two rookies have surprising seasons and make a real impact. It's unheard of for rookies to be making up half of your lineup and not looking out of place, and actually making a playoff team better than they were last year.

We have Hischier and McAvoy being centerpieces of the team, Bjork/DeBrusk/Heinen/Butcher being key contributors... Not familiar with their other ones, but it's definitely a good year for rookies. It's awesome because it pushes the vets on the team to be better, too. What's their excuse if a bunch of college aged kids are stronger, faster, and more motivated than them?

 

[KrejciMVP]

need to stay in that 3rd spot in division and not have to fight for the wild card. Quite a few games in hand on the habs

 

[Fenian24]

Again key word with this team is frustrating. There is no clear cut favorite in the East, Washington has been up and down (although they are playing much better), Pittsburgh is looking good to very good but beatable, Tampa is very good but I don't see a team built for the playoffs in them, the Leafs look to be for real but the D is not great, Columbus is very solid overall.

Then there are the Bruins, with one rookie who looks like he will be an anchor on the D for years to come, another who looks to be a good number 4 and three pretty good rookie forwards to go along with a pretty good core. It's a team that is close to competing and could make a decent playoff run if Dealer Donnie wakes up and uses some of his uber prospects as trade bait to bring in a 2nd line power forward and get some grit, size and toughness for a fourth line that his coach seems to want to use as an old school energy line.

Personally I have no desire to wait another 39 years for another Stanley Cup, gambling on the prospects all making the team is silly and inefficient, move some to correct your mistakes (Beleskey) and bring in established veterans for a run. Sweeney making trades terrifies me but for worse or disastrous he's the GM, let's see what Bourques coattails can do.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

Again key word with this team is frustrating. There is no clear cut favorite in the East, Washington has been up and down (although they are playing much better), Pittsburgh is looking good to very good but beatable, Tampa is very good but I don't see a team built for the playoffs in them, the Leafs look to be for real but the D is not great, Columbus is very solid overall.

Then there are the Bruins, with one rookie who looks like he will be an anchor on the D for years to come, another who looks to be a good number 4 and three pretty good rookie forwards to go along with a pretty good core. It's a team that is close to competing and could make a decent playoff run if Dealer Donnie wakes up and uses some of his uber prospects as trade bait to bring in a 2nd line power forward and get some grit, size and toughness for a fourth line that his coach seems to want to use as an old school energy line.

Personally I have no desire to wait another 39 years for another Stanley Cup, gambling on the prospects all making the team is silly and inefficient, move some to correct your mistakes (Beleskey) and bring in established veterans for a run. Sweeney making trades terrifies me but for worse or disastrous he's the GM, let's see what Bourques coattails can do.

Wait another 39 years? Were you in a coma for the 2010-11 season? It seems like forever but it’s only been 7 years.

 

[Over the volcano]

Again key word with this team is frustrating. There is no clear cut favorite in the East, Washington has been up and down (although they are playing much better), Pittsburgh is looking good to very good but beatable, Tampa is very good but I don't see a team built for the playoffs in them, the Leafs look to be for real but the D is not great, Columbus is very solid overall.

Then there are the Bruins, with one rookie who looks like he will be an anchor on the D for years to come, another who looks to be a good number 4 and three pretty good rookie forwards to go along with a pretty good core. It's a team that is close to competing and could make a decent playoff run if Dealer Donnie wakes up and uses some of his uber prospects as trade bait to bring in a 2nd line power forward and get some grit, size and toughness for a fourth line that his coach seems to want to use as an old school energy line.

Personally I have no desire to wait another 39 years for another Stanley Cup, gambling on the prospects all making the team is silly and inefficient, move some to correct your mistakes (Beleskey) and bring in established veterans for a run. Sweeney making trades terrifies me but for worse or disastrous he's the GM, let's see what Bourques coattails can do.

I don't get this at all. The only thing that's frustrating this year are all the injuries. They are STACKED with so much young talent that they will soon need to turn away NHL ready kids - not because they're being blocked by old journeymen but because they're being outplayed by other NHL ready kids.

They're 3rd in the division with games in hand on the entire league - after playing most of the year without core players. Give these kids a full season, watch them grow. Carry that into the post season and you're looking at an exciting playoff push. Remember last year Kuraly and McAvoy came up huge against Ottawa and they had combined for a total of 8 NHL games before that series.

If they can make it to the post season this year you're looking replacing Stafford and Moore with Debrusk, Heinen, Bjork, and Cehlarik. If they're healthy this year you can replace Morrow and Liles with Krug, Carlo. You could also add Krejci, and McQuaid to last year's playoff crew and throw in a year's more experience for guys like McAvoy, Kuraly, Acciari, and Pasta.

I don't get how this year is frustrating b/c Sweeney hasn't been day trading.

 

[Fenian24]

Wait another 39 years? Were you in a coma for the 2010-11 season? It seems like forever but it’s only been 7 years.

I was talking about from 1972-2011 we are now at year 7 of the next wait which I have no desire to be 39 years. I have zero faith in Sweeney's rebuild and faith in his super prospects, really I have zero faith in Sweeney period

 

[BradPark22]

I was talking about from 1972-2011 we are now at year 7 of the next wait which I have no desire to be 39 years. I have zero faith in Sweeney's rebuild and faith in his super prospects, really I have zero faith in Sweeney period

The positive attitude you have is infectious.

 

[Fenian24]

I don't get this at all. The only thing that's frustrating this year are all the injuries. They are STACKED with so much young talent that they will soon need to turn away NHL ready kids - not because they're being blocked by old journeymen but because they're being outplayed by other NHL ready kids.

They're 3rd in the division with games in hand on the entire league - after playing most of the year without core players. Give these kids a full season, watch them grow. Carry that into the post season and you're looking at an exciting playoff push. Remember last year Kuraly and McAvoy came up huge against Ottawa and they had combined for a total of 8 NHL games before that series.

If they can make it to the post season this year you're looking replacing Stafford and Moore with Debrusk, Heinen, Bjork, and Cehlarik. If they're healthy this year you can replace Morrow and Liles with Krug, Carlo. You could also add Krejci, and McQuaid to last year's playoff crew and throw in a year's more experience for guys like McAvoy, Kuraly, Acciari, and Pasta.

I don't get how this year is frustrating b/c Sweeney hasn't been day trading.

Because this team has a chance to make some noise in the playoffs but there are obvious holes that the uber prospects aren't going to fill this year (or possibly ever).

I am going to use a baseball example, something I'm not overly comfortable doing but it works in this case. If people were being honest on here how many would have cried about dealing Armas jr and Pavano for Pedro? How about Schilling for Mike Goss, Casey Fossum, Brandon Lyon, and Jorge De La Rosa?

Prospects are great, established talent is better. Of the remaining prospects, that almost every major media outlet in Canada and America do not have anywhere nearly as highly rated as posters on here do, how many make it? You can't tell but there is not one that I would not include in a deal to make this team better. Senyshyn, JFK, Zboril, Lingren, Frederic, Studnicka, Vaakanainen, Lauzon, Donato, Fitzgerald, etc aren’t all making the NHL. Management needs to identify their most likely to succeed prospects and move the rest to make this team better

 

[dafoomie]

Grzelcyk possibly solving their left handed puck moving defenseman problem is an interesting development. Him and Spooner will be the keys to the "what I need" question.

Cehlarik will add another wrinkle if he can play with Krejci and push someone down to the 4th line. They'll have to decide between moving on from guys or sending down the ones playing better who don't have to clear waivers.

 

[DKH]

The positive attitude you have is infectious.

Thank you

 

[BruinDust]

Because this team has a chance to make some noise in the playoffs but there are obvious holes that the uber prospects aren't going to fill this year (or possibly ever).

I am going to use a baseball example, something I'm not overly comfortable doing but it works in this case. If people were being honest on here how many would have cried about dealing Armas jr and Pavano for Pedro? How about Schilling for Mike Goss, Casey Fossum, Brandon Lyon, and Jorge De La Rosa?

Prospects are great, established talent is better. Of the remaining prospects, that almost every major media outlet in Canada and America do not have anywhere nearly as highly rated as posters on here do, how many make it? You can't tell but there is not one that I would not include in a deal to make this team better. Senyshyn, JFK, Zboril, Lingren, Frederic, Studnicka, Vaakanainen, Lauzon, Donato, Fitzgerald, etc aren’t all making the NHL. Management needs to identify their most likely to succeed prospects and move the rest to make this team better

And how the heck are they suppose to do that with some of them 2 months into their pro careers, and the rest still in CHL/NCAA/Euro pro.

I don't have issue with taking a couple of these guys and packaging them for help now. But the guys "most likely to succeed" that would be identified by the Bruins as time moves on are the same guys likely identified by other teams. Everyone else is scouting these guys as well. They aren't going to fool the rest of the league into taking the worst of this group in exchange for a valuable piece of another team.

 

[Fenian24]

And how the heck are they suppose to do that with some of them 2 months into their pro careers, and the rest still in CHL/NCAA/Euro pro.

I don't have issue with taking a couple of these guys and packaging them for help now. But the guys "most likely to succeed" that would be identified by the Bruins as time moves on are the same guys likely identified by other teams. Everyone else is scouting these guys as well. They aren't going to fool the rest of the league into taking the worst of this group in exchange for a valuable piece of another team.

That's what you pay your scouts for, to determine who will make it and who won't. I'm sure they have their lists of prospects as does every other team, you can find a way to keep the prospects you rate highly, other teams may like another player/prospect more than you.

Dealer Donnie should be out working the phones moving players his scouts think will not have as big an impact, package them, move them with picks but bring in established talent to help this team. the cap is going up next year, you should have space to add a player that isn't a rental. Whatever deal you make include Spooner and his contract, nobody is taking Beleskey, but Spooner (as people like to say about McQuaid) is redundant and may add extra value, if not his cap savings allow a move to be made, send Beleskey to Providence ( I don't think his NTC is a no movement) a move that will still save a little over a million, deal Vatrano for a pick (he would get claimed I believe) and you know have over 4 million to make a move to add a decent second line winger. If the argument is you can't afford Hoffman what I just outlined would allow you to do it.

 

[BruinDust]

[QUOTE="Fenian24, post: 138969449, member: 104833"]That's what you pay your scouts for, to determine who will make it and who won't. I'm sure they have their lists of prospects as does every other team, you can find a way to keep the prospects you rate highly, other teams may like another player/prospect more than you.

Dealer Donnie should be out working the phones moving players his scouts think will not have as big an impact, package them, move them with picks but bring in established talent to help this team. the cap is going up next year, you should have space to add a player that isn't a rental. Whatever deal you make include Spooner and his contract, nobody is taking Beleskey, but Spooner (as people like to say about McQuaid) is redundant and may add extra value, if not his cap savings allow a move to be made, send Beleskey to Providence ( I don't think his NTC is a no movement) a move that will still save a little over a million, deal Vatrano for a pick (he would get claimed I believe) and you know have over 4 million to make a move to add a decent second line winger. If the argument is you can't afford Hoffman what I just outlined would allow you to do it.[/QUOTE]

Well scouts typically need a body of work to be able to make those determinations. I wonder what scouts were saying about Debrusk one year ago after he got off to a bit of a slow start in the AHL? Doubtful any scouts were sitting around saying "nope, he ain't going to be an NHL player" because up to that point, there was really not much to base that assessment on.

I like the idea of packaging some of their excess in young prospects for help now, but you're likely looking at losing some of the better guys out of this group of prospects you listed originally.

And the reality is, when Sweeney calls on guys like say a Hoffman or previously a Duchene, the response from the other team was "how about Carlo, how about Bjork", not "hey can we build a package around Jack Studnicka and Ryan Lindgren".

 

[bp13]

And how the heck are they suppose to do that with some of them 2 months into their pro careers, and the rest still in CHL/NCAA/Euro pro.

I don't have issue with taking a couple of these guys and packaging them for help now. But the guys "most likely to succeed" that would be identified by the Bruins as time moves on are the same guys likely identified by other teams. Everyone else is scouting these guys as well. They aren't going to fool the rest of the league into taking the worst of this group in exchange for a valuable piece of another team.

No but let's be fair...it's definitely possible that other teams have differing opinions on "most likely to succeed", as teams deal prospects for more established players and teams pass on guys in the draft who were higher on other teams' boards in every sport. Some GM's have a knack for acquiring or not giving up the right guys, and some don't. So while what you say makes logical sense, the very nature of the sport tells you it isn't a rule by any stretch. I mean we talk here all the time about Barzal, but clearly the Bruins didn't value him as the supposed majority did, right? Same at the other end for guys like Pasta.

As you know I think Sweeney's work/non-work with NHL acquisitions and/or trades has been awful. But the drafting and developing effort has been excellent. So if the time comes where he actually closes a deal to try to improve his roster and gives up kids in the process, I'm pretty optimistic he'll give up the right ones because after all, he's been good at that. He's shown he has an eye for the right ones, and he's developed, promoted and remained patient with guys I think we all like, for the most part. The bigger concern I think we should all have isn't whom he gives up, but whom he gets. That's what he's sucked at to date - acquiring the right NHL level talent.