AAA 2015 Quarterfinals: 4) Rum River Renegades vs. 5) City Point Clovers

[seventieslord]

lineups coming soon

Click to read more...

 

[tony d]

Good luck Bubba, will post my lineup tomorrow.

 

[BubbaBoot]

RUM RIVER RENEGADES

Coach: Terry Crisp

Shawn Mceachern-Don Raleigh-Blaine Stoughton
Jeff Friesen-Michal Pivonka(A)-Earl Robinson
Andre Pronovost-Larry Patey-Lucien Deblois
Jim Riley-Mike Bullard-Scott Young

Ted Graham-Doug Lidster(C)
Chris Phillips(A)-Paul Martin
Hy Buller-Uwe Krupp

Bill Ranford
Jim Henry

Bench: Cecil Blachford, Johnny Sheppard, Kyle Mclaren, Tobias Enstrom

Special teams:

PP 1: Mceachern-Raleigh-Stoughton-Lidster-Martin
PP 2: Friesen-Bullard-Robinson-Buller-Graham

PK 1: Pronovost-Patey-Graham-Phillips
PK 2: Pivonka-Deblois-Krupp-Martin

VS

CITY POINT CLOVERS

Head Coach: Vladimir Yurzinov

Cory Stillman - Bronco Horvath - Dave Christianhttp://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=107490405&postcount=15
Josef Cerny - Jozef Stumpel - Ray Sheppard
Don Smith - Jiri Novakhttp://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=107565165&postcount=52 - Mikael Renberg (C)
Yevgeny Mishakov - Bryan Smolinskihttp://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=107965589&postcount=175 - Jim Peplinski (A)

Joe Jerwa - Ivan Tregubov
Sergei Babinov (A) - Jim McKenny
Bob Turner - Rudolf Potsch

- Flipping my GKs
Leif Holmqvist
Vladimir Myshkin


- spares -
Doug Brown - RW/LW/CTR
Vic Lynn - LW/D
Ronald "Sura-Pelle" Pettersson - RW [F/D]
Behn Wilson - D


- PP1 -
Cerny - Stumpel - Sheppard
Jerwa - Potsch

- PP2 -
Stillman - Horvath - Christian
McKenny - Tregubov

- spot duty PP forwards -
Novak / Renberg / Smith / Smolinski

- PK1 -
Mishakov - Smolinski
Turner - Tregubov

- PK2 -
Christian - Peplinski
Jerwa - Babinov

- spot duty PK forwards -
Stumpel / Stillman / Renberg / Novak / Turner
​

 

[BubbaBoot]

Rum River Renegades v City Point Clovers
Game Day match-ups

OFFENSE
1st LINES
LW Shawn Mceachern v RW Dave Christian
CTR Don Raleigh v CTR Bronco Horvath
RW Blaine Stoughton v LW Cory Stillman

2nd LINES
LW Jeff Friesen v RW Ray Sheppard
CTR Michal Pivonka v CTR Jozef Stumpel
RW Earl Robinson v LW Josef Cerny

3rd LINES
LW Andre Pronovost v RW Mikael Renberg (C)
CTR Larry Patey v CTR Jiri Novak
RW Lucien Deblois v LW Don Smith

4th LINES
LW Jim Riley v RW Jim Peplinski (A)
CTR Mike Bullard v CTR Bryan Smolinski
RW Scott Young v LW Yevgeny Mishakov


DEFENSE
1st PAIRINGS
LD Ted Graham v RD Ivan Tregubov
RD Doug Lidster v LD Joe Jerwa

2nd PAIRINGS
LD Chris Phillips v RD Jim McKenny
RD Paul Martin v LD Sergei Babinov (A)

3rd PAIRINGS
LD Hy Buller v RD Rudolf Potsch
RD Uwe Krupp v LD Bob Turner


GK
GK1 Bill Ranford v Leif Holmqvist
GK2 Jim Henry v Vladimir Myshkin


Bench:
RUM - Johnny Sheppard (LW) - Cecil Blachford (F/ROVER) - Kyle Mclaren (D) - Tobias Enstrom (D)
v
CPC - Doug Brown (RW/LW/CTR) - Vic Lynn (LW/D) - Ronald "Sura-Pelle" Pettersson ( RW [F/D]) - Behn Wilson (D)


Coaches:
Terry Crisp v Vladimir Yurzinov


Special teams:
RUM PP 1: Mceachern - Raleigh - Stoughton - Lidster - Martin
v
CPC PK 1: Mishakov - Smolinski - Turner - Tregubov
_______________________________________________

RUM PP 2: Friesen - Bullard - Robinson - Buller - Graham
v
CPC PK 2: Christian - Peplinski - Jerwa - Babinov
__________________________________________________
__________________________________________________

CPC PP 1: Cerny - Stumpel - Sheppard - Jerwa - Potsch
v
RUM PK 1: Pronovost - Patey - Graham - Phillips
_________________________________________________

CPC PP 2: Stillman - Horvath - Christian - McKenny - Tregubov
v
RUM PK 2: Pivonka - Deblois - Krupp - Martin​

 

[BubbaBoot]

Obviously going to try to play my 4th line (Yevgeny Mishakov / Bryan Smolinski / Jim Peplinski) v the RUM 1st line (Shawn Mceachern-Don Raleigh-Blaine Stoughton).

Try to match my 3rd line (Don Smith / Jiri Novak /Mikael Renberg) with the RUM 2nd line (Jeff Friesen / Michal Pivonka / Earl Robinson)

Also try to keep my 1st line (Cory Stillman / Bronco Horvath / Dave Christian) away from the good RUM 3rd line (Andre Pronovost-Larry Patey-Lucien Deblois) by matching with the speed from my 3rd line, occasionally using Cerny or Peplinski to Replace Renberg.

Head to head matchups with 2nd lines (Josef Cerny / Jozef Stumpel / Ray Sheppard v Jeff Friesen / Michal Pivonka / Earl Robinson) looks to be very interesting....the edge in play here could be he tipping balance of the game?

 

[seventieslord]

Well this one's off to a fast start.

 

[tony d]

Looks like Bubba beat me to the punch, my comments in bold

Obviously going to try to play my 4th line (Yevgeny Mishakov / Bryan Smolinski / Jim Peplinski) v the RUM 1st line (Shawn Mceachern-Don Raleigh-Blaine Stoughton).

Shouldbe a good battle. I expect Raleigh and Stoughton to provide some great goal scoring and Mceachern to get pucks for them, Smolinski and Peplinski where noted defensive players but are they enough to get past Raleigh and Stoughton?

Try to match my 3rd line (Don Smith / Jiri Novak /Mikael Renberg) with the RUM 2nd line (Jeff Friesen / Michal Pivonka / Earl Robinson)

Should be a good battle, Pivonka seems like a good all around player, Robinson should be the benficiary of Pivonka's playmaking. Novak and Renberg seem like good 2 way players, will be interesting to see how they do vs. Pivonka and Robinson

Also try to keep my 1st line (Cory Stillman / Bronco Horvath / Dave Christian) away from the good RUM 3rd line (Andre Pronovost-Larry Patey-Lucien Deblois) by matching with the speed from my 3rd line, occasionally using Cerny or Peplinski to Replace Renberg.

Interesting, I do like your 1st line, Horvath was told to me to be a good goal scorer after I reviewed your team. I'm quite proud of my checking line and think it's among the best in the league. This matchup of offense/defense could help determine the series as well.

Head to head matchups with 2nd lines (Josef Cerny / Jozef Stumpel / Ray Sheppard v Jeff Friesen / Michal Pivonka / Earl Robinson) looks to be very interesting....the edge in play here could be he tipping balance of the game?

It could, Stumpel vs. Pivonka intrigues me. Stumpel was a good playmaker but does he play the same good defensive game that Pivonka played?

I look forward to continued debate with you in this series.

 

[BubbaBoot]

It could, Stumpel vs. Pivonka intrigues me. Stumpel was a good playmaker but does he play the same good defensive game that Pivonka played?

I look forward to continued debate with you in this series.

While Stumpel wasn't in the same league as Pivonka defensively, he was no slouch. It appears, He was used basically on 2nd team PKs, this includes the 2006 WCs.

Penalty Kill - 4 Players
Center
1 MICHAL HANDZUS
2 JOZEF STUMPEL

 

[BubbaBoot]

Sixth best PK forward in this graph.

Who is the NHL's best penalty killer?
Picking up on something Matt Fenwick was talking about over at The Battle of Alberta, I've been working on an analysis of the league's best penalty killers.

The results will probably surprise you.

Using data from Behind the Net and taking only players who have played at least 120 minutes shorthanded as of Feb. 18 (approximately two minutes per game), the player with the lowest number of power-play goals scored against per two minutes short-handed ice time is Vancouver Canucks forward Josh Green.

In fact, the Canucks — owners of the league's top-ranked penalty kill — have the four highest-ranked players in the category, and five of the top seven players. This isn't a measurement that takes into account the strength of a player's teammates or the goaltender (hello Roberto Luongo!), so take it for what it's worth.

A look through the chart toppers reveals a list of players you likely wouldn't name off the top of your head if pressed for defensive dynamos: Green, Fernando Pisani, Jeff Friesen, Alex Burrows, David Legwand, Jozef Stumpel and Todd White lead the way for forwards, while Lukas Krajicek, Sami Salo, Mattias Ohlund, Daniel Tjarnqvist, Kim Johnsson and Branislav Mezei top the blueliners.

Here's a look at the top 30 overall. I'll do my best to get a full spreadsheet up later on if there's enough interest:


Player Team Pos PPGA MINS PPGA per
two mins SH
1 GREEN VAN F 3 142 0.042
2 KRAJICEK VAN D 5 141 0.071
3 SALO VAN D 8 187 0.086
4 OHLUND VAN D 10 231 0.086
5 PISANI EDM F 7 159 0.088
6 FRIESEN CGY F 7 149 0.094
7 BURROWS VAN F 10 209 0.096
8 LEGWAND NSH F 8 160 0.100
9 TJARNQVIST EDM D 7 134 0.104
10 STUMPEL FLA F 10 187 0.107
11 WHITE MIN F 9 167 0.108
12 JOHNSSON MIN D 13 234 0.111
13 MEZEI FLA D 7 124 0.113
14 STURM BOS F 8 139 0.115
15 JOVANOVSKI PHX D 7 122 0.115
16 MARCHANT ANA F 10 168 0.119
17 KESLER VAN F 10 162 0.123
18 REASONER EDM F 11 178 0.124
19 WALLIN CAR D 10 162 0.124
20 ROZSIVAL NYR D 11 176 0.125
21 SMOLINSKI CHI F 10 155 0.129
22 ROLSTON MIN F 12 186 0.129
23 MORRISON VAN F 9 139 0.129
24 LAROSE CAR F 10 154 0.130
25 MOEN ANA F 12 185 0.130
26 MCCLEMENT STL F 11 169 0.130
27 STAJAN TOR F 9 137 0.131
28 DALEY DAL D 11 165 0.133
29 ZANON NSH D 14 209 0.134
30 JONES PHI D 11 163 0.135

Also found the first year that Faceoffs.net was the same season as above.....Stumpel also took more faceoffs in his defensive zone than the other two zones and his success rate was above the league average at even strength as well as shorthanded.

|FO | FO/gm| FW| FL| FO%| League Avg.
Offensive zone |189 |3.6 |97 |92 |51.3 |50.9
Defensive zone |248 |4.8 |126 |122 |50.8 |49.1
Neutral zone |206 |4 |106 |100 |51.5 |50
Power play |90 |1.7 |46 |44 |51.1 |55.2
Shorthanded |95 |1.8 |46 |49 |48.4 |44.8
Even-strength |458 |8.8 |237 |221 |51.7 |50

 

[BubbaBoot]

Definitely expanded his defensive abilities later in his career.

Our penalty killing has really done a good job," coach Jacques Martin said. "It's just that we've had to kill so many penalties."

One of the Panthers' most reliable penalty killers, second-year winger Rostislav Olesz, said the forwards have tried to be more aggressive of late. After using several different players early in the season, Martin has become comfortable with two units: Olesz-Jozef Stumpel and Ville Peltonen-Gregory Campbell.

 

[tony d]

DEFENSE
1st PAIRINGS
LD Ted Graham v RD Ivan Tregubov
RD Doug Lidster v LD Joe Jerwa

I think our 2 1st pairings are equal, Tregubov and Jerwa are 2 good defenseman but so are Graham and Lidster, I think that whichever pairing plays to the best of their abilities in this equal matchup could go a long way to determining the series

2nd PAIRINGS
LD Chris Phillips v RD Jim McKenny
RD Paul Martin v LD Sergei Babinov (A)

Again an equal matchup but I ? Mckenny in his own zone, Babinov's a noted defensive defenseman but is he good enough to cover for any gaffes made by Mckenny.My 2nd pairing is the classic offensive defensive pairing of Phillips and Martin.

3rd PAIRINGS
LD Hy Buller v RD Rudolf Potsch
RD Uwe Krupp v LD Bob Turner

Offense Defense is the mantra for these 2 pairings as they have 1 good offensive guy and 1 good defensive guy, Reading on Potsch I see he was good offensively, what can you tell me about him defensively? the bio on Buller notes he could play physically. Krupp and Turner will provide good shutdown play.

I look forward to a rebuttal from you later today.

 

[BubbaBoot]

DEFENSE
1st PAIRINGS
LD Ted Graham v RD Ivan Tregubov
RD Doug Lidster v LD Joe Jerwa

I think our 2 1st pairings are equal, Tregubov and Jerwa are 2 good defenseman but so are Graham and Lidster, I think that whichever pairing plays to the best of their abilities in this equal matchup could go a long way to determining the series

Agreed, closely matched in an apples v oranges way. Tried to find faults with either Graham and Lidster but it's difficult. While neither are stars or true #1's, at this level they're good at being #1b or #2....quietly efficient minutes eaters with Lidster having enough offense, especially early in his career, to make this a good pairing.

Jerwa had a pretty good offense and like to hit. Tregubov was more defensive oriented but also known to be a good passer and was not afraid to jump into the play if the opportunity arose. He also was known as a big hitter.

2nd PAIRINGS
LD Chris Phillips v RD Jim McKenny
RD Paul Martin v LD Sergei Babinov (A)

Again an equal matchup but I ? Mckenny in his own zone, Babinov's a noted defensive defenseman but is he good enough to cover for any gaffes made by Mckenny.My 2nd pairing is the classic offensive defensive pairing of Phillips and Martin.

This is the 2nd time I've picked McKenny. While he wasn't beyond taking risks, I haven't seen anything about him being gaffe-oriented. While Behn Wilson was tough, mean and very good offensively but was known to have brain farts, which is why I dropped him out of the defensive rotation and went with others with more consistency. Could Babinov cover for his "gaffes"? I don't know but in the bios of read, he was part of a "shutdown" duo so the skillset and ability was there.

3rd PAIRINGS
LD Hy Buller v RD Rudolf Potsch
RD Uwe Krupp v LD Bob Turner

Offense Defense is the mantra for these 2 pairings as they have 1 good offensive guy and 1 good defensive guy, Reading on Potsch I see he was good offensively, what can you tell me about him defensively? the bio on Buller notes he could play physically. Krupp and Turner will provide good shutdown play.

I look forward to a rebuttal from you later today.

Potsch was known for his offensively ability and took advantage of the fact that he had a good stay-at-home guy for a partner. That being said, while he was known as a "complete" player, his other skills seemed to be that he was an all-out/100% player who didn't like slackers and was known as a borderline open ice headhunter, frequently given to using his shoulder/arm (aka the Potschbodyček) up high to the point where forwards dreaded and feared coming down his side of the ice. Whether this as an indication of his defensive prowess is anybodies guess....

Buller has a good all around rep and I vaguely remember Krupp playing....a big guy who hit but didn't move to well, but not anywhere near as lumbering slow as Luke Richardson or Hal Gill.

 

[tony d]

GK1 Bill Ranford v Leif Holmqvist

Should be a good battle, any particular reason you moved Holmqvist to be your #1 instead of Myshkin? Myshkin was among the top #1 goalies here so I wonder why you made the switch. Ranford is a good goalie and can step it up in the playoffs as he did in the 1990 playoffs

GK2 Jim Henry v Vladimir Myshkin

Both these guys could be #1's in this for sure, so if either of our #1's go down both can step in and play as well.

 

[BubbaBoot]

GK1 Bill Ranford v Leif Holmqvist

Should be a good battle, any particular reason you moved Holmqvist to be your #1 instead of Myshkin? Myshkin was among the top #1 goalies here so I wonder why you made the switch. Ranford is a good goalie and can step it up in the playoffs as he did in the 1990 playoffs

GK2 Jim Henry v Vladimir Myshkin

Both these guys could be #1's in this for sure, so if either of our #1's go down both can step in and play as well.

Holmqvist had more time on the big stage. Nothing against Myshkin, who unfortunately was the #2 behind arguably one of the top 10 goalies to ever play the game....I just wanted the experience.

 

[tony d]

Coaching:

Terry Crisp vs. Vladimir Yurzinov:

Crisp is a solid coach , winning the Cup in 1989 and having a solid junior coaching record. Yurzinov was the coach of the 1998 Russian Olympic team so he is a solid coach as well, again coaching shouldn't be an issue here and will certainly not decide this series.

 

[BubbaBoot]

Coaching:

Terry Crisp vs. Vladimir Yurzinov:

Crisp is a solid coach , winning the Cup in 1989 and having a solid junior coaching record. Yurzinov was the coach of the 1998 Russian Olympic team so he is a solid coach as well, again coaching shouldn't be an issue here and will certainly not decide this series.

You mention Crisp's solid Jr career yet my guy's career as a head coach for nearly 35 straight years, multiple championships as both a head and assistant coach, 3 times an SM-Liiga coach of the year awards and induction as a coach in 3 Halls of Fame gets poo-pooed or glossed over around here.....go figure.

 

[seventieslord]

You mention Crisp's solid Jr career yet my guy's career as a head coach for nearly 35 straight years, multiple championships as both a head and assistant coach, 3 times an SM-Liiga coach of the year awards and induction as a coach in 3 Halls of Fame gets poo-pooed or glossed over around here.....go figure.

He could just as well not mentioned Crisp even had a junior career. He was quite successful in the NHL, you know.

 

[seventieslord]

Sixth best PK forward in this graph.



Also found the first year that Faceoffs.net was the same season as above.....Stumpel also took more faceoffs in his defensive zone than the other two zones and his success rate was above the league average at even strength as well as shorthanded.

|FO | FO/gm| FW| FL| FO%| League Avg.
Offensive zone |189 |3.6 |97 |92 |51.3 |50.9
Defensive zone |248 |4.8 |126 |122 |50.8 |49.1
Neutral zone |206 |4 |106 |100 |51.5 |50
Power play |90 |1.7 |46 |44 |51.1 |55.2
Shorthanded |95 |1.8 |46 |49 |48.4 |44.8
Even-strength |458 |8.8 |237 |221 |51.7 |50

bet you never saw me rebutting an argument based on advanced stats, but here we go...

This is based on the 2006-7 season, as I can tell because it has Friesen on the Flames. From looking at the team by team TOI stats on nhl.com, it appears nearly all those guys are 2nd unit penalty killers. This is problematic for two reasons: 1) it's a small sample size, it's 2/3 of a season and for players with less time per game killing penalties, and 2) competition level is clearly a factor if mostly 2nd unit penalty killers are showing up at the top of the list. Practically the entirety of Vancouver's 2nd unit is here. We can safely assume that their own coaching staff thought (knew) that the best penalty killers were the guys they were giving the most shorthanded icetime to, against top PP units, like Willie Mitchell and Bieksa, were the actual best penalty killers on the team, but they don't make the list, and the forward with the most time, Kesler, is behind a lot of guys who weren't getting the same heavy load he was.

As far as Stumpel goes, he was actually a top unit guy on Florida (2nd on the team in PKTOI per game), but the duties were spread out thinly on this team. By the end of the season he was on the ice for 26% of their PPGA, and for a team that wasn't that good at killing penalties (16th in the NHL). As far as feathers in caps go, it's not a particularly big or bright one.

Regarding faceoffs, there's little sense in using such a small sample when we have a decade worth of data. Stumpel took 11,000 faceoffs that were recorded and we know his win% was 51.6%. Good, and obviously above average. Not great in an all-time context.

And as for his zone start percentage being high (it would technically be 56.8% for 2006-07 based on the data you have presented), this doesn't in itself tell us anything, because some teams are so bad that the majority of the team has more defensive than offensive zone starts. This isn't something that evens out on a team; they can literally have hundreds more defensive zone starts than offensive. So, without knowing the data for the rest of the team we cannot use his zone start % to conclude he had a defensive role.

Look at the 2015 leafs, for example: http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stat...+3+5+4+6+7+8+13+14+29+30+32+33+34+45+46+63+67

 

[BubbaBoot]

He could just as well not mentioned Crisp even had a junior career. He was quite successful in the NHL, you know.

Yet, he did....

 

[BubbaBoot]

bet you never saw me rebutting an argument based on advanced stats, but here we go...

Facetiousness rules!

This is based on the 2006-7 season, as I can tell because it has Friesen on the Flames. From looking at the team by team TOI stats on nhl.com, it appears nearly all those guys are 2nd unit penalty killers. This is problematic for two reasons: 1) it's a small sample size, it's 2/3 of a season and for players with less time per game killing penalties, and 2) competition level is clearly a factor if mostly 2nd unit penalty killers are showing up at the top of the list. Practically the entirety of Vancouver's 2nd unit is here. We can safely assume that their own coaching staff thought (knew) that the best penalty killers were the guys they were giving the most shorthanded icetime to, against top PP units, like Willie Mitchell and Bieksa, were the actual best penalty killers on the team, but they don't make the list, and the forward with the most time, Kesler, is behind a lot of guys who weren't getting the same heavy load he was.

As far as Stumpel goes, he was actually a top unit guy on Florida (2nd on the team in PKTOI per game), but the duties were spread out thinly on this team. By the end of the season he was on the ice for 26% of their PPGA, and for a team that wasn't that good at killing penalties (16th in the NHL). As far as feathers in caps go, it's not a particularly big or bright one.

Regarding faceoffs, there's little sense in using such a small sample when we have a decade worth of data. Stumpel took 11,000 faceoffs that were recorded and we know his win% was 51.6%. Good, and obviously above average. Not great in an all-time context.

And as for his zone start percentage being high (it would technically be 56.8% for 2006-07 based on the data you have presented), this doesn't in itself tell us anything, because some teams are so bad that the majority of the team has more defensive than offensive zone starts. This isn't something that evens out on a team; they can literally have hundreds more defensive zone starts than offensive. So, without knowing the data for the rest of the team we cannot use his zone start % to conclude he had a defensive role.

Look at the 2015 leafs, for example: http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stat...+3+5+4+6+7+8+13+14+29+30+32+33+34+45+46+63+67

The question I was posed was if Stumpel was as good defensively as Pivonka.

He's not, however I wanted to show that he was not a sluggard and had good defensive qualities and
and wasn't a one-dimensional player, of which there are plenty of down in these lower drafts. These were the only concrete facts I could find that showed some skills that I didn't know he possessed. Hell, he's not even listed on my PK units and I should probably add him to my PK spot forwards list.

 

[tony d]

I'm finished with my arguing and will leave the decision as to who wins this series up to the voters and wish good luck to my opponnent and thank him for a good and well argued series.

 

[seventieslord]

I should probably add him to my PK spot forwards list.

Well, he is more qualified than half those guys.

 

[BubbaBoot]

I'm finished with my arguing and will leave the decision as to who wins this series up to the voters and wish good luck to my opponnent and thank him for a good and well argued series.

Arguing?

Damn, you've never met my ex-wives....now THAT'S arguing....

 

[Elvis P]

Arguing? Damn, you've never met my ex-wives....now THAT'S arguing....

TMI, Bubba!

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Rum River wins in 6

3 Stars:

1. Bronco Horvath
2. Joe Jerwa
3. Bill Ranford/Don Raleigh