8th Baseball ATD Round 4 AL New York @ Brooklyn

[Pwnasaurus]

Brooklyn Bridegrooms:

Manager: Fred Clarke

Position Players​

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Pitchers​

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Lineup​

C: Thurman Munson | SP1: Lefty Grove (L) | 1. Frankie Frisch (B)
1B: Mark McGwire | SP2: Pedro Martinez (R) | 2. Arky Vaughan (L)
2B: Frankie Frisch | SP3: Smoky Joe Wood (R) | 3. Miguel Cabrera (R)
3B: Miguel Cabrera | SP4: Johan Santana (L) | 4. Mark McGwire (R)
SS: Arky Vaughan | SP5: Joe McGinnity (R) | 5. Reggie Jackson (L)
LF: Zack Wheat | Long1: Dave Stieb (R) | 6. Earl Averill (L)/Hack Wilson (R)
CF: Earl Averill | Mid1: Wilbur Wood (L) | 7. Zack Wheat (L)
RF: Reggie Jackson | Mid2: Virgil "Fire" Trucks (R) | 8. Thurman Munson (R)
Bench: | Short1: John Hiller (L) | 9. Pitcher's Spot
Hack Wilson CF/LF/RF (R) | Short2: Mark Eichhorn (R)
Carlos Delgado 1B (L) | Closer: Goose Gossage (R)
Hanley Ramirez SS/3B/LF (R)|
Tony Lazzeri 2B/SS/3B (R) |
Deacon White 3B/C/RF/1B (L)
Bobby Bonds RF/CF/LF (R) |

Click to read more...

 

[Pwnasaurus]

New York Yankees:

Manager: Bobby Cox

Position Players​

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Pitchers​

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Lineup​

C: Carlton Fisk | SP1: Mordecai Brown | 1. Joe Dimaggio
1B: Hank Greenberg | SP2: Robin Roberts | 2. George Davis
2B: Bobby Grich | SP3: Bert Blyleven | 3. Hank Greenberg
3B: David Wright | SP4: Felix Hernandez | 4. Barry Bonds
SS: George Davis | SP5: Harry Brecheen | 5. Carlton Fisk
LF: Barry Bonds| Long1: Jim Brewer | 6. David Wright
CF: Joe Dimaggio | Mid1: Brad Ziegler | 7. Andruw Jones
RF: Andruw Jones | Mid2: Eric Gagne | 8. Bobby Grich
Bench: Bill Dahlen (SS/3B) | Short1: Joe Nathan | 9. Pitcher's Spot
Bench: Keith Hernandez (1B) | Short2: Dave Righetti
Bench: Gene Tenace (C) | Closer: Lee Smith
Bench: Willie Randolph (2B) |
Bench: Pete Browning (OF/INF) |
Bench: Dummy Hoy (OF) |
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[UL Washington]

Dramatic representation of Wrigley upon hearing that Darko and I are in the ALCS:

 

[Say Hey Kid]

Dramatic representation of Wrigley upon hearing that Darko and I are in the ALCS:

Cabrera and Reggie? You better stick to this ATD where D doesn't matter.

 

[Winger for Hire]

Cabrera and Reggie? You better stick to this ATD where D doesn't matter.

Except when you have Jim Thome

 

[le_sean]

Battle of the Boroughs. Hispanics vs. hipsters.

 

[Say Hey Kid]

Dramatic representation of Wrigley upon hearing that Darko and I are in the ALCS:

Paranoia The Destroyer

 

[Say Hey Kid]

I have been disappointed by the lack of discussion in the playoffs so ... I appreciate GMs like darko who realize that D matters:

dWAR​

3B: Miguel Cabrera -13.5 - 3B: David Wright 1.7

RF: Reggie Jackson -17.2 - RF: Andruw Jones 24.1

Totals: - 30.7 and 25.8

 

[Winger for Hire]

Is that 24 dWAR for Jones based on his whole career? Which is 1724 game from CF and only 224 in RF.

 

[darko]

Good luck UL.

Pleasently surprised to be here considering I've got a dude with 3 fingers and 2 deaf guys. One of them also being an illeterate.

 

[darko]

Rocking with a 4-man rotation. Breech to the pen.

 

[UL Washington]

I have been disappointed by the lack of discussion in the playoffs so ... I appreciate GMs like darko who realize that D matters:

dWAR​

3B: Miguel Cabrera -13.5 - 3B: David Wright 1.7

RF: Reggie Jackson -17.2 - RF: Andruw Jones 24.1

Totals: - 30.7 and 25.8

Yep. Not exactly earth shattering analysis that Reggie and Miggy are not good at the defense. When constructing an ATD team, something usually has to give, so I figured with my pitching staff and their excellent ability to generate strikeouts, defense was something I could give a bit on. That being said, apart from Miggy and Reggie, the rest of the Bridegrooms combine for a +20.2 WAR, mostly related to solid middle D from Munson, Vaughan and Frisch.

Darko has a great team and this should go the full 7 games either way. It definitely is an interesting match up. Darko's first 3 picks were big sluggers while my first picks were ace pitchers. I'm hoping that the adage that good pitching beats good hitting in the playoffs holds up.

Good luck Darko!

 

[td_ice]

Its a great matchup.

I've had the Yankees a notch above in a very tough AL all season and playoffs.

Pinstripes in 7.

 

[UL Washington]

162 Game Averages (for those that care):

Starting Rotations (top 4, since the #5 guys have moved to the pens):

Bridegrooms: 18-9, 2.81 ERA, 1.14 WHIP, 193 K, 146.3 ERA+
Yankees: 16-12, 2.97 ERA, 1.15 WHIP, 160 K, 124.5 ERA+

Starting Lineup:

Bridegrooms: 99 R, 22 HR, 99 RBI, 10 SB, .301 BA, .379 OBP, .869 OPS, 135.1 OPS+
Yankees: 104 R, 27 HR, 106 RBI, 16 SB, .290 BA, .380 OBP, .887 OPS, 137.9 OPS+

 

[Tecumseh]

As we go further into the playoff, my biggest issue with Brooklyn's 3-4-5 hitters become more important. Granted, these guys have tremendous power but they strike out at an astronomical rate. Chances are if they're not hitting home runs, they're not hitting at all.

 

[Vegeta]

As we go further into the playoff, my biggest issue with Brooklyn's 3-4-5 hitters become more important. Granted, these guys have tremendous power but they strike out at an astronomical rate. Chances are if they're not hitting home runs, they're not hitting at all.

Eh, I would agree with this assessment of the 4, 5 hitters, but Miggy certainly can put the ball in play with consistency.

Anyway I find my team and New York's team to be very, very similar in strategy, so obviously I'm inclined to like them. However the gap between the pitching staffs is much, much greater than the gap between the lineups. I'm leaning towards Bridegrooms in a 7 game marathon.

Edit: And while the Yankees are much better defensively, they're going to have to rely on stellar defense a heck of a lot more than the Bridegrooms will anyway. I don't consider 3 finger brown to be an ace in this format.

 

[UL Washington]

As we go further into the playoff, my biggest issue with Brooklyn's 3-4-5 hitters become more important. Granted, these guys have tremendous power but they strike out at an astronomical rate. Chances are if they're not hitting home runs, they're not hitting at all.

Not sure I understand the logic here. Shouldn't you be looking at OBP to see how often a guy will get on base, not the number of times he strikes out? McGwire's OBP was .394 meaning even when he wasn't hitting long bombs, he still got on base almost 4 times every 10 at bats. As a comparison, Mike Trout struck out 158 times last year but people still view him as the best in baseball. How a player gets out (strikeout, ground out, pop fly, etc) is far less important than how often he gets on base or how many extra base hits he can get when he makes contact).

And yes, Reggie struck out at a historic rate, but still had a .356 OBP (.457 in WS play) so these guys have the green light to take homerun swings all day.

Vegeta also hits the nail on the head. Miggy has only struck out over 100 times once in the past 6 seasons while winning 4 batting titles so when he's not hitting home runs, I think he'll be just fine.

 

[Winger for Hire]

How a middle of the order hitter gets out, to me, is quite important.

Big Mac is a .263 career hitter and averages 138+ Ks and 114+ BB per 162 games. I don't have the math chops to really do the exact math here, but Mac's OBP is heavily based on his homers and walks (he averages under 25 doubles per 162, that's appallingly low for a power hitter in my view, and has under 1700 career hits).

He's a true 3 outcome hitter, he's going to either homer, strikeout or walk. I don't want my clean-up hitter walking too much, can't drive in runs like that and if he strikes out too much, you're not getting sac flies or moving the runners up/around at all.

Reggie is kind of the same, but slightly worse, which is bad hitting behind Mac. Reggie hits some more doubles (27 per 162) but strikes out more and walks much less. He also has under 1700 hits for his career. If he's not shipping balls, he's not doing much to be productive.

Miggy's fine. Doubles machine with a high average can negate a lot. He's putting the ball in play and making things happen.

I'd like the lineup a lot more if Miggy was hitting 4th, forcing teams to pitch to either Mac or Reggie in 3 spot because the hitter behind him would be a threat to make something happen.

Sure Frankie and Arky can set the table for Miggy, but there's a high chance that's as far as it goes most times through. I'd rather extend that into the clean-up spot. Miggy would have been nice protection for one of Reggie or Mac.

 

[UL Washington]

Interesting lineup strategy, but I like having my most complete hitter batting #3. If someone wants to pitch around McGwire to face Reggie in a playoff game, I'd be more than happy with that outcome.

 

[Winger for Hire]

That's fine, but if Miggy or anyone at the top of your lineup gets out, there's a high probability that Mac and Reggie end the inning.

 

[UL Washington]

That's fine, but if Miggy or anyone at the top of your lineup gets out, there's a high probability that Mac and Reggie end the inning.

There's a high probability that if there's one out and a .394 OBP guy and a .355 OBP guy will both get out? Math would say that there's a greater than 60% probability that at least one of those two gets on base. You can lower that a bit since these guys are facing better pitchers, but it still over 50%. To say there's a high probability they end the inning is not a correct assessment.

 

[Winger for Hire]

OK, I may have went too far with ending the inning.

What I should have said was that you're not getting the optimal outcome from most of your trips through the lineup with 2 all-or-nothing guys where they are, one with a high and hollow OBP and one with an average and not quite as hollow OBP.

 

[Pwnasaurus]

On to the results.....

Game 1 began with 3 Finger Brown striking out 5 consecutive Bridegrooms an ATD Baseball record to begin a postseason series featuring 2 owners from outside the USA. Bonds and McGwire both homered and received rousing ovations from the split crowd in Brooklyn. The Yankees take the first one on the road by the score of 5-2.

In Game 2, Brooklyn battled back to even the series as Pedro Martinez, focused on exercising his Yankee demons was masterful, limiting New York to 3 hits over 7 innings. Gossage mopped a 2 inning save and the Bridegrooms had taken a much needed win at home by the score of 3-1.

Game 3 saw a raucous Bronx crowd as the Yankees are seeking their first ATD World Series berth since they were the Highlanders 5 years ago. Bert Blyleven called the crowd "lit" or so the legend goes. Whatever he called them, his curveball did most of the talking as it baffled Bridegroom hitters all night. Reggie Jackson took the golden sombrero and Blyleven cruised to a 4-0 complete game victory.

In Game 4, the Bridegrooms showed why any UL driven team is a force as they pounded out 14 hits and chased Felix Hernandez after 2 innings in his first ever postseason start en route to a 10-3 drubbing and another series tie.

Brooklyn again was the scene for a pivotal Game 5 but yet again it was the handicapped hand of Mordecai Brown that tilted the series for the Yankees. Brown again baffled Bridegrooms hitters sending them muttering to themselves after weak contact. Brown went 8 innings scattering 5 hits, 4 of them singles as the Yankees took control of the series by the score of 4-1 sending the series back to the Bronx for a chance to advance to the World Series.

The Bridegrooms were not about to go quietly in Game 6, despite a standing room only Yankee Stadium crowd escalating the tension even further. Pedro Martinez, tasked with saving the season was up for the challenge and took a shutout into the 7th. Trailing 1-0 in the 7th, Carlton Fisk batted with 2 on and 2 out and "yanked" a Pedro changeup down the left field line. It was called a foul ball and the stadium crowd began to litter the field with debris. Hall of Famer Whitey Ford tried to calm the crowd by offering free pretzels (without permission from Darko it was later determined) but the mob would not cease. After a 7 and a half minute delay, the umpires reviewed the call. It was determined the ball sailed over the foul pole and actually grazed it ever so slightly. What was once anger and bitterness swung to elation as the Yankees were now 6 outs away from advancing. Yankees manager Bobby Cox played matchups superbly as Nathan retired Miggy and McGwire in the 8th and Righetti K'd Reggie to get through the toughest part of the Bridegrooms lineup. In the 9th, Lee Smith came on to close it out. After a solo homerun by Thurman Munson sent the crowd gasping, the big right hander collected himself and retired Carlos Delgado to end the game and send the Yankees into the World Series, via a final of 3-2.

Great series guys, excellent teams.

 

[darko]

See what happens when you serve full strength beers all game long.

 

[Say Hey Kid]

Dramatic representation of Wrigley upon hearing that Darko and I are in the ALCS:

This is an ironic post since as Pwn knows I voted for both teams all the way through to here.