50mil vs. 69mil

[One M0RE YEAR]

Before everyone calls me a downer let me say that I go to 5-6 sens games a year and have gone every year whether the team is great or not.

That being said, I wanted to hear everyone's thoughts on how good the sens could be, if they could spend to the cap. All else being the same, if the Sens could sign two elite free agents with that cap, are we a contender for the cup instantly? Obviously it would depend who the players were, but say we could add an elite player or two would we be ready to compete for the cup with our current roster?

Click to read more...

 

[Sensinitis]

Even if we spend, it would be silly because the core is still too young. The time to spend is in about 2 years; if it's not done then, God bless us all.

 

[HavlatMach9]

look to the Canadiens to get a rough idea. They underwent a rebuild just after us, but shot past us by spending to the cap.

 

[Super Cake]

Our core is still too young. So no, adding two elite free agents would not turn us into instant cup contenders.

 

[One M0RE YEAR]

Our core is young, which makes this the time to spend IMO. We are wasting valuable years of Turris' (along with other players') cheap contracts instead of adding players that could make us contenders for years to come. Once all of our players mature, they will all want bigger contracts, which will limit our ability to add elite players

 

[Lenny the Lynx]

look to the Canadiens to get a rough idea. They underwent a rebuild just after us, but shot past us by spending to the cap.

Really? Who did they spend on that made any difference?

I think they shot by us by:
- Doing really well in that random lottery draft and getting Price (while we got Lee)
- Drafting Pacioretty with a late first (while we got JOB)
- Drafting PK with a 2nd rounder (home run pick while we got BashKHLrov)

I don't see any comparison between us and Montreal, I don't even think they did much of a rebuild except for getting one high pick in Galchenyuk. Otherwise its just drafting

 

[DrakeAndJosh]

I think we would be better if we still had Spezza, Hemsky, and Alfie.

 

[jbeck5]

I think it would make a big difference. Adding a 70 point forward and a number 2 or 3 d. Or adding 2 top 6 forwards and a top 4 d. That would make us really deep and allow us to knock greening,condra,Phillips,neil etc off the team which would give us another 7-8 million to spend on 2 more top 2 line players. And fill the spots with young guys like stone,Hoffman,pageau,Lazar or wtv. Our team could be much better.

 

[Hale The Villain]

MacArthur - Turris - Ryan
Moulson - Zibanejad - Alfredsson
Michalek - Legwand - Chiasson
Stone - Smith - Neil

Methot - Karlsson
Cowen - Niskanen
Wiercioch - Ceci

Anderson
Lehner

That's what our roster could look like if we used some of the 16M in cap space we currently have.

The advantage some teams have over us is incredible.

 

[Slack]

I have a hard time believing Murray didn't go after Moulson. Sounds like his decision was based on family concerns and how much he appreciated the warm welcome they got in Buffalo.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Even if we spend, it would be silly because the core is still too young. The time to spend is in about 2 years; if it's not done then, God bless us all.

Perfectly said.

Next year is our measuring stick year. We get to see how far/good our young guys actually are.

If Turris, Zibanejad, Ceci, Cowen, Ryan, Stone, Lehner step up, then next year we add in the pieces to contend for next year(or make big deadline day acquisition).

If most of the guys I mentioned above don't step up, then we'll probably be in the basement compensated with high pick and better understanding of who is part of our core and who isn't.

The direction of this team will be clearer then so spending next year doesn't make much sense at all unless it's for a young top fire winger/defender or for someone like Alfredsson.

 

[Caeldan]

MacArthur - Turris - Ryan
Moulson - Zibanejad - Alfredsson
Michalek - Legwand - Chiasson
Stone - Smith - Neil

Methot - Karlsson
Cowen - Niskanen
Wiercioch - Ceci

Anderson
Lehner

That's what our roster could look like if we used some of the 16M in cap space we currently have.

The advantage some teams have over us is incredible.

If we were spending a bit of money I think the forward group would more accurately look like:
Michalek - Spezza - Hemsky (Hemsky would stay to play with Spezza, Spezza wouldn't have indicated he was not interested in re-signing after this season)
MacArthur - Turris - Ryan
Stone - Zibanejad - Alfredsson (wouldn't have walked last year)
Greening - Smith - Neil
Condra/Pageau(?)

While the D:
Methot - Karlsson
Cowen - UFA Vet that can play PP and log minutes when required (Boyle?)
Phillips - Ceci
Gryba/Wiercioch

Anderson
Lehner

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

This team was not gonna go anywhere with Spezza as it's number 1 C.

Alfredsson would have taken the burden off as the number 1 guy and captain though so that's a different story.

I doubt Alfredsson left cause of the money anyway or cause he wanted to win a cup. Why got Detroit when he could have gone to Boston, lolz.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

If we could have held on to Spezza and Hemsky this team could have been deadly next season

 

[Caeldan]

This team was not gonna go anywhere with Spezza as it's number 1 C.

Alfredsson would have taken the burden off as the number 1 guy and captain though so that's a different story.

I doubt Alfredsson left cause of the money anyway or cause he wanted to win a cup. Why got Detroit when he could have gone to Boston, lolz.

Well most signs indicate it was for the money, and even if it was for tax shelter purposes... then let's assume he's back this year.
And we got to the SCF with Spezza as 1C. So we have been somewhere.

 

[jbeck5]

I'll use only ufa signings made this summer that signed with non-contenders and will even give them slightly more then what they signed for.

macarthur(3.3)-turris(3.5)-ryan(5.1)
vanek(6.7)-zibanejad(0.9)-vrbata (5.3)
moulson(5.3)-legwand(3.0)-chiasson(0.9)
morrow(2.0)-smith(1.9)-stone(0.6)
hoffman(0.8)

karlsson(6.5)-methot(3.0)
meszaros(4.5)-cowen(3.0)
ceci(0.9)-wiercioch(2.0)
engelland(3.0)

anderson (3.2)
lehner (3.0)

68.4 cap hit with rounding up and overpaying for guys who signed in places like buffalo when it probably wasnt needed. probably have an extra million or 2 in cap space from that figure.

see ya michalek, see ya neil, see ya phillips, see ya condra, see ya greening. see ya borowiecki, see ya gryba

That line up can definitely make some noise in the east.

 

[We Want the Cup 2010]

Not sure any of this years FA crop were going to make that big of a difference. Is Matt Niskanen or Tomas Vanek the difference between a mediocre team and cup contenders? Not likely.

I'm all for spending, but big July 1st signings rarely pan out.

A trade for Sharp, Marchand, or Voracek/Simmonds would net you a better player on a better contract. Ottawa is in a good position to take advantage of teams up against the cap... if Melnyk is willing to spend, that's the route I would go to improve the team.

 

[Cosmix]

My thoughts

MacArthur - Turris - Ryan
Moulson - Zibanejad - Alfredsson
Michalek - Legwand - Chiasson
Stone - Smith - Neil

Methot - Karlsson
Cowen - Niskanen
Wiercioch - Ceci

Anderson
Lehner

That's what our roster could look like if we used some of the 16M in cap space we currently have.

The advantage some teams have over us is incredible.

Or it could look like this:

MacArthur - Turris - Ryan
Moulson - Zibanejad - Alfredsson
Michalek - Spezza - Hemsky
Hoffman - Smith - Stone

Methot - Karlsson
Cowen - Gryba
Wiercioch - Ceci

Anderson
Lehner

 

[Cosmix]

Alfie leaving

This team was not gonna go anywhere with Spezza as it's number 1 C.

Alfredsson would have taken the burden off as the number 1 guy and captain though so that's a different story.

I doubt Alfredsson left cause of the money anyway or cause he wanted to win a cup. Why got Detroit when he could have gone to Boston, lolz.

I don't think he left just because of the money, but it was because of the low initial offer from the Senators, the treatment he received from the Senators, and his desire to play for a cap team that had a better chance at winning the cup.

Here is my view as to what happened: I recall Alfie said he tried to negotiate a new contract before his final year with us started. The team apparently did not negotiate another 2 year contract at that time. Not sure why (probably the low ball offer). So, I believe Alfie felt slighted by that and decided to go to free agency as the Senators would not agree to the $7M per season for 2 seasons that he was asking for (i.e., $5M per season plus additional $4M that he was not paid in his final year of his last contract; the final year at $1M that both sides thought he would not play). I do not know what the Senators offered at that time. I believe Murray, after waiting to hear from Alfie as to whether he would play another year or two, subsequently offered $3M or $3.5 M to start negotiations for the next contract. Given this low ball offer and the team's low budget approach, Alfie probably felt he would have a better chance at winning a cup if he played elsewhere.

 

[Sensinitis]

And we got to the SCF with Spezza as 1C. So we have been somewhere.

The NHL is evolving, and that was when we had two top 5-8 wingers in the game flanking him.

 

[Stylizer1]

Or it could look like this:

MacArthur - Turris - Ryan
Moulson - Zibanejad - Alfredsson
Michalek - Spezza - Hemsky
Hoffman - Smith - Stone

Methot - Karlsson
Cowen - Gryba
Wiercioch - Ceci

Anderson
Lehner

Using those players I think it would have been better to line them up as:

Moulson- Spezza - Hemsky
MacArthur - Turris - Ryan
Michalek- Zibanejad - Alfredsson
Hoffman - Smith - Stone

Methot - Karlsson
Cowen - Gryba
Wiercioch - Ceci

Anderson
Lehner

Spezza is still a #1 C and the best offensively on that team.

 

[Sensinitis]

And he's still the worst defensively on that team.

 

[Dino Tkachuk]

Our core is young, which makes this the time to spend IMO. We are wasting valuable years of Turris' (along with other players') cheap contracts instead of adding players that could make us contenders for years to come. Once all of our players mature, they will all want bigger contracts, which will limit our ability to add elite players

The big assumption that you're making is that our kids are going to continue to progress dramatically and earn those big contracts. The alternative though is that they don't. Now you've gone out an spent a large amount of money picking up complimentary vets and all that is going to do is keep you near the playoffs while not getting those really high picks that we would obviously need.

Now if next year some of our young guys really blossom and we KNOW that we have some key core pieces THEN you go out and pick up the missing parts.

Strategically Bryan Murray really has done a masterful job...if our young guys flop then we are well positioned to pick up a high draft pick in a top draft year. If our young guys blossom then we are set to pick up some quality UFAs next year as part of free agent frenzy to make a push, in a year where (as of today) there are some top players available. It really is a win-win...

 

[Dino Tkachuk]

If we could have held on to Spezza and Hemsky this team could have been deadly next season

This team would have been good...deadly, I'm not so sure... Those are two fairly fragile players and we would be an injury or two from icing a lineup worse than what will be going out there in the fall.

Again though, if your young guys don't progress as expected then all you're doing is prolonging the inevitable and going back into a full rebuild. Not a good situation...

 

[Cosmix]

Reply

Using those players I think it would have been better to line them up as:

Moulson- Spezza - Hemsky
MacArthur - Turris - Ryan
Michalek- Zibanejad - Alfredsson
Hoffman - Smith - Stone

Methot - Karlsson
Cowen - Gryba
Wiercioch - Ceci

Anderson
Lehner

Spezza is still a #1 C and the best offensively on that team.

Perhaps. I can go either way. But that would be a very entertaining lineup.

I would like a team that does spend to the cap; however, a team like Ottawa cannot afford to if it desires to operate as a viable business on a long term basis. It could only do so if it was financed by a rich patron (e.g., Lord Thomson, perhaps).

As a long term fan of the Winnipeg Jets I was disheartened to see the team leave Winnipeg many years ago. I am glad they have a team now.

I am now an Ottawa Senators fan living in Ottawa. I believe the Ottawa team must be operated as a business and our team is not one that can afford to spend to the cap. So, in order to compete, the team must use a different strategy than the rich teams.

We cannot afford large buyouts of players if we sign them as UFAs and pay top dollar. Instead we must build through the draft and trades. We also cannot afford many high salary players, so we must ensure we have solid two-way players who can defend well.

I would much rather have a so-called budget team than no team at all!