2024 NHL Draft Thread (CBJ to pick 4th)

Predict CBJ's draft position


  • Total voters
    40
  • Poll closed .

GoJackets1

Someday.
Sponsor
Aug 21, 2008
6,833
3,377
Montana
the pining is because people want the team to be bigger and meaner. but that doesn't happen by drafting an 18-year-old who puck-watches in his own zone.

the more I think about it, the more I'm drawn to helenius. so much of his profile reminds me of sebastian aho. plays a highly intelligent, super-refined game, extremely good compete level, has thrived in all three zones against grown men.
IMO, hockey sense is the most important trait to find, especially this high in the draft. I usually hate taking guys for tools or size. If Buium’s best trait is his hockey sense and he’s a strong skater, it’s hard for me to pass on a guy like that. And he has size. Levshunov sounds similar but I need to read more on him.

That said I don’t know anything about Lindstrom in this regard.
 

stevo61

Registered User
Jul 5, 2011
11,189
12,299
Canada
the pining is because people want the team to be bigger and meaner. but that doesn't happen by drafting an 18-year-old who puck-watches in his own zone.

the more I think about it, the more I'm drawn to helenius. so much of his profile reminds me of sebastian aho. crafty, intelligent, competitive player who can play all situations. I'm less convinced lindstrom turns out as a center or as a plus-level defensive player.
He shares deficiencies many teenagers do. You are not drafting a completed player and most of his issues are coachable. Fantilli often is lost defensively at the pro level and I dont think anyone thought twice about taking him
 

OldGoaltender

Registered User
Jul 17, 2006
1,297
442
The Triad NC
No way I want to move down, we are prospect heavy right now and more picks to could result is more JAG's. If there's a prospect they think has top two line potential draft him and let him develop.
 

Ice9

Registered User
Jun 25, 2016
1,434
772
In the woods
Iginla is a  safe pick. He will be a staple for years to come. Nobody will be sorry if they reach a bit on him. You might pass on a good player but I dont think you'd ever be sorry for the pick. But ultimately...Im no GM or talent scout!
 

cbjthrowaway

Registered User
Jul 4, 2020
1,952
3,429
He shares deficiencies many teenagers do. You are not drafting a completed player and most of his issues are coachable. Fantilli often is lost defensively at the pro level and I dont think anyone thought twice about taking him
sure, but fantilli has elite elements that lindstrom doesn't (hands, skating) and was a strong defensive player in college.

lindstrom struggles defensively in junior and can simply steamroll his opponents since he's so much bigger/stronger than teenagers. that gets neutralized in the NHL. he's going to have a steep learning curve.

he's a talented kid, no doubt, but i'm not sold on him as a game-breaker. i think he ends up on the wing and, if all breaks right, becomes a chris kreider type. which is good! but, if they want a forward, i'd rather shoot for a sebastian aho type – someone who is smaller but plays a highly detailed, competitive game and differentiates with hockey IQ.

to me, that's helenius or catton.

*obligatory "I'm no scout" caveat here*

I'm in agreement with the couple of posters who say Helenius is intriguing. The other guy I find interesting, and it would be considered a reach absent a trade-down, is Tij Iginla.

It's going to be hard to pass on Levshunov if he's there.
if levshunov or demidov make it to #4 the new GM should sprint to the podium to take them imo.

otherwise, i think the move is to trade down with ottawa (7) or calgary (9). both have additional firsts this year, and there are some guys in the later half of the first round who have the traits folks like in lindstrom.

my dream outcome is trading with one of them, moving back a few spots, getting one of helenius/catton in the top 10, then picking a guy like egor surin, sacha boisvert or michael hage in the late first.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Napoli

KJ Dangler

Registered User
Oct 21, 2006
8,398
5,030
Columbus
I think you have to draft center this year .. that is unless you are 100% sold Sillinger is #2c….

Currently we have Mateychuk, Jiricek, Svozil knocking on the door for a spot . I think Mateychuk makes it next year , Jiricek is AHL again … But you also have Boquist who is 23 .

At center we have Fantilli.. Sillinger , and then Boone and Voronkov .. If you draft Lindstrom , you have Fantilli , Lindstrom , Sillinger down the middle .
 
  • Like
Reactions: puckgoalnet

CBJx614

Registered User
May 25, 2012
15,070
6,712
C-137
IMO, hockey sense is the most important trait to find, especially this high in the draft. I usually hate taking guys for tools or size. If Buium’s best trait is his hockey sense and he’s a strong skater, it’s hard for me to pass on a guy like that. And he has size. Levshunov sounds similar but I need to read more on him.

That said I don’t know anything about Lindstrom in this regard.
This is why I'm leaning for Silayev, he has the size/tools AND the hockey sense. He's 17, playing a harder position at a younger age compared to guys like Marchenko and Voronkov who were struggling to get minutes in the KHL in their 20s(more so Marchenko than Voro)

He's going to spend 2 more years minimum in the KHL to finish developing and fill out a little longer.. Hell even if he spends 4 more years in the KHL, he'd only be 21-22...

I think you have to draft center this year .. that is unless you are 100% sold Sillinger is #2c….

Currently we have Mateychuk, Jiricek, Svozil knocking on the door for a spot . I think Mateychuk makes it next year , Jiricek is AHL again … But you also have Boquist who is 23 .

At center we have Fantilli.. Sillinger , and then Boone and Voronkov .. If you draft Lindstrom , you have Fantilli , Lindstrom , Sillinger down the middle .
Brindley plays center as well. Curious what the org thinks though
 

KJ Dangler

Registered User
Oct 21, 2006
8,398
5,030
Columbus
This is why I'm leaning for Silayev, he has the size/tools AND the hockey sense. He's 17, playing a harder position at a younger age compared to guys like Marchenko and Voronkov who were struggling to get minutes in the KHL in their 20s(more so Marchenko than Voro)

He's going to spend 2 more years minimum in the KHL to finish developing and fill out a little longer.. Hell even if he spends 4 more years in the KHL, he'd only be 21-22...


Brindley plays center as well. Curious what the org thinks though
So who’s your #2 center ? Do you feel confident 100% Sillinger grows into that role ?
 

CBJx614

Registered User
May 25, 2012
15,070
6,712
C-137
So who’s your #2 center ? Do you feel confident 100% Sillinger grows into that role ?
We have 1-3 years below any of these guys would be ready, plenty of time to see how Silly/Voronkov develop or to grabbed someone from FA or to make a trade. Hell for all we know a guy like Keskinen could pop and come over and solidify a spot before a 2024 pick is NHL ready...
 

CBJWerenski8

Formerly CBJWennberg10 (RIP Kivi)
Jun 13, 2009
42,545
24,543
It feels since forever since a team has traded down. Like a legitimate trade down, not one or two spots.

I don’t see us doing that
 

DoingItCoolKiwi

Registered User
May 23, 2017
3,498
2,711
It feels since forever since a team has traded down. Like a legitimate trade down, not one or two spots.

I don’t see us doing that
Depends really where they go with in the gm position.

'Old school' gms like Jarmo dont really do it since they always have the one guy who they want. Then they'll go to the media with the classic 'We got our guy!' line.

Analytical new school gms love doing it when the computer says they'll gain value. It felt like Dubas traded down more often than not. So basically if the new gm is someone like Eric Tulsky, there's probably a greater chance for a trade down than ever before.
 
  • Like
Reactions: squashmaple

CBJx614

Registered User
May 25, 2012
15,070
6,712
C-137
Depends really where they go with in the gm position.

'Old school' gms like Jarmo dont really do it since they always have the one guy who they want. Then they'll go to the media with the classic 'We got our guy!' line.

Analytical new school gms love doing it when the computer says they'll gain value. It felt like Dubas traded down more often than not. So basically if the new gm is someone like Eric Tulsky, there's probably a greater chance for a trade down than ever before.
Eh I feel like that's backwards, top picks used to get trade a lot more before the lockout. Whens the last time a top 5 pick was traded?

The players themselves get traded later of course, but young kids who can make an impact on an ELC are EXTREMELY VALUABLE. GMs don't want to give that up.
 
  • Like
Reactions: squashmaple

stevo61

Registered User
Jul 5, 2011
11,189
12,299
Canada
It feels since forever since a team has traded down. Like a legitimate trade down, not one or two spots.

I don’t see us doing that
San Jose traded from 11 to the late 20s 2 years ago, probably as close as I can remember. But to endure a trash season and trade down a top 5 pick? Nah, thats not cool
 
  • Like
Reactions: CBJWerenski8

cbjthrowaway

Registered User
Jul 4, 2020
1,952
3,429
It feels since forever since a team has traded down. Like a legitimate trade down, not one or two spots.

I don’t see us doing that
trading down with ottawa (7 + 25ish) or calgary (9 + 29ish + they also have a late 2nd) from #4 overall might be prudent.

walking away with helenius and someone like egor surin would be a potential home run imo.
 

majormajor

Registered User
Jun 23, 2018
25,117
30,002
I'm all in on Lindstrom.

I'm even more all in on Lindstrom after watching this:



From watching live I had Lindstrom 4th, partly out of injury concern. But even the video here from when he returned from injury and supposedly was playing poorly, he still has moments where he looks like a future star in the league.
 

squashmaple

gudbranson apologist
Sponsor
Sep 24, 2022
1,473
2,541
Columbus
Lindstrom is probably my least favorite of the likely pack available at four. I also get Sillinger vibes from him in my limited viewing and reading (makes sense, too, if Medicine Hat has a type they favor).

My own preference list is:

Demidov (undeniable, Russian issues not as critical for Columbus)
Silayev (the hockey sense and size, who cares if he doesn’t score a ton when offensive D are a dime a dozen)
Levshunov (very close to NHL ready, good skater, could enable them to move Jiricek for an upgrade elsewhere)
Lindstrom (his biggest strengths are Big and Fast, which I don’t really love. I want hockey IQ, especially since Fantilli’s is only average)

with Helenius and Buium very close after that. To the point that if Ottawa or Calgary is dangling an enticing trade down package, I probably bite. I really like Helenius but hesitate to include him in the top five conversation because he isn’t elite at anything but hockey sense.

But I can talk myself into any of them quite easily, and I can’t really see myself upset whichever way the Jackets go. Nice position to be in, really.
 

GoJackets1

Someday.
Sponsor
Aug 21, 2008
6,833
3,377
Montana
I’ve seen a couple mentions of Silayev’s hockey sense now. Given that he doesn’t score much, is this evident in his defensive positioning and breakouts, or something else? It’s hard for me to envision taking a purely defensive D-man in the top 5. Last one I remember is Gudbranson.
 
  • Like
Reactions: majormajor

majormajor

Registered User
Jun 23, 2018
25,117
30,002
I saw a couple of mentions of concerns about Lindstrom’s competitiveness on Reddit. I haven’t seen any of that here so can I assume that’s some typical Reddit BS?

It's 100% Reddit BS. Maybe 3% of CBJ reddit posters have watched a single Lindstrom game, so they end up randomly upvoting ignorant comments and it's all over the place. I wouldn't say the percentage is much higher on HF but at least here we don't put our ignorance on the top of the page.

Lindstrom is very competitive in all aspects. Watch him defend in the video I posted above, that's remarkable focus. To me that's part of what defines him as a player, he's not the big kid who you think you can push to become a power forward (e.g. PLD), he's dialed in and always using his body to gain advantages.

purely comparing them as prospects:
  • sillinger was a better passer/playmaker
  • sillinger played a far more detailed game (lindstrom gets caught puck-watching in the d-zone a LOT for my tastes)
  • similarly lethal shots
  • similar physicality
  • lindstrom has better size
  • lindstrom is more explosive with more straight line speed
  • similar technical skating flaws (lindstrom is VERY upright, unrefined edgework, wide turns)
lindstrom plays a powerful game but he's also 6'4 220 and can get away with lacking refinement against teenagers. i have concerns about how that translates to the NHL. lots of prospects with similar profiles (big, powerful, raw, productive in junior) have either struggled to adapt to the NHL or topped out as mid-tier players.

You keep getting this wrong.

Players who physically dominate vs juniors but lose that element vs the pros are guys like Sillinger and Kerby Rychel who aren't that strong. It happens to a lot of 6'1 200 lb guys. There are players who are physically dominant in the NHL and Cayden Lindstrom has the strength to be one of them. He's also a much better skater, much faster in both his first step and top speed, basically he and Sillinger are opposite ends of the scale in terms of speed.

i'd rather shoot for a sebastian aho type – someone who is smaller but plays a highly detailed, competitive game and differentiates with hockey IQ.

to me, that's helenius or catton.

FWIW Aho certainly benefited from growing that extra couple of inches, his reach is much longer than Helenius. And Helenius isn't that level of skater. I think the comparison for Helenius is you wonder if he can become a Suzuki type of guy.

Catton is kind of short, but more problematically he's very thin and weak, and that also means injury prone. I don't have a great sense of how much stronger he'll be able to get, from the draft rankings it seems NHL scouts have major concerns. Despite his incredible talent - he has the skating, hands, and vision of an elite NHL forward - only a couple scouts in Bob's poll had Catton in the top ten, and it was around #9 or #10.

People talk about Lindstrom being injury prone (maybe not accurately) but it's a much bigger concern for weaker players like Catton and Parekh.
 

majormajor

Registered User
Jun 23, 2018
25,117
30,002
Silayev (the hockey sense and size, who cares if he doesn’t score a ton when offensive D are a dime a dozen)
Levshunov (very close to NHL ready, good skater, could enable them to move Jiricek for an upgrade elsewhere)
Lindstrom (his biggest strengths are Big and Fast, which I don’t really love. I want hockey IQ, especially since Fantilli’s is only average)

- I don't see how we would judge that Silayev has more hockey sense than Lindstrom. Both rely on big and fast above all, and both have good decision making for the role they play, shutdown D for Silayev and power forward for Lindstrom. And like how Lindstrom doesn't have the pretension of being a star playmaker, Silayev doesn't have the pretension of being anything other than a shutdown guy. He displays zero hockey sense offensively - I'm not saying that he's stupid about it, he doesn't try to play that side of the game so there's nothing to evaluate.

- If you want to talk about a player who tries a lot of things and has questionable sense, it's Levshunov. You'd wonder half the time if he knows where the defensive side of the rink is, he often just hangs out at forward even when it doesn't gain an advantage. I could see him getting a lot better but he will need time, he's not close to NHL ready.
 

CBJx614

Registered User
May 25, 2012
15,070
6,712
C-137
It's 100% Reddit BS. Maybe 3% of CBJ reddit posters have watched a single Lindstrom game, so they end up randomly upvoting ignorant comments and it's all over the place. I wouldn't say the percentage is much higher on HF but at least here we don't put our ignorance on the top of the page.

Lindstrom is very competitive in all aspects. Watch him defend in the video I posted above, that's remarkable focus. To me that's part of what defines him as a player, he's not the big kid who you think you can push to become a power forward (e.g. PLD), he's dialed in and always using his body to gain advantages.



You keep getting this wrong.

Players who physically dominate vs juniors but lose that element vs the pros are guys like Sillinger and Kerby Rychel who aren't that strong. It happens to a lot of 6'1 200 lb guys. There are players who are physically dominant in the NHL and Cayden Lindstrom has the strength to be one of them. He's also a much better skater, much faster in both his first step and top speed, basically he and Sillinger are opposite ends of the scale in terms of speed.



FWIW Aho certainly benefited from growing that extra couple of inches, his reach is much longer than Helenius. And Helenius isn't that level of skater. I think the comparison for Helenius is you wonder if he can become a Suzuki type of guy.

Catton is kind of short, but more problematically he's very thin and weak, and that also means injury prone. I don't have a great sense of how much stronger he'll be able to get, from the draft rankings it seems NHL scouts have major concerns. Despite his incredible talent - he has the skating, hands, and vision of an elite NHL forward - only a couple scouts in Bob's poll had Catton in the top ten, and it was around #9 or #10.

People talk about Lindstrom being injury prone (maybe not accurately) but it's a much bigger concern for weaker players like Catton and Parekh.
Just speaking personally, to me it's not being prone, it's what's the extent of this latest back injury(do we even know if it's a confirmed back injury?) there's not a ton out there about it. If it's something minor well then meh. But if it's something that could linger, it's scary to have to Factor that into a top 5 pick.
 
  • Like
Reactions: cbjthrowaway

cbjthrowaway

Registered User
Jul 4, 2020
1,952
3,429
Lindstrom is very competitive in all aspects. Watch him defend in the video I posted above, that's remarkable focus. To me that's part of what defines him as a player, he's not the big kid who you think you can push to become a power forward (e.g. PLD), he's dialed in and always using his body to gain advantages.
i had a comment in this thread about him puck-watching (not questioning compete, but engagement when his man doesn't have the puck in the d-zone) – that specific critique came from a film breakdown i watched a while ago.

that same breakdown said his puck skill was good but not dynamic, and that he had some signs of improved playmaking. also called out what i thought were major issues with his skating.

i then watched a few other pieces on lindstrom – a breakdown by eliteprospects and then their march roundtable – and those alleviated a lot of those concerns.

there was some overlap between the previous breakdown i'd watched and the EP ones (praising his rush patterns, shooting and explosiveness) but the EP team have him as their unanimous number three.

they praised his defense, praised the routes he takes and said his playmaking and hockey sense are becoming real assets.

fwiw the same group (which has him at #3) has parekh at #5, saying his offense is more translatable to the NHL than other high-scoring junior defensemen, and that his defense is significantly better than people realize. so their criteria is more than the often lazy "big = good" stuff that i've seen from other media praising lindstrom, silayev, etc.


Players who physically dominate vs juniors but lose that element vs the pros are guys like Sillinger and Kerby Rychel who aren't that strong. It happens to a lot of 6'1 200 lb guys.
i'm not saying he's sillinger or rychel, but the power forward archetype in junior has unpredictable outcomes because so much of their success in junior is built on a strength advantage that dissipates at the pro level.

i don't think he's going to be a logan brown or kratsov type bust, but my concern is that guys like pavel zacha and lawson crouse had similar projections as power forwards in otherwise deep drafts and ended up as useful but ultimately disappointing (relative to draft position) players.

even if he's a chris kreider type player in the NHL – which i don't think is a bad comp – that's still not quite the impact you hope for from a top five pick. but again, the EP breakdowns have reassured me that he could have a really high ceiling.

He's also a much better skater, much faster in both his first step and top speed, basically he and Sillinger are opposite ends of the scale in terms of speed.
semantics here, but he's a much more explosive athlete than sillinger but even to my layman eyes there are some things in his skating that need to be cleaned up. his acceleration is good, his top-end speed is insane (and looks easy), but his turns are very wide (as sillinger's were at the same stage) and his posture is way too upright for my liking.

those are, ultimately, correctable. but the posture thing, combined with a back injury, could be seen as a red flag.
FWIW Aho certainly benefited from growing that extra couple of inches, his reach is much longer than Helenius. And Helenius isn't that level of skater. I think the comparison for Helenius is you wonder if he can become a Suzuki type of guy.
i think there's an element of like a chandler stephenson or elias lindholm in helenius's game, but in a smaller package, with aho being the ultimate dream outcome. but he seems to have near-prodigious hockey IQ (in a 200-foot way, rather than being an o-zone savant) for his age.

he certainly doesn't have the same physical upside as a guy like lindstrom, but players that smart tend to figure it out. i think there's a ton of translatable stuff in his game and that he'll be capable of being a good all-situations player in the NHL.
 
  • Like
Reactions: majormajor

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad