Yes, Detroit needs to draft good players and not draft bad players. I'm not sure why Yzerman hasn't thought of this yet.
2024 Draft Discussion
- Thread starter Vector Cereal
- Start date
heyfolks
Registered User
- Apr 30, 2007
- 1,870
- 607
If this kid fell to the Wings in the 2nd, I'd draft him. I've seen him anywhere from top 10 to 27. It is an odd draft, but if this kid has unquestionable top 5 talent, I take him at 15. One scout said he is the 2nd best player in the draft. IF that is true, I take him at 15. My concern is his weight. One report said he was under 160. I'd pass just to keep Jaster from a stroke.
Breaking down the National Enquirer forever tail these kids get from the Internet.
I haven't seen anything about crap in a bag, so I will leave that aside. I will say, I've seen top players in the Nation do some real dumb sh** (hahaha) in the past. It just wasn't the day of the Internet.
Swastika - His teammate made the symbol with books at a library. He took a photo of it and post is on Snapchat. He then thought better of it and took it down, within minutes. However, someone took a screen shot of it and sent it around. Dumb, sure. Malicious, now. Did he pay a price for it? Yes, a very heavy price in the hockey world. He also went on a journey of self education and a better understanding of the topic. How many 16 year olds do you know that would take this mature approach to the issue?
Racial slur - The forever topic about anything uttered at all by any white person. This was before juniors and, after being suspended and going through a trail of BS, was completely exonerated. It is criminal that this hangs over him, but that is the Internet. Even in this area, with complete vindication, he has worked to remove the black cloud.
"He's probably the second-best player after Mack Celebrini in the U.S.," said one scout. "Uber-talented, makes everyone else on the ice better, very smart, fast, good skill, high IQ, good vision. He checks all the boxes. It's going to be one of those deals where you have to kick it up the ladder and your manager is going to have to make a decision. All we can do is vet the kid. He's a top-10 talent."
Swastika:
Although the post was deleted minutes later, the photo was screen-shotted by someone first and has since circulated over the past 17 months.
Make no mistake, Connelly is the first to admit he regrets posting the photo and quickly felt the consequences.
While it’d be easy to say he was just an ignorant 16-year-old kid, Connelly has owned up to it and used it as a way to better himself.
“I wanted to learn from it and educate myself,” he said. “I visited the LA Holocaust Museum and I also read the book, 'Night' (by Holocaust survivor Elie Wiesel). That gave me a much better understanding of why the post and the swastika symbol are so hurtful, and that antisemitism is still a big problem today.
“Knowing what I know now, I would never post something like that and I regret doing it.”
Racial slur (that never occurred):
Jazmine Miley, Hockey Players of Color founder
Along with the photo, there have also been rumblings of another incident, where Connelly allegedly used a racial slur towards an opponent during a game in 2021. However, Connelly adamantly denied those allegations.
Connelly was initially suspended for the accusation but it was ultimately lifted and removed from his record by the California Amateur Hockey Association. After a hearing with the CAHA, it was determined no violation occurred.
Connelly reiterated he’s committed to being the best person he can be on and off the ice. He’s taken several diversity, equity and inclusion training courses and has done over many hours of volunteer community service work — several of which came during the season.
"Trevor was as impressive of a 16-year-old from a maturity standpoint that I've seen in this league," Tri-City head coach Anthony Noreen told The Rink Live.
"I can tell you from every single facet of our organization — billet families, fan interaction, community service, players, staff, ownership — everything. The overwhelming sentiment of Trevor has been positive. Every single community outreach event that our organization was involved in, Trevor was there. He wasn't told that he had to be, but he made it a point to do it. He did every single thing we asked of him and more."
He’s also now involved with Hockey Players of Color, a group that’s geared towards making hockey more inclusive and a better place — something Connelly said he wants to do.
"Oftentimes you have people who don't understand other people's culture and they don't realize how certain things impact them or how having that extra insight and perspective on the world itself can benefit them," said Jazmine Miley, the founder of Hockey Players of Color.
I have zero clue if he is the 2nd best or 30th best player in the draft, but I wouldn't stay away from him because of character.
Remember when Kane wore black face and it was called a racial incident.....
Blackhawks in blackface: Most predictable backlash of 2009
When we tweeted last night about local coverage of the Chicago Blackhawks Halloween Party, we did so...
sports.yahoo.com
... or when he beat up a 62 year old cab driver over 20 cents?
When Patrick Kane beat up a 62-year-old cab driver over 20 cents
In August 2009, the hockey world was shocked by the news that star player Patrick Kane had been arrested in Buffalo, NY, along with his cousin James.
www.sportskeeda.com
Funny how his character isn't called into question.
I don't pretend to know everything about the kid, I'm just saying this stuff appears way overblown and his acts of contrition go well beyond what others have done who were actually more malicious or, you know, actually committed the act for which they were accused.
Heck I hope he IS the 2nd best player in the draft and his punishment is for him to drop all the way to 15, hell 47! LOL!
And this is why I don’t have any problem with trading this year’s 1st rounder as a package deal to bring in a solid roster player from a rival…Sure - you could get a ‘sleeper’ at 15, but the reality is it’ll take a few seasons to really know what ya got and for all ya know it’ll be another Veleno, or Zadina clone…
Gniwder
Registered User
Then why does Draper still have a job?
Detroit has been out of the playoffs for considerably longer time. Tied for 6th all time now. That's hella bad.
Stevie does well with the first round pick though.
It's usually the second round that make me cringe.
ShanahanMan
Registered User
Only two of his 1st round picks are guaranteed “good picks”. The verdict is still out on the others.
Oddbob
Registered User
- Jan 21, 2016
- 15,980
- 10,520
If this kid fell to the Wings in the 2nd, I'd draft him. I've seen him anywhere from top 10 to 27. It is an odd draft, but if this kid has unquestionable top 5 talent, I take him at 15. One scout said he is the 2nd best player in the draft. IF that is true, I take him at 15. My concern is his weight. One report said he was under 160. I'd pass just to keep Jaster from a stroke.
Breaking down the National Enquirer forever tail these kids get from the Internet.
I haven't seen anything about crap in a bag, so I will leave that aside. I will say, I've seen top players in the Nation do some real dumb sh** (hahaha) in the past. It just wasn't the day of the Internet.
Swastika - His teammate made the symbol with books at a library. He took a photo of it and post is on Snapchat. He then thought better of it and took it down, within minutes. However, someone took a screen shot of it and sent it around. Dumb, sure. Malicious, now. Did he pay a price for it? Yes, a very heavy price in the hockey world. He also went on a journey of self education and a better understanding of the topic. How many 16 year olds do you know that would take this mature approach to the issue?
Racial slur - The forever topic about anything uttered at all by any white person. This was before juniors and, after being suspended and going through a trail of BS, was completely exonerated. It is criminal that this hangs over him, but that is the Internet. Even in this area, with complete vindication, he has worked to remove the black cloud.
"He's probably the second-best player after Mack Celebrini in the U.S.," said one scout. "Uber-talented, makes everyone else on the ice better, very smart, fast, good skill, high IQ, good vision. He checks all the boxes. It's going to be one of those deals where you have to kick it up the ladder and your manager is going to have to make a decision. All we can do is vet the kid. He's a top-10 talent."
Swastika:
Although the post was deleted minutes later, the photo was screen-shotted by someone first and has since circulated over the past 17 months.
Make no mistake, Connelly is the first to admit he regrets posting the photo and quickly felt the consequences.
While it’d be easy to say he was just an ignorant 16-year-old kid, Connelly has owned up to it and used it as a way to better himself.
“I wanted to learn from it and educate myself,” he said. “I visited the LA Holocaust Museum and I also read the book, 'Night' (by Holocaust survivor Elie Wiesel). That gave me a much better understanding of why the post and the swastika symbol are so hurtful, and that antisemitism is still a big problem today.
“Knowing what I know now, I would never post something like that and I regret doing it.”
Racial slur (that never occurred):
Jazmine Miley, Hockey Players of Color founder
Along with the photo, there have also been rumblings of another incident, where Connelly allegedly used a racial slur towards an opponent during a game in 2021. However, Connelly adamantly denied those allegations.
Connelly was initially suspended for the accusation but it was ultimately lifted and removed from his record by the California Amateur Hockey Association. After a hearing with the CAHA, it was determined no violation occurred.
Connelly reiterated he’s committed to being the best person he can be on and off the ice. He’s taken several diversity, equity and inclusion training courses and has done over many hours of volunteer community service work — several of which came during the season.
"Trevor was as impressive of a 16-year-old from a maturity standpoint that I've seen in this league," Tri-City head coach Anthony Noreen told The Rink Live.
"I can tell you from every single facet of our organization — billet families, fan interaction, community service, players, staff, ownership — everything. The overwhelming sentiment of Trevor has been positive. Every single community outreach event that our organization was involved in, Trevor was there. He wasn't told that he had to be, but he made it a point to do it. He did every single thing we asked of him and more."
He’s also now involved with Hockey Players of Color, a group that’s geared towards making hockey more inclusive and a better place — something Connelly said he wants to do.
"Oftentimes you have people who don't understand other people's culture and they don't realize how certain things impact them or how having that extra insight and perspective on the world itself can benefit them," said Jazmine Miley, the founder of Hockey Players of Color.
I have zero clue if he is the 2nd best or 30th best player in the draft, but I wouldn't stay away from him because of character.
Remember when Kane wore black face and it was called a racial incident.....
Blackhawks in blackface: Most predictable backlash of 2009
When we tweeted last night about local coverage of the Chicago Blackhawks Halloween Party, we did so...
... or when he beat up a 62 year old cab driver over 20 cents?
When Patrick Kane beat up a 62-year-old cab driver over 20 cents
In August 2009, the hockey world was shocked by the news that star player Patrick Kane had been arrested in Buffalo, NY, along with his cousin James.
Funny how his character isn't called into question.
I don't pretend to know everything about the kid, I'm just saying this stuff appears way overblown and his acts of contrition go well beyond what others have done who were actually more malicious or, you know, actually committed the act for which they were accused.
Heck I hope he IS the 2nd best player in the draft and his punishment is for him to drop all the way to 15, hell 47! LOL!
Kane's character has been called into question many times, what are you talking about?
OgeeOgelthorpe
Sparkplug
- Feb 29, 2020
- 17,343
- 18,521
If this kid fell to the Wings in the 2nd, I'd draft him. I've seen him anywhere from top 10 to 27. It is an odd draft, but if this kid has unquestionable top 5 talent, I take him at 15. One scout said he is the 2nd best player in the draft. IF that is true, I take him at 15. My concern is his weight. One report said he was under 160. I'd pass just to keep Jaster from a stroke.
Breaking down the National Enquirer forever tail these kids get from the Internet.
I haven't seen anything about crap in a bag, so I will leave that aside. I will say, I've seen top players in the Nation do some real dumb sh** (hahaha) in the past. It just wasn't the day of the Internet.
Swastika - His teammate made the symbol with books at a library. He took a photo of it and post is on Snapchat. He then thought better of it and took it down, within minutes. However, someone took a screen shot of it and sent it around. Dumb, sure. Malicious, now. Did he pay a price for it? Yes, a very heavy price in the hockey world. He also went on a journey of self education and a better understanding of the topic. How many 16 year olds do you know that would take this mature approach to the issue?
Racial slur - The forever topic about anything uttered at all by any white person. This was before juniors and, after being suspended and going through a trail of BS, was completely exonerated. It is criminal that this hangs over him, but that is the Internet. Even in this area, with complete vindication, he has worked to remove the black cloud.
"He's probably the second-best player after Mack Celebrini in the U.S.," said one scout. "Uber-talented, makes everyone else on the ice better, very smart, fast, good skill, high IQ, good vision. He checks all the boxes. It's going to be one of those deals where you have to kick it up the ladder and your manager is going to have to make a decision. All we can do is vet the kid. He's a top-10 talent."
Swastika:
Although the post was deleted minutes later, the photo was screen-shotted by someone first and has since circulated over the past 17 months.
Make no mistake, Connelly is the first to admit he regrets posting the photo and quickly felt the consequences.
While it’d be easy to say he was just an ignorant 16-year-old kid, Connelly has owned up to it and used it as a way to better himself.
“I wanted to learn from it and educate myself,” he said. “I visited the LA Holocaust Museum and I also read the book, 'Night' (by Holocaust survivor Elie Wiesel). That gave me a much better understanding of why the post and the swastika symbol are so hurtful, and that antisemitism is still a big problem today.
“Knowing what I know now, I would never post something like that and I regret doing it.”
Racial slur (that never occurred):
Jazmine Miley, Hockey Players of Color founder
Along with the photo, there have also been rumblings of another incident, where Connelly allegedly used a racial slur towards an opponent during a game in 2021. However, Connelly adamantly denied those allegations.
Connelly was initially suspended for the accusation but it was ultimately lifted and removed from his record by the California Amateur Hockey Association. After a hearing with the CAHA, it was determined no violation occurred.
Connelly reiterated he’s committed to being the best person he can be on and off the ice. He’s taken several diversity, equity and inclusion training courses and has done over many hours of volunteer community service work — several of which came during the season.
"Trevor was as impressive of a 16-year-old from a maturity standpoint that I've seen in this league," Tri-City head coach Anthony Noreen told The Rink Live.
"I can tell you from every single facet of our organization — billet families, fan interaction, community service, players, staff, ownership — everything. The overwhelming sentiment of Trevor has been positive. Every single community outreach event that our organization was involved in, Trevor was there. He wasn't told that he had to be, but he made it a point to do it. He did every single thing we asked of him and more."
He’s also now involved with Hockey Players of Color, a group that’s geared towards making hockey more inclusive and a better place — something Connelly said he wants to do.
"Oftentimes you have people who don't understand other people's culture and they don't realize how certain things impact them or how having that extra insight and perspective on the world itself can benefit them," said Jazmine Miley, the founder of Hockey Players of Color.
I have zero clue if he is the 2nd best or 30th best player in the draft, but I wouldn't stay away from him because of character.
Remember when Kane wore black face and it was called a racial incident.....
Blackhawks in blackface: Most predictable backlash of 2009
When we tweeted last night about local coverage of the Chicago Blackhawks Halloween Party, we did so...
... or when he beat up a 62 year old cab driver over 20 cents?
When Patrick Kane beat up a 62-year-old cab driver over 20 cents
In August 2009, the hockey world was shocked by the news that star player Patrick Kane had been arrested in Buffalo, NY, along with his cousin James.
Funny how his character isn't called into question.
I don't pretend to know everything about the kid, I'm just saying this stuff appears way overblown and his acts of contrition go well beyond what others have done who were actually more malicious or, you know, actually committed the act for which they were accused.
Heck I hope he IS the 2nd best player in the draft and his punishment is for him to drop all the way to 15, hell 47! LOL!
We call Kane’s character into question all the time. Some Wings fans are ignoring the bad stuff from the past because he produced well but many are still pointing out that he’s king turd.
Holden Caufield
Registered User
Well, maybe Kane is no angel. Doesn’t change anything he accomplished on the ice. And Chicago isn’t ready to give back those Stanley Cup titles.
My point. You don’t need a team full of perfect image Sidney Crosby’s to win.
McCarty wasn’t exactly in bed by 10pm every night with a zero blood alcohol level. Fedorov was accused of being more interested in living a flashy Hollywood life, then focusing on hockey. All those characters blended well and more than worked out !
Sometimes talent just wins out and teams can win with all different types of guys.
Hopefully we don’t narrow our draft pool to only hockey obsessed, goody two shoes, who do two a day workouts 7 days a week.
My point. You don’t need a team full of perfect image Sidney Crosby’s to win.
McCarty wasn’t exactly in bed by 10pm every night with a zero blood alcohol level. Fedorov was accused of being more interested in living a flashy Hollywood life, then focusing on hockey. All those characters blended well and more than worked out !
Sometimes talent just wins out and teams can win with all different types of guys.
Hopefully we don’t narrow our draft pool to only hockey obsessed, goody two shoes, who do two a day workouts 7 days a week.
Our Lady Peace
Registered User
Thing is though, Fedorov, and especially McCarty, had many other Hall of Fame stars to grab the bull by the horns on those dynasty years.
Kane in Chicago had Toews, Keith, Hossa, Sharp, Crawford and Coach Q. His rockstar attitude had some effects but other stars could take turns leading the way during the franchise's dynasty years.
With Detroit, Kane signed and stepped in, he was arguably the 2nd best forward on the team even after that surgery and his 35th birthday. More spotlight on a guy like that when our team sucks compared to the teams Fedorov and McCarty played on.
wingerdinger
Registered User
- Oct 21, 2018
- 1,177
- 1,104
lilidk
Registered User
- Mar 4, 2008
- 9,991
- 3,683
| 1 | 2 | Vancouver | Daniel Sedin | L | MODO Hockey Ornskoldsvik [SEL] | 1306 | 393 | 648 | 1041 | 546 | 2017-18 |
| 7 | 210 | Detroit | Henrik Zetterberg | C | Timra (Sweden) | 1082 | 337 | 623 | 960 | 401 | 2017-18 |
| 7 | 212 | Colorado | Radim Vrbata | R | Hull Olympiques [QMJHL] | 1057 | 284 | 339 | 623 | 294 | 2017-18 |
| 1 | 26 | Ottawa | Martin Havlat | R | Trinec Ocelari HC [Czech] | 790 | 242 | 352 | 594 | 404 | 2015-16 |
| 7 | 191 | Nashville | Martin Erat | R | Zlin Jr. (Czech. Rep) | 881 | 176 | 369 | 545 | 506 | 2014-15 |
| 1 | 5 | NY Islanders | Tim Connolly | C | Erie Otters [OHL] | 697 | 131 | 300 | 431 | 300 | 2011-12 |
| 4 | 115 | Pittsburgh | Ryan Malone | F | Omaha Lancers [USHL] | 647 | 179 | 191 | 370 | 693 | 2014-15 |
| 3 | 91 | Edmonton | Mike Comrie | C | U. of Michigan [CCHA] | 589 | 168 | 197 | 365 | 443 | 2010-11 |
| 3 | 70 | Florida | Niklas Hagman | L | HIFK Helsinki Jr. (Finland) | 770 | 147 | 154 | 301 | 220 | 2011-12 |
| 3 | 94 | Ottawa | Chris Kelly | C | London Knights [OHL] | 845 | 123 | 168 | 291 | 417 | 2017-18 |
Chris 84
Registered User
- Sep 15, 2007
- 1,255
- 100
Kane's character WAS called into question quite often. The difference is, from a purely hockey perspective, that Kane proved he could do it at the top. if you're drafting a player whose maturity and common sense has been called into question, you don't really know if he can hack it at the top.If this kid fell to the Wings in the 2nd, I'd draft him. I've seen him anywhere from top 10 to 27. It is an odd draft, but if this kid has unquestionable top 5 talent, I take him at 15. One scout said he is the 2nd best player in the draft. IF that is true, I take him at 15. My concern is his weight. One report said he was under 160. I'd pass just to keep Jaster from a stroke.
Breaking down the National Enquirer forever tail these kids get from the Internet.
I haven't seen anything about crap in a bag, so I will leave that aside. I will say, I've seen top players in the Nation do some real dumb sh** (hahaha) in the past. It just wasn't the day of the Internet.
Swastika - His teammate made the symbol with books at a library. He took a photo of it and post is on Snapchat. He then thought better of it and took it down, within minutes. However, someone took a screen shot of it and sent it around. Dumb, sure. Malicious, now. Did he pay a price for it? Yes, a very heavy price in the hockey world. He also went on a journey of self education and a better understanding of the topic. How many 16 year olds do you know that would take this mature approach to the issue?
Racial slur - The forever topic about anything uttered at all by any white person. This was before juniors and, after being suspended and going through a trail of BS, was completely exonerated. It is criminal that this hangs over him, but that is the Internet. Even in this area, with complete vindication, he has worked to remove the black cloud.
"He's probably the second-best player after Mack Celebrini in the U.S.," said one scout. "Uber-talented, makes everyone else on the ice better, very smart, fast, good skill, high IQ, good vision. He checks all the boxes. It's going to be one of those deals where you have to kick it up the ladder and your manager is going to have to make a decision. All we can do is vet the kid. He's a top-10 talent."
Swastika:
Although the post was deleted minutes later, the photo was screen-shotted by someone first and has since circulated over the past 17 months.
Make no mistake, Connelly is the first to admit he regrets posting the photo and quickly felt the consequences.
While it’d be easy to say he was just an ignorant 16-year-old kid, Connelly has owned up to it and used it as a way to better himself.
“I wanted to learn from it and educate myself,” he said. “I visited the LA Holocaust Museum and I also read the book, 'Night' (by Holocaust survivor Elie Wiesel). That gave me a much better understanding of why the post and the swastika symbol are so hurtful, and that antisemitism is still a big problem today.
“Knowing what I know now, I would never post something like that and I regret doing it.”
Racial slur (that never occurred):
Jazmine Miley, Hockey Players of Color founder
Along with the photo, there have also been rumblings of another incident, where Connelly allegedly used a racial slur towards an opponent during a game in 2021. However, Connelly adamantly denied those allegations.
Connelly was initially suspended for the accusation but it was ultimately lifted and removed from his record by the California Amateur Hockey Association. After a hearing with the CAHA, it was determined no violation occurred.
Connelly reiterated he’s committed to being the best person he can be on and off the ice. He’s taken several diversity, equity and inclusion training courses and has done over many hours of volunteer community service work — several of which came during the season.
"Trevor was as impressive of a 16-year-old from a maturity standpoint that I've seen in this league," Tri-City head coach Anthony Noreen told The Rink Live.
"I can tell you from every single facet of our organization — billet families, fan interaction, community service, players, staff, ownership — everything. The overwhelming sentiment of Trevor has been positive. Every single community outreach event that our organization was involved in, Trevor was there. He wasn't told that he had to be, but he made it a point to do it. He did every single thing we asked of him and more."
He’s also now involved with Hockey Players of Color, a group that’s geared towards making hockey more inclusive and a better place — something Connelly said he wants to do.
"Oftentimes you have people who don't understand other people's culture and they don't realize how certain things impact them or how having that extra insight and perspective on the world itself can benefit them," said Jazmine Miley, the founder of Hockey Players of Color.
I have zero clue if he is the 2nd best or 30th best player in the draft, but I wouldn't stay away from him because of character.
Remember when Kane wore black face and it was called a racial incident.....
Blackhawks in blackface: Most predictable backlash of 2009
When we tweeted last night about local coverage of the Chicago Blackhawks Halloween Party, we did so...
... or when he beat up a 62 year old cab driver over 20 cents?
When Patrick Kane beat up a 62-year-old cab driver over 20 cents
In August 2009, the hockey world was shocked by the news that star player Patrick Kane had been arrested in Buffalo, NY, along with his cousin James.
Funny how his character isn't called into question.
I don't pretend to know everything about the kid, I'm just saying this stuff appears way overblown and his acts of contrition go well beyond what others have done who were actually more malicious or, you know, actually committed the act for which they were accused.
Heck I hope he IS the 2nd best player in the draft and his punishment is for him to drop all the way to 15, hell 47! LOL!
I'm not saying a trade is off limits, but I must plead ignorance: who is left in calgary that is worth trading for, what would it cost, and does it put us over the top. Maybe the goalie, or is he a FA???, either way he is not the type that puts you over the top and steals games, so why give up assets for him. I'm willing to play the long game and not the dumb game.
Draft a good player and let Larkin become or new Yzerman. By the time we won a cup Stevie was not or best player.
Mangiapane is a decent 2nd line winger who’ll become a UFA 2025. Does Yzerman see Larkin as a key piece to this team regarding the playoffs, or is he willing to take the time via drafting and hoping for success going that route?
Larkin will be 28 when the puck drops this upcoming season.
Believe me, I do understand what you are saying. It is Larkin's prime, but I'm saying that doesn't necessarily nean it's the team's time.
Were getting there, but please don't pull a philly fletcher. They gave up serious assets for risto and made another surprising trade. And missed the playoffs by a lot. Nor should we fall victim to an Ottawa sanguinity, where no one had them in the playoffs, but the hamburgler went nuts. In that coming off season, they couldn't wait to give away assets, a 1st and prospects, for Duchesne. They were out of the playoff by November and Colorado had the 4th OV. And I have nothing against mangiapane, he's a fine player, but decent 2nd? He has scored more the 40 once, and that was 43. What you're suggesting is a trade for a true contender. A great add to the third line, who can step up to the second. We just aren't there yet. I'd rather take my chances. Number 15 could be a 30 to 40 point winger, or it could be boat.
I can understand people wanting to continue the build thru the draft, but unless we're bottom 10 - what exactly can we expect in terms of 'quality' that's available at 15 - especially in what many consider a relatively 'meh' draft year?
I've said this before - we are fast becoming 'Minnesota Mediocrity' (in reference to the Wild and their record since returning to the NHL) where we're not great - not bad - just meh where we may or may not make the playoffs.
So - we draft 'player X' at 15 - then what - 3, or 4 years from now we'll see where he's at OR we package that 1st round pick and Stevie Y works his magic via his iPhone to see whom he can fleece. Now granted - I am not expecting a top pair Dman, nor a legit 1st line forward, but someone who's a roster player from a rival that is capable of being a solid addition in Detroit.
Mangiapane for what it's worth (not great - not bad)...He's just an example of whom might be available in the near future from a rival that may look to move players.
RabidBadger
Mazur detractors will look like dummies!
I've been beating that drum too. He's been rising up the draft boards lately and will likely go in the top 10.
Frk It
Mo Seider Less Problems
- Jul 27, 2010
- 36,314
- 14,810
Instead of people repeating this ad nauseam, why don't you tell us how you are supposed to avoid this in a landscape where being last in the league gets you most likely pick #4.
Honestly I think you are fortunate to end up in mediocrity in this current system. A lot of teams will just stay stuck at the bottom.
By all means it's worthhille contenmplating trade possibilities rather than drafting someone at 15. But not for Mangiapane, coming off 43- and 40-point seasons. Nice little energy player with some skill, but overpaid, undersized, a bit older than Larkin is not going to cut it. And the fundamental question remains: If you're convinced the 15th OA pick can't help a team that didn't make the playoffs and has a huge roster turnover coming over the next 2-3 years, why would anyone else want it?
If you're thinking of a trade, think big. Give up something of value that you'd prefer not to give up for someone who could make a difference in three years plus. For example, I want nothing to do with Zegras,, but maybe 15th OA plus Edvinsson would get Anaheim's attention. Otherwise, there is no point in doing anything except trying to find the useful or better winger who will be available at 15. The 8th through 12th drafted forwards this year are not all going to bust. Or trade up a little for one that might not be available at 15 (like Helenius) or draft yet another RD or pure C like Hage. There are ways to get value out of this Draft that make far more sense than acquiring Mangiapane or any similarly proven mediocre middle six winger unlikely to be of any help when it matters in 3-4 years.
If you're thinking of a trade, think big. Give up something of value that you'd prefer not to give up for someone who could make a difference in three years plus. For example, I want nothing to do with Zegras,, but maybe 15th OA plus Edvinsson would get Anaheim's attention. Otherwise, there is no point in doing anything except trying to find the useful or better winger who will be available at 15. The 8th through 12th drafted forwards this year are not all going to bust. Or trade up a little for one that might not be available at 15 (like Helenius) or draft yet another RD or pure C like Hage. There are ways to get value out of this Draft that make far more sense than acquiring Mangiapane or any similarly proven mediocre middle six winger unlikely to be of any help when it matters in 3-4 years.
norrisnick
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You mean Zegras? You're talking about Zegras, right?
You want to use our 1st to acquire Mangiapane on an expiring contract? This is the very issue with saying we need to trade our 1st for immediate help come hell or high water. You end up talking yourself into really bad decisions by chasing that white whale.
I am happy to move our first for immediate help, but it needs to be a player that better fits the horizon and timeline of this team. We shouldn't be forcing it.
You conveniently left out the part where I said now might be the time when you trade the #15 pick by itself or part of a package in order to land a quality current roster player on a rival team…
People tend to take things far too literally and fail to recognize an example of what my point of view is…If you noticed I added …
“That 1st rounder could be used as part of a package for him, or any other roster player on a rival club.”
norrisnick
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Using a really poor example runs the risk of distracting people from what your point is.
