2023-2024 EPL Season

[hatterson]

Asking for a friend, but would it be so bad if Everton collapsed?

(bad joke obviously).

How 777 even got past some initial discussions is beyond me. the people checking owners don't really care about much.

It's a little bit odd given that the only question the PL seems to care about is "do you have the money?" and in this case it really seems like they don't.

 

[Wee Baby Seamus]

Finalists for the fake awards have dropped (the PFA ones are the real ones, IMO).

POTY:

Foden
Haaland
Isak
Odegaard
Palmer
Rice
Van Dijk
Watkins

YPOTY:

Foden
Haaland
Isak
Mainoo
Palmer
Saka
Saliba
Udogie

It's worth a note that, whereas the PFA YPOTY reduced its age cap from 23 to 21 a few years ago (after a season in which a 24 year old Raheem Sterling won it and every single football fan was like 'uh, this seems strange'), the fake YPOTY still has a u23 cap. Hopefully they abide by the spirit of the award and recognize that giving it to any of the guys here who have been playing top football since 2019 would be silly.

Picks are easy for me. Watkins for POTY, Palmer for YPOTY.

 

[bluesfan94]

Rodri not getting nominated is silly.

 

[luiginb]

Rodri not getting nominated is silly.

No Saka either

 

[Wee Baby Seamus]

Rodri not getting nominated is silly.

Agree, but what do you expect from a fake award

No Saka either

This is less silly, although I'd take Saka over multiple people on the shortlist

 

[Brunkmeister]

Rodri not getting nominated is silly.

They really had to squeeze one from Liverpool in there and they choose VVD? He's been good, but he's clearly behind both Saliba and Gabriel and i don't think any of those two should be in there aswell. If they were to pick someone from Liverpool i think it should probably have been MacAllister?

Rodri were probably up against Rice and Declan has better numbers this season.

POTY will ofc go to a player on the winning team.

 

[bluesfan94]

No Saka either

I can at least understand that. His numbers don't pop off the page at you (although they are better than Phil Foden's). Understanding his greatness requires watching him, which I don't expect from the people that put together these awards. Which I guess the same could be said about Rodri.

Plus, there are already two other Arsenal players. Although, again, the same could be said about Rodri.

 

[JeffreyLFC]

They really had to squeeze one from Liverpool in there and they choose VVD? He's been good, but he's clearly behind both Saliba and Gabriel and i don't think any of those two should be in there aswell. If they were to pick someone from Liverpool i think it should probably have been MacAllister?

VVD is way more important to LFC than Mac Allister, I do not get this resistance Arsenal fans seem to have in giving VVD his praise. He has been leading a bunch of kids because of all the injuries (Quansah, Bradley) for the biggest part of the year and Gabriel + Saliba are immense as unit and Arsenal collectively are way more discipline defensively than LFC. Without VVD, LFC would be closer to the middle of the table than near the top. It just seem very weird at least to me that Arsenal cannot appreciate the talent and importance of him.

Mac Allister has probably be more consistent player this year, he is also versatile and one of the signing of the season but his impact is not as significant as VVD.

 

[Wee Baby Seamus]

I can at least understand that. His numbers don't pop off the page at you (although they are better than Phil Foden's). Understanding his greatness requires watching him, which I don't expect from the people that put together these awards. Which I guess the same could be said about Rodri.

Plus, there are already two other Arsenal players. Although, again, the same could be said about Rodri.

yeah i feel like "his numbers don't pop off the page and people running awards don't watch games" is in pretty direct contradiction with Foden being nominated (and likely winning, and Foden having won this YPOTY award in both 2021 and 2022), given that Foden is kinda the epitome of "stats don't tell the whole story" when his direct goal contribution stats have been generally lower than Saka's.

 

[bluesfan94]

yeah i feel like "his numbers don't pop off the page and people running awards don't watch games" is in pretty direct contradiction with Foden being nominated (and likely winning, and Foden having won this YPOTY award in both 2021 and 2022), given that Foden is kinda the epitome of "stats don't tell the whole story" when his direct goal contribution stats have been generally lower than Saka's.

Yes, but I think his hype is a lot higher. The story around the two seasons is that Foden is putting Man City on his back and is having this incredible season while Saka is having a good/great season, but nothing incredible. I think there are a number of reasons for that, but I think that it's generally the case.

 

[Wee Baby Seamus]

Yes, but I think his hype is a lot higher. The story around the two seasons is that Foden is putting Man City on his back and is having this incredible season while Saka is having a good/great season, but nothing incredible. I think there are a number of reasons for that, but I think that it's generally the case.

Saka has been hurt by Odegaard being spectacular down the stretch, even as Saka has been better for most of the season.

It's all moot though because Rice is pretty unambiguously Arsenal's MVP.

 

[luiginb]

Saka is also decent defensively (as he started his career at fullback) which for me makes him more valuable than some wingers with better numbers. Same reason I love mcneil at Everton.

 

[Savant]

They really had to squeeze one from Liverpool in there and they choose VVD? He's been good, but he's clearly behind both Saliba and Gabriel and i don't think any of those two should be in there aswell. If they were to pick someone from Liverpool i think it should probably have been MacAllister?

Rodri were probably up against Rice and Declan has better numbers this season.

POTY will ofc go to a player on the winning team.

I don’t agree, but he none of those players are winning it if it makes you feel better

Saka has been hurt by Odegaard being spectacular down the stretch, even as Saka has been better for most of the season.

It's all moot though because Rice is pretty unambiguously Arsenal's MVP.

You know I can’t help but wonder if there is a (bad) Saka vs Palmer conversation for the Euros. I’m starting Saka either way, (obviously so you can put Palmer on for PKs later ) but you know there are going to be some BAD conversations regarding some of the team selection, that are going to especially be had for the wrong reasons

 

[Wee Baby Seamus]

I don’t agree, but he none of those players are winning it if it makes you feel better


You know I can’t help but wonder if there is a (bad) Saka vs Palmer conversation for the Euros. I’m starting Saka either way, (obviously so you can put Palmer on for PKs later ) but you know there are going to be some BAD conversations regarding some of the team selection, that are going to especially be had for the wrong reasons

IMO, if you're figuring out 2 of 3 of Foden, Saka, Palmer to start (despite some people's wishes, England will be a sieve if all three start because you don't want Bellingham pushed deeper next to Rice), it has to be Foden and Saka. Saka is a very different player stylistically to the other two, and Foden/Palmer (although they have differences) are of broadly similar play profiles - Foden is currently better than Palmer.

what I think will occur is Southgate starts Saka and Foden in Game 1 against Serbia, starts Palmer against Denmark, and then figures out from there.

 

[Savant]

IMO, if you're figuring out 2 of 3 of Foden, Saka, Palmer to start (despite some people's wishes, England will be a sieve if all three start because you don't want Bellingham pushed deeper next to Rice), it has to be Foden and Saka. Saka is a very different player stylistically to the other two, and Foden/Palmer (although they have differences) are of broadly similar play profiles - Foden is currently better than Palmer.

what I think will occur is Southgate starts Saka and Foden in Game 1 against Serbia, starts Palmer against Denmark, and then figures out from there.

I don’t think there is any reason not to play Bellingham at 10. It would be ridiculous to play him in a different position

 

[Wee Baby Seamus]

I don’t think there is any reason not to play Bellingham at 10. It would be ridiculous to play him in a different position

exactly.

against serbia england will look like this:

foden - kane - saka
bellingham
rice - gallagher
[x] - stones - maguire - walker
pickford

they have a serious left back problem right now. Shaw hasn't played since February, Chilwell has played 10 minutes since the last international break, Trippier hasn't played since March. is Rico Lewis ready? does he call up Tyrick Mitchell for the first time? is the hope that Colwill will get enough minutes in the next three matches to be ready to go?

 

[Savant]

exactly.

against serbia england will look like this:

foden - kane - saka
bellingham
rice - gallagher
[x] - stones - maguire - walker
pickford

they have a serious left back problem right now. Shaw hasn't played since February, Chilwell has played 10 minutes since the last international break, Trippier hasn't played since March. is Rico Lewis ready? does he call up Tyrick Mitchell for the first time? is the hope that Colwill will get enough minutes in the next three matches to be ready to go?

Yeah we are basically in the same page here

 

[bluesfan94]

exactly.

against serbia england will look like this:

foden - kane - saka
bellingham
rice - gallagher
[x] - stones - maguire - walker
pickford

they have a serious left back problem right now. Shaw hasn't played since February, Chilwell has played 10 minutes since the last international break, Trippier hasn't played since March. is Rico Lewis ready? does he call up Tyrick Mitchell for the first time? is the hope that Colwill will get enough minutes in the next three matches to be ready to go?

Big assumption that it won't be Hendo next to Rice

 

[Savant]

Big assumption that it won't be Hendo next to Rice

I’m (alphabetically)taking Alexander-Arnold, Gallagher, Mainoo, Rice and Wharton for the double pivot. Sorry not sorry.

My views do not reflect the views of Gareth Southgate

 

[S E P H]

Rice has definitely been POYT and that is not because I am biased.

On the topic of Saka, I would say if there is one thing that might prevent Arsenal from taking the next step to becoming a Real Madrid or prime Liverpool, I think it is our wingers. Saka is amazing, but at this point, he's a bit of a one-trick pony where he's dangerous when he cuts inside and slices the ball. I want to see him score in more different ways akin to Salah (but he's not as fast as Moh which is how he gets the majority of his goals). Martinelli also has some problems as well, he has the speed, work ethic, and trickery you want from a top-calibre winger, but his finishing skills are quite behind a lot of his other attributes. There's a chance he might not ever be a good finisher, but he has to improve to an average level if we want to take the next step.

 

[bluesfan94]

Rice has definitely been POYT and that is not because I am biased.

On the topic of Saka, I would say if there is one thing that might prevent Arsenal from taking the next step to becoming a Real Madrid or prime Liverpool, I think it is our wingers. Saka is amazing, but at this point, he's a bit of a one-trick pony where he's dangerous when he cuts inside and slices the ball. I want to see him score in more different ways akin to Salah (but he's not as fast as Moh which is how he gets the majority of his goals). Martinelli also has some problems as well, he has the speed, work ethic, and trickery you want from a top-calibre winger, but his finishing skills are quite behind a lot of his other attributes. There's a chance he might not ever be a good finisher, but he has to improve to an average level if we want to take the next step.

Saka is really good at driving to the byline and cutting the ball back or scoring near post top shelf with his right foot. Martinelli is under his xG by 0.5 this year after exceeding his xG by 4.7 goals last year.

Arsenal is 6 goals away from the highest GF tally Liverpool has ever had under Klopp. I don't think goal scoring is the problem.

 

[Evilo]

 

[Wee Baby Seamus]

yea, martinelli's issue isn't his finishing. hot finishing last year made people think he was a lot better than he is!

martinelli's issue is that his IQ isn't great, imo. if you want trossard to keep being a supersub, you need an upgrade over martinelli on the left.

this is insanely f***ing funny

 

[bluesfan94]

yea, martinelli's issue isn't his finishing. hot finishing last year made people think he was a lot better than he is!

martinelli's issue is that his IQ isn't great, imo. if you want trossard to keep being a supersub, you need an upgrade over martinelli on the left.

Alternatively, it's one of those things that could improve as he matures. Not trying to be combative, just mentioning that it's a possibility that could alleviate the problem.

 

[Wee Baby Seamus]

Alternatively, it's one of those things that could improve as he matures.

players don't keep developing past the age of 22