Speculation: 2017-18 Roster Discussion - Part 7

[VoluntaryDom]

Btw I think we waive Dotchin now. This is because a friend of mine earlier today said he had an inside tip that Dotchin may be traded. Maybe not a trade, maybe it's waivers.

 

[Sky04]

Btw I think we waive Dotchin now. This is because a friend of mine earlier today said he had an inside tip that Dotchin may be traded. Maybe not a trade, maybe it's waivers.

Any bozo off the street could've told you this.

 

[The Gongshow]

So do we go

Hedman - Stralman
McDonagh - Girardi

or

Hedman - Girardi
McDonigh - Stralman

Serg - Coburn
being the 3rd pair

 

[VoluntaryDom]

I see it being this:

Hedman-Stralman
McDonagh-Sergachev

 

[AndreRoy]

Maybe I’m just dreaming here because I think we’ve criminally botched his development but if we keep Koekkoek and move Serg to the right that would allow us to have KK replace Coburn on our third pairing next season.

Hedman-Stralman
McDonagh-Sergachev
Koekkoek-Girardi

Looks pretty good to me.

 

[BowDownToVasilevskiy]

Did the Yzerman press conference happen already?

 

[The Gongshow]

My guess for playoff forward lines are

Gourde-Stamkos-Kucherov
Palat-Point-Johnson
Killorn-Miller-Peca
Callahan-Paq-Kunitz

 

[AndreRoy]

This is almost certainly the end of Dotchin in Tampa. Here’s why:

Barring an unforeseen development it is likely that Hedman, McDonagh, Stralman, Girardi, and Sergachev are all coming back next season. That leaves Coburn, Dotchin, and Koekkoek fighting for two roster spots (assuming we aren’t going to carry eight defensemen again.) There’s a decent chance at least one of those three is traded at the draft, but let’s assume for the moment that all three return to battle for those final two spots.

Of the five defensemen who are near locks to return three are left handed and two are right handed; that plus the fact that Dotchin is our only RD signed beyond next season would seem to argue for him to be kept around. But where we would play him? Dotchin clearly isn’t good enough for top four duties which leaves him at best on the bottom pairing. But putting McDonagh there with him would be a waste and pairing Sergachev with him would be dicey at best. What makes far more sense and better balances our pairings would be to move either McDonagh or Sergachev to the right, opening a hole on the left side of our defense and forcing Dotchin out of the lineup.

That in turn means that either Koekkoek or Coburn would end up starting on the left (most likely on the bottom pairing) with the loser fighting Dotchin for the last roster spot. But while McDonagh, Sergachev, and Coburn can all play the right side none of our righties to my knowledge can play the left. We are also stronger on the right side than the left below the NHL level. So our seventh defenseman should ideally be a lefty in case of injury (or even simply to allow us to rest players from time to time.)

To me that makes Dotchin the odd man out. Even if we traded both Coburn and Koekkoek there still wouldn’t be a spot for Dotchin in the starting lineup because there’s not a pairing that makes sense to put him on, and not only do we ideally want a lefty at 7D but it’d be pointless to keep him there as he’s not going to get any better with little to no playing time.

It’s also possible we bring in another defensemen either internally or via trade. If that defenseman plays the right side then once again Dotchin is forced out of the lineup; if he plays the left then he still forces Dotchin out because either McDonagh or Sergachev would move to the right. (In either of these scenarios Koekkoek/Coburn would also be forced out of the lineup.)

So in short while there are scenarios where Koekkoek and/or Coburn might remain with us next season, whether as a starter or in a backup role, barring some unforeseen circumstance I really don’t see any place for Dotchin.

 

[RussianGuyovich]

This is almost certainly the end of Dotchin in Tampa. Here’s why:

Barring an unforeseen development it is likely that Hedman, McDonagh, Stralman, Girardi, and Sergachev are all coming back next season. That leaves Coburn, Dotchin, and Koekkoek fighting for two roster spots (assuming we aren’t going to carry eight defensemen again.) There’s a decent chance at least one of those three is traded at the draft, but let’s assume for the moment that all three return to battle for those final two spots.

Of the five defensemen who are near locks to return three are left handed and two are right handed; that plus the fact that Dotchin is our only RD signed beyond next season would seem to argue for him to be kept around. But where we would play him? Dotchin clearly isn’t good enough for top four duties which leaves him at best on the bottom pairing. But putting McDonagh there with him would be a waste and pairing Sergachev with him would be dicey at best. What makes far more sense and better balances our pairings would be to move either McDonagh or Sergachev to the right, opening a hole on the left side of our defense and forcing Dotchin out of the lineup.

That in turn means that either Koekkoek or Coburn would end up starting on the left (most likely on the bottom pairing) with the loser fighting Dotchin for the last roster spot. But while McDonagh, Sergachev, and Coburn can all play the right side none of our righties to my knowledge can play the left. We are also stronger on the right side than the left below the NHL level. So our seventh defenseman should ideally be a lefty in case of injury (or even simply to allow us to rest players from time to time.)

To me that makes Dotchin the odd man out. Even if we traded both Coburn and Koekkoek there still wouldn’t be a spot for Dotchin in the starting lineup because there’s not a pairing that makes sense to put him on, and not only do we ideally want a lefty at 7D but it’d be pointless to keep him there as he’s not going to get any better with little to no playing time.

It’s also possible we bring in another defensemen either internally or via trade. If that defenseman plays the right side then once again Dotchin is forced out of the lineup; if he plays the left then he still forces Dotchin out because either McDonagh or Sergachev would move to the right. (In either of these scenarios Koekkoek/Coburn would also be forced out of the lineup.)

So in short while there are scenarios where Koekkoek and/or Coburn might remain with us next season, whether as a starter or in a backup role, barring some unforeseen circumstance I really don’t see any place for Dotchin.

from your keyboard to god's ears, my friend

 

[Stormbreaker]

 

[Flat Ronnie]

So do we go

Hedman - Stralman
McDonagh - Girardi

or

Hedman - Girardi
McDonigh - Stralman

Serg - Coburn
being the 3rd pair

Hedman - Stralman
McD - Girardi
Serge - Coburn

 

[HoseEmDown]

My guess for playoff forward lines are

Gourde-Stamkos-Kucherov
Palat-Point-Johnson
Killorn-Miller-Peca
Callahan-Paq-Kunitz

I highly doubt a player who isn't with us during the home stretch and is playing in the AHL is going to come in and be thrust into the top 9. Kunitz is a playoff beast, I would move him into the top 9 and we are most likely going 11/7 the rest of the year.

 

[HoseEmDown]

This is almost certainly the end of Dotchin in Tampa. Here’s why:

Barring an unforeseen development it is likely that Hedman, McDonagh, Stralman, Girardi, and Sergachev are all coming back next season. That leaves Coburn, Dotchin, and Koekkoek fighting for two roster spots (assuming we aren’t going to carry eight defensemen again.) There’s a decent chance at least one of those three is traded at the draft, but let’s assume for the moment that all three return to battle for those final two spots.

Of the five defensemen who are near locks to return three are left handed and two are right handed; that plus the fact that Dotchin is our only RD signed beyond next season would seem to argue for him to be kept around. But where we would play him? Dotchin clearly isn’t good enough for top four duties which leaves him at best on the bottom pairing. But putting McDonagh there with him would be a waste and pairing Sergachev with him would be dicey at best. What makes far more sense and better balances our pairings would be to move either McDonagh or Sergachev to the right, opening a hole on the left side of our defense and forcing Dotchin out of the lineup.

That in turn means that either Koekkoek or Coburn would end up starting on the left (most likely on the bottom pairing) with the loser fighting Dotchin for the last roster spot. But while McDonagh, Sergachev, and Coburn can all play the right side none of our righties to my knowledge can play the left. We are also stronger on the right side than the left below the NHL level. So our seventh defenseman should ideally be a lefty in case of injury (or even simply to allow us to rest players from time to time.)

To me that makes Dotchin the odd man out. Even if we traded both Coburn and Koekkoek there still wouldn’t be a spot for Dotchin in the starting lineup because there’s not a pairing that makes sense to put him on, and not only do we ideally want a lefty at 7D but it’d be pointless to keep him there as he’s not going to get any better with little to no playing time.

It’s also possible we bring in another defensemen either internally or via trade. If that defenseman plays the right side then once again Dotchin is forced out of the lineup; if he plays the left then he still forces Dotchin out because either McDonagh or Sergachev would move to the right. (In either of these scenarios Koekkoek/Coburn would also be forced out of the lineup.)

So in short while there are scenarios where Koekkoek and/or Coburn might remain with us next season, whether as a starter or in a backup role, barring some unforeseen circumstance I really don’t see any place for Dotchin.

Why can't we keep all 8 defenders and the only one we lose is Sustr? Dotchin sucks but most 8th Defenseman do so no different than any other team. Just keep him around for injuries, play him once in awhile to see if he can be competent and either help or show enough that someone trades for him. Cernak could use more time in the minors and Thomas isn't an upgrade, his skating is but not much more.

On the left I'd like to trade Coburn. He's a 3.7mil luxury that we aren't bringing back and we can use that money to add a forward. We don't have a forward besides Peca and Erne who need to be up next year. Kunitz most likely leaves and Conacher hopefully is back in Syracuse, he's not good enough to be a fulltime NHLer. Koekkoek can do just as good for less. The only issue is Coburn is a strong vet which Yzerman likes so we wouldn't need to trade for a rental as we'd be set on defense.

 

[AndreRoy]

Why can't we keep all 8 defenders and the only one we lose is Sustr? Dotchin sucks but most 8th Defenseman do so no different than any other team. Just keep him around for injuries, play him once in awhile to see if he can be competent and either help or show enough that someone trades for him. Cernak could use more time in the minors and Thomas isn't an upgrade, his skating is but not much more.

On the left I'd like to trade Coburn. He's a 3.7mil luxury that we aren't bringing back and we can use that money to add a forward. We don't have a forward besides Peca and Erne who need to be up next year. Kunitz most likely leaves and Conacher hopefully is back in Syracuse, he's not good enough to be a fulltime NHLer. Koekkoek can do just as good for less. The only issue is Coburn is a strong vet which Yzerman likes so we wouldn't need to trade for a rental as we'd be set on defense.

That’s certainly an option. Either way though I don’t see Dotchin having a regular spot in the lineup; I’m hoping that Koekkoek will, especially if we trade Coburn so Cooper can’t play him in front of KK.

 

[HoseEmDown]

With the trade of Howden it opens up a contract for Sommpi. With Hajek gone Sosunov most likely goes to the AHL instead of playing an overage year in junior.

 

[These Are The Days]

Yeah, McDonagh is definitely gonna play with Girardi again... Miller on the other hand is a tad bit more difficult to pencil in. I'm apprehensive as hell about him. 40 games and 1 playoff goal is NO bueno man

 

[dechire]

Yeah, McDonagh is definitely gonna play with Girardi again... Miller on the other hand is a tad bit more difficult to pencil in. I'm apprehensive as hell about him. 40 games and 1 playoff goal is NO bueno man

I don't really mind if Miller hasn't scored a lot in the playoffs with the Rangers when all it takes is one good series with the Bolts to completely change that narrative. And tbh I can't take fans complaining about a just traded player's playoff scoring very seriously since Bruins fans still try to use it to justify trading Seguin.

 

[RussianGuyovich]

we tend to rotate our defenseman quite often, so while it's true that McD will probably play with G, it won't be exclusively, and if it doesnt work, it wont be for long.

 

[flamesftw]

Hedman-Stralman
Mcdonagh-Girardi
Sergachev-Coburn

 

[Sky04]

Hedman - Stralman
McD - Girardi
Serge - Coburn

Girardi with McDonagh again? You want to hamper him like they did in New York? NYR fans exaggerated some things on Girardi but these 2 were not a great fit and he did hold McDonagh back during their time together. This is where I hope Dotchin can find his game because he has value playing next to Hedman where Sustr and KK can't, Dotchin is the most stable of the 3 when he's on his game. Also gives us an elite and mobile shutdown pairing in McDonagh-Stralman, Girardi stays on the 3rd pairing where he's most suited and babysits Sergachev. Coburn has lost a step this season, shouldn't be about the 3rd pairing either.

If Dotchin gets his head on, our defense is at it's best:

Hedman-Dotchin
McDonagh-Stralman
Sergachev-Girardi/Coburn

I wonder if they start trying Sergachev on the right at any time.

 

[Hinterland]

Girardi with McDonagh again? You want to hamper him like they did in New York? NYR fans exaggerated some things on Girardi but these 2 were not a great fit and he did hold McDonagh back during their time together. This is where I hope Dotchin can find his game because he has value playing next to Hedman where Sustr and KK can't, Dotchin is the most stable of the 3 when he's on his game. Also gives us an elite and mobile shutdown pairing in McDonagh-Stralman, Girardi stays on the 3rd pairing where he's most suited and babysits Sergachev. Coburn has lost a step this season, shouldn't be about the 3rd pairing either.

If Dotchin gets his head on, our defense is at it's best:

Hedman-Dotchin
McDonagh-Stralman
Sergachev-Girardi/Coburn

I wonder if they start trying Sergachev on the right at any time.

This is nonsense. I've read the same rumors here when Tampa signed Girardi but it's honestly all bs. Told you back then and nothing has changed since. Girardi was always a fine defenseman...the only problem being his health. He basically played a full season injured and was barely able to skate. Yet still he was forced to play top pairing minutes alongside McDonagh because the Rangers didn't have anybody capable of stepping in. Wasn't for a lack of trying...they tried to shut Girardi down multiple times but always had to turn back to him.

Girardi and McDonagh have been an elite duo for years and everybody telling you anything else is just flat out lying. As long as Girardi doesn't have to play 25mins per game they'll be just fine. This will be much easier for the duo anyway...they were the only top4 defenders in New York but in Tampa they're only the 2nd pairing.

I fear that it's gonna be Dotchin they'll chase out of town and I feel like it has to do with the off ice trouble he caused. Sad story if he's the odd man out because he's clearly better than Sustr. Also adds a physical element other defenders (except McDonagh) don't have.

 

[Stammertime91]

Wait, what's the off ice trouble with Dotchin?

 

[Sky04]

Wait, what's the off ice trouble with Dotchin?

Yeah news to me....

 

[Sky04]

This is nonsense. I've read the same rumors here when Tampa signed Girardi but it's honestly all bs. Told you back then and nothing has changed since. Girardi was always a fine defenseman...the only problem being his health. He basically played a full season injured and was barely able to skate. Yet still he was forced to play top pairing minutes alongside McDonagh because the Rangers didn't have anybody capable of stepping in. Wasn't for a lack of trying...they tried to shut Girardi down multiple times but always had to turn back to him.

Girardi and McDonagh have been an elite duo for years and everybody telling you anything else is just flat out lying. As long as Girardi doesn't have to play 25mins per game they'll be just fine. This will be much easier for the duo anyway...they were the only top4 defenders in New York but in Tampa they're only the 2nd pairing.

I fear that it's gonna be Dotchin they'll chase out of town and I feel like it has to do with the off ice trouble he caused. Sad story if he's the odd man out because he's clearly better than Sustr. Also adds a physical element other defenders (except McDonagh) don't have.

There is literally pages of Ranger analytics on your board that suggested otherwise, either a strong vendetta with selective numbers or there's some truth to it, mostly coming from the last 2 years of his tenure, but then again McDonagh apparently isn't the same player he was 3-4 years ago either.

Girardi started out well this season but the last month or two he's been invisible, not bad just almost unnoticeable which I guess can be a good thing as a defenseman, as we've singled out Coburn and Dotchin having a rough stretch.

 

[Stormbreaker]