Pre-Game Talk: 2016 NHL Draft

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Icebreakers

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Prospects from 6-10 is basically like 2014. Could really take anyone unlike last year Provorov and Weresnki the clear ones to take after 6. Theres no clearcut player. Im intrigued by Mcleod though , ranked 2nd by McKeens and 5th by ISS (overall). Hopefully its not like Crouse last year where they ranked him 4th overall ahead of Strome at the beginning of the season.

Basically after 5th pick you can make a case for like 8 different players to take. at 6th overall.
 

BerSTUzzi

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I think it's still important to keep perspective on things with the draft. This pick, wherever it ends up being...it's not going to be some kind of "cure all" for our rebuild. It's not going to be that one final piece to cap things off. It's just one of what needs to be many many pieces that we still don't have.

Even if we do manage to nab ourselves a stud defensive prospect for example...in all likelihood, it's going to be at least 3-5 years before we start to see real NHL dividends from the pick. There are always a few defencemen, mostly from the very top of the draft who manage to make the jump a bit sooner...but defence is a bit like goaltending, in that there's typically a lot of time investment before the picks start to really pay off. You need to draft defencemen well before you need defencemen (unfortuantely we're already in a big hole with that, which is where desperation mistakes tend to happen). Even good quality blue-chip defence prospects often take 3-5 years before they manage to gain a real NHL foothold.

All the more reason to try to get some more irons in the fire in terms of defence prospects developing sooner, rather than later. But it's not going to be something that immediately fixes our NHL team's defensive depth issues. There's a great likelihood that a defenceman picked now, isn't going to pay any NHL dividends until the Sedins are done and gone.

That's the eventuality that you're really drafting on "need" for. In which case, we need an awful lot of things still, not just defencemen. Can't keep ignoring defence and/or not getting much out of the position in the pipeline as has happened for a lot of years now, but at the same time...you really don't want to start passing up forwards where we still look to have a lot of "rebuilding" to do as well. Realistically...it looks as though we potentially still have a "need" of various degrees for the future at every single position.



So much right with this post. Another "key" for us is starting to hit more than "once" a draft or having all your hopes of a successful draft on 1 or 2 players. The worst thing we've got a history of (recent as well) is drafting the Clark, Rai, Hannay , Anthony, Mallett, Myron, Beattie, Stewart..... types that aren't even highly successful Junior/College players and going for the miracle. Start going for the miracle types that are successful at Junior/College/Europe that have produced at a high level, but have something they have to break through in their game to make it at a pro level ( Spencer Watson, Nick Ebert, Connor Garland.....).
 
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Verviticus

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guys, if defensive prospects actually had a premium, they would get drafted even more often/higher. you're looking at [what we dont have] and just assuming that everyone doesnt have it and therefore its not available. if you want a good defensive prospect, draft the best asset that you can and move it for a defenceman when you want them
 

WTG

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My boy Bean's got a pretty insane statline

12 goals 17 assists 29 points in 31 games


Too bad we need RHD, haven't watched Fabbro but he doesn't seem like a bad pick.
 

Bleach Clean

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I don't think I ever said we can expect to be able to trade for these top dman prospects for cheap.

But I rather let other teams do the gamble. Again the point is forwards are more projectable at 18 than defenseman.


Agreed. If this team gets the 6th or 7th pick, and the top5 is off the board, I'd lean towards picking Dubois/McLeod... Even though Sergachev/Fabbro are justified picks at that position too. I just like the forwards a shade more.


Yeah, I would only take a d-man if it's not a reach, otherwise I would try to trade back a few spots to get an extra pick. I wouldn't take a guy who would likely go around 14th overall with the 7th overall pick. But I still strongly believe we need to take a d-man. We keep on delaying taking d-men, and it (our franchise's defensive depth) continues to get worse.


It's also not written in stone that another d-man isn't going to be ranked in that 6-10 spot. Guys like Fabbro, Juolevi, and Sergachyov could easily rise in the next 6 months. You could easily argue that one (or more) of those guys belong in one of those spots right now.


With the way this draft is shaping up, it looks like Dubois, McLeod and Nylander will lock down spots 6-7-8 (any order). After that, Sergachev seems to be the best talent available --> who also happens to be a Dman. Beyond this, it seems to be more wide open. So if the Canucks pick 10th or later, then 'BPA' is a lot more fluid.

I like Fabbro and McAvoy. Both Dmen that match a long term franchise need as well. However, if Bellows/Jones continue to do well and Brown/Jost continue to produce like they have, it becomes a much tougher decision. Benson is even starting to pick it up... Most BPA lists (not mocks) have about 3 Dmen picked in the top15. The odds just don't favour taking a Dman in the top half IMO. The back half includes about 4-5 dmen though...

Last year, I was impressed with Benning's ability to forgo a Dmen to take what he felt was the best player. It showed that he won't draft for positional need. Hope that continues.
 

Icebreakers

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Agreed. If this team gets the 6th or 7th pick, and the top5 is off the board, I'd lean towards picking Dubois/McLeod... Even though Sergachev/Fabbro are justified picks at that position too. I just like the forwards a shade more.





With the way this draft is shaping up, it looks like Dubois, McLeod and Nylander will lock down spots 6-7-8 (any order). After that, Sergachev seems to be the best talent available --> who also happens to be a Dman. Beyond this, it seems to be more wide open. So if the Canucks pick 10th or later, then 'BPA' is a lot more fluid.

I like Fabbro and McAvoy. Both Dmen that match a long term franchise need as well. However, if Bellows/Jones continue to do well and Brown/Jost continue to produce like they have, it becomes a much tougher decision. Benson is even starting to pick it up... Most BPA lists (not mocks) have about 3 Dmen picked in the top15. The odds just don't favour taking a Dman in the top half IMO. The back half includes about 4-5 dmen though...

Last year, I was impressed with Benning's ability to forgo a Dmen to take what he felt was the best player. It showed that he won't draft for positional need. Hope that continues.

You are forgetting Juolevi who most people have over the Ruissian + Fabbro.

Nylander is the Canucks best pick after 5 if things go the way they are currently going imo, need the most skilled player.
 

Catamarca Livin

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You are forgetting Juolevi who most people have over the Ruissian + Fabbro.

Nylander is the Canucks best pick after 5 if things go the way they are currently going imo, need the most skilled player.

what is most skilled? Most productive or guy with most tangible skills? The best stickhandler? It is never that easy there is no sign this guy is the next guy with the most skill.
 

thefeebster

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You are forgetting Juolevi who most people have over the Ruissian + Fabbro.

Nylander is the Canucks best pick after 5 if things go the way they are currently going imo, need the most skilled player.
Its actually quite mixed 50-50 for the major publications who is above whom RE: Juolevi and Sergachyov. Of that trio, none have pulled away ranking wise yet.
 

biturbo19

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Its actually quite mixed 50-50 for the major publications who is above whom RE: Juolevi and Sergachyov. Of that trio, none have pulled away ranking wise yet.

Yeah. Certainly seems to be pretty much a 3-way split with opinions on those guys. Wouldn't be surprised to see that split continue right up to the draft either.
 

Bleach Clean

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You are forgetting Juolevi who most people have over the Ruissian + Fabbro.

Nylander is the Canucks best pick after 5 if things go the way they are currently going imo, need the most skilled player.


I didn't forget Juolevi, just don't think he warranted being ranked above Sergachev/Fabbro. But sure, you can include him in that grouping. Which means, there are 4 Dmen usually ranked amongst the top15 players. Still not good odds for picking a Dman.

I still favour Dubois/McLeod over Nylander for the 6th spot. Dubois is producing at a great clip (1.42 P/G), just slightly under Nylander's 1.51 P/G rate. McLeod also is above PPG with 1.26 P/G. Tough to choose, but I like everything else that Dubois and McLeod bring to the table.


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Question to those who have seen McLeod: What do you think about this shot? I like it better than Dubois's shot, but then Dubois has scored more this year. Makes me question what I'm seeing as far as that goes.
 

Icebreakers

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what is most skilled? Most productive or guy with most tangible skills? The best stickhandler? It is never that easy there is no sign this guy is the next guy with the most skill.

Nylander is all skill, theres no other part of his game thats worth talking about.
 

Icebreakers

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I didn't forget Juolevi, just don't think he warranted being ranked above Sergachev/Fabbro. But sure, you can include him in that grouping. Which means, there are 4 Dmen usually ranked amongst the top15 players. Still not good odds for picking a Dman.

I still favour Dubois/McLeod over Nylander for the 6th spot. Dubois is producing at a great clip (1.42 P/G), just slightly under Nylander's 1.51 P/G rate. McLeod also is above PPG with 1.26 P/G. Tough to choose, but I like everything else that Dubois and McLeod bring to the table.


----------------


Question to those who have seen McLeod: What do you think about this shot? I like it better than Dubois's shot, but then Dubois has scored more this year. Makes me question what I'm seeing as far as that goes.


McLeod is a mystery, the guy was ranked top 10 by Bob in the preseason rank while putting up only 29 points last year and is ranked top 5 even by some rankings playing with a good player with good chemistry and putting up 1.26 ppg which isnt that high. Is this like Crouse last year when he was ranked 4th ahead of Marner and Strome? I think the last player to be ranked that high who actually went that high with a ppg under 1.35 was landeskog. Who of course turned out pretty good. If we take him , one of Horvat and McCann would have to be moved as i see non of those shifting to the wing.
 

biturbo19

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Nylander is all skill, theres no other part of his game thats worth talking about.

I don't think that's really true. Alexander is a more "well rounded" player than his brother imo. Might not be as purely "skilled", but has a lot of other things going for him.

McLeod is a mystery, the guy was ranked top 10 by Bob in the preseason rank while putting up only 29 points last year and is ranked top 5 even by some rankings playing with a good player with good chemistry and putting up 1.26 ppg which isnt that high. Is this like Crouse last year when he was ranked 4th ahead of Marner and Strome? I think the last player to be ranked that high who actually went that high with a ppg under 1.35 was landeskog. Who of course turned out pretty good. If we take him , one of Horvat and McCann would have to be moved as i see non of those shifting to the wing.

You can have more than 2 good Centers on a team...

McLeod is a real "projection" type prospect. Has a very projectable skillset and tools, and flashes of potential for greater production. His size+speed+skill combo and high tempo style of play looks very translatable to the Pro game. The kind of player every team wants.

Just how far that will carry him up draft boards if the production doesn't continue growing through the year, who knows...still a very long ways off from draft day. But he's definitely a guy trending in the right direction. And has a total package of skill and tools that teams will love.
 

Verviticus

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what are things that are "effective for different reasons that are within the rules of the game" that are not skills
 

Verviticus

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he has a naturally angry face that scares his opponents. his unmistakable odor throws them off their game
 

CanaFan

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what are things that are "effective for different reasons that are within the rules of the game" that are not skills

How consistently he applies those skills is probably a big one. Compete level. It's great to have high a skill level obviously but that alone isn't always enough. Sven Baertschi is arguably more "skilled" than Bo Horvat or at least was throughout his junior career. But how he uses those skills (or in his case *doesnt* use them) is worth at least throwing into the discussion.

Also is hockey sense a "skill"? Or are skills limited to things that can be taught and practiced like skating, shooting, puckhandling?
 
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