Speculation: 2014 Trade Deadline Discussion - Part IX - The Buffalo Syndrome

[Big McLargehuge]

Wow, if the Blues make the CF this year, they would have traded their 1sts in all of 2013, 2014 and 2015. When you have the top prospect pool in the league and great young players, I guess you can do that.

19th ranked prospect pool =/= Top prospect pool in the league. I know HF's rankings are far from perfect, but that's a fairly big gap to jump.

There's not a ton of meat in that Blues system. They have tons of young talent on the NHL roster already, but they're not exactly bursting from the seams with blue chippers.

 

[cheesedanish87]

According to a poster on the main trade board the Pens were not mentioned by Mckenzie when he listed the 7 teams seriously pursuing Kesler. Maybe they've moved on but we did have some other reports saying they were in on him earlier today. Who knows.



http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?p=80684253#post80684253

https://twitter.com/TSN1050Radio/status/439522243065151488

Asked who's interested in Kesler, @TSNBobMcKenzie says Leafs, Pens, Wings, Rangers, Flyers, Jackets. Listen now on TSN Drive

 

[KIRK]

Let me ask something....

After we won in 09 , what did you guys expect us to do throughout Crosy and Malkins careers? 2 more cups...3...4?

My mindset back then was we "should " at least win 2 more. Whenever that may be. And yeah it's been frustrating the last 4 years, but we still have a long ways to go. I guess it's about expectations . If some were expecting the next dynasty in an era where that is next to impossible, then of course there will be disappointment. There's just too many variables these days . The main one being a cap. Would love to see what we could do without one, you'd see plenty of players coming aboard to try to win( like we saw with jersey, Detroit, Colorado in 90s) but that's a moot point.

Even with all that's happened, I guess I'm not as frustrated because I can still see this team winning two more cups. May have to wait until bylsma is fired, or even Shero...but regardless I do think my expectations will be completed.

And sure we can look back on it all and say we could've done more if not for the " dark years" but would anyone not be happy with this core winning 3 cups when all said and done? However, I'm assuming there's people who don't even think we can win 2 more so there will be a little more frustration right now than how I'm looking at it all.

Also, no doubt Shero felt the pressure in not winning so he went all in last year. That hurt us going forward. We can't keep doing that. I'm pretty sure he realizes that. It would be nice if he would restock that system by trading some UFAs this year, but that's not happening. Point is, need to stop looking at doing whatever it takes to win the cup each year, and look at the big picture. Don't mortgage it each year. Some will say Crosby and Malkin are almost out of their prime so we need to win now. I disagree, they are generational talents...their primes are much longer than others. We have time. There's no need to panic each year and mortgaging the future to try to get that 2nd cup. I still say we end u with 3. That's my opinion.

Speaking of that , an outsider reading our comments can't help but think how spoiled we are when we are talking about winning multiple cups and they'd kill for their team to just win one. Could be worse.

I'm frustrated because I've seen the Pens as pretender more than contender since 2009.

The **** I gripe about now. I was griping about that **** in the around Christmas 2009.

Look, there are things beyond an organization's control when it comes to winning a cup. The 2008 team was much better than the 2009 team, but the 2009 team avoided the toughest competition in the east and got Detroit with Malkin healthy and Datsyuk hurt instead of the opposite.

At the same time, there is nothing about Dan Bylsma as a coach that inspires confidence for a cup run.

And, there is nothing about Ray Shero's management of the team-- from the risk aversion, to the Sister Sledge like definition of the team's core, to his approach to building everywhere but around Sid and Geno-- since June 2009 that inspires confidence.

Even this team's ownership-- from expecting entertainment and sellouts over cups and pushing the GM and coach to build a team that would make the Marquis of Queensbury proud-- is part of the problem.

One day, hopefully before the entirety of Sid's and Geno's primes, Bylsma and even Shero will be gone. Until then, I'll expect nothing and be delightfully surprised by the playoff mediocrity that follows. It's a lot less aggravating than hoping for more.

 

[KIRK]

19th ranked prospect pool =/= Top prospect pool in the league. I know HF's rankings are far from perfect, but that's a fairly big gap to jump.

There's not a ton of meat in that Blues system. They have tons of young talent on the NHL roster already, but they're not exactly bursting from the seams with blue chippers.

True. A lot of the blue chippers have graduated to the big club, as you say.

Around here, I think we conflate the two. I'm not sure that's necessarily a bad thing.

The Blues have drafted well. A lot better than the Pens. And, it goes beyond the extra picks Shero moved.

 

[penguins2946*]

19th ranked prospect pool =/= Top prospect pool in the league. I know HF's rankings are far from perfect, but that's a fairly big gap to jump.

There's not a ton of meat in that Blues system. They have tons of young talent on the NHL roster already, but they're not exactly bursting from the seams with blue chippers.

They used to be first. I haven't looked recently at the team rankings, I just remember the Blues used to be incredibly high. I think that was before Tarasenko graduated.

 

[jmelm]

We should have signed Niskanen to an extension earlier in the season. With Letang's injury and the possibility that a guy like Pouliot or Despres gets traded, it becomes even more important than ever that we retain him, and he's got more leverage in negotiations, knowing the Pens want/need him more. Just saying.

 

[Big McLargehuge]

They used to be first. I haven't looked recently at the team rankings, I just remember the Blues used to be incredibly high. I think that was before Tarasenko graduated.

That 19th ranking still counts Tarasenko, so they'll likely be in the mid/late 20s in the Spring rankings.

But yeah, I don't think anyone could doubt having arguably the best scouting director of the past decade has helped built the Blues to what they are today...I'm just saying Kekalainen isn't there anymore and they're ditching draft picks like it's in style with a mediocre farm system that is basically Allen, Rattie, Jaskin, and a bunch of potential role players. That will be an issue eventually.

If they win a Cup this year it's justified, but it'll be hard to replace outgoing players when you have nothing but role players in the system...something we know all too well.

 

[jmelm]

What?

Crosby
Malkin
Letang
Staal(traded)
Maatta
Bennett

Would you like to trade the two sides?

I specifically didn't include Crosby and Malkin into that discussion, because picking those guys at first overall and second overall (after Ovechkin) respectively are no-brainer draft picks that a 5 year old GM could make. I thought not mentioning that was implicit and obvious. I was talking about the later first round picks, picks beyond the first, and good asset management/not trading picks/trading a draftee for an even better pick (Rundblad/Tarasenko)

Maatta was a no-brainer: great player that fell to us. Was very high on the Pens draft list and was clearly their BPA when he fell to #22.

Letang was a fantastic pick, Bennett was a fantastic pick, and Harrington was fantastic in the 2nd round. But that's about all they've done. Staal is also a "can't miss" pick at #2, but you can also argue a more astute scouting staff would have known to take Backstrom or Toews ahead of him. So if anything, I count that as a negative.

Our scouting, very simply, on the aggregate and excluding our top-2 selections has been average. Average. I want and I demand above average from this hockey club. The Penguins should demand AT LEAST above average, if not trying to be the best or one of the best, from themselves as well.

 

[cheesedanish87]

I was listening to a Pierre Mcguire podcast on TSN.ca just now, Pierre just said he knows a GM who is ready to load up to get Kesler, but he wouldn't say which GM.

BTW guess where Pierre is right now? Yes hes in Chicago with his buddy Shero.

 

[Pharrell Williams]

I was listening to a Pierre Mcguire podcast on TSN.ca just now, Pierre just said he knows a GM who is ready to load up to get Kesler, but he wouldn't say which GM.

BTW guess where Pierre is right now? Yes hes in Chicago with his buddy Shero.

So basically, yes, 100% we will get Kesler, no doubt about it, I guarantee it.

 

[nhindian]

I was listening to a Pierre Mcguire podcast on TSN.ca just now, Pierre just said he knows a GM who is ready to load up to get Kesler, but he wouldn't say which GM.

BTW guess where Pierre is right now? Yes hes in Chicago with his buddy Shero.

Pierre knows his stuff when it comes to the Pens brass.

 

[cheesedanish87]

So basically, yes, 100% we will get Kesler, no doubt about it, I guarantee it.

I think Pierre knows Columbus GM as well, Columbus has been one of the teams rumored for Kesler, so it could be them.

 

[gordie]

Pens are taking a big risk if Sutter + Pouliot were turned down by Vancouver. Trading Pouliot with Letang's status could come back to bite them and even if Pouliot turns into a Mike Green clone. That's a tough call and maybe I add Dumoulin to the offer, but that's it.

 

[jmelm]

I was listening to a Pierre Mcguire podcast on TSN.ca just now, Pierre just said he knows a GM who is ready to load up to get Kesler, but he wouldn't say which GM.

BTW guess where Pierre is right now? Yes hes in Chicago with his buddy Shero.

Pierre knows his stuff when it comes to the Pens brass.

This doesn't mean anything. This is the information-age, with cell phones and the internet. He could be in any city in NA and there would be nothing further or different to read in between the lines.


Oh, and he doesn't just "happen" to be in Chicago with his buddy Shero, he's part of the primary broadcast team. Be realistic, this doesn't mean anything.

 

[Captain Hook]

It wouldn't surprise me if it was Shero. They are tight and it's easy to picture them talking about the Kesler situation. But yeah, it could be anybody. It's not the 1800's. Pierre could be in contact with any GM anywhere in North America with today's technology.

 

[ZeroHero]

I was listening to a Pierre Mcguire podcast on TSN.ca just now, Pierre just said he knows a GM who is ready to load up to get Kesler, but he wouldn't say which GM.

BTW guess where Pierre is right now? Yes hes in Chicago with his buddy Shero.

Sounds like a bidding war...

Run Shero Run!

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

Sutter and Dumoulin would be better

I like Kesler but trading away Pouliot now makes no sense

 

[Speaking Moistly]

Given the Letang situation you have to figure that Pouliot just got a lot more valued by the Pens, maybe even Tubs did too.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

Sutter and Dumoulin would be better

I like Kesler but trading away Pouliot now makes no sense

So it'd basically be Staal for Kesler and Pouliot. That's a win.

 

[specialized]

I can see why the blues made that deal, they never won a cup and this could be there year.

 

[pensfan71]

Pierre knows his **** when it comes to us

 

[Speaking Moistly]

I'm not sure how much I want Kesler. I like Kesler a lot, but I don't like his age coupled with his style of play. I don't like the history of playing through injuries, I really don't like that because with the Pens that probably becomes out for a month. I'm not sure I'll like the price and there's a good chance that I don't like how he's used. He's probably not a long term solution to anything either.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

IF the Penguins do trade Sutter, who do they get to improve the bottom 6?

 

[Hottubber]

Keslers hand looked ok on that goal

 

[Michael8771*]

I don't think we are willing to part with the assets it would take to get Kesler. Beyond that and has been mentioned I don't think he'd want to be a third line center here. If he did, great, but I don't think he would.