1993 Stanley Cup Final/Your Thoughts Going In?

[hacksaw7]

now that i think back i think i always had a prejudice about offensive dmen who weren’t also elite two way players because calgary won without gary suter and montreal won mostly without schneider. those were two very formative playoffs for me as a kid, along with vancouver destroying phil housley in back to back years.

even that early i would classify desjardins as an elite two way d.

so even when i was just a kid who didn’t know anything, i was like, you can’t win with a steve duchesne. and back on the topic of those finals, look at LA after they replaced their blueline that was built around duchesne with the core of blake, zhitnik, and marty mcsorley playing out of his mind.

Don't forget the Pens and Oilers both taking multiple Cups after jettisoning Coffey.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

Don't forget the Pens and Oilers both taking multiple Cups after jettisoning Coffey.

tbh i always have considered coffey a special case. he is just so incredibly dominant offensively that you can't lump him in with gary suter or mathieu schneider or steve duchesne, or even housley.

i also would point out that you obviously can win with coffey because edmonton did three times and pittsburgh did once.

imo, the exception (from that time) that proved the rule was larry murphy. then and now, i would have had no problem lumping him in with those other guys.

and i also want to mention charlie huddy. my memory is subtracting duchesne as the focal guy and adding huddy as a kind of do-everything calming presence was huge, and imo had a bigger on-ice impact than the bigger names they brought in (robinson and coffey). i felt similar ways about toronto adding jamie macoun around the same time.

 

[hacksaw7]

tbh i always have considered coffey a special case. he is just so incredibly dominant offensively that you can't lump him in with gary suter or mathieu schneider or steve duchesne, or even housley.

i also would point out that you obviously can win with coffey because edmonton did three times and pittsburgh did once.

imo, the exception (from that time) that proved the rule was larry murphy. then and now, i would have had no problem lumping him in with those other guys.

and i also want to mention charlie huddy. my memory is subtracting duchesne as the focal guy and adding huddy as a kind of do-everything calming presence was huge, and imo had a bigger on-ice impact than the bigger names they brought in (robinson and coffey). i felt similar ways about toronto adding jamie macoun around the same time.

Macoun absolutely. Never got the accolades he deserved but he was a very solid, steady physical presence who was an excellent defenseman. And not a total 0 offensively too. Very tough guy to play against.

Sylvain Lefebvre was also pretty damn good for them between 92 and 94.

 

[Magicman]

Panther I wonder, I know McSorely has a book/biography out, I wonder if he "falls on the sword" in the sense that he should've known better than to go back to his legal stick with 6 or 7 minutes or whatever left in the game. I want to say I've read on HoH on another posting there was a "friendly reminder" from someone during the 2nd intermission-"don't forget to switch your sticks back" or something to that effect.

Gretzky told the room to lose the illegal sticks between the 2nd and 3rd periods. Then equipment manager Mark O'Neil collected them and stashed them so they couldn't be grabbed, whether by accident or on purpose. Regardless of the all the tales on how Montreal supposedly knew, the fact is everybody knew who used illegal sticks. And when somebody on Montreal noticed the stick McSorley was using was torched, they were pretty certain it was illegal and being desperate, Demers made the call.

They came out flat in OT and gave away the game. Though the illegal stick is blamed, the real culprit was lack of scoring from the top scorers. Gretzky, Kurri, Luc and Sandstrom scored a combined 2 goals after game 1.

Marty McSorley scored the last 2 Kings goals in that finals, the tying goal in game 4 and the only goal in 5. In fact Marty was arguably the best defenseman on the Kings that playoff year and for sure in the finals as top scoring defensemen Blake, Sydor and Zhitnik combined for 2 assists total between the 3 in 5 finals games.

 

[The Panther]

Don't forget the Pens and Oilers both taking multiple Cups after jettisoning Coffey.

Just for some counter-context:

-- The Pens didn't win win "multiple Cups after jettisoning Coffey". They won one. And then they had one of the all-time chokes in '93, partly because their line-up was too offensively tilted (without Coffey).
-- The Pens never became a contender or a Cup-champ until they'd acquired Coffey.
-- The Oilers never had a 1st-place or a 100-point season again after losing Coffey.
-- The Wings finished 1st overall for the 1st-time in 40 years only after acquiring Coffey. They made the Cup Finals for the first time in 30 years with Coffey.
-- The Flyers only made the Finals again after a 10-year drought after acquiring Coffey (okay, he was passing his prime by then, but still).

All of Edmonton, Pittsburgh, and Detroit became much stronger and more competitive clubs after acquiring Coffey.

 

[double5son10]

I’ll be using that video to help explain Gretzky to the kids. That’s one of those where if you slow it down, the chess-master aspect of his game becomes very apparent.

Great play by Marty on that shorthander, jumping in to the play and taking three Canucks w/ him, allowing Kurri to skate in to empty ice, right where Wayne knew he'd be. Huddy was on that PK too. Hmmm what do those four have in common?

As others have said Marty was an absolute beast that playoffs and Huddy was a needed veteran presence on an otherwise young blueline.

 

[hacksaw7]

Just for some counter-context:

-- The Pens didn't win win "multiple Cups after jettisoning Coffey". They won one. And then they had one of the all-time chokes in '93, partly because their line-up was too offensively tilted (without Coffey).
-- The Pens never became a contender or a Cup-champ until they'd acquired Coffey.
-- The Oilers never had a 1st-place or a 100-point season again after losing Coffey.
-- The Wings finished 1st overall for the 1st-time in 40 years only after acquiring Coffey. They made the Cup Finals for the first time in 30 years with Coffey.
-- The Flyers only made the Finals again after a 10-year drought after acquiring Coffey (okay, he was passing his prime by then, but still).

All of Edmonton, Pittsburgh, and Detroit became much stronger and more competitive clubs after acquiring Coffey.

Yes, it was one Cup for Pittsburgh. Coffey was there in 90-91

Edmonton went through the 86-87 playoffs, 1988, and 1990 without Coffey and won Cups. In 87-88 they had 99 points, gunning for Cup #4. Regular season point totals and whether or not they were in first I doubt mattered much to them. They were focused on getting it done in the playoff and did just that. 87-88 without Coffey was outright domination every series they played.

Wings also had two absolutely awful first round losses back to back years 1993 and 1994 with Coffey, and lost a finals series to NJ getting dominated. When that Wings team was restructured a bit after another disappointing postseason did they become champions. And moving on from Coffey was part of making that team a champion. Their 96-97 regular season was not all that impressive by 90s Wings standards, but they were an absolute machine in the playoffs going 16-2 (much like the 88 post Coffey Oilers)

I don't want to totally bash the guy, I like him as a player. Teams have won with him, teams have also become better playoff performers once he left the roster.

 

[The Panther]

Yes, it was one Cup for Pittsburgh. Coffey was there in 90-91

Edmonton went through the 86-87 playoffs, 1988, and 1990 without Coffey and won Cups. In 87-88 they had 99 points, gunning for Cup #4. Regular season point totals and whether or not they were in first I doubt mattered much to them. They were focused on getting it done in the playoff and did just that. 87-88 without Coffey was outright domination every series they played.

Wings also had two absolutely awful first round losses back to back years 1993 and 1994 with Coffey, and lost a finals series to NJ getting dominated. When that Wings team was restructured a bit after another disappointing postseason did they become champions. And moving on from Coffey was part of making that team a champion. Their 96-97 regular season was not all that impressive by 90s Wings standards, but they were an absolute machine in the playoffs going 16-2 (much like the 88 post Coffey Oilers)

I don't want to totally bash the guy, I like him as a player. Teams have won with him, teams have also become better playoff performers once he left the roster.

Edmonton didn't go through the 86-87 playoffs without Coffey. He missed some games, but played in several. He had 5 points in 5 games vs. Detroit (+2), and 6 points against Philly (+4).

Of course, because the Oilers (again), Pens (again), and Red Wings won the Cup right after Coffey was traded, it's easy to paint a false narrative that they won because they traded Coffey. However, it's also true that all of those clubs only became elite WITH Coffey, and two of them won Cups with him (and we don't know that the Red Wings wouldn't have won with him, too -- they might have).

I think what we can say about Coffey is he was a difference-making player, but he was so unique that the difference he made was really good in some team situations and not-so-good in other team situations. If your club already has offensive defencemen and a strong forward core, you don't really need a Coffey.

 

[Minar]

I see thr

Great play by Marty on that shorthander, jumping in to the play and taking three Canucks w/ him, allowing Kurri to skate in to empty ice, right where Wayne knew he'd be. Huddy was on that PK too. Hmmm what do those four have in common?

As others have said Marty was an absolute beast that playoffs and Huddy was a needed veteran presence on an otherwise young blueline.[/QUOTE

I see three canuck players that all turn and follow Gretzky leaving kurri wide open. The brilliance the the play by 99.