Line Combos: 15-16 Hurricane Line Combos

[59Rosebuds]

What do you think our lineup looks for this coming season. As we have seen, Peters is not afraid to move people up and down the line up or even bench them when they don't seem motivated. As of right now this is how I could see it playing out.
Forwards:
E. Staal- J. Staal- E. Lindholm
J. Skinner- V. Rask -D. Ryan
N. Gerbe- R. Nash - A. Nestrasil
C. Terry- J. McClement - B. Malone

Injury Replacements/ Other:
Boychuck/Hensick/Brown/Sutter/Woods

Defense:
R. Hainsey- J. Faulk
N. Hanifin- J. Wisniewski
J. Liles - R. Murphy
M. Jordan/ D. Biega

Goal:
C. Ward
E. Lack

Barring any more movements from Francis, I think that each of the lines play out to some version of this. The first line seems to be a given; the two Staal boys play great together and take some pressure off of each other given their big bodies and skill level. The two of the being the focal point gives Lindholm more room to work with much like Tlusty did with Staal and Semin (although Lindholm is better than Tlusty). The second line is a bit more difficult and where we will see more change. Skinner is a good second line player as long as he is healthy and not hesitant. Rask needs to build on his rookie campaign with stronger production numbers. Ryan is probably the biggest question mark here. Yes, he was the SHL player of the year, but like Bellemare will he actually pan out. From there it looks a lot like last year, but maybe Nash and Terry continue developing and Gerbe bounces back. But overall we have a relatively defensively sound bottom six.

On defense, there is hope in the future, but this year may still be rough. The first pairing is one I am not entirely sure of. Faulk and Hainsey are both great steady players, but the chemestry is not there like it was with Sekera. I would have liked to have used Wisniewski with Faulk and Hainsey with Hanifin, but handedness throws that off. Liles is a great bottom pairing defenseman, but I think Jordan would be better than Murphy this coming season. Unless Murphy is given sheltered minutes and power play time, I don't see him being as effective as Jordan.

Goaltending is what it is. Both guys are capable, and Cam had his best numbers ever last season. Lack is the new guy and will be hungry for a starting job. The two of them can battle it out and with the goaltending prospects we have, one of either Ward or Lack can be flipped at the deadline.

Playoff Prediction:
Like any team, the chance is there if everything goes perfectly. I do think a 16 point improvement is within reach given the way the team played over the last few months. We could also be a lottery team again.

Let me know what you think. Should be a fun season

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[Finlandia WOAT]

Switch Liles and Hainsey. Liles can skate and get the puck out of the zone. With Hainsey-Faulk going against top match-ups, it would become much more difficult getting the puck out of the zone cleanly and under pressure. Despite Hainsey being better than Liles defensively (though they're still very overmatched on the top pair).

Good job getting handedness though, most people like to ignore or forget that.

 

[59Rosebuds]

Switch Liles and Hainsey. Liles can skate and get the puck out of the zone. With Hainsey-Faulk going against top match-ups, it would become much more difficult getting the puck out of the zone cleanly and under pressure. Despite Hainsey being better than Liles defensively (though they're still very overmatched on the top pair).

Good job getting handedness though, most people like to ignore or forget that.

I can see why that would work, and it would give us a more capable/ proven defenseman on all three lines. The main reason I saw it like that is that I figured Liles would be rellied on for the powerplay (even with Wisniewski and Faulk) he is the only proven left- handed defenseman with at least good offensive ability. Kinda like how we used Marc-Andre Bergeron.

 

[Nordiques1979]

Still no place for Fleurty?

 

[DaveG]

Most people were guessing this offseason that 16-17 was going to be the case anyway.

 

[tarheelhockey]

You guys are forgetting Gleason.

 

[dukie01]

2RW is a big question mark, and I'm uneasy about giving Derek Ryan top six minutes out of the gate. Speaking of handedness though...out of the current expanded summer roster on the Canes website, the only righty forwards are:
Brown
Hensick
Lindholm
Nash
Ryan
Shugg
Sutter

Of those, only Lindholm and Nash have (recent) notable NHL experience. Peters didn't hesitate last year to play wingers on their off-wings or centers at wing, but Ryan's right hand shot does probably give him a leg up when thinking about lines and the depth chart.

That said, I still think the depth chart posted here is more realistic, with Ryan probably in the AHL to start but as a short leash call-up option to replace Boychuk or an injury:

Skinner - E. Staal - Lindholm
Gerbe - J. Staal - Nash
Terry - Rask - Nestrasil
Malone - McClement - Boychuk

 

[Vagrant]

I can't take any lineup seriously that has Derek Ryan starting in the Top 6. In fact, I have trouble seeing his name on the depth chart at all for all we know about him. Before we start tossing around numbers from Sweden, imagine what Boychuk and Terry would produce in the SHL. I have never seen the guy play a game to my knowledge and would wager that most here haven't either. The fact that we're penciling him in anywhere in the NHL is a testament to how bad our team is right now.

Teams were beside themselves talking about Bud Holloway after what he did in the SHL two years ago. He had a horrible season last year and quietly signed a contract with Montreal this offseason and will likely be immediately shipped to Hamilton. And he's, by reports, a much more dynamic player than Ryan.

Is Ryan the new Patrick O'Sullivan here?

Jordan
Eric
Rask
Lindholm
Nash
Terry
Malone
Skinner
Gerbe
Nestrasil
McClement

To me, those guys are the locks to make the roster barring anything ridiculous. There will be fights for the 12th and 13th forward, but that's the general feel of the team right now. And I would wager by the end of September that a camp invite like Tlusty or Cole will be signed to take that last vacancy. If not, I could see them wanting to elevate a prospect with a physical game. Woods and McGinn being two that leap to mind. I think they learned enough about Patrick Brown's game last season. Woods and McGinn still represent some upside.

 

[Ole Gil]

I can't take any lineup seriously that has Derek Ryan starting in the Top 6. In fact, I have trouble seeing his name on the depth chart at all for all we know about him. Before we start tossing around numbers from Sweden, imagine what Boychuk and Terry would produce in the SHL. I have never seen the guy play a game to my knowledge and would wager that most here haven't either. The fact that we're penciling him in anywhere in the NHL is a testament to how bad our team is right now.

Teams were beside themselves talking about Bud Holloway after what he did in the SHL two years ago. He had a horrible season last year and quietly signed a contract with Montreal this offseason and will likely be immediately shipped to Hamilton. And he's, by reports, a much more dynamic player than Ryan.

Is Ryan the new Patrick O'Sullivan here?

I think penciling Ryan into the middle 6 is optimistic, but not too absurd. The best anyone can do in the SHL is lead the league in scoring and win the MVP. If he's a playmaking Terry or Boychuk level player, I think he'll do just fine.

That being said, I like Malone-McClement-Ryan. Brad and Jay really came on strong the 2nd half of last year. Add in a 2way playmaker like Ryan, that might be the level of opposition against 3rd and 4th lines and 3rd pairings where what he did over in Sweden might translate pretty well for 12 minutes a night.

Overall, I think the real mystery this season, like every season, is what to do with Skinner. Is THIS the year he plays responsible enough to play on Jordan's wing? If so,

Staal-Rask-Lindholm
Skinner-Staal-Nestrasil
Gerbe-Nash-Terry
Malone-McClement-Ryan

 

[NotOpie]

I think penciling Ryan into the middle 6 is optimistic, but not too absurd. The best anyone can do in the SHL is lead the league in scoring and win the MVP. If he's a playmaking Terry or Boychuk level player, I think he'll do just fine.

That being said, I like Malone-McClement-Ryan. Brad and Jay really came on strong the 2nd half of last year. Add in a 2way playmaker like Ryan, that might be the level of opposition against 3rd and 4th lines and 3rd pairings where what he did over in Sweden might translate pretty well for 12 minutes a night.

Overall, I think the real mystery this season, like every season, is what to do with Skinner. Is THIS the year he plays responsible enough to play on Jordan's wing? If so,

Staal-Rask-Lindholm
Skinner-Staal-Nestrasil
Gerbe-Nash-Terry
Malone-McClement-Ryan

To me I think you're wasting Ryan's skills on the 4th line, even if he can help add some offensive pop to that group. He was brought over here to be in a top 6 role either in Raleigh or in Charlotte. Perhaps he would fit on a scoring 3rd line here. But given that you'll see our 4th line average about 8 to 10 minutes a game, more if they get PK time, I think the better construction puts Gerbe on the 4th line. That way you have a physical, difficult to play aginst group that isn't truly an offensive black hole and is skilled enough to get the puck out of our zone effectively.

Remember Peters recently also stated that he'd like to see what an EStaal/Rask/Lindholm line would do. If that's the case Jordan goes back to 2C and either he and Skinner learn to play together or you develop a 2nd line that's got some bigger bodies and is hard to play against. To me that opens the door for a guy like either McGinn or Di Giuseppe to play on such a line. Realistically you almost have to give PDG the upper hand as his play-making skills are better than McGinns and that line lacks that type of player.

But after some experimentation, I think you'll likely see something like this pan out:

EStaal/JStaal/Lindholm
Skinner/Rask/Terry-Nestrasil-Tlusty
McGinn/Nash/Terry-Nestrasil-Tlusty
Gerbe/McClement/Malone
Checker

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I think the Canes will still sign 1 forward, like Tlusty, Cole or someone else like that. Even though we know little about Ryan, I do think Peters will give him every chance to make the squad. He's coached him before and knows a lot more about him than we do, plus, I'm not sure Ryan would sign a deal if he didn't think he at least had a fair chance at making the Canes. I have no idea though if he'll make it or where he'll fit in as I know almost nothing about him.

My guess, at least to start the season since we know this will change a hundred times.

Staal-Rask-Lindholm (based on Peters comments)
Skinner-Staal-UFA signee
Gerbe - Nash - Nestrasil
McGinn-McClement-Malone
Terry, Ryan

Defense I think is easy, at least to start the season:

Hainsey-Faulk
Hanifin-Wiz
Liles-Murphy
Jordan

I understand what some are saying about Liles would work better with Faulk because of his ability to move the puck, but I don't see the Canes putting Liles in a position where he has to face top players from other teams. I think that would be putting him in a position to fail. Liles got pretty sheltered minutes last year and after Sekera was traded, it was Hainsey that played with Faulk (in fact, I don't recall Liles ever being paired with Faulk last year, or at least it was very infrequent). I really can't see Liles taking on that burden defensively.

On another note, I'd really like to see them put Lindholm at center. I think is game is well suited for the center position and at some point, they need to start thinking about who's taking over for E. Staal, weather that's next year (if they don't re-sign him) or a couple years down the road (as his play tails off with age).

 

[the halleJOKEL]

nhl first line center victor "the dagger" rask

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

nhl first line center victor "the dagger" rask

Yeah, I'd rather see Rask as a 3C behind Eric and Jordan, but just going off of Peter's comments, it sounds like he wants to see that line. Of course, we haven't even hit training camp so his view on that will probably change by the time opening night rolls around.

 

[Ole Gil]

nhl first line center victor "the dagger" rask

The only positive, is Peters must see something in his game that he really likes if that's his plan.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

The only positive, is Peters must see something in his game that he really likes if that's his plan.

Maybe. It also might be that there aren't a whole lot of options due to the lack of talent. If you put Eric and Jordan together, it creates a pretty top heavy line-up and a weak 2nd line. If you put Eric and Jordan as 1C,2C, it leave gaping holes on the wing.

The team really has 3, maybe 4 what I'd say are legitimate top 6 forwards. Eric, Jordan, and maybe Lindholm/Skinner (and even those 2 still have question marks). Trying to fill in other spots with Rask, Gerbe, Nestrasil, etc... makes it difficult.

 

[Vagrant]

The only positive, is Peters must see something in his game that he really likes if that's his plan.

He works. I think Peters primary depth chart sorting technique is based on hard work. I know that sounds like a positive thing, but it's a very Junior hockey thing too. Peters likes the players that rely on him implicitly to be told what to do. There are players all over NHL rosters that can't be bothered to work every shift the way these hungry young guys do. The incentive isn't there for them. You have to find ways to motivate those guys as well and it isn't always icetime. I think Peters has done a poor job with our star players since coming here and has done a great job with the younger kids. Unfortunately, that isn't how you win in the NHL. You need your stars to be stars. Peters has gotten *nothing* from the top end of the roster. He's a developmental coach in my mind. Has a system that he wants to adhere to religiously that isn't fun to play and doesn't win games. Not hard to see the problem there.

 

[BrindAmours Army]

He works. I think Peters primary depth chart sorting technique is based on hard work. I know that sounds like a positive thing, but it's a very Junior hockey thing too. Peters likes the players that rely on him implicitly to be told what to do. There are players all over NHL rosters that can't be bothered to work every shift the way these hungry young guys do. The incentive isn't there for them. You have to find ways to motivate those guys as well and it isn't always icetime. I think Peters has done a poor job with our star players since coming here and has done a great job with the younger kids. Unfortunately, that isn't how you win in the NHL. You need your stars to be stars. Peters has gotten *nothing* from the top end of the roster. He's a developmental coach in my mind. Has a system that he wants to adhere to religiously that isn't fun to play and doesn't win games. Not hard to see the problem there.

eric stall's apathy is the only problem

 

[tarheelhockey]

All I know is, Rask would be the worst #1 center in the league by a significant margin. And #1 center is typically the most important skating position on the roster. It's not hard to see where this is headed.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Chrchyn!

He works. I think Peters primary depth chart sorting technique is based on hard work. I know that sounds like a positive thing, but it's a very Junior hockey thing too. Peters likes the players that rely on him implicitly to be told what to do. There are players all over NHL rosters that can't be bothered to work every shift the way these hungry young guys do. The incentive isn't there for them. You have to find ways to motivate those guys as well and it isn't always icetime. I think Peters has done a poor job with our star players since coming here and has done a great job with the younger kids. Unfortunately, that isn't how you win in the NHL. You need your stars to be stars. Peters has gotten *nothing* from the top end of the roster. He's a developmental coach in my mind. Has a system that he wants to adhere to religiously that isn't fun to play and doesn't win games. Not hard to see the problem there.

It's scary how well this post fits with the teams' recent history.

(Though to be fair, it also coincided with a year were Staal, Staal and Skinner all suffered serious injury and Ward/Semin were in decline)

 

[RodTheBawd]

He works. I think Peters primary depth chart sorting technique is based on hard work. I know that sounds like a positive thing, but it's a very Junior hockey thing too. Peters likes the players that rely on him implicitly to be told what to do. There are players all over NHL rosters that can't be bothered to work every shift the way these hungry young guys do. The incentive isn't there for them. You have to find ways to motivate those guys as well and it isn't always icetime. I think Peters has done a poor job with our star players since coming here and has done a great job with the younger kids. Unfortunately, that isn't how you win in the NHL. You need your stars to be stars. Peters has gotten *nothing* from the top end of the roster. He's a developmental coach in my mind. Has a system that he wants to adhere to religiously that isn't fun to play and doesn't win games. Not hard to see the problem there.

My hope has been that he went into last season knowing it was going to be a wash, but wanted to use it to set the tone and what he expects out of players, with the idea that going forward he'll give some guys a little more leash (e.g. Skinner). I would think a coach at this level would know not to expect every player and line to play the exact same style and we'll get to see a line or two with some creativity. If not....

 

[Ole Gil]

He works. I think Peters primary depth chart sorting technique is based on hard work. I know that sounds like a positive thing, but it's a very Junior hockey thing too. Peters likes the players that rely on him implicitly to be told what to do. There are players all over NHL rosters that can't be bothered to work every shift the way these hungry young guys do. The incentive isn't there for them. You have to find ways to motivate those guys as well and it isn't always icetime. I think Peters has done a poor job with our star players since coming here and has done a great job with the younger kids. Unfortunately, that isn't how you win in the NHL. You need your stars to be stars. Peters has gotten *nothing* from the top end of the roster. He's a developmental coach in my mind. Has a system that he wants to adhere to religiously that isn't fun to play and doesn't win games. Not hard to see the problem there.

I think you're mixing up 'work' with 'possession.' I think the transition is about smarter decisions with the puck, not 'grinding.'

I think the key will be playmaking. With the incoming skill on the backend, and the young playmakers developing up front, if they can turn that posession game into better offensive chances, it seems like this will have a shot (in a year or two). I think this strategy makes a lot more sense than trying to get a bunch of mediocre skating forwards to play an up and down hockey game.


Re Rask: As it stands, he'd be the worst #1 Center in the league. But last season was his rookie year. There's always the chance he improves.

 

[StormCast]

Hainsey-Faulk
Hanifin-Wiz
Liles-Murphy
Jordan

I understand what some are saying about Liles would work better with Faulk because of his ability to move the puck, but I don't see the Canes putting Liles in a position where he has to face top players from other teams. I think that would be putting him in a position to fail. Liles got pretty sheltered minutes last year and after Sekera was traded, it was Hainsey that played with Faulk (in fact, I don't recall Liles ever being paired with Faulk last year, or at least it was very infrequent). I really can't see Liles taking on that burden defensively.

Literally a 0% chance Liles plays in the first pairing, IMO.

All I know is, Rask would be the worst #1 center in the league by a significant margin. And #1 center is typically the most important skating position on the roster. It's not hard to see where this is headed.

Taking over that dubious distinction from one JStaal.

 

[nobuddy]

yeah because tyler bozak and martin hanzal are better than jordan staal. yes mhm.

 

[A Star is Burns]

One year definitely seems like a short period of time to jump to any major conclusions on Peters. We'll see what changes he puts in this year, as he's been saying he wants to build on the foundation he put in last year with a little more offense. If all the major veteran offensive players again have something around career worsts, or are trending in that direction, then it is probably a problem with his style. Still kind of early to say I think.

 

[What the Faulk]

One year definitely seems like a short period of time to jump to any major conclusions on Peters. We'll see what changes he puts in this year, as he's been saying he wants to build on the foundation he put in last year with a little more offense. If all the major veteran offensive players again have something around career worsts, or are trending in that direction, then it is probably a problem with his style. Still kind of early to say I think.

But enough for some to decide that certain players are done/should be moved elsewhere?