GDT: 13 // 10 Nov // Jets @ Coyotes: Veteran's Day Edition

[rt]

The problem with this team has never been that there are too many casual fans. It has always been that there are too few.

 

[AZviaNJ]

I tuned out towards the end. Flipped back to see the Rieder goal. All sympathy to those who remained or became STHs. Especially those of you who stay in your assigned seats.

My thoughts exactly during my 50 mile drive home last night.

 

[AZviaNJ]

I had a few issues several years ago, but none since (fingers crossed). I think it was the second year of the card, I actually had to get a new one and never had a problem since.

Now that card they give you for reduced concession items may, or may not have worked last night.... they told me the machine wasn't reading it, so that card was useless!

Quite a few issues with the STH Card year 1 (some of the issues may have been gate attendant user error), but this is now 3rd or 4th year with the card I believe, and haven't had issues since.

 

[YotesFan47]

Good post.

I've never owned season tickets, but i've supported the team in pretty much any way an out-of-stater can. buying far too much merchandise than i should, going to games in Nashville and Raleigh, watching every game, etc.

sometimes the attitude from some posters on this board is bothersome, but i suppose that if we were winning, it wouldn't really happen as much.

That's pretty much when the board changed, back when we weren't making the playoffs. It's progressed each year. This place has kind of become a sounding board for fans frustrations rather than a place to enjoy hockey and this team. I guess that's natural for most people though. We see it all over society, not just here.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

The problem with this team has never been that there are too many casual fans. It has always been that there are too few.

Bingo.

IF you don't buy tickets you are not supporting your team. If you like to watch the games on TV, which is your choice, you are a fan. There is a big difference.

You're playing a semantic game that doesn't pass the smell test. If you buy tickets, you are a consumer. If you watch on TV, you are a consumer. If you buy jerseys, keychains, stickers, hats, exotic underwear, and other tchotchkes, you are a consumer. Consumers by definition are supporters, because professional hockey is a sport that survives on consumer spending.

But being a fan is also being a supporter. It may not be a tangible expenditure of financial assets but that is made up for in spades by the equity of blood, sweat, and tears. A fan might show up for a community event and not spend a dime, but help build and dedicate a ball hockey area with the team... is that not support?

Trying to separate people into different classes of fans might be fine in a hockey hotbed like Toronto or Montreal, but it should be beneath us in principle and it is a toxic exercise in practical terms. Let's just ditch it altogether and move on.

 

[Jakey53]

Bingo.



You're playing a semantic game that doesn't pass the smell test. If you buy tickets, you are a consumer. If you watch on TV, you are a consumer. If you buy jerseys, keychains, stickers, hats, exotic underwear, and other tchotchkes, you are a consumer. Consumers by definition are supporters, because professional hockey is a sport that survives on consumer spending.

But being a fan is also being a supporter. It may not be a tangible expenditure of financial assets but that is made up for in spades by the equity of blood, sweat, and tears. A fan might show up for a community event and not spend a dime, but help build and dedicate a ball hockey area with the team... is that not support?

Trying to separate people into different classes of fans might be fine in a hockey hotbed like Toronto or Montreal, but it should be beneath us in principle and it is a toxic exercise in practical terms. Let's just ditch it altogether and move on.

I understand what you are saying and I agree to an certain extent, but if I watch one game of basketball on TV, does that mean I support the Suns. My definition of support for a team is buying tickets. If the team leaves they will say the support was not there, so does that mean we didn't buy enough exotic underwear, hats etc.? Like you said, hockey is a sport that survives on consumer spending, but buying the piddly a---- stuff you are talking about, no team would survive. You have to buy tickets, that is support. Like you said, time to move on.

 

[BUX7PHX]

Bingo.



You're playing a semantic game that doesn't pass the smell test. If you buy tickets, you are a consumer. If you watch on TV, you are a consumer. If you buy jerseys, keychains, stickers, hats, exotic underwear, and other tchotchkes, you are a consumer. Consumers by definition are supporters, because professional hockey is a sport that survives on consumer spending.

But being a fan is also being a supporter. It may not be a tangible expenditure of financial assets but that is made up for in spades by the equity of blood, sweat, and tears. A fan might show up for a community event and not spend a dime, but help build and dedicate a ball hockey area with the team... is that not support?

Trying to separate people into different classes of fans might be fine in a hockey hotbed like Toronto or Montreal, but it should be beneath us in principle and it is a toxic exercise in practical terms. Let's just ditch it altogether and move on.

I think that Jakey is trying to create an analogy along the lines of this:

The difference between being involved and being committed is like a ham and eggs breakfast - the chicken is involved, but the pig makes the ultimate commitment.

 

[_Del_]

The difference between being involved and being committed is like a ham and eggs breakfast - the chicken is involved, but the pig makes the ultimate commitment.

If your business model relies on me willingly dying, I'm out.

If your business model consists of lying to me repeatedly over the course of several years while taking my money, icing teams that clearly don't seem engaged or to care, don't be surprised I don't care enough to continue handing over my money. If your business model is failing and you don't make changes but double down, don't blame me for not doubling down on my lost bet. If your business model has repeatedly been to force a false narrative to me and you have no commitment beyond this season, don't send me letters asking me to send money and recommit.

 

[Plub]

As per usual, Coyote fans are staying harmonious and positive.

 

[TheLegend]

You're playing a semantic game that doesn't pass the smell test. If you buy tickets, you are a consumer. If you watch on TV, you are a consumer. If you buy jerseys, keychains, stickers, hats, exotic underwear, and other tchotchkes, you are a consumer. Consumers by definition are supporters, because professional hockey is a sport that survives on consumer spending.

But being a fan is also being a supporter. It may not be a tangible expenditure of financial assets but that is made up for in spades by the equity of blood, sweat, and tears. A fan might show up for a community event and not spend a dime, but help build and dedicate a ball hockey area with the team... is that not support?

Trying to separate people into different classes of fans might be fine in a hockey hotbed like Toronto or Montreal, but it should be beneath us in principle and it is a toxic exercise in practical terms. Let's just ditch it altogether and move on.

I remember getting into it here over just what constitutes being a fan.

I went from being a 6-10 game per year attendee down to zero, but not because I wouldn't. Financially I couldn't. I do manage to get at least one game in these days if I can, but when you spend 12 to 18 months between jobs (done it twice now), and have to support adult kids (like my daughter at NAU currently) it isn't easy.

We are all fans..... that's why we're here. Those who have been long time STHs deserve a lot of respect, especially with the roller coaster ride this franchise has been on for so long. But likewise, those who support the team in other ways also deserve respect as well.

We can disagree on lines, who got scratched, who got more ice time than anyone, and even how the team is coached. But we cannot forget that we're all Coyotes fans and want the same thing. For the team to be successful.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

I went from being a 6-10 game per year attendee down to zero, but not because I wouldn't. Financially I couldn't. I do manage to get at least one game in these days if I can, but when you spend 12 to 18 months between jobs (done it twice now), and have to support adult kids (like my daughter at NAU currently) it isn't easy.

My daughter's a junior now at NAU. I finally was able to get her a used car and now she's able to go to the club hockey games.

 

[RemoAZ]

We can disagree on lines, who got scratched, who got more ice time than anyone, and even how the team is coached. But we cannot forget that we're all Coyotes fans and want the same thing. For the team to be successful.

Amen to that. I hate when fans are criticized for not buying tickets. Two reasons: First, that is the only way we can hold ownership accountable to put a competitive product on the ice. Second: No one knows what each of us has the ability to do financially. I think if you can't afford tickets, you definitely don't need someone making you feel worse than you already do by questioning whether you are a real fan or not.

 

[BUX7PHX]

If your business model relies on me willingly dying, I'm out.

If your business model consists of lying to me repeatedly over the course of several years while taking my money, icing teams that clearly don't seem engaged or to care, don't be surprised I don't care enough to continue handing over my money. If your business model is failing and you don't make changes but double down, don't blame me for not doubling down on my lost bet. If your business model has repeatedly been to force a false narrative to me and you have no commitment beyond this season, don't send me letters asking me to send money and recommit.

Haha, yeah, I always loved that statement to identify involvement vs commitment. I think its a little poor to state that just because someone doesn't go to the games doesn't mean that they aren't committed. I haven't been to many games since I moved out of Arizona, but if I am in town, I try to make games when possible.

 

[TheLegend]

My daughter's a junior now at NAU. I finally was able to get her a used car and now she's able to go to the club hockey games.

Hey... my daughter's also a junior and we just got her a used car this summer and she tries to make a few games at Jay Lively.

 

[_Del_]

Hey... my daughter's also a junior and we just got her a used car this summer and she tries to make a few games at Jay Lively.

Reporting suspected alts. TheFecklessLegend hmmmm

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Hey... my daughter's also a junior and we just got her a used car this summer and she tries to make a few games at Jay Lively.

If you tell me your daughter is studying visual communications and animation, my brain will asplode.

 

[_Del_]

Wait, are you guys married? Maybe there is a rational explanation...

 

[Dirty Old Man]

Wait, are you guys married? Maybe there is a rational explanation...

 

[TheLegend]

If you tell me your daughter is studying visual communications and animation, my brain will asplode.

Mine is studying Exercise Science. She wants to be an athletic trainer, or physical therapist.

Wait, are you guys married? Maybe there is a rational explanation...

Can't speak for Freckles but I am. Got hitched 11 days after the daughter was born (and no.... it wasn't with shotguns present. ).

 

[_Del_]

I meant to eachother...

 

[Jakey53]

Amen to that. I hate when fans are criticized for not buying tickets. Two reasons: First, that is the only way we can hold ownership accountable to put a competitive product on the ice. Second: No one knows what each of us has the ability to do financially. I think if you can't afford tickets, you definitely don't need someone making you feel worse than you already do by questioning whether you are a real fan or not.

I'm NOT criticizing fans. More the better. I understand if you can't financially afford tickets as it is expensive. I guess it comes down to what I think "supporting a team" means. If you think clapping your hands watching a game on TV is supporting a team, so be it. Buying tickets is what I call supporting a team.

 

[RR]

I'm NOT criticizing fans. More the better. I understand if you can't financially afford tickets as it is expensive. I guess it comes down to what I think "supporting a team" means. If you think clapping your hands watching a game on TV is supporting a team, so be it. Buying tickets is what I call supporting a team.

Watching a game on TV, consuming advertised products, helping drive up advertising rates that make it more feasible for Fox Sports AZ to carry Coyotes games isn't "supporting" the team? Your definition of support is incredibly short-sighted.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

I'm NOT criticizing fans. More the better. I understand if you can't financially afford tickets as it is expensive. I guess it comes down to what I think "supporting a team" means. If you think clapping your hands watching a game on TV is supporting a team, so be it. Buying tickets is what I call supporting a team.

Sorry, Jakey, but that's elitist. Supporting a team is just that, support, even if it doesn't lead to a direct commercial transaction. People clap their hands and watch the game also watch the TV ads. The sponsors support the team commercially, so those who never buy a ticket but follow the team, whether on TV or on boards (such as this one) with the maddeningly annoying advertisements, support the team.

 

[Lawson of Anarchy]

I'm NOT criticizing fans. More the better. I understand if you can't financially afford tickets as it is expensive. I guess it comes down to what I think "supporting a team" means. If you think clapping your hands watching a game on TV is supporting a team, so be it. Buying tickets is what I call supporting a team.

Supporting a team is going in to work and saying "did you see that Domi punch on Kesler last night?" to a crowd of people who don't know what hockey is, but become interested because you are interested. They overhear you talk of some fantasy league you are in. See you wear a Yotes t-shirt on casual day. All of this stuff supports the team.

 

[Jakey53]

Watching a game on TV, consuming advertised products, helping drive up advertising rates that make it more feasible for Fox Sports AZ to carry Coyotes games isn't "supporting" the team? Your definition of support is incredibly short-sighted.

Sorry, Jakey, but that's elitist. Supporting a team is just that, support, even if it doesn't lead to a direct commercial transaction. People clap their hands and watch the game also watch the TV ads. The sponsors support the team commercially, so those who never buy a ticket but follow the team, whether on TV or on boards (such as this one) with the maddeningly annoying advertisements, support the team.

Supporting a team is going in to work and saying "did you see that Domi punch on Kesler last night?" to a crowd of people who don't know what hockey is, but become interested because you are interested. They overhear you talk of some fantasy league you are in. See you wear a Yotes t-shirt on casual day. All of this stuff supports the team.

I guess we agree to disagree. I know the Coyotes get revenue from TV, but watching from home on your couch is not supporting the team. How often do you turn channels when the Coyotes are losing, or turn the TV off, or even record it. I know buying merchandise helps support the team, but buying a t-shirt or hat or what ever once a year is a pretty lame excuse to say that you support your team. Buying tickets is supporting your team. Being a fan is great, but buying a hat, t- shirt or even talking about the Coyotes around the water cooler won't keep the team here, buying tickets will.