‘Game management’ at the root of NHL’s officiating issues

[The Macho King]

And honestly - one of the dumbest things about "game management" is there are still a class of black and white calls that are not infrequent. So even if you're one of the idiots who argue that game management is good (it's not), it goes out the window the second a puck goes over the glass or a player misses a stick lift and touches some visor.

This leaves us with a system wherein 90% of infractions are called in the "flow of the game" - hook to the hands in the first is called but when you're up by 2 with 6 minutes left is let go - but a not-insignificant portion allow for none of that wiggle room for the refs. That means either we have to "make up" the black and white calls with some chincey calls later, or strive for a 50/50 universe of "game management" calls and allow the black and white calls to make up the entire difference.

 

[Mick Riddleton]

One word - inconsistent

One game something is allowed the next it is not, they have to get on the same page.

 

[barry halls]

There was a TSN article by former ref Kerry Fraser a while back where he inadvertently admitted that the fraternity of NHL refs believe they are part of the entertainment value & pace of a game.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

There was a TSN article by former ref Kerry Fraser a while back where he inadvertently admitted that the fraternity of NHL refs believe they are part of the entertainment value & pace of a game.

I can give them that they're part of the pace of a game but not part of the entertainment value. Nobody comes to watch the refs. I don't mind game management when the game is out of hand. I mind game management as the chosen strategy for officiating games from the onset. Game management should only apply to certain conditions within the game. They should be calling things regardless of if it's slanted towards one team or another if that's where the penalties are.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

f*** game management.

 

[jcs0218]

Game management from the referees is something that definitely happens. And fans of the game need to look into the mirror and know that they are partially to blame.

How many times do you hear fans complain about how the other team is getting more powerplays, despite the fact that the team getting the majority of powerplays is severely outplaying the other team?

A lot of fans have this idea that powerplays should be equal for both teams regardless of what is actually happening in the game. This particularly happens when one's favourite team is playing and there is an emotional investment in the outcome of the game. This is when you are most likely to hear complaints that the powerplays are too uneven.

 

[The Macho King]

I can give them that they're part of the pace of a game but not part of the entertainment value. Nobody comes to watch the refs. I don't mind game management when the game is out of hand. I mind game management as the chosen strategy for officiating games from the onset. Game management should only apply to certain conditions within the game. They should be calling things regardless of if it's slanted towards one team or another if that's where the penalties are.

Game management *should* be giving out misconducts when the temperature is rising in a game.

Game management *should not* be deciding whether or not to call a clear hook because it would put the team that's already up three goals on the power play.

 

[Top Shelf Wrister]

And honestly - one of the dumbest things about "game management" is there are still a class of black and white calls that are not infrequent. So even if you're one of the idiots who argue that game management is good (it's not), it goes out the window the second a puck goes over the glass or a player misses a stick lift and touches some visor.

This leaves us with a system wherein 90% of infractions are called in the "flow of the game" - hook to the hands in the first is called but when you're up by 2 with 6 minutes left is let go - but a not-insignificant portion allow for none of that wiggle room for the refs. That means either we have to "make up" the black and white calls with some chincey calls later, or strive for a 50/50 universe of "game management" calls and allow the black and white calls to make up the entire difference.

You ain’t lying brotha. Some of those “slashing” penalties called where the tape on a stick blade brushes against the pinky finger on a glove would go over really well in the playoffs

 

[pabst blue ribbon]

There was a TSN article by former ref Kerry Fraser a while back where he inadvertently admitted that the fraternity of NHL refs believe they are part of the entertainment value & pace of a game.

Hockey Refs Are Out To Get You (If They Already Got The Other Guy)

Fraser talks about game management a lot in this article

 

[kingsholygrail]

I guarantee the next time a game has a ton of calls, there's going to be a bunch of posters crying that they're ruining the pacing and they're tired of all the whistles and they're "not letting them play."

Let's be actually honest in this thread. Refs should just make calls on the away team.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

We aren't really talking about infractions committed here, but infractions called (either way). Let's say the Sharks are a heavily penalized team.....they might commit 12 infractions that are legitimate penalties. As the penalty differential mounts, maybe the refs don't raise the hand on two clear trips, a couple holds, and an interference. So there were 7 PKs for SJS during the game. Maybe Colorado committed 4 legitimate infractions. The refs don't see one of them, so 3 are penalized. In addition, a touch on the side of a puckhandler with the stick is called a hook and a phantom hooking is called. Refs are satisfied with a 7 to 5 balance on PP chances.

The fact that the Sharks have a high number of infractions committed increases the odds that the refs will call soft or barely existent penalties against Colorado. This is what I'm talking about.

We’re in violent agreement

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

Game management from the referees is something that definitely happens. And fans of the game need to look into the mirror and know that they are partially to blame.

How many times do you hear fans complain about how the other team is getting more powerplays, despite the fact that the team getting the majority of powerplays is severely outplaying the other team?

A lot of fans have this idea that powerplays should be equal for both teams regardless of what is actually happening in the game. This particularly happens when one's favourite team is playing and there is an emotional investment in the outcome of the game. This is when you are most likely to hear complaints that the powerplays are too uneven.

that would make more sense if statistically the team getting more power plays was the better team; but it’s not. You’re more likely to get a power play if you’re losing.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

I guarantee the next time a game has a ton of calls, there's going to be a bunch of posters crying that they're ruining the pacing and they're tired of all the whistles and they're "not letting them play."

Let's be actually honest in this thread. Refs should just make calls on the away team.

Is that supposed to be some kind of gotcha? Of course the posters who prefer game management are going to be upset if it’s removed.

 

[Tacitus Kilgore]

Call every single cross-check until players stop doing it

 

[kingsholygrail]

Is that supposed to be some kind of gotcha? Of course the posters who prefer game management are going to be upset if it’s removed.

If you want everything called, then they need to review the rules to avoid a situation where the entire game is played with one team on the powerplay. Like hooking should actually be hooking as it used to be called and not as it currently is called.

 

[Porkleaker]

There's some clear bias between refs as well. Take for instance the recent games between Oilers vs Flames and Oilers vs Jets. Oilers had the same two refs for both games.

This data is from the 2019-2020 season but give Kendrick Nicholson 2 more wins for the Oilers this season.

Oilers vs Flames
Kendrick Nicholson #30 and Chris Schlenker #3.
2019-2020 Kendrick Nicholson the Oilers went 6-0, and Flames went 2-1
2019-2020 Chris Schlenker the Flames went 5-0 and Oilers went 2-4

Oilers vs Jets
2019-2020 Kendrick Nicholson 6-0 for Oilers and the Jets went 0-7
2019-2020 Chris Schlenker the Oilers went 2-4 and the Jets went 0-3

Last season's data but how do these refs have teams winning 100% of the time or losing 100% of the time when they're officiating?
Seems pretty suspicious to me and I'm an Oilers fan.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

If you want everything called, then they need to review the rules to avoid a situation where the entire game is played with one team on the powerplay. Like hooking should actually be hooking as it used to be called and not as it currently is called.

There’s also the possibility the players start to adapt their behavior.

 

[Snipes45]

One word - inconsistent

One game something is allowed the next it is not, they have to get on the same page.

It's pretty simple. I don't want to see a game full of 6 PP's each, but the more you call, the more the players will get used to it and stop. They do this in exhibition and then just stop.

It is an absolute terrible officiated league. It all depends on what the score is, etc.

I take you back tot hat OTT OT win against CGY

CGY was down a few. CGY is coming on because they need to catch up. THE REFS, IN TOTAL, CALLED 8 PENALTIES ON OTTAWA in the 3rd period

They also ignored a few of the exact same blatant ones on CGY in the same period.

It was insane.

 

[Snipes45]

Game management *should* be giving out misconducts when the temperature is rising in a game.

Game management *should not* be deciding whether or not to call a clear hook because it would put the team that's already up three goals on the power play.

100% this. I don't get it. If my team is getting pummeled 4-0, call my team if they hook somebody. I don't care as long as you don't miss much overall on both sides.

The most annoying (and rare) thing is how any NHL team can go a full game without a penalty. Toronto had no calls against them in 2/3 games against Edmonton. I watched those games and there were calls there. That sounds like whining, but it's the truth.

I think CGY-OTT had a game where zero calls were made for either team lol

 

[Porkleaker]

100% this. I don't get it. If my team is getting pummeled 4-0, call my team if they hook somebody. I don't care as long as you don't miss much overall on both sides.

It helps looking at the refs for each game and the win/loss record they have for teams. My above post shows bias for and against certain teams with 100% wins or 100% loses. That's absurd even if it is just over the course of 1 season. But Kendrick Nicholson has the Oilers winning 100% of games he refs, and we just had him twice in the last 2, he's a big Oilers fan lol.

 

[kingsholygrail]

There’s also the possibility the players start to adapt their behavior.

Well players still get called for hooking, so I'm not really sure what you mean there. If players all adapted, no calls would ever be made.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

It helps looking at the refs for each game and the win/loss record they have for teams. My above post shows bias for and against certain teams with 100% wins or 100% loses. That's absurd even if it is just over the course of 1 season. But Kendrick Nicholson has the Oilers winning 100% of games he refs, and we just had him twice in the last 2, he's a big Oilers fan lol.

while at some frequency it would be important given the large number of team pairs to examine its unlikely from a statistical standpoint that it would never happen.

 

[IceNeophyte]

If you want everything called, then they need to review the rules to avoid a situation where the entire game is played with one team on the powerplay. Like hooking should actually be hooking as it used to be called and not as it currently is called.

I agree that the phantom calls should go away. Call everything, but only if it's significant. Like if a hook is solid enough to affect a player's movement, or if a slash touched the hands (I actually like that one) or actually exerted downward force on the opponent's stick. These stick taps on the side that are being called hooks and slashes are ridiculous.

Once you've cleaned that up, if a team can't defend without cheating, they SHOULD spend the whole game outmanned. Also, 1 minute penalties with icing enforced (2.5 minutes for majors) would help.

 

[Porkleaker]

while at some frequency it would be important given the large number of team pairs to examine its unlikely from a statistical standpoint that it would never happen.

Oilers have gone 9-0 with this ref now, Jets 0-8 that's fishy.

 

[kingsholygrail]

I agree that the phantom calls should go away. Call everything, but only if it's significant. Like if a hook is solid enough to affect a player's movement, or if a slash touched the hands (I actually like that one) or actually exerted downward force on the opponent's stick. These stick taps on the side that are being called hooks and slashes are ridiculous.

Once you've cleaned that up, if a team can't defend without cheating, they SHOULD spend the whole game outmanned. Also, 1 minute penalties with icing enforced (2.5 minutes for majors) would help.

Exactly. Make it so the refs basically can't manage the game because there's not a lot to miss.