Player Discussion Would you trade Kakko/Laf right now?
- Thread starter SnowblindNYR
- Start date
UnSandvich
Registered User
- Sep 7, 2017
- 5,198
- 7,371
Let me guess, we should also trade Berard, Cuylle, and Othmann the minute they don't look as good as you guys want too, huh? I already see plenty of people wanting to trade Miller & Lundkvist too
- Oct 3, 2013
- 36,977
- 10,679
Those guys aren’t due for a raise. Kakko is. Rangers have major cap issues. Now this doesn’t mean you move Kakko (or Lafreniere) just for the sake of it, but they cannot afford to have any passengers.
NYRFANMANI
Department of Rempe Safety Management
Tell me this isn't the most depressing image ever lol "Room for Improvement: None"
I mean it's people's fault for believing it. It's like Kramer and stonks. But honestly I was hyped too, that day. Kaapo was my wish from day one and it's balls that it actually happened.
Ultimately Kakko could have stayed home for a year. Tear the Liiga a second one or the AHL. Idk ... just be patient and keep in mind that the depth chart here is categorically different than TOR, ARI, EDM, OTT, ANA and what other f***ing team that rebuilt from scratch.
a) Kakko has been on the Zibanejad for a while now.
b) David Quinn is no longer the coach. He was my favorite whipping boy but we need to stop blaming him.
c) JT Miller was a late first round pick and showed a ton more than both Kakko/Laf.
NYRFANMANI
Department of Rempe Safety Management
a) confidence, chemistry
b) PTSD, internalization
c) mid 1st rd pls, 15th OV and no he did not show a ton more. At 23 maybe, yeah. But at 20 he's show less than both.
Miller and Lundkvist I'm more patient with because they weren't supposed to be NHL ready off the bat. Especially Miller who has been a monster at times.
My bad, but you can't compare a 15 OV to a 1 or 2 OV. Maybe a guy like Byfield, but that guy's a rare type of player taken at 2 OV.
DanielBrassard
It's all so tiresome
Lol, I guess no one watched him play, because clearly his skating had a ton of room for improvement at the bare minimum.
Tell me this isn't the most depressing image ever lol "Room for Improvement: None"
I'm not even looking for them to star or even production.
You just want to see glimpses of them being elite in some facet of the game.
You could combine the "skill sets" of both of them and you still wouldn't even get a decent player.
Tell me this isn't the most depressing image ever lol "Room for Improvement: None"
What is crazy is that there have been absolutely zero flashes of anything last what 10-12 games? I mean zero. His rookie year and last year at least we saw some points where he would hold onto the puck and shield the dman with his size and good edge work.
I wouldn't consider either off-limits if someone else really wanted them, but I wouldn't actively be shopping them.
Chaels Arms
Formerly Lias Andersson
I have seen signs of Kakko having the ability to be an impact player. There was a string of games earlier in the season where he was very strong on the puck, strong along the boards and aggressive defensively. I don't know if he'll ever be the player he was projected to be but I think Kakko has a higher floor than Laf. I believe worst case scenario Kakko long term is still a solid top six forward.
I haven't seen anything from Lafreniere. I don't know what he's good at or what kind of player he is supposed to be. I love misery so I spent a while last night reading what the scouts were saying about him before the draft and all of their projections. It's absolutely miserable reading. Same with a lot of writers before the start of this season ("Draft Alexis Lafreniere in your fantasy league, he's the breakout candidate of the year!!!!)" Everyone before the draft had Laf pegged as an NHL ready top six forward. The things they talk about regarding his game, "excellent vision", "bully on the puck", "capable of carrying his entire line"; I haven't seen any of these things in the slightest from him so far.
I understand the roster construction and his deployment are most definitely hampering his ability to put up numbers. But is it too much to ask for him to maybe do something positive once every few games? If he wasn't a #1 overall draft pick is he even on the Rangers NHL roster right now?
I watch Lafreniere and I'm reminded of the conversation Sheldon Keefe had with Jimmy Vesey on the Maple Leafs Amazon Prime series where he asked him: "What kind of player are you? Are you a grinder, are you a skill guy? I don't know what kind of player you want to be." I feel that way about Lafreniere at the moment. What kind of player is he supposed to be?
Granted, Kakko had an extra year of development but that extra year was under Quinn so I don't even know if that's a positive or a negative.
True his straight away speed leaves a lot to be desired but for a big kid/man his edge work and skating in tight corners is amazing. We need to see that again.
Unless he's injured I tend to believe what @EdJovanovski said, which I rarely make that claim. He seems to be missing something upstairs. Not IQ, but attitude and composure when things don't go well.
UnSandvich
Registered User
- Sep 7, 2017
- 5,198
- 7,371
Among regulars on the roster at F, at 5v5 Kakko ranks 1st in CF%, FF% (only F over 50%), SF% (only F over 50%), xGF% (only F over 50%). He's 2nd in GoalsFor%, behind only Blais (who played 14 games). And that GF% could easily be higher if the team was shooting better than 7.69% with him on the ice
Laf is 5th on the team in goals, but all the goals he's scoring are the kind he's expected to score. He's shooting at 16.3% but his numbers aren't being boosted by ENGs or PP goals. Were the team's personnel different and he playing on PP1, his scoring numbers could very reasonably be expected to go up.
Laf is 5th on the team in goals, but all the goals he's scoring are the kind he's expected to score. He's shooting at 16.3% but his numbers aren't being boosted by ENGs or PP goals. Were the team's personnel different and he playing on PP1, his scoring numbers could very reasonably be expected to go up.
Honestly surprised by Kakko's fancy stats. Last year he was a bull on the puck this year he seems to give it up a lot more easily. My big thing with him is that when he has the puck even if he protects it well he never knows what to do with it. Like 75% of the time it just goes back to the point or he takes some bad angle muffin shot. He just doesn't seem to have the skill and vision to make plays with it.
Sayba
Dark Schneider
- Jul 7, 2009
- 2,345
- 2,291
Beginning of the year I would have no way to Kakko but he is just a passenger wherever he plays right now and doesn’t drive play, hit or shoot.
Laf has shown the ability to physically engage and score some goals, I have more confidence he’ll eventually be a contributor at this point.
We have to learn going forward, regardless of ranking you just can’t draft guys this high who aren’t good skaters. I don’t care, trade the pick, reach a little, it just can’t be someone who is slow.
Laf has shown the ability to physically engage and score some goals, I have more confidence he’ll eventually be a contributor at this point.
We have to learn going forward, regardless of ranking you just can’t draft guys this high who aren’t good skaters. I don’t care, trade the pick, reach a little, it just can’t be someone who is slow.
Row I Goon
Registered User
- Nov 14, 2018
- 3,061
- 6,431
I may have previously called either….or both…a bust.
I’ll amend it now to “consistently inconsistent”.
I’ll amend it now to “consistently inconsistent”.
UnSandvich
Registered User
- Sep 7, 2017
- 5,198
- 7,371
bbny
Unregistered User
- Apr 12, 2019
- 2,166
- 3,540
I think he maintains a high level of composure in all situations. He rarely shows much emotion. He doesn’t usually show a lot of frustration. He is a mature kid. But that’s kind of the problem, and I agree with you and Ed re: attitude. To me he lacks killer instinct. He plays too nice. He’s your neighbor who chats it up about the weather and you walk away saying “really nice guy, but kinda boring”. It feels like you just need to light a fire under this guy’s ass somehow and unlock a hidden “IDGAF” demeanor that he can tap into on the ice, but I’m not sure it even exists in him.
Chaels Arms
Formerly Lias Andersson
Jason Robertson is just as slow as Kakko and LaFreniere, possibly slower, and has 37 points in 30 games in his second full NHL season right now.
It's not as simple as just drafting fast guys. This team would draft a good skater projected to score 80 points a season and he'd end up becoming Enver Lisin.
I don't even think it's a drafting issue at this point. It's not like the Rangers went way off the board with Kakko, LaFreniere, Chytil, Kravtsov or Andersson (maybe a tiny bit with Andersson but nothing crazy). This team clearly has a problem developing forwards once we've chosen them and I don't think it's as simple a problem as everyone being a slow skater.
Sayba
Dark Schneider
- Jul 7, 2009
- 2,345
- 2,291
Yeah they have may have a problem, however Lias is dirt slow and Kakko is a good skater, just not fast. I’m just saying let’s not use top picks on slow players.
Sayba
Dark Schneider
- Jul 7, 2009
- 2,345
- 2,291
- Oct 3, 2013
- 36,977
- 10,679
His shot never developed/hasn’t developed yet. Look at Svechnikov. He didn’t have a great shot when he came into the league (and wasn’t too different of a player to Kakko) but it’s something that has improved a great deal in Carolina and now he is all star caliber player. Probably the best u23 player in the league. Kakko hasn’t taken the next step in any of his skills.
