GDT: World Cup of Hockey 2016 Discussion

[Frk It]

Tatar has the sort of johnny on the spot luck that good goal scorers have

It is kind of concerning though because it has nothing to do with his skills necessarily, its just a goal scorers sort of intuition/ timing to be at the right area of the slot/ crease to bury like he did tonight against Canada and earlier against Sweden

Like he could score 20 goals this year or upwards of 35, to me he is sort of unpredictable that way, and it probably comes down to usage/ opportunity in terms of where he lands in that range. He seems like the type of guy whose shooting percentage will fluctuate every year and confuse the stats crowd

I guess I don't look at it this way. Finding soft spots in coverage is a skill. Anticipating the play is a skill. It's mostly hockey IQ. I think Tatar is good in this area.

Good goal scorers do it way too often for it to be luck.

 

[PullHard]

I guess I don't look at it this way. Finding soft spots in coverage is a skill. Anticipating the play is a skill. It's mostly hockey IQ. I think Tatar is good in this area.

Good goal scorers do it way too often for it to be luck.

I don't necessarily disagree because it is true that it is something goal scorers know to do, but I just meant it in a "it isn't tangible so when his production isn't there, people think he is a tweener/ fluke." It is not so much for us Wings fans, but more outsiders who will just see variances in his totals and then watch him play a game here and there and maybe not see him doing a ton that night, etc.

His style isn't really one that pops out and makes you go "wow!!!" every night. He has some of that stickhandling ability for sure but it isn't on display as often as a guy like Dasyuk or maybe/ hopefully AA where they are flying up and down the ice beating guys 1on1 fairly often. His offense often comes really quickly and unexpectedly because of this sort of sense of where to be to fire in loose pucks or sneaky passes.

My post was inspired by fantasy hockey because I know my buddy who had Tatar last year was pretty frustrated with his production. I'm just thinking now -- he isn't a guy to write off, but my buddy probably will, because he will resent him for a while. I guess that is what happens with fantasy hockey haha. Like I wouldn't be shocked if Tatar pops in ~30 goals this year and further frustrates my friend.

 

[Henkka]

For fantasy hockey purposes, time to trade for Tatar is now. I think he will have a bounce-back season, contract ending etc.

 

[Frk It]

I don't necessarily disagree because it is true that it is something goal scorers know to do, but I just meant it in a "it isn't tangible so when his production isn't there, people think he is a tweener/ fluke." It is not so much for us Wings fans, but more outsiders who will just see variances in his totals and then watch him play a game here and there and maybe not see him doing a ton that night, etc.

His style isn't really one that pops out and makes you go "wow!!!" every night. He has some of that stickhandling ability for sure but it isn't on display as often as a guy like Dasyuk or maybe/ hopefully AA where they are flying up and down the ice beating guys 1on1 fairly often. His offense often comes really quickly and unexpectedly because of this sort of sense of where to be to fire in loose pucks or sneaky passes.

My post was inspired by fantasy hockey because I know my buddy who had Tatar last year was pretty frustrated with his production. I'm just thinking now -- he isn't a guy to write off, but my buddy probably will, because he will resent him for a while. I guess that is what happens with fantasy hockey haha. Like I wouldn't be shocked if Tatar pops in ~30 goals this year and further frustrates my friend.

He impacts posesssion in a big way, even when he isn't scoring. He and Nyquist are well past being tweeners, in my opinion, even though our coach foolishly decided to play them as such last year.

I think Tatar's passing, stickhandling, and shooting abilities are all at a pretty high level. He's clearly a skilled offensive player. His problems are that he over handles the puck a lot, and he tries to pick corners far too often which results in missing the net more than he should from some high danger areas.

Fantasy wise our whole team was bad last year. I drafted Tatar too. But I had Kane, so it didn't matter.

 

[PullHard]

He impacts posesssion in a big way, even when he isn't scoring. He and Nyquist are well past being tweeners, in my opinion, even though our coach foolishly decided to play them as such last year.

I think Tatar's passing, stickhandling, and shooting abilities are all at a pretty high level. He's clearly a skilled offensive player. His problems are that he over handles the puck a lot, and he tries to pick corners far too often which results in missing the net more than he should from some high danger areas.

Fantasy wise our whole team was bad last year. I drafted Tatar too. But I had Kane, so it didn't matter.

Agree with all you've said. I don't draft Wings anymore if I can help it . It gets messy when things aren't going peachy for my teams.

 

[InGusWeTrust]

Tatar shot the puck a lot more when he almost had 30. Our whole offense struggled. I fully expect Tatar to be close to 30 if not hitting it. I'd have to say he is our strongest goal scorer

Every season he is at about 12% shooting...he just needs to do less dangle and more shooting.

 

[Ezekial]

The 2 minutes less a game had a pretty big impact I'd imagine... Give the guy some minutes and he's a 30 goal scorer again easy

 

[Chance on Chance]

looks like the wings need to add more Canadians

 

[Inspiration]

Not counting playoffs.

Tatar is 2nd on the Wings in playoff points since he entered the league full time (which doesn't amount to much, but is still better than anyone not named Datsyuk).

 

[GMR]

Tatar is 2nd on the Wings in playoff points since he entered the league full time (which doesn't amount to much, but is still better than anyone not named Datsyuk).

The whole team has sucked in the playoffs, but you'd like to see either him or Nyquist step up and elevate the team and their linemates. They're supposed to be the young guns on the team and have looked weak in the playoffs. Not difference makers. I know having a scrub like Helm on your line doesn't help, but good players make those around them better.

 

[GMR]

looks like the wings need to add more Canadians

Would Doughty or Benn take a paycut to play for an Original 6 franchise?

 

[Yemack]

This tournament was interesting for many points Young guns vs veterans was pretty interesting. Although they lost team NA played very exciting brand of hockey for sure and it made me wonder if the Oilers of 80s were like this. Still they lost and it happens time and time again. Oilers against Islanders and Red Wings vs Devils come to mind.

Also team Europe, wow who could have imagined they would be playing in the Final? I thought it was a joke team that was going no where. 'Giving 110% for a continent? ha yeah good luck there.' When they got crushed first two exhibition games, I thought 'yeah well this is a bad idea'. However, I think this tournament proves that little adversity really can help any team if they can come out of it better. Fear is one of the biggest motivator and when they got beaten so badly by team NA to a point of embarrassment, something really kicked in for them. Scandinavian teams are usually pretty good at executing their plans in a short tournament probably due to their culture but team Europe really played like a team and almost executed as well as some NHL teams in their mid season form. I have no doubt in my mind if they didnt face team NA in those exhibitions, they wouldnt have fared as well. Anyways Kudos to team Europe.

Also Tatar scored some very important goals at crucial moments in this tournament. I was wondering if he plays with a bigger forward who can draw attention in front of the net or in the corner maybe it allows him to attack the net better?

 

[Bench]

Would Doughty or Benn take a paycut to play for an Original 6 franchise?

Absolutely. They'll look fantastic on the Hawks.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Absolutely. They'll look fantastic on the Hawks.

 

[SpookyTsuki]

Would Doughty or Benn take a paycut to play for an Original 6 franchise?

Bench got you there. Doughty or Benn or any superstar won't take pay cuts to play for us a .500 team

 

[Chance on Chance]

looking now at our drafts we really strike out on the CHL. We have Helm from there when 39% of the league comes from the CHL.

 

[Claypool]

looking now at our drafts we really strike out on the CHL. We have Helm from there when 39% of the league comes from the CHL.

Mantha, AA, Ouellet, Sproul, Mrazek, Callahan, Jurco, Svechnikov, Bertuzzi, Aubry, Frk, Paterson

Plenty of players from the CHL in the system or on the cusp of making the team. And that's not counting guys like Ferraro and Nestrasil. Wouldn't exactly call that striking out lately.

 

[Frk It]

Mantha, AA, Ouellet, Sproul, Mrazek, Callahan, Jurco, Svechnikov, Bertuzzi, Aubry, Frk, Paterson

Plenty of players from the CHL in the system or on the cusp of making the team. And that's not counting guys like Ferraro and Nestrasil. Wouldn't exactly call that striking out lately.

Mrazek would definitely be the name to tout on that list. Not sure why Callahan, Aubry, Paterson are even being mentioned.

 

[Henkka]

Mantha, AA, Ouellet, Sproul, Mrazek, Callahan, Jurco, Svechnikov, Bertuzzi, Aubry, Frk, Paterson

Plenty of players from the CHL in the system or on the cusp of making the team. And that's not counting guys like Ferraro and Nestrasil. Wouldn't exactly call that striking out lately.

Striking out with Tyler Wright -drafted prospects.

Thank god Nill/McDonnel aren't running that ****show anymore.

 

[Claypool]

Mrazek would definitely be the name to tout on that list. Not sure why Callahan, Aubry, Paterson are even being mentioned.

Jurco, AA, and Mantha are NHL players. Where they slot long-term remains to be seen. Bertuzzi is close. Callahan, Ouellet, and Sproul could become NHL players, but maybe not on Detroit. My point is they're getting good talent from the CHL, but not sure-thing superstars.

 

[Wood Stick]

Jurco, AA, and Mantha are NHL players. Where they slot long-term remains to be seen. Bertuzzi is close. Callahan, Ouellet, and Sproul could become NHL players, but maybe not on Detroit. My point is they're getting good talent from the CHL, but not sure-thing superstars.

To be fair with XO, defensive D's are so hit or miss. I would never want to draft one in the first round unless he had borderline elite skating.

Jurcs struggling so much is so odd to me as his second pro season was so good in Grand Rapids and Detroit.

Anthony Mantha was a good pick IMO. Some just hadn't seen such a good prospect in some time here and he was overhyped a tad. He still has all the makings of a 30 goal scorer. He came from the worst CHL league and had a serious injury.

AA was a late pick that developed real well in the OHL. He's a 20 goal NHL player right now with elite skating.

Bertuzzi was a 2nd rounder that will be a third line Andrew Shaw guy. Great pick.

Ryan Sproul was the OHL D of the year but is a hit or a miss type of guy. Could be lighting up the K in a couple of years.



In 2 years, in your top 9 you're going to have Anthony Mantha, Tyler Bertuzzi (maybe a tad more time) , and double A. Keep in mind Detroit loves their Europeans so of course they're going to draft and develop from there, and have those guys on the roster.

Even as a Canadian I've noticed the absolute strength of US hockey. It's developing really, really well. More players are coming from the USHL/College hockey and Canadians are going that route.

 

[LastWordArmy]

A Review of the Red Wings at the World Cup

http://lastwordonhockey.com/2016/10/01/how-the-red-wings-did-at-the-world-cup-of-hockey/

 

[Chance on Chance]

Mantha, AA, Ouellet, Sproul, Mrazek, Callahan, Jurco, Svechnikov, Bertuzzi, Aubry, Frk, Paterson

Plenty of players from the CHL in the system or on the cusp of making the team. And that's not counting guys like Ferraro and Nestrasil. Wouldn't exactly call that striking out lately.

How many guys on our actual roster are from the CHL though. 2? I forgot about Mrazek because I was leaning towards Canadian players but he counts for CHL. And realistically only AA and Mantha will make the team. I'm not too confidant in Svechnikov being anything special considering the track record of Russians in the CHL

 

[MTU hockey]

To be fair with XO, defensive D's are so hit or miss. I would never want to draft one in the first round unless he had borderline elite skating.

Jurcs struggling so much is so odd to me as his second pro season was so good in Grand Rapids and Detroit.

XO was seen as a two way d man when he was drafted, typically defensive d's score at less than a .5 ppg rate in the CHL but XO did much better than that in his CHL career.

And Jurco's struggles are directly a result of a back injury that he suffered during his first full NHL season. He finally had surgury to correct it this offseason but it remains to be seen if he can rebound to the player he was in his first NHL stint.

 

[Claypool]

How many guys on our actual roster are from the CHL though. 2? I forgot about Mrazek because I was leaning towards Canadian players but he counts for CHL. And realistically only AA and Mantha will make the team. I'm not too confidant in Svechnikov being anything special considering the track record of Russians in the CHL

Bertuzzi is probably good enough to be a bottom 6 player in the NHL right now. Assuming he continues to improve he'll be in Detroit sooner than later. So, there's three forwards coming, at least. Jurco got injured and wasn't able to rebound (yet). Either way, I don't see the concern over the lack of CHL players on the team. There are good players being found across many leagues all over the world.

There's no reason to suggest the Red Wings' recent lack of improved success is due to poor drafting and developing players from the CHL.