Winnipeg Jets going into the 24/25 season

[gojetsgo]

I don't think anyone is defending Ehlers' PO performance. I'm certainly not. But I am not isolating on him and blaming him for the failings of all of the other players either.

Jets lost mostly due to lack of team D from front to back. I don't know if anyone could be excluded from fault.

lol, everytime you bring up ehlers playoff performance bunches of people come out with "bUt EvErYoNe WaS BaD" if that isn't defending him idk what is... ehlers is getting singled out here more because he gets propped up soooo so much around here where people were claiming he was a top 10 winger in the game, literally every thread turns into a debate about ehlers usage

hf boards: ehlers is a top 10 winger in the league give him all the minutes!

ehlers: 4 goals in 37 playoff games

hf boards: but everyone else played bad!

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

lol, everytime you bring up ehlers playoff performance bunches of people come out with "bUt EvErYoNe WaS BaD" if that isn't defending him idk what is... ehlers is getting singled out here more because he gets propped up soooo so much around here where people were claiming he was a top 10 winger in the game, literally every thread turns into a debate about ehlers usage

I don't think I've mentioned his usage in the PO once. Don't argue with me because of what some others may or may not have said. We are not an organized group coordinating an effort to foist Ehlers on the rest of you. We don't have meetings and agree on what arguments to make.

We are going to lose him now so you can be happy. He won't be here to disappoint you next PO.

 

[Dale53130]

I don't think I've mentioned his usage in the PO once. Don't argue with me because of what some others may or may not have said. We are not an organized group coordinating an effort to foist Ehlers on the rest of you. We don't have meetings and agree on what arguments to make.

We are going to lose him now so you can be happy. He won't be here to disappoint you next PO.

That's funny, there are 3 people here posting in the past 30 minutes or so, that make it seem as though they just got off a zoom call.

 

[gojetsgo]

I don't think I've mentioned his usage in the PO once. Don't argue with me because of what some others may or may not have said. We are not an organized group coordinating an effort to foist Ehlers on the rest of you. We don't have meetings and agree on what arguments to make.

We are going to lose him now so you can be happy. He won't be here to disappoint you next PO.

I guess I'll be more clear, I meant anytime you as in anytime anyone said anything about ehlers playoff performance it leads to people coming out defending him, not you specifically

I'm fine with ehlers on the team, he is a good player... if he won't sign though he needs to be traded, I'm just annoyed at the people who overrate the shit out of him, you know the people that are now claiming it will tank the franchise if we trade him

 

[JetsFan815]

lol, everytime you bring up ehlers playoff performance bunches of people come out with "bUt EvErYoNe WaS BaD" if that isn't defending him idk what is... ehlers is getting singled out here more because he gets propped up soooo so much around here where people were claiming he was a top 10 winger in the game, literally every thread turns into a debate about ehlers usage

hf boards: ehlers is a top 10 winger in the league give him all the minutes!

ehlers: 4 goals in 37 playoff games

hf boards: but everyone else played bad!

5 on 5 +/- of Jets forwards in the playoffs:

Connor +2
Monahan +1
Toffoli 0
Ehlers -1
Vilardi -1
Iafallo -1
Gus -1
Lowry -2
Appleton -2
Names -2
Nino -3
Scheifele -3

 

[gojetsgo]

5 on 5 +/- of Jets forwards in the playoffs:

Connor +2
Monahan +1
Toffoli 0
Ehlers -1
Vilardi -1
Iafallo -1
Gus -1
Lowry -2
Appleton -2
Names -2
Nino -3
Scheifele -3

guess were using +/- as a stat again

 

[DRW204]

Yeah but balloons are floated all the time with stuff like "Team X would love to lock in their pending UFA ASAP". So far all we have heard is a Murat report saying the Jets will look to explore the market for Ehlers... nothing about their desire to re-sign him. For example last year it was pretty obvious the org wanted to re-sign Helle well before the summer.

they were doing trade destinations last year just as much for scheifele & hellebuyck.

 

[Buffdog]

I think you have it completely backwards. Only defending when attacked.

Name 1 poster who has said that Ehlers was godlike and only let down by _________ .

I'm not referring to you. I'm referring to posters who cherrypick stats and claim that he's a top 10 winger in the league, posters who claim that the Jets will be set back to the "dark ages" without him and posters who claim that anyone who doesn't think that way "doesn't understand" Ehlers value to the team

Personally, I love Nik as a player and would like to see him here long term. But I'm also realistic about his strengths and weaknesses, like I am with every other player on the team

 

[scelaton]

Been away for a few days. I see I missed a lot

 

[WolfHouse]

lol, everytime you bring up ehlers playoff performance bunches of people come out with "bUt EvErYoNe WaS BaD" if that isn't defending him idk what is... ehlers is getting singled out here more because he gets propped up soooo so much around here where people were claiming he was a top 10 winger in the game, literally every thread turns into a debate about ehlers usage

hf boards: ehlers is a top 10 winger in the league give him all the minutes!

ehlers: 4 goals in 37 playoff games

hf boards: but everyone else played bad!

sounds like your posts when I criticize Scheifele

 

[gojetsgo]

sounds like your posts when I criticize Scheifele

all your posts are claiming the team sucks because scheifele doesn't listen to the coach and stops playing his perfect unbeatable system

 

[WolfHouse]

all your posts are claiming the team sucks because scheifele doesn't listen to the coach and stops playing his perfect unbeatable system

Ahhh nice to know. Continue with your diatribe - sorry to interrupt.

 

[bumblebeeman]

I guess I'll be more clear, I meant anytime you as in anytime anyone said anything about ehlers playoff performance it leads to people coming out defending him, not you specifically

I'm fine with ehlers on the team, he is a good player... if he won't sign though he needs to be traded, I'm just annoyed at the people who overrate the shit out of him, you know the people that are now claiming it will tank the franchise if we trade him

I responded a few days ago to someone saying Ehlers and Helle were players that deserved the most blame for the series loss. I don't agree with that so I responded. Being critical is fine, but that seemed very hyperbolic and I said so. He isn't the reason the Jets lost. But yes he should be better.

But ya agreed 2nd paragraph there. I do have a feeling he'll re-sign tho honestly. But if he wants to go to UFA then I think he'll be moved, and Chevy will get a nice return for him and the team will be fine.

 

[Jets 31]

they were doing trade destinations last year just as much for scheifele & hellebuyck.

Yup they were both absolutely gone after last season and then Chevy re-signed them both. Ehlers could get re-signed just as easily or he will get traded , one of the two things will absolutely happen, Chevy won't just let Ehlers walk for nothing.

 

[Jets 31]

5 on 5 +/- of Jets forwards in the playoffs:

Connor +2
Monahan +1
Toffoli 0
Ehlers -1
Vilardi -1
Iafallo -1
Gus -1
Lowry -2
Appleton -2
Names -2
Nino -3
Scheifele -3

The fact Connor and Monahan were plus players in a series where we got out scored so bad is amazing.

 

[ps241]

Interesting thread.

Last year at this time we got rid of our HFBoards whipping boys, then, after “possibly” both sides testing the market a bit (who knows) money talked and we were able to get Helly and Scheif back under new long term deals. Chevy had a pretty good summer, we had a great season, we went all in by giving up a draft class (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th) to win the cup, then shit the bed in the playoffs yet again, even with what I thought was a much better defensive team we gave up close of 5 goals a game??

@GJF asked in the great OP what is the top priority going into the 2024-25 season.

Lets start with the controllable variables which are the only ones I am worried about:

For me its to temper (lower) my expectations, try to get out to a few more games live (tough with my kids schedules), continue to enjoy the journey more like I did this past season, to not worry about the playoffs this season if we able to get there.

Now to the uncontrollable variables:

As for the team I hope they continue in earnest on their coaching search. I think it is very important for them to get it right.

I mean this honestly. I have no idea where Chevy and Mark are at and how they are going to approach this off season. What is the foundational TNSE belief. Do they think………Hey this team had the second best regular season in 2.0 history so we’re close……..or do they think we have not really been remotely competitive in the playoffs in half a decade and we are just spinning our wheels here, we are not close? I think I agree with @Joe Hallenback when he said “behind the scenes I think TNSE will consider this season a success with an aberration in the playoffs” (even though its really the only way this team has played in the playoffs).

I don’t expect nearly as much change and excitement as last off season (Wheeler gone, PLD for a shopping cart full of assets, Scheif and Helly signed to new long term deals….etc etc).

They will probably try to sign at least two of Monahan, DeMelo, Dillon (if they’ll stay). No rush with the guys heading into the last year unless there is an offer they like.

TLDR Summary: mostly roll it back is where I assume they land.

 

[Cotton Eye Joe]

The effort level this team puts out the last few seasons in playoff crunch time is embarrassing and beyond disappointing.
Good for you guys putting in more effort than most players.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I'm not referring to you. I'm referring to posters who cherrypick stats and claim that he's a top 10 winger in the league, posters who claim that the Jets will be set back to the "dark ages" without him and posters who claim that anyone who doesn't think that way "doesn't understand" Ehlers value to the team

Personally, I love Nik as a player and would like to see him here long term. But I'm also realistic about his strengths and weaknesses, like I am with every other player on the team

Well, he might be a top 10 winger in the league - with a couple of ifs. If he was utilized better for 1. If he could learn to score on breakaways for another.

I think we are going to lose him and lose the trade when we move him. I wouldn't say back to the dark ages, but we will be a weaker team without him, at least in the short term.

The 'weakness' we are talking about here is his lack of PO performance. I think it is hard to zero in on any 1 player when the whole team is as bad as it has been. OTOH as one of the top players on the team, he is one we look to for on ice leadership. Ideally he would step up and help turn the team around. But I think he makes the mistake of trying to do too much on his own when the team is going badly. Just a guess of course.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I guess I'll be more clear, I meant anytime you as in anytime anyone said anything about ehlers playoff performance it leads to people coming out defending him, not you specifically

I'm fine with ehlers on the team, he is a good player... if he won't sign though he needs to be traded, I'm just annoyed at the people who overrate the shit out of him, you know the people that are now claiming it will tank the franchise if we trade him

I have been defending him when he has been attacked, though I concede his performance was not good. But I question attacking him when the whole team was bad. After that performance I don't want to single out any player's poor play.

I don't know if there were any good enough to be excepted from the criticism either. KC and Scheif at least scored at about their normal rates. I don't know about their net effects. Maybe Morrissey was good.

A little hyperbole there, I think. I haven't seen anyone claim trading Ehlers will tank the franchise. I think we lose that trade, at least short term. But we will get something. If futures, we could benefit in the long term.

 

[Adam da bomb]

I have been defending him when he has been attacked, though I concede his performance was not good. But I question attacking him when the whole team was bad. After that performance I don't want to single out any player's poor play.

I don't know if there were any good enough to be excepted from the criticism either. KC and Scheif at least scored at about their normal rates. I don't know about their net effects. Maybe Morrissey was good.

A little hyperbole there, I think. I haven't seen anyone claim trading Ehlers will tank the franchise. I think we lose that trade, at least short term. But we will get something. If futures, we could benefit in the long term.

I don’t know how you can’t argue Lowry and kc were good. Kc stepped up his defensive game, which is exactly what you want players to do in the playoffs. If everyone played slightly better than they did in the regular season we’d be further ahead.
It wasn’t enough as kc is no Rantanen.
Actually there are several players I think can be exempt from criticism and just because we lost and our stars weren’t good enough, doesn’t mean everyone played bad. Names I thought had a good series. Miller and perfetti when they drew in had good games.
Schief, ehlers, Helly, toffoli, mono were disappointing.
Stanley was a head scratcher as he is not good enough but he wasn’t a disappointment, because he’s not good enough, but, that’s on the coach for playing him over better options.
Brossoit didn’t play much if at all so is exempt.

 

[Dale53130]

A little hyperbole there, I think. I haven't seen anyone claim trading Ehlers will tank the franchise. I think we lose that trade, at least short term. But we will get something. If futures, we could benefit in the long term.

You might have missed it, but one poster pretty much said so.

As an aside, even though I can disagree with some of your views, I see you as an independent.

 

[DRW204]

Yup they were both absolutely gone after last season and then Chevy re-signed them both. Ehlers could get re-signed just as easily or he will get traded , one of the two things will absolutely happen, Chevy won't just let Ehlers walk for nothing.

i know folks love the idea of trading him an off-season early as a ufa-1 but just has never really been the Jets MO... here's a list of some of the UFA-1 players of similar age, who were still on the roster at TC preceding their UFA-1 years: dillon, demelo, frolik, ladd, buff, myers, chiarot, copp..... buff extended of course, ladd and copp went at the tdls. idk if you classify trouba or pld in the same group since they were still unsigned RFAs at the time they were traded. idk if they deal ehlers this summer

 

[Dale53130]

The 'weakness' we are talking about here is his lack of PO performance. I think it is hard to zero in on any 1 player when the whole team is as bad as it has been. OTOH as one of the top players on the team, he is one we look to for on ice leadership.

I spent a couple of hours yesterday, combing through all of Ehles' playoff games, going through every line he played on, and his linemates had poor results playing with him. Their "success", generally came from PP time, away from him.

He's a glorified puck possession player. When Ehlers ranks near the top of the league in various metrics, he's "one of these guys is not like the other, c'mon, can you tell which one", mistakenly lumped in with ACTUALLY great players.. He can get away with it in the regular season. He's the pipeline, and all the opposition has to do is turn him off once the playoffs start. It's that easy.

His linemates are at his mercy. He's the one with the puck.

Ehlers is not a leader, and he's going to fall off a cliff once he hits 30. Why on Earth would you want to re-sign him?

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I don’t know how you can’t argue Lowry and kc were good. Kc stepped up his defensive game, which is exactly what you want players to do in the playoffs. If everyone played slightly better than they did in the regular season we’d be further ahead.
It wasn’t enough as kc is no Rantanen.
Actually there are several players I think can be exempt from criticism and just because we lost and our stars weren’t good enough, doesn’t mean everyone played bad. Names I thought had a good series. Miller and perfetti when they drew in had good games.
Schief, ehlers, Helly, toffoli, mono were disappointing.
Stanley was a head scratcher as he is not good enough but he wasn’t a disappointment, because he’s not good enough, but, that’s on the coach for playing him over better options.
Brossoit didn’t play much if at all so is exempt.

I'm not arguing that they were good or not. I'm not singling out any players either way. I concede that there were a few players who were not as bad as the rest.

Speaking of Brossoit not playing, the only one I see singling out for criticism is the coach.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

guess were using +/- as a stat again

That is 5 v 5. Not the same as NHL +/-. Slightly better.