Winnipeg Jets going into the 24/25 season

[Dale53130]

I think the concern with KC has always been his allergy to helping out in the D zone. It is not the best stat I know but how can he be the ONLY regular player on the team this year that is a minus player? His centre was +19.

Yes, he was horrible in his own end this year, and the worst on the team. I'm (almost) always PO with his defensive play in private, and pretty much gave up on him as a player around March of this year. And it's not just this year, but this was a carry over from the 2nd half of last year, not to mention that he's never been good in his own end; to say the least.

But... I thought that he showed signs down the stretch (in that 8-game winning streak) of the regular season, and in the 5-game shellacking, I almost never thought of him being a problem in that regard. I can't think of any other stretch of his career, where I wasn't panicking about his play in his own end. It was refreshing.

I'm still skeptical if he'll carry that over to the beginning of next season, and won't need to be reminded again. But there are signs that his defensive play (slightly below average is a start) might be turning around.

 

[WolfHouse]

We had a known bad piece in Stanley, and we didn't replace him with other options. That's inexcusable, regardless of what you think of Kovacevic and Chisholm.

It is worrying to see people defend the model based on the top picks in the early 2010s making it in. Of course you're going to hit more often, when you're replacing shit with high-end prospects with a higher likelihood of becoming NHLers.

But basically ever since 2015, our drafting has been a total waste of time. Five NHLers (+Chisholm and Kovacevic blundered away) in nine drafts is just awful, and given the amount of terrible filler players we have messed with over the years, that cannot all be attributed to having a deeper lineup. Someone is not doing their job properly.


If you go 81-17, who is the RW on that line? I reckon we'd need a strong playmaker there, no?

If we are draft and develop then play connor-gus-perfetti at least for preseason and a few games...

 

[Adam da bomb]

Sure but Scheifele is probably on the ice at the same time, no?

Regardless, Connor is poor defensively. He needs to be paired with a smart 200 foot C.

Although he has begun making more of an effort at end of season and in playoffs. If he makes gradual improvements he’ll be no worse than ehlers defensively.

Yes, he was horrible in his own end this year, and the worst on the team. I'm (almost) always PO with his defensive play in private, and pretty much gave up on him as a player around March of this year. And it's not just this year, but this was a carry over from the 2nd half of last year, not to mention that he's never been good in his own end; to say the least.

But... I thought that he showed signs down the stretch (in that 8-game winning streak) of the regular season, and in the 5-game shellacking, I almost never thought of him being a problem in that regard. I can't think of any other stretch of his career, where I wasn't panicking about his play in his own end. It was refreshing.

I'm still skeptical if he'll carry that over to the beginning of next season, and won't need to be reminded again. But there are signs that his defensive play (slightly below average is a start) might be turning around.

Giving up on him defensively makes sense, but in short po he was one of our better players so to give up on him as a player is something else.

 

[Dale53130]

Although he has begun making more of an effort at end of season and in playoffs. If he makes gradual improvements he’ll be no worse than ehlers defensively.


Giving up on him defensively makes sense, but in short po he was one of our better players so to give up on him as a player is something else.

I felt that that he had something to prove in the playoffs too, and I thought offensively (amongst forwards), he was our best player (irrespective of points). If he had 3 points in 5 games for example, I still thought he was bringing it. It's strange that he played well defensively (all things considered), and the team didn't.

He even delivered a pretty nice check.

All of the things I was souring on (other than defense), he addressed over the past month. A complete 180.

 

[Adam da bomb]

I felt that that he had something to prove in the playoffs too, and I thought offensively, he was our best player (irrespective of points). If he had 3 points in 5 games for example, I still thought he was bringing it. It's strange that he played well defensively (all things considered), and the team didn't.

He even delivered a pretty nice check.

All of the things I was souring on (other than defense), he addressed over the past month. A complete 180.

Like you I don’t trust it to last and will believe him playing d when I see it and then I’ll think it’s a one off, but, in post season he showed that it is theoretically possible for him to play defence.

 

[Buffdog]

TNSE has really drifted away from draft and develop... Chevy kind of broke his own slow and steady rule when he signed Pionk to that monster contract and traded for Schmidt - there had to be more behind the scenes...

Kova was just coming off a big season with the moose and Heinola was chomping at the bit... those signings were high danger swings (and it turns out misses) that cost the org.... then add the Stanley insanity year after year - just to develop a fringe 3rd pairing player...

Jets basically swapped Kovacevic for Capo... but we didn't need another leftie. Then the lack of effort to hide Chisholm was baffling when they needed a conditioning stint for a couple weeks to make it to TD... then we trade for Miller for 'depth'

I don't see the draft develop plan anymore - even Samberg should have been given more of a shot earlier... we've traded a lot of draft capital for plugs...

Th reason they went out and got Dillon and Schmidt was because the season before we had a steady diet of Lucas Sbisa and company. Kova and Heinola weren't ready yet and nobody wanted to se more Beaulieu

At the time, the trades were generally well liked on here. Of course we can play the hindsight games, but I'm not sure the point in doing so

 

[10Ducky10]

He played top pairing in LA for a while too... I'd honestly put him with Dillon or samberg anyway - but he's the offensive dman that pionk was supposed to be

I'd lower the prospect from heinola to kuzmin maybe

LA's 1RHD is Doughty.

I'd go for Pulock.

 

[scelaton]

And when I have to read these "suggestions" over and over again and then respond "gratuitously" as you put it then some how that is a problem? Come on.

I will share something else with you.

I don't think there really isn't anything wrong with this team. I think this team is exactly what the ownership wants it to be. A team that is capable of making the playoffs year after year and then maybe with a bit of luck we make a run in those playoffs. I think they need to make a tweak or two on defense and I think they have the assets to make something happen there for next year. But other then that I am fine with how things are moving forward

It's a problem because it sets a standard for how others respond to perfectly legitimate points of view that don't align with yours/theirs.

FWIW, I don't think ownership is just satisfied with making the playoffs and especially losing out so early almost every time. Chipman wants more, IMO, and will turn over every stone to get better. Each stone, big and small, represents a decision and we get to turn them over on this board too. Or do we?

 

[Thechozen1]

There’s speculation on the Canucks board that the Canucks are likely signing Zadorov and potentially moving on from Hronek to afford keeping Zadorov.

 

[10Ducky10]

There’s speculation on the Canucks board that the Canucks are likely signing Zadorov and potentially moving on from Hronek to afford keeping Zadorov.

Good drugs in BC.

 

[Royale With Cheese]

It's discouraging to read this gratuitous response, because obviously the posters never implied that at all.

Most teams (and organizations) are built by a continuous series of small moves over time. The small decisions add up, especially for a franchise like the Jets, which has no superstar forwards like MacKinnon and is shunned by FAs.

Outside our top pair, the decisions made re which D to keep and how to deploy them are fair game for criticism. The same goes for forward deployment, tho it wasn't as obvious in the Avalanche series.

That's like a few of his posts. And he's a mod. Nice.

 

[DRW204]

There’s speculation on the Canucks board that the Canucks are likely signing Zadorov and potentially moving on from Hronek to afford keeping Zadorov.

i don't think Hronek has had a very good year. not sure if he's a player to make a long-term bet on. Zadorov probably doesn't cost as much in dollars or term compared to Hronek, and given the usual scarcity of RD, Hronek may be overvalued in trades.

 

[tbcwpg]

Maybe -- but part of the job of a draft and develop org is to pay enough attention to those prospects in order to see what they might have, and provide opportunities accordingly. We may not know what he was, but they should -- that's part of what they're paid for.

And Moose watchers were well aware of Johnny K's abilities as a big, smart, tough and mobile D -- he was talked about in exactly those terms.

I'm not mourning him as the one who got away, but IMO a small-market club finds success by getting the small things right. Capable RHD aren't easy to find in this league, and he was found money.

I think it's fair to say that the org's fixation on Stan has cost them. Now maybe he'll continue to grow into that dominant big man on D they thought he might be when they drafted him, but he'll be 26 going into next season, so time is running out, and even if he and Kovy are evens, Stan plays a less important position with more internal competition. The team needs true RHD, and will now have to spend assets for one

Anyway, there's Salmo, and he looks great. Maybe he'll be ready in time for Pionk's expiring or renegotiated contract.

As far as AHL success goes, there are lots of guys who are great AHL players that can't stick in the NHL. The Moose before the Jets came back were loaded with guys like that. I think they looked at what they had and what Kovacevic offered and decided Kovacevic didn't offer anything that wasn't already here, or at least at a level that would be impactful. I don't think they expected him to be claimed.

I'd say the organization's stubbornness with Stanley has cost them more on ice with being overplayed beyond his talent than it has with potential others being claimed off waivers by other teams.

I think if Kovacevic or Chisholm are the RD they'd still be spending assets on trying to find "true RHD" because they aren't moving the needle. Kovacevic got ice time with a horrible team and Chisholm has looked replacement level in his short time with Minnesota. Maybe he'll amount to something a bit better but if they're on this team playing over O
Pionk or Stanley I'm not sure this team is any better off. In fact I'd probably suggest Pionk is the best of the 4 but just massively overpaid for what he does.

Agree on Solomonsson I have hopes for him.

 

[Zhamnov5GoalGame]

I don't think you'll have much luck trading Pionk without attaching draft assets to get rid of him but that should be priority number 1. We won't do it but a buyout should be a consideration. No single player has caused more negative outcomes for the team than Neal. It was comical how bad he was and how he elevated his suckatude in the playoffs. I'm sure were stuck with him.

I loved Monahan in the regular season and HATED him in the playoffs.
I'm not sure how that improves if we sign him (likely to a big raise to keep him).

Ehlers probably shouldn't sign with us based on our usage of him, and frankly I'm not sure he can help us win in the playoffs anyways. As much as I am entertained by his skill set and as much joy (at times) as he's brought to us it's likely time for him to go somewhere else.

I have this feeling that come November/December that we'll be in a good spot in the Central and the West but that nervous feeling of things going off the rails in the second half and playoff bed wetting will remain.

Teams lose badly in the first round all the time but this particular stench doesn't seem to be coming out in the wash.

 

[JetsUK]

As far as AHL success goes, there are lots of guys who are great AHL players that can't stick in the NHL. The Moose before the Jets came back were loaded with guys like that. I think they looked at what they had and what Kovacevic offered and decided Kovacevic didn't offer anything that wasn't already here, or at least at a level that would be impactful. I don't think they expected him to be claimed.

I'd say the organization's stubbornness with Stanley has cost them more on ice with being overplayed beyond his talent than it has with potential others being claimed off waivers by other teams.

I think if Kovacevic or Chisholm are the RD they'd still be spending assets on trying to find "true RHD" because they aren't moving the needle. Kovacevic got ice time with a horrible team and Chisholm has looked replacement level in his short time with Minnesota. Maybe he'll amount to something a bit better but if they're on this team playing over O
Pionk or Stanley I'm not sure this team is any better off. In fact I'd probably suggest Pionk is the best of the 4 but just massively overpaid for what he does.

Agree on Solomonsson I have hopes for him.

Agree for the most part on Stan -- think it's a combo of opp cost / on-ice results but hopefully it's resolved soon.

Chisholm isn't an issue for me.

And agree on Salmo. He's a probable impact player filling a need and they are going to work hard with him in dev and opportunities.

Pionk as a 3rd-pairing guy with spot special teams duty is fine for sure. Hopefully that day arrives.

 

[Thechozen1]

i don't think Hronek has had a very good year. not sure if he's a player to make a long-term bet on. Zadorov probably doesn't cost as much in dollars or term compared to Hronek, and given the usual scarcity of RD, Hronek may be overvalued in trades.

Yeah the talk was how he hasn’t been able to carry his pairing while Zadorov has been a beast for them in all zones.

Likely just their fans throwing around wild speculation like we do here, but he can’t be worse than what the Jets are running on the right side. Would be worth considering if they could get out of the Schmidt and Pionk contracts.

 

[Wedgeden]

I always say I won't read social media Jets page comments and Facebook always sends them to my feeds. Then I open it and more get sent..
Anyway... so many people who want to get rid of Demelo and either put 3 or 4 rookie defensemen on the team which would be a disaster or they assume that other teams are going to trade away their big mobile defensemen like they grow on trees.
Demelo who was second overall in plus/minus playing against other teams' top lines.

 

[Eyeseeing]

I don't think there really isn't anything wrong with this team. I think this team is exactly what the ownership wants it to be. A team that is capable of making the playoffs year after year and then maybe with a bit of luck we make a run in those playoffs. I think they need to make a tweak or two on defense and I think they have the assets to make something happen there for next year. But other then that I am fine with how things are moving forward

How is this working out for the organization?
Stuck in its ways, good but not good enough.
Play it safe all the time and never improving, actually it could said we are getting worse playoff performances.
Or as you say with a bit of luck we might do something.
It’s ok to be a fan and criticize the team.
This is part of the territory for the GM and ownership.
It’s interesting to see how others perceive this situation.

 

[Buffdog]

How is this working out for the organization?
Stuck in its ways, good but not good enough.
Play it safe all the time and never improving, actually it could said we are getting worse playoff performances.
Or as you say with a bit of luck we might do something.
It’s ok to be a fan and criticize the team.
This is part of the territory for the GM and ownership.
It’s interesting to see how others perceive this situation.

I feel like that if you're gonna call for change just for changes sake, you lose the right to complain if things get even worse. Because it's very possible

 

[Eyeseeing]

I feel like that if you're gonna call for change just for changes sake, you lose the right to complain if things get even worse. Because it's very possible

It’s not a change just for the sake of change.
Would you make changes to your retirement plans if the returns were stagnant?
Of course you would.
That comes with risk, but most people would do that.
TNSE found out this season that attendance was down.
Of course there are many reasons for that, but the last few seasons were part of it for sure.
TNSE is in the business of sports entertainment and success on the ice translates to success on the spreadsheet.
So change can be a good thing.

 

[Heldig]

Good drugs in BC.

Yes, yes there are.

 

[SteakTips]

Jets are actually never going very far in the playoffs until they get players who are competitive with the best. Right now Jets top line would only be a 2nd line on a good team, Jets 2nd line would only be a serviceable 3rd line on an average team, and Jets 3rd line would only be a marginal 4th line on an average team. Winnipeg just does not attract the star power to compete in the league, and as long as Jets stay in Winnipeg it is very unlikely they will have a roster that goes further than the 1st round in the playoffs. As soon as draft picks get good enough they will move to a more favorable market, and the growth of the draft picks remains stunted on the Jets due to the lack of good quality players and coaches to mentor and grow them.

 

[SteakTips]

To make them better, I think you need to trade Ehlers and Connor. Both of those players are figure skaters and do not go to the hard areas on offence. They do not have the right intestinal fortitude for the NHL playoffs. Additionally a number of useless defensemen need to go, particularly ones that score on themselves. The problem is you will not find better players that are willing to go to Winnipeg, so it is really hard to make this team better.

 

[Heldig]

Jets are actually never going very far in the playoffs until they get players who are competitive with the best. Right now Jets top line would only be a 2nd line on a good team, Jets 2nd line would only be a serviceable 3rd line on an average team, and Jets 3rd line would only be a marginal 4th line on an average team. Winnipeg just does not attract the star power to compete in the league, and as long as Jets stay in Winnipeg it is very unlikely they will have a roster that goes further than the 1st round in the playoffs. As soon as draft picks get good enough they will move to a more favorable market, and the growth of the draft picks remains stunted on the Jets due to the lack of good quality players and coaches to mentor and grow them.

This crappy roster finished 4th overall. Yes, we are all ticked off at the brutal playoff results but this take is BAD.

 

[Buffdog]

It’s not a change just for the sake of change.
Would you make changes to your retirement plans if the returns were stagnant?
Of course you would.
That comes with risk, but most people would do that.
TNSE found out this season that attendance was down.
Of course there are many reasons for that, but the last few seasons were part of it for sure.
TNSE is in the business of sports entertainment and success on the ice translates to success on the spreadsheet.
So change can be a good thing.

Stagnant?

We finished 4th in the league, improved from the year before