Post-Game Talk: Wild @ Caps 7PM EST | Caps Lose 2-1

[g00n]

Watch the goal that everybody has been/will blame on Mike Green.

3 forwards standing flat footed in the neutral zone, even after the puck left our zone. I saw Ward, so I'm assuming its the 25/16/42 line.

People are blaming Green because of two failed exit attempts that were probably made more complicated than they needed to be, which is a known flaw in his game at times. When the first one blows up the forwards can't just keep skating into the offensive zone without the puck. They have to turn around and come back, and start the breakout again. Were they actually flatfooted or put in a position where they had to retreat and wait because Green fumbled the puck and failed to exit twice? How much room are they going to get to swoop around in a clogged neutral zone?

 

[Mothra]

... that's because what Green provides offensively (going to get 45-50 points this season) is what a second line guy would provide anyways. Why pay a second line guy who gets 45-50 points 4-6 million/season when you can just sign Green and get that production in Green who not only does that already -but also has proven to be pretty good on the 3rd line D.

First off....lets slow down on how many points 52 will get this season. Assuming he doesnt get injured again he has to put up what, almost a point per game to reach 50? Adding to that he currently has 15 PP points, if he is not on the top PP unit it makes it more unlikely he reaches that number

He doesnt generate the offense for this team.....i know the pro-52 crowd likes to think he is taking the puck and rushing it up ice, making dazzling plays, and setting up teammates like only he can do....but thats not reality. You make it sound like the Caps go as 52 goes, when it really the exact opposite.

Having 52 on the 3rd pairing isnt going to offset the lack of offensive push on the 2nd/3rd lines...it just isnt....which is what you are saying will happen

Right now our goals per game is 6th in NHL and goals against is 6th in the NHL. Our defense is 3rd in the NHL in scoring, which is also doing the job defensively. That's pretty good and we've needed it. If our D goes from Green's close to 40 points on the year to someone with 15 - that brings our goals per game to 15th in the NHL. That's a huge drop off.

Again...in this example you are replacing 52 with a traditional 3rd pair player...but not factoring in another forward to be brought in

Green had a terrible game changing turnover today. I'm not defending it. It was a lazy unacceptable play that late in the game. I 100% agree. However, lets not think he didn't help hold the 3rd line and be the reason the 3rd line hasn't been a liability for most of the season too.

Team success doesnt hinge on your 3rd pairing D...you make it out like he is some vital key. The play he made tonight....its expected, he does that. For some reason he is the only D on this team that cant regularly find someone to pass to (wearing a Caps jersey) on the breakout

Trust me... I'd love to find a way to get two All Star caliber players on the 2nd line, but I just don't see it out there... that's why I believe keeping Green is just the best way to have a for sure chance of contending again. If we lose Green it's not like that just means we're going to go get a superstar 1st or 2nd line guy in his place. For one, we can't afford it. Two, there's none available this summer.

This is what I dont get....you say they have money to re-sign 52, thats at least 6 mil.....but not enough to bring in a forward. How do any of us know who is available in the offseason?

 

[ChibiPooky]

This is not the Mike Green thread.

 

[Roughing]

He had 3 or 4 premium chances.... better then the rest of the team.

Sure. And he missed them ALL. So, he was clearly not he best "shooter". Your word.

 

[hockeykicker]

And now, no more Alex Ovechkin. Took a slap shot during warmups, skated over to Trotz, chatted for a brief moment and left the ice. Per Twitter. On phone cant post it for some reason

 

[Vladiator16*]

yep need to get rid of that mike green guy, his 1 high leverage turnover every 70 games is really what's holding them back..

guys that handle the puck are going to turn it over every now and then, fyi. his situational awareness was super awful here, not sure why he was forcing the issue, but god forbid somebody tries to make a play to generate offense. If you're only scoring 1 at home, there's a good chance that you have other issues outside of your 3rd pairing defenseman.

The Burakovsky thing is ridiculous, even if you're ignoring the advanced stats sheet, he was optically your best forward. When he was on the ice, they were playing in the offensive zone a lot more than they weren't. The preconceived Trotz notion that the younger guys can't play in crunch time is going to, and has already, cost this team more games than Mike Green ever will.

I cant agree more... even though MG turns it over a bit more often then you stated, but in general thats pretty much how i feel...

This might be an unpopular opinion, but i think, as good as Trotz has been for OV and the team in general, his treatment of young (probably in his view unproven players) is downright atrocious... Last year in Nashville Forsberg couldn't get on the ice to save his life, this year he is a superstar, granted, past off season he apparently hit the gym, but realistically, can 1 summer make this much of a difference? Dont get me wrong, Trotz is a good coach, and by far superior to anything we had in the past few years, but i believe for this team Laviolette would've been better. Just look at what is happening to Bura and Kuz...
Also, reading through the thread apparently some fans feel that we have some weak, useless, euro duds on our hands in Bura and Kuz. Never mind that the coach has them on "chihuahua leash" and they are probably afraid to make a mistake instead of trying to create, and thats, imo, what they are here for... so yeah, lets run the only skilled players (after Nick and OV) out of town in their first year with the team, because we have such an abundance of those. Lets give them a stigma of weak and useless so anytime one of them ****s up we can all say i told you so, instead of being a bit more patient, with rookies that trying to adjust to a life in a foreign country and a very different (NHL) game...
Also, in regards to playoffs: How did Mr. Trotz has faired in those, up to this point? I understand he didn't have OV's caliber player on offense in Nashville, but defense that bolstered Weber and Suter at the same time surely could go farther then just first round, right?
Don't get me wrong, I want Trotz to succeed, i really like him as a person, especially after seeing him off the ice in those Epic pre WC shows, and team mates seems to be sticking up for each other (as they should) but his handling of young talent is not something that i agree with, but then again he is a NHL head coach and i'm not. Lets just wait and see, PO's are just around the corner.

 

[Vladiator16*]

And now, no more Alex Ovechkin. Took a slap shot during warmups, skated over to Trotz, chatted for a brief moment and left the ice. Per Twitter. On phone cant post it for some reason

****....

 

[NoLookPass]

Sure. And he missed them ALL. So, he was clearly not he best "shooter". Your word.

ok, your right Glencross was better, and that's it.

 

[KevinM]

I cant agree more... even though MG turns it over a bit more often then you stated, but in general thats pretty much how i feel...

This might be an unpopular opinion, but i think, as good as Trotz has been for OV and the team in general, his treatment of young (probably in his view unproven players) is downright atrocious... Last year in Nashville Forsberg couldn't get on the ice to save his life, this year he is a superstar, granted, past off season he apparently hit the gym, but realistically, can 1 summer make this much of a difference? Dont get me wrong, Trotz is a good coach, and by far superior to anything we had in the past few years, but i believe for this team Laviolette would've been better. Just look at what is happening to Bura and Kuz...
Also, reading through the thread apparently some fans feel that we have some weak, useless, euro duds on our hands in Bura and Kuz. Never mind that the coach has them on "chihuahua leash" and they are probably afraid to make a mistake instead of trying to create, and thats, imo, what they are here for... so yeah, lets run the only skilled players (after Nick and OV) out of town in their first year with the team, because we have such an abundance of those. Lets give them a stigma of weak and useless so anytime one of them ****s up we can all say i told you so, instead of being a bit more patient, with rookies that trying to adjust to a life in a foreign country and a very different (NHL) game...
Also, in regards to playoffs: How did Mr. Trotz has faired in those, up to this point? I understand he didn't have OV's caliber player on offense in Nashville, but defense that bolstered Weber and Suter at the same time surely could go farther then just first round, right?
Don't get me wrong, I want Trotz to succeed, i really like him as a person, especially after seeing him off the ice in those Epic pre WC shows, and team mates seems to be sticking up for each other (as they should) but his handling of young talent is not something that i agree with, but then again he is a NHL head coach and i'm not. Lets just wait and see, PO's are just around the corner.

I don't think he's done that poorly, Burt has had some nice stretches playing in the Top 6 and Kuz was locked in as 2C for quite some time and both have had a little time on PP2. He really only limits their time if we have a lead late in the third period which is understandable even if you don't like it. Turtling on a lead is just his strategy and keeping them from going out in those situations gives them the best chance to win.

I'm more concerned about his treatment of Wilson on the fourth line, the justification for sending Burt to the AHL was if he wasn't going to be seeing lots of minutes in the NHL it's better for his development to get sent down which I agree with. Earlier in the year his plan was for Wilson to be 1RW but after the first few games he's been consistently on that fourth line. Is he not sending Wilson down to see more TOI because he doesn't see him having what it takes to be a top 6 player anymore?

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

I've never seen so much handwringing over the use of young and inexperienced players. I remember back in the 80's/90's it felt like we were lucky if the Caps had one rookie on the roster. We have what, 4? Some Of you just don't seem to get that there's a very fine line between balancing winning enough to make the playoffs somewhat comfortably and developing young guys. They ALL Have to earn their ice time, top line or 4th line no matter what. Coaching moves can be second guessed at every turn.

 

[KevinM]

They ALL Have to earn their ice time, top line or 4th line no matter what.

Except for Brouwer and Johansson

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

I've never seen so much handwringing over the use of young and inexperienced players. I remember back in the 80's/90's it felt like we were lucky if the Caps had one rookie on the roster. We have what, 4? Some Of you just don't seem to get that there's a very fine line between balancing winning enough to make the playoffs somewhat comfortably and developing young guys. They ALL Have to earn their ice time, top line or 4th line no matter what. Coaching moves can be second guessed at every turn.

The issue is that Burakovsky is the second best RW we have available. And the only guy I'd put ahead of him on the depth chart hasn't proven to be a good fit opposite Alex.

The second issue is that the scratches and shuffling up and down the lineup are doing nothing to improve him.

I'd rather he had spent the entire season in Hershey if he's not going to be awarded the NHL role he has earned.

 

[hockeykicker]

Trotz said "there's a temptation" to sit Ovechkin vs. BUF with three days between games after, but "it's not a major injury. It's minor."

 

[hockeykicker]

Orpik's will play tomorrow after his maintenance day. No structural damage for Latta, expected back next week.

 

[Vladiator16*]

I don't think he's done that poorly, Burt has had some nice stretches playing in the Top 6 and Kuz was locked in as 2C for quite some time and both have had a little time on PP2. He really only limits their time if we have a lead late in the third period which is understandable even if you don't like it. Turtling on a lead is just his strategy and keeping them from going out in those situations gives them the best chance to win.

I'm more concerned about his treatment of Wilson on the fourth line, the justification for sending Burt to the AHL was if he wasn't going to be seeing lots of minutes in the NHL it's better for his development to get sent down which I agree with. Earlier in the year his plan was for Wilson to be 1RW but after the first few games he's been consistently on that fourth line. Is he not sending Wilson down to see more TOI because he doesn't see him having what it takes to be a top 6 player anymore?

Yeah, totally forgot about Wilson. As weird as it sounds, i think Willies size and strength kind of worked against him... kind of: hey, the guy is a monster, and destroys pretty much anybody at the tender age of 20, just put him with the grinders and let him hit. On the other hand, he sort of did disappear from the score sheet as most of the rookies do once in a while... i hope he doesn't (or they don't) turn him into 4th line hitter only, i think he could be so much more then that.

 

[Vladiator16*]

Trotz said "there's a temptation" to sit Ovechkin vs. BUF with three days between games after, but "it's not a major injury. It's minor."

Sounds a lot better... thanks for your updates, man.

 

[hockeykicker]

Sounds a lot better... thanks for your updates, man.

No problem sir. I get everything from prewitt on twitter

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

Yeah, totally forgot about Wilson. As weird as it sounds, i think Willies size and strength kind of worked against him... kind of: hey, the guy is a monster, and destroys pretty much anybody at the tender age of 20, just put him with the grinders and let him hit. On the other hand, he sort of did disappear from the score sheet as most of the rookies do once in a while... i hope he doesn't (or they don't) turn him into 4th line hitter only, i think he could be so much more then that.

Wilson should have spent the entire year in Hershey in a scoring role.

 

[Mothra]

People are blaming Green because of two failed exit attempts that were probably made more complicated than they needed to be, which is a known flaw in his game at times. When the first one blows up the forwards can't just keep skating into the offensive zone without the puck. They have to turn around and come back, and start the breakout again. Were they actually flatfooted or put in a position where they had to retreat and wait because Green fumbled the puck and failed to exit twice? How much room are they going to get to swoop around in a clogged neutral zone?

this is exactly the case....he seems to be the only D on the team that regularly cant find an open man to pass to on the breakout within a stride or two...when his head is in this place, its not good.

 

[Nharris31]

Sorry, Minny is a boring team. I wish they weren't but they are.

They are a very good team, have good structure and are well coached but they are not exciting at all to watch.

They are Dale Hunter level boring to watch.

As a wild fan that was one of most boring games of the season for the wild. They couldn't get through the neutral zone at all. Obviously it doesn't help the two best defensemen on the team at transitioning the puck are out.

 

[Teppo]

As a wild fan that was one of most boring games of the season for the wild. They couldn't get through the neutral zone at all. Obviously it doesn't help the two best defensemen on the team at transitioning the puck are out.

First two periods I could barely stay awake. I can understand why the Wild have a perception of being boring (especially by a fan base that sees them only a couple of times a year), but the Caps were playing identical to the way the Wild played and they were the home team.

The fact of the matter is that without a structured defence in today's NHL you will not have success - look at all the top teams. The other thing that is often misunderstood is that you can be structured and disciplined on D, but you can also be aggressive and score a lot of goals.

 

[Langway]

Minnesota at least was capable of making plays at high-level pace. Outside of the Swede line, Washington did not.

This team is what it is and that's unlikely to significantly change in five weeks. The three games vs. NYR will be huge from a psychological standpoint. They need to prove that they can hang with them and then some.

 

[Ajax1995]

Wilson should have spent the entire year in Hershey in a scoring role.

And all of last season in Plymouth doing the same...

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

And all of last season in Plymouth doing the same...

Absolutely.

 

[hockeykicker]

You think he may be sent down all next year depending if we sign a few people or do you think he's here to stay?