Discussion in 'The History of Hockey' started by ThatOneGuy*, Jun 5, 2007.
To the Quacks?
Was Tverdovsky that good? Or did the Jets ownership just want to slash salary?
They wanted the team to re-locate to Phoenix obviously.
They wanted to slash salary and Tverdovsky was a highly touted prospect at the time.
Selanne was pissed when he was traded.
I bet he would of been.
Financially, the Pegs felt they needed to make a choice between Tkachuk and Selanne. They chose Walt. The Ducks offered Tverdovsky and Chad Kilger, both top five picks who hadn't been around long enough to show how ineffective they actually were.
Tverdovsky went on to be an All-Star and played for Team Russia as a a top defeder, and won a Cup
some people forget his better years...
True... There is too many young amateur of hockey on hfboards who didn't really watch it before 2000. Between 1995 and 2001, Oleg Tverdovsky was a good first pairing d-men in the NHL. He was just never the same after that season and never really reach his potential even if he had 3 50pts season.
Possibly has the highest ratio of Stanley Cups won to contribution of any player ever!
Zhamnov was also in the picture , Someone had to go, and at the time Kilger and Teverdosky were highly touted
I mean, I can understand Tverdovsky, but how was Kilger highly touted? Clearly I haven't seen him play, but what did he do to acquire such a reputation?
He was supposed to be a big tough scoring forward. The big and tough were right, but the scoring never translated to the bigs (really, he wasn't even that prolific in junior).
Kilger was touted as another Ron Francis possibly. No joke.
That is why I ask. I havenÂ´t seen him play of course but the numbers I checked (I know, numbers donÂ´t tell the whole story) didnÂ´t seem THAT good.
Wow, that is some would-be reputation.
It's one of those players whose physical gifts seduced scouts; he could certainly move well and had above average hands for a guy his size. And hey, the guy had been drafted 4th overall less than a year earlier, so that plus Tverdovsky must have seemed pretty good to Winnipeg.
In fact, I remember hearing a lot of people say that the Ducks overpaid and had made a big mistake in selling off their future. Too bad there wasn't Hfboards at the time, the prospects-are-everything crowd would have had a fit.
I think it was a situation where he had all the tools but hadn't put them all together, and scouts figured that he could get his skills to translate to the bigs.
He was taken 4th overall 8 months before the trade. He made the Ducks straight out of his first training camp after a huge preseason, and produced respectable numbers in limited icetime to the mid-way point of that season. His value/situation at the time would have been pretty much = to what Jordan Staal's was mid-way through last season.
Tverdovsky scored 55 points and played in the All-Star game the year following at the age of 20. Was considered the next Coffey/Niedermayer great skating/skill defender.
At the time, it was an enormous package - if you listed the top 10 under-21 talents in the league at the time, both would probably have made the list. Would be something like Jordan Staal and Jack Johnson today. But Kilger floundered immediately, and Tverdovsky had 3-4 really good years before he fell apart as well.
Kilger had 40 goals and 95 points in 62 games in his draft year. That is first line upside. And, given his size, he had scouts drooling. But, he's a perfect example of why drafting for size is stupid. It just doesn't compensate for other deficiencies, while, good skating does.
Tverdovsky had a few good offensive years, but he never could play defense.
Now correct me if I'm wrong, as I may be misreading your post...but are you saying that Kilger's lack of skating is what hurt him?
Selanne also missed 30+ games in each of the two seasons before he was traded.
No, I was saying that scouts thinking size is the same as skills like hockey sense and skating is why he was so overrated.
Kilger's struggles aren't so simple.
He did appear to have all three of size, skating, and hockey sense when he was 18-19.
Desire/work ethic was a huge problem when he was younger. Would show flashes, put strings of 15-20 games together where he looked like a top-6 talent, then regress. Note his quick starts almost everywhere he went in his career - Anaheim (on the 'Special K' line that ripped up preseason 1995), Chicago, and especially Montreal. Then he would become disinterested, fade, end up marooned on the 4th line, and dispatched to another organization.
By the time he figured out what it took to be a solid pro, he was in Toronto and nearly 30, and when you go a decade without being put in skill situations (top-6, PP icetime) your tools have faded and you aren't going to get them back. If he would have shown the dedication earlier in his career, he probably would have developed into a really nice two-way center. His 30-game stretch in Montreal in 2001, where he looked really outstanding, probably shows what could have been.
Didn't help that he was rushed, either.
if only Hfboards was around for that trade. 2 highly rated prospects for a All Star winger. Imagine the outcry.
He missed 23 games in 93-94, and 3 games in 94-95.