Why does Sweden fail so much?

[TLeafsFan]

I and about 5 million other Finns don't.

LOL, yeah I'd say that's fair.

 

[Brock Boeser]

Gotta wonder if other nations start looking to hire NHL coaches for international tournaments held on NHL ice. Looking at the Swedish roster they are all NHL players so there wouldn't be a language barrier plus the players are used to playing the systems their NHL teams use, which are probably a lot different than what an international head coach would try to set up.


Looking at other sports like soccer you see all the time national team coaches being from different countries so it isn't something farfetched.

 

[LaGu]

Gotta wonder if other nations start looking to hire NHL coaches for international tournaments held on NHL ice. Looking at the Swedish roster they are all NHL players so there wouldn't be a language barrier plus the players are used to playing the systems their NHL teams use, which are probably a lot different than what an international head coach would try to set up.


Looking at other sports like soccer you see all the time national team coaches being from different countries so it isn't something farfetched.

I wish. Keep the coaching team for the year-round activities but bring in a NA coaching team for these events, or at the very least a NA head coach.

Thinking outside the box for a team playing the same way for years and years would be agood start.

 

[Drij]

Because their team was build like ikea furniture?

 

[Dazed and Confused]

Coaching is a big issue.

If I had to guess why, I'd say it's because it difficult to bring in a "national" coach who likely spends little to no time with or watching his players, and then expect everything to fall into place. The vanilla system is likely due to the coach not knowing his roster, and instead of utilizing its strengths, tries to play it safe.

Babcock at least spends his time game planing around Crosby and such to know what he's getting into. The players also get to play against Babcock's teams and see how they work. Grönborg likely just has reputation and highlight packs to go by. Not to say he's a good coach, but it's definitely a massive issue to deal with.

If all/most of your roster is NHL based, perhaps a more NHL-centric coaching staff is needed.

 

[WingsFan95]

So out of the last 7 big tournaments, Sweden has 1 Gold and Silver.

Okay. Czech has 1 Gold.

And Canada has the rest.

World Championships have nice variety.

 

[Epsilon]

So out of the last 7 big tournaments, Sweden has 1 Gold and Silver.

Okay. Czech has 1 Gold.

And Canada has the rest.

World Championships have nice variety.

Canada only has 4 out of 7, USA has 1 win along with Sweden and the Czech Republic.

 

[LaGu]

Coaching is a big issue.

If I had to guess why, I'd say it's because it difficult to bring in a "national" coach who likely spends little to no time with or watching his players, and then expect everything to fall into place. The vanilla system is likely due to the coach not knowing his roster, and instead of utilizing its strengths, tries to play it safe.

Babcock at least spends his time game planing around Crosby and such to know what he's getting into. The players also get to play against Babcock's teams and see how they work. Grönborg likely just has reputation and highlight packs to go by. Not to say he's a good coach, but it's definitely a massive issue to deal with.

If all/most of your roster is NHL based, perhaps a more NHL-centric coaching staff is needed.

I agree in principle, but you are most likely wrong about him not knowing his players. They spend lots of tike in NA and it would be wrong to think they are going off high light reels to study up on their players. Grönborg didn't participate in the iihf world championships this year because he was working on preparations for the world cup, so I am pretty confident that they spent enough time preparing, the question of course is how they used that time.

The problem is coaching tough, there I agree. I think they want to (and do) use the Swedish model which has worked in the past. Calm, secure defensive and then trust that your star fwds pot a couple. Problem is of course that they need to be relying much more on the D for offense seeing how that team is built and where its strenghts are.

 

[Benedict Kovalchuk]

Canada only has 4 out of 7, USA has 1 win along with Sweden and the Czech Republic.

Which? As far as I know the USA hasn't won a senior tournament in over 20 years.

 

[Epsilon]

Which? As far as I know the USA hasn't won a senior tournament in over 20 years.

Did I miscount? Working backwards:

2014 Olympics: Canada
2010 Olympics: Canada
2006 Olympics: Sweden
2004 World Cup: Canada
2002 Olympics: Canada
1998 Olympics: Czech Republic
1996 World Cup: USA

Is something missing that's just slipping my mind?

 

[Canuck21t]

I think it has got better from the 2014 Olympics and onwards. Canada was a tough opponnent in the Olympics (especially with some key players missing) and Price played like a God in that tournament. Yesterday's loss against Team Europe wasn't as bad as people seem to think. Europe has been playing good the whole tournament and I doubt that Sweden would've won against Canada anyway.

I'd say that the top 6 best on best rankings are something like this:
1. Canada
2. Sweden
3. USA (they would've been way better without the NA U23 team)
4. Russia
5. Finland (just wait until the juniors are top notch NHL players)
6. Czech Republic

What?!? Price was hardly tested in 2014 since Canada mostly played in the attacking zone; all off Canada's opponents barely had good chances in the Canadian zone.

 

[babylonzoo]

Canada only has 4 out of 7, USA has 1 win along with Sweden and the Czech Republic.

Canada has more if you factor in the Canada cups

 

[sr edler]

They need a good scorer with killer instinct. An egotistical shoot first player.

Like a Markus Näslund but not Markus Näslund, if that makes sense.

 

[Laineux]

Hmm? Sweden was the second best national team in this tournament.

Starting from 2006 there have been 4 best on bests.

Sweden has finished 1, 5, 2, 2.

 

[Senor Catface]

So they can learn to pick themselves up.

I appreciated the quote, Mr. Wayne.

 

[Tulipunaruusu*]

Gotta wonder if other nations start looking to hire NHL coaches for international tournaments held on NHL ice. Looking at the Swedish roster they are all NHL players so there wouldn't be a language barrier plus the players are used to playing the systems their NHL teams use, which are probably a lot different than what an international head coach would try to set up.

https://blog.paf.com/petterisihvonen/

"Even the Swedes didn't keep the identity of their own making. Tre Kronor, played as everyone, some sort of modified-NHL."

The Leading One put it the best. NHL is so unimaginative cloning league that you get no advantage from following their (in most cases) tactically poor, on all fronts unified ice hockey. Leading One points out that only Team Europe had a non-NHL identity in this World Cup: Finland and Sweden did not.

Under Kustaa II Adolf Sweden in 17th century created an identity for all team sports to follow. Where was that?

 

[Tmu84]

World Cup 96, loss against Canada in semifinal.

Olympics 98, loss against Finland in qf.

Olympics 2002, loss against Belarus in qf.

World Cup 2004, loss against Czech in qf.

Olympics 2010, loss against Slovakia in qf.

Olympics 2014, loss against Canada in final.

World Cup 2016, loss against Team Eu in semifinal.


How is it possible to fail so often with so good teams?

My take on it, is that Sweden is playing to non-physical and with to little energy.

Seriously, as a Finn, there is no way Swedes should feel they have underachieved in any way in last 20 years. They do have the gold from 2006. And Canada, as others have mentioned, is on a level of it's own. Sadly other countries can't do anything about it . So I have no problems saying Sweden is clearly #2 now followed by the rest. Losing to a gimmick team in semi-finals (World Cup 2016) changes absolutely nothing.

What?!? Price was hardly tested in 2014 since Canada mostly played in the attacking zone; all off Canada's opponents barely had good chances in the Canadian zone.

Agreed. I think when it comes to 2014 Olympics, Canada could have played with Vesa Toskala and they still would have won gold. Probably. Ok, maybe not a shutout against Sweden. But still.

 

[vippe]

They lack intensity. It's a team full of Ryan's (hue hue hue)

I mean, outside of Backstrom, Hornqvist and Hagelin it was a total lackluster effort by every single forward on the team. The loss of Rakell hurt more than it should have. He's giving it all 100% of the time.

 

[Pyromaniac]

Sweden desperately needs better forward talent. It was sad to watch them throw out the Sedins in OT after how ineffective they were this past season. They have to hope that all of E. Lindholm, W. Nylander, A. Nylander, Burakowsky and Forsberg all reach their max potential. So far the only ones I have a reasonable degree of confidence will reach their full potential are William and Forsberg. Compare that to the young forward talent coming for the other countries and Sweden looks very lackluster.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

I am actually impressed they made it this far this tourney but then again the Finns and Americans were nothing special so you expected Sweden to make the finals, not surprised they lost to Europe tho.

Their forward talent took an enormous hit with Alfredsson and Zetterberg gone. Let alone Sundin back from 06'.

They have yet to replace that talent. Backstrom is phenomenal but the Sedins are on the decline(even though they carried a lot of the offense too this year, if not half). There needs to be an influx of star talent forwards to help Backstrom. Nylander bothers could help and Forsberg playing better. Landeskog has been a let down, smh.

Berglund playing a key role on any of your top 2 PPs is already a red flag, imo.

 

[Ben Matlock]

World Cup 96, loss against Canada in semifinal.

Olympics 98, loss against Finland in qf.

Olympics 2002, loss against Belarus in qf.

World Cup 2004, loss against Czech in qf.

Olympics 2010, loss against Slovakia in qf.

Olympics 2014, loss against Canada in final.

World Cup 2016, loss against Team Eu in semifinal.

One of these is not like the others; the one that was actually a shameful fail. Then you have two somewhat surprising losses against solid teams. The rest are neither. On the other hand you managed to win the Olympic final against the best playing team of the tournament in 2006.

 

[Laineux]

What team, other than Canada, does not "fail" then?

Only Finland has done better than expected. Not in this tourney though, obviously.

 

[InGusWeTrust]

Just a team with no finish.

I see what you did there...

 

[Epsilon]

Canada has more if you factor in the Canada cups

Well yeah, but the discussion was about the last 7, which I presume meant 1996 World Cup onwards.

 

[Hybbe]

Failing by what standards? I don't consider making the finals at the Olympics or losing in the semi finals during this tournament failing. At what point are people gong to admit that other teams are no longer collapsing and that Team Europe actually outperforming their expectations?

I don't see Sweden as failing at all. I think they put together a decent team and have a promising future.

Agreed, reactionary hyperbole from the OP, but losing against Team Europe was still definitely a failure. To me it felt like someone was holding the reins on them and refused to let go pretty much all throughout the tournament, but particularly against Europe.