Who is to blame most for the Buffalo Sabres current state of affairs?

[Bobby Bottle Service]

Voted for Terry, though it's really a split between him and GMKA.

Meatballs is trying his best. The players like him. It's up to others to see/decide/admit that Donnie is not the right person for the job.

 

[paulmm3]

I originally voted for Terry Pegula for the meddling and the sequence of poor decision after poor decision. Then I went back and changed my vote to "the players". I believe we'd have squeaked into the playoffs this year if it wasn't for the inconsistent effort.

 

[Nikolajs Sillers]

All of it.

 

[Tatanka]

Players don’t draft themselves, trade themselves or demote themselves. They are accumulated by gm’s who do not hire or fire themselves and are assigned roles by coaches ho again do not hire or fire themselves. All the issues stem from a lack of a clear goal that winning is the top priority. That has not been established. Instead we have been told that an effective, efficient and cost effective organization is the goal. None of the player, coaching or general management issues can ever be analyzed with respect to what fans want, i.e. winning, until that is the message sent from the top. Until that changes, the rest is somewhat irrelevant and any post season appearances will largely be the result of luck. For these reasons I voted for the booing fans. Jk.

 

[TageGod]

Results surprised me. Same GM same Coach, massive discrepancy in performance. I voted for the players, they all sucked. No one looked like themselves for 80% of the season.

 

[WiHockeyGuy]

Starts at the top with T. Pegula.

 

[kirby11]

All the issues with the franchise as a whole start and end with Pegula, but for this season in particular, everyone else (Adams, Granato, and the players) also has a decent amount of blame to share.

 

[Mattilaus]

Results surprised me. Same GM same Coach, massive discrepancy in performance. I voted for the players, they all sucked. No one looked like themselves for 80% of the season.

I suppose the counter argument is how do you know last year they looked like themselves and this year they sucked vs. Them overachieveing last year and this year they look like themselves.

Not arguing that, just wondering how you determined that their performance last year is their real selves for a bunch of them. We don't have adequate sample sizes for a bunch and for a few others last year looks like the outlier when looking at career results.

 

[brian_griffin]

I implore people to go watch Terry Pegulas last press conference for the Sabres (back in 2020).

He said he was going to go lean. He said he didn’t do a GM search because Kevyn Adams always did his other tasks well.

They didn’t do a real coaching search and hired Granato.

He installed Kim (then himself) as the president.

Besides Taylor Hall, he’s shown zero interest in spending money on the Sabres since then. If you disagree, I have two words - Ben Bishop.

Yeah, Adams is unqualified and inexperienced. Yeah, our coaching staff isn’t the best. But this is what Terry wanted. A stripped down version of the Sabres to stop the bleeding of money.

It’s on him, 100%.

Not arguing, just curious…what’s the knock about Ben Bishop? We used cap space to have him under the umbrella and then allowed him to go be a coach or something somewhere else, that’s all I remember.

Instead of paying money for real NHL talent, before NHL free agency even started we traded for Ben Bishop's contract, who had a very low cash value for the final year of his contract. We ended up paying something around 150k (since his contract was insured) for 4.9m cap hit, so we could be over the cap floor.

They're complaining because they knew he'd be LTIR with insurance paying most of the actual costs so they could artificially reach the cap floor while saving millions

While all the above is true, not clear to me the Bishop trade is/was 100% impugning to Pegula's cheapness. If, e.g., Tampa or Vegas or Toronto signed Bishop pre-draft then many observers might have praised them for buying a ticket for legal cap circumvention.

Bishop trade was done pre-draft and pre-free agency, with no foreknowledge of who may or may not have been willing to sign in BUF that offseason. I see a small fraction of it as an insurance policy for being able to be cap compliant without knowing if any fish would bite the Sabres UFA hook.

Not clear there was a bona-fide Free-agent alternative which could have been guaranteed in advance of the draft / July 1st.
Chara or Thornton going 1 more year in BUF for $10+M after all they made in their careers?
Bergeron signing max value in BUF vs. 1 last lap in BOS?
Klingberg for $10M in BUF vs. $7M in ANA? okay...maybe...maybe
Max Domi or Athanasiou or both for $6M each instead of $3M each in CHI?
Paul Stastny for a final ride in CAR for $1.5M or come to BUF for ~$7M?
or Phil Kessel ($1.5M) and Marc Staal ($750k) going to Vegas and Florida and eventually playing in a Cup Final against each other vs. signing for name your price money in BUF.

If BUF had thrown foolish money at (more) low-tier UFAs than they already did that summer (Boosh, Comrie), I'd strongly suspect we'd lambast them for that.

Remember, the "free" in free agency means they are free to sign anywhere they choose, and to entice a top talent to play a year (or more) in the burning stench of the Sabres tire fire isn't free cost, in particular if the player has made a chunk of change in his career already.

So, IMO not 100% Pegula cheapness, there's a little reality, pragmatism, and smart economy as well.

 

[RefsIdeas]

While all the above is true, not clear to me the Bishop trade is/was 100% impugning to Pegula's cheapness. If, e.g., Tampa or Vegas or Toronto signed Bishop pre-draft then many observers might have praised them for buying a ticket for legal cap circumvention.

Bishop trade was done pre-draft and pre-free agency, with no foreknowledge of who may or may not have been willing to sign in BUF that offseason. I see a small fraction of it as an insurance policy for being able to be cap compliant without knowing if any fish would bite the Sabres UFA hook.

Not clear there was a bona-fide Free-agent alternative which could have been guaranteed in advance of the draft / July 1st.
Chara or Thornton going 1 more year in BUF for $10+M after all they made in their careers?
Bergeron signing max value in BUF vs. 1 last lap in BOS?
Klingberg for $10M in BUF vs. $7M in ANA? okay...maybe...maybe
Max Domi or Athanasiou or both for $6M each instead of $3M each in CHI?
Paul Stastny for a final ride in CAR for $1.5M or come to BUF for ~$7M?
or Phil Kessel ($1.5M) and Marc Staal ($750k) going to Vegas and Florida and eventually playing in a Cup Final against each other vs. signing for name your price money in BUF.

If BUF had thrown foolish money at (more) low-tier UFAs than they already did that summer (Boosh, Comrie), I'd strongly suspect we'd lambast them for that.

Remember, the "free" in free agency means they are free to sign anywhere they choose, and to entice a top talent to play a year (or more) in the burning stench of the Sabres tire fire isn't free cost, in particular if the player has made a chunk of change in his career already.

So, IMO not 100% Pegula cheapness, there's a little reality, pragmatism, and smart economy as well.

No other team would’ve wanted to do that Bishop trade when we did it. We could’ve waited until the end of FA to make a move like that, or have taken on a better cap dump and received a better return.

We didn’t even try. We signed dumpster tier FAs and wound up missing the playoffs by 1 point. There were plenty of other good FAs that year that you omitted. It was actually one of the deepest free agent years in recent memory.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

I’m not above blaming Mike Harrington.

 

[WhereAreTheCookies]

While the overall blame falls directly onto Pegula to me this seasons disappointment falls squarely on Granato and the coaching staff. He seems to do well at developing players, but he has not made adjustments when needed and there doesn't seem to be a lot of accountability with him. I think he was a good coach for what they needed the previous couple of seasons, but they are at the point now where we've seen what the players can do, it's time to bring in a coach that holds guys accountable and pushes them.

Adams has his faults and I don't like some of the moves or lack of moves he's made, but the improvements from UPL and the PK for most of the season tells me that this team could be a playoff team with a consistent effort. I think Adams provided a team that could have made the playoffs. They have their faults, and wouldn't be winning presidents trophies but I think with a coach like dare I say Torts they could have probably gotten 4 or 5 more wins.

 

[Moncton man]

Obviously the media, then the fans, the team, Don, Kevin with a Y, then Terry in that order. Plus Bettman somehow

 

[Jim Bob]

While the overall blame falls directly onto Pegula to me this seasons disappointment falls squarely on Granato and the coaching staff. He seems to do well at developing players, but he has not made adjustments when needed and there doesn't seem to be a lot of accountability with him. I think he was a good coach for what they needed the previous couple of seasons, but they are at the point now where we've seen what the players can do, it's time to bring in a coach that holds guys accountable and pushes them.

Adams has his faults and I don't like some of the moves or lack of moves he's made, but the improvements from UPL and the PK for most of the season tells me that this team could be a playoff team with a consistent effort. I think Adams provided a team that could have made the playoffs. They have their faults, and wouldn't be winning presidents trophies but I think with a coach like dare I say Torts they could have probably gotten 4 or 5 more wins.

I would put more of it on Adams than Granato.

Adams did not pressure Granato into getting an upgrade at Asst Coach that runs the PP after how bad it looked down the stretch last season.

Adams did not get a replacement for Quinn when he was hurt a couple of days before UFA season began.

Adams did nothing to upgrade their team at C.

Adams did nothing to improve the goaltending situation and his bet on Levi being the guy from game 1 on did not pan out.

Adams signed two UFA D that did not move the needle enough.

Granato and his staff wasn't good enough this year. But, Adams didn't even do the bare minimum since the end of the 2022-23 season to put the team in the best position possible to make the playoffs this season.

 

[Chainshot]

I would put more of it on Adams than Granato.

If we are looking at the two, that's certainly possible. I would also say that the coach usually goes for the failings of the GM - see Lindy in NJ.

Adams did not pressure Granato into getting an upgrade at Asst Coach that runs the PP after how bad it looked down the stretch last season.

I've wondered at Ellis being Adams' hire for the staff somehow insulated him last summer when it was clear from December on that the PP design was no longer working. Hell, what they do with Tage is what they were doing with Eichel but now without Eichel's ability to do that high seam pass to the other flanker (which subsequently led to the near death of Vic Olofsson's PP scoring).

Adams did not get a replacement for Quinn when he was hurt a couple of days before UFA season began.

That one hurts the most. Thinking they could half-ass it by using Vic in the same minutes has me questioning *again* his ability to assess players. I also wonder how much of it was Pollyanna thoughts that one of his prospect proteges could produce in that spot, thus making him look even better. And they all fumbled early, just like the rest of the team.

Adams did nothing to upgrade their team at C.

One could say he's made it worse by dealing one of the three-ish NHL centers they had.

Adams did nothing to improve the goaltending situation and his bet on Levi being the guy from game 1 on did not pan out.

Another big one - the push from on high to make Levi "the guy".

Adams signed two UFA D that did not move the needle enough.

I think those moves actually did help. Early season improvements on the PK were helped by the arrival of Clifton and Johnson. They struggled - in part because they had Clifton playing on the wrong side after not even working him there in pre-season and how washed Johnson was. But they didn't have guys like Fitz or even Jokiharju on the PK for large segments of the season and that helps.

Granato and his staff wasn't good enough this year. But, Adams didn't even do the bare minimum since the end of the 2022-23 season to put the team in the best position possible to make the playoffs this season.

I'm expecting more of his friends from the Academy of Hockey to be in the offing for assistant spots this summer.

And all of that comes back to who hired Adams and why don't they have more hockey voices in their front office, especially on the pro scouting side of the shop? And that's on the owner.

 

[TageGod]

I suppose the counter argument is how do you know last year they looked like themselves and this year they sucked vs. Them overachieveing last year and this year they look like themselves.

Not arguing that, just wondering how you determined that their performance last year is their real selves for a bunch of them. We don't have adequate sample sizes for a bunch and for a few others last year looks like the outlier when looking at career results.

The answer is likely in-between the two seasons. Why couldn't this team play defensively responsible hockey? I doubt it was the coach implementing a crap system. Donny said there wasn't much change in the system why did they struggle so much? Players like Cozens going 15 goals without a game is pretty hard to blame the coach on.

 

[OkimLom]

I've wondered at Ellis being Adams' hire for the staff somehow insulated him last summer when it was clear from December on that the PP design was no longer working. Hell, what they do with Tage is what they were doing with Eichel but now without Eichel's ability to do that high seam pass to the other flanker (which subsequently led to the near death of Vic Olofsson's PP scoring).

What scares me is that Ellis is looked at as a future head coach candidate for the organization/Adams. He was a part of the organization as Director of Player Development before Granato came along, and then was promoted once Krueger was ousted to assistant coach. It has all the makings of a mirrored positional process that Kevyn went down as well, and an organization that wants to do things differently and will be stubbornly resistant to change, I could see the organization being "patient" with Ellis' development into a Head Coaching position.

 

[Chainshot]

What scares me is that Ellis is looked at as a future head coach candidate for the organization/Adams. He was a part of the organization as Director of Player Development before Granato came along, and then was promoted once Krueger was ousted to assistant coach. It has all the makings of a mirrored positional process that Kevyn went down as well, and an organization that wants to do things differently and will be stubbornly resistant to change, I could see the organization being "patient" with Ellis' development into a Head Coaching position.

Terrifying.

 

[chi777]

What scares me is that Ellis is looked at as a future head coach candidate for the organization/Adams. He was a part of the organization as Director of Player Development before Granato came along, and then was promoted once Krueger was ousted to assistant coach. It has all the makings of a mirrored positional process that Kevyn went down as well, and an organization that wants to do things differently and will be stubbornly resistant to change, I could see the organization being "patient" with Ellis' development into a Head Coaching position.

Please don't say that.