Proposal: Trades & Tirades Thread no. 69

[sampollock]

Figs want JT Miller, and a goalie and a top 4 d man.. just listen to TSN...lol

 

[Habs Halifax]

I don't agree. Cap wise, the perfect scenario would be drafting Wright, sending him back to OHL for one more year since he lost an year from pandemic, then having him start in NHL in 23/24.
This will time Wright's ELC with Weber/Price's contracts ending. Don't think Wright is getting a fair shot by lot of people. He's safe bet to at least be a 2nd line 2way C.

Hopefully JT Miller gets moved soon to Rangers competition and Meier re-signs long term so Montreal can try to leverage Anderson/Lehkonen/Chiarot to Rangers and try to get Lafreniere that way. They did trade Buchnevich for Blais+2nd... hopefully they see their spot in standing, see that Fox extension next year and try to win now.

I would agree to this context if I felt both players were close in potential. But personally, I like Lafreniere a lot. Something not quite right with Wright IMO. Would I pass on picking him #1 OA? Hell no but I'm a bit concerned he might be the next Patrick. I can't avoid think it and there are others who have those concerns as well. With Lafreniere, I think we can hit on a star that has not busted out yet. With Wright, I don't think he becomes a center better than Suzuki.

I know I can eat crow later. But I would make that 1/1 trade. Has Wright shown any ability to dominate like what Lafreniere did in his age 18 WJC? Playing with an injury too? I think once Lafreniere fills into his frame, he's going to be very very good.

 

[Sterling Archer]

If you're ready to keep arguing without being an ass, I'm all for it.

Why trying to imply that I'm "emotionnal" about Toffoli ? I didn't particuly like the player, he's been on my list of players I wanted traded. I'm 40 now, I don't have posters of players on my wall or ask for autographs and I prefer a night out with friends than watching a game at home.

There is reasons to believe the best time to trade a player with term is during the summer, just like a UFA to be at trade deadline. Do you agree with me ?

Also, do you agree that we haven't heard rumors about Toffoli being on the market before the trade, which could mean Hughes didn't test the market as much as he is with other players ?

Does that mean he didn't get the best return ? No... it just means, we maybe possibly peut-être caliss could have had a better return... and since I believe there was no rush in trading him, I would have taken that bet.

I’m not being an ass. I’m just calling out your bs. You’re insistent that Toffoli could’ve gotten more in a trade with absolutely no evidence. All you’re coming with is rhetoric and what ifs.

You don’t know what the market is, you don’t know what the offers were, you don’t know what the conversations the GMs are having and you don’t know either what more Hughes could’ve gotten for Toffoli or that they’d have done better if they waited longer.

Truth is, you don’t know anything but you’re acting like Hughes had multiple better offers from other teams that was much better or that he’s have gotten more at the deadline. Truth is, markets drop. Ask Isles with Vanek when they traded him for pennie’s on the dollar.

Bottom line is players have values placed on them both buy and sell side. If you’re getting what you want, why wait? Player can get injured, interest may evaporate, market could saturate etc. Strike while the iron is hot and as a successful agent for years, I trust Hughes discretion on the matter a hell of a lot more than a poster on a fan board with no actual knowledge of what’s going on other than their feelings on what they think happened or could, maybe, possibly happen in the future, maybe.

 

[Scintillating10]

Rads is terrible this year, was injured last year, and was crappy 2 years ago. He had two good years there.

Stars got 2 good years, but had to pay for 5

 

[Wats]

I would agree to this context if I felt both players were close in potential. But personally, I like Lafreniere a lot. Something not quite right with Wright IMO. Would I pass on picking him #1 OA? Hell no but I'm a bit concerned he might be the next Patrick. I can't avoid think it and there are others who have those concerns as well. With Lafreniere, I think we can hit on a star that has not busted out yet. With Wright, I don't think he becomes a center better than Suzuki.

I know I can eat crow later. But I would make that 1/1 trade. Has Wright shown any ability to dominate like what Lafreniere did in his age 18 WJC? Playing with an injury too? I think once Lafreniere fills into his frame, he's going to be very very good.

Lafreniere has a late 2001 birthday so his age 18 WJC was the one he had in 2018/2019 season (1 point in 5 games). I think the impact of missing an entire year is being underrated. I wouldn't be surprised if Wright destroys OHL/WJC in draft+1 if the team that drafts him sends him down (ie. Marner) and he comes in as a rookie in 23/24 season and puts up 50+ points as a rookie 19 yr old C.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Figs want JT Miller, and a goalie and a top 4 d man.. just listen to TSN...lol

I can see Dubas trying this move... Laugh as you wish but bookmark it. I think he tries to dig into futures to address some needs for this playoffs but also his cap space problems for next season. Mrazek and Kerfoot have to go

* 1st rounder
* Other prospects/picks (he digs very deep)
* Sandin (NHL young body with offensive potential)
* Kerfoot
* Mrazek (cap dump)
for
* JT Miller (Possible retention)
* Halak (pending UFA)
* LW asset for the playoffs (Motte maybe)

And

* Subban (3rd team retains 50% bring down the cap hit to $2.25M prorated)
for
* 2nd rounder in 2023. Too high? Sure, something like a 3rd rounder and B prospect. Who cares but he can acquire for cheap

Bunting / Matthews / Marner
Robertson / Tavares / Nylander
Mikheyev / Miller / Kampf
Motte / Spezza / Simmonds
Engvall, Clifford

Rielly / Brodie
Muzzin / Subban
Dermott / Lyubushkin
Liljegren, Holl

Campbell
Halak

 

[Adam Michaels]

Figs want JT Miller, and a goalie and a top 4 d man.. just listen to TSN...lol

Every TDL, they link everyone to the Leafs

 

[Wats]

Stars got 2 good years, but had to pay for 5

Those 2 good years you are referring to his play was well above a 6.25M cap hit. He was point/game last season and helped them make finals the year before (on pace for 46 points in full regular season...essentially a Gallagher). They got 4/5 seasons of a good player worth 6.25M. This year, he looks done but they could have bought him out last year for pretty cheap too.

 

[Vachon23]

 

[sheed36]

Figs want JT Miller, and a goalie and a top 4 d man.. just listen to TSN...lol

But only if they can do it by moving the likes of Mrazek, Kerfoot, Holl, and Dermott and not any 1st round picks or any top prospects right.

 

[JoelWarlord]

Bottom line is players have values placed on them both buy and sell side. If you’re getting what you want, why wait?

I think it's just a case where Toffoli just got a bit overhyped here. He's a Zucker tier player and we got a Zucker tier return. He went for a 2nd and a comparable prospect as a rental, his 2021 playoffs and contract bumps the pick up to a 1st. The rest of the argument is just nitpicking to me, Heineman and Addison aren't in different tiers even if you like Addison better, and Toffoli/Zucker are pretty much the same tier of player. We fell in love with him here and I think people started to view him as a bonafide first liner, but you just have to look at Calgary and see that guys like Gaudreau and Tkachuk are what actual first liners are on a contending team.

I also think the ancillary benefits of having that month where Anderson got a chance to play on the top line and Pitlick got a stable role on the 3rd line are being ignored. Knowing that Anderson is a good fit with those two guys is extremely valuable information in the long term which we only really accessed by trading Toffoli at this time.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Lafreniere has a late 2001 birthday so his age 18 WJC was the one he had in 2018/2019 season (1 point in 5 games). I think the impact of missing an entire year is being underrated. I wouldn't be surprised if Wright destroys OHL/WJC in draft+1 if the team that drafts him sends him down (ie. Marner) and he comes in as a rookie in 23/24 season and puts up 50+ points as a rookie 19 yr old C.

October 11th Birthdate. That's not that late. His 19/20 season was his draft year and he was age 18 for most of that season

19/20: Age 18 season (Last year in the Q and where he had 10 pts with 4 goals in 5 WJC games)
20/21: Age 19 season (1st year with the Rangers)
21/22: Age 20 season (this year right now today). He don't turn 21 until this coming October.

The 1 pt in 5 WJC games was his age 17 season . Wright was not good enough to make the WJC at age 17.

 

[McPhees Moustache]

I can see Dubas trying this move... Laugh as you wish but bookmark it. I think he tries to dig into futures to address some needs for this playoffs but also his cap space problems for next season. Mrazek and Kerfoot have to go

* 1st rounder
* Other prospects/picks (he digs very deep)
* Sandin (NHL young body with offensive potential)
* Kerfoot
* Mrazek (cap dump)
for
* JT Miller (Possible retention)
* Halak (pending UFA)
* LW asset for the playoffs (Motte maybe)

And

* Subban (3rd team retains 50% bring down the cap hit to $2.25M prorated)
for
* 2nd rounder in 2023. Too high? Sure, something like a 3rd rounder and B prospect. Who cares but he can acquire for cheap

Bunting / Matthews / Marner
Robertson / Tavares / Nylander
Mikheyev / Miller / Kampf
Motte / Spezza / Simmonds
Engvall, Clifford

Rielly / Brodie
Muzzin / Subban
Dermott / Lyubushkin
Liljegren, Holl

Campbell
Halak

Isn't Subban playing 3rd pairing in NJ right now? I like him but doesn't seem like an upgrade to their 2nd pairing

 

[Sterling Archer]

 

[sampollock]

Here starts the trading

 

[habsfan891]

Here starts the trading

I don't expect us to make the 1st trade coming up to the deadline but I'll be pissed if we get left at the altar with a bunch of expiring contracts what a massive waste of assets that would be

 

[sampollock]

I don't expect us to make the 1st trade coming up to the deadline but I'll be pissed if we get left at the altar with a bunch of expiring contracts what a massive waste of assets that would be

if ANA moves Lindholm, then it will start

 

[sampollock]

off to #70

 

[Zorba]

Wow Friedman breaking news Teams trying to trade their UFAS Unheard of

 

[lamp9post]

I can see Dubas trying this move... Laugh as you wish but bookmark it. I think he tries to dig into futures to address some needs for this playoffs but also his cap space problems for next season. Mrazek and Kerfoot have to go

* 1st rounder
* Other prospects/picks (he digs very deep)
* Sandin (NHL young body with offensive potential)
* Kerfoot
* Mrazek (cap dump)
for
* JT Miller (Possible retention)
* Halak (pending UFA)
* LW asset for the playoffs (Motte maybe)

And

* Subban (3rd team retains 50% bring down the cap hit to $2.25M prorated)
for
* 2nd rounder in 2023. Too high? Sure, something like a 3rd rounder and B prospect. Who cares but he can acquire for cheap

Bunting / Matthews / Marner
Robertson / Tavares / Nylander
Mikheyev / Miller / Kampf
Motte / Spezza / Simmonds
Engvall, Clifford

Rielly / Brodie
Muzzin / Subban
Dermott / Lyubushkin
Liljegren, Holl

Campbell
Halak

I think (and as a hockey fan, hope) you're right. Not necessarily about the specifics, but that Dubas will be aggressive at the deadline. That team is playing their best hockey. They need to make a push to at least get to the second round. One of the biggest mistakes we made the past decade is holding on to our late 1sts when Price, Subban, and Pacioretty were in their prime. Instead of adding difference-makers at the deadline, we drafted McCarron, Scherbak, and Juulson, all of which literally turned into nothing.

Leafs have an MVP level talent in Matthews who has 2 years on his contract after this season. If I'm the Leafs, I'm going all-in every year until he leaves or re-signs. Late 1st round picks are the most overrated assets on these boards. JT Miller for two playoff runs >>>> late 1st+. And ya, if they can fix their cap situation for next year, that would be a good idea as well, though it will cost them.

 

[Andrewcoursol]

Exactly, we haven't heard anything because he didn't really tested the market long enough. A late first is nothing to write home about 50% chance he doesn't even play in the NHL...

I am hoping that the habs package the late 1st round pick ,early 2nd or some of the 3rd rounders that they have to try and move into the top 5 preferably or top 10 for someone else they really like, they also have assets from the chiarot deal as well, i hope they move some to get higher probability of quality over quantity of prospects .

 

[Sterling Archer]

 

[Draft]

off to #70

No. 69 PT. 2

 

[salbutera]

Wow Friedman breaking news Teams trying to trade their UFAS Unheard of

Not even trade, they’re “exploring” the market…

 

[Hins77]

Lafreniere has a late 2001 birthday so his age 18 WJC was the one he had in 2018/2019 season (1 point in 5 games). I think the impact of missing an entire year is being underrated. I wouldn't be surprised if Wright destroys OHL/WJC in draft+1 if the team that drafts him sends him down (ie. Marner) and he comes in as a rookie in 23/24 season and puts up 50+ points as a rookie 19 yr old C.

Marner was a 2pts+/game in the ohl second year and 3rd. There is no comparison to make with Wright. Wright progression curve had flattening a little. I expect wright to have a 19 yo between 90-100 pts next year in the OHL. Below than that would be disappointing…wright is at least a second line centerman, however his roof is tough to tell right now