Ragamuffin Gunner
Lost in the Flood
They'll go nowhere with Sully behind the bench. 6 years of failure.
Loser.
Loser.
This Pittsburgh Penguins Act is Getting Old
- Thread starter PaulD
- Start date
Ozz
Registered User
Pens are a playoff team but with coaching failures to address the PP and absurd OT record, Pens easily are in with average play in those 2 categories. Dubas has his hands full here with the retool and getting the coaching up to speed. A couple smart moves, addition by subtraction and a return to better form from Graves, Jarry, Acciari certainly adds to next years mix.
Misery74
Registered User
- Nov 20, 2017
- 2,260
- 2,154
Man, what a way to miss the playoffs. At least the Pens play recently lessens what they need to give San Jose.
HamiltonNHL
Parity era hockey is just puck luck + draft luck
- Jan 4, 2012
- 21,016
- 11,572
Rodgerwilco
Entertainment boards w/ some Hockey mixed in.
- Feb 6, 2014
- 7,369
- 6,680
Hard to tell. Bunting has played really well since coming to Pittsburgh so it's a bit of a wash.
I think without Todd Reirden they would have made playoffs. Even a slight up-tick in the powerplay and Overtime play could have put them over the edge. It's inconceivable how a team with the kind of ambitions that Pittsburgh had would be okay just trotting out the same pathetic powerplay this entire season.
- Feb 10, 2010
- 13,628
- 10,252
Why is 5v5 play on the players and PP is on the coaches?
What is the distinction there?
Don't the coaches design 5v5 play as well?
WarriorofTime
Registered User
- Jul 3, 2010
- 28,888
- 17,032
With Crosby's $8.7 million cap hit being good value and only one year left, the Avalanche having no second line center but otherwise having a contending core, Crosby being friends with MacKinnon, it seems like a no brainer to get Crosby to waive his NMC to be traded to Colorado and chase a fourth Cup.
Rodgerwilco
Entertainment boards w/ some Hockey mixed in.
- Feb 6, 2014
- 7,369
- 6,680
Well the distinction is that the special teams coach who specifically designs and implements the powerplay, Todd Reirden, was clearly lackluster and this issue was never addressed by the organization. I think it's pretty reasonable to say a team that was 1-3 points out of playoffs would have easily been in had they been better than #31 in the Powerplay.
The coaching at 5v5 and Sullivan's system have also been significantly criticized, as well.
Oddly enough, the 3v3 overtime played a major role in the sinking of this team as well. This is a blatant coaching issue, considering that the team reportedly almost never practices the 3 on 3.
Beau Knows
Registered User
Seems unlikely. Bunting brought an element that the team needed and was hot down the stretch.
He also helped spread the scoring out, since Malkin wasn't getting much help this season.
Extra Texture
A new career
It’s Todd Rierdon. But the Pens have fired assistants out from under Sullivan before, and kept the big man. And like Exile said, it’s not a vacuum where each coach has some silo. Sullivan is working every day in that environment.
Thus, if an "individually talented" team has the (second) worst PP in the league all season, and he's content to allow that situation to persist, he's failing at his job to either intervene or improve that abysmal stat via change.
They had Guentzel for 50 games, and were a worse team for points %. On top of that, acquiring Bunting brought their second line to life and was the only reason they were close.
The main problem with the Pens has been complacency. Keeping the same mentality, same "system", same coaches, well past their sell by date. Keeping the same failurific formula all season, and changing even less, tells me the would've missed by a country mile. Even if Guentzel himself is a great player.
Coastal Kev
There will be "I told you so's" Bet on it
If you take out the 18 months where they won 2 cups (more credit goes to JR for tweeking the roster), and include his time at Boston............... Maybe the most overrated coach of all time in hockey.
Dr Pepper
Registered User
Has Dubas already given his endorsement to Sully for next season?
He kept backing Keefe after every playoff failure, would be interesting to see if he's going to remain loyal to a coach that every Pens fan seems tired of defending.
He kept backing Keefe after every playoff failure, would be interesting to see if he's going to remain loyal to a coach that every Pens fan seems tired of defending.
Oleksiak
Registered User
They might have been able to make the playoffs if Dubas had had the sense to hire a qualified GM instead of further handicapping the team with his incompetence. They now have even less assets, another bad contract for a defenceman who can't play defence, and a President of Hockey ops who lacks about understanding of the sport. They're in deep, deep trouble unless ownership fixes their mistake and fires Dubas before he's allowed to do even more damage.
Dubas needs a complete collapse to justify a Sully firing. Give it another year.
Oleksiak
Registered User
Would you trust an unqualified analytics dweeb to hire a new coach? Whoever Dubas hires is likely to be even worse.
Nucker101
Foundational Poster
- Apr 2, 2013
- 21,085
- 16,524
If they had even a league average powerplay they’d have comfortably made the playoffs in the East.
Whoever ran the powerplay should be out of a job.
Whoever ran the powerplay should be out of a job.
Well, you take away the cups he probably doesn't get rated as well as he is and isn't still coaching the team....so, no don't think he'd be in that most overrated category.
Dr Pepper
Registered User
I dunno, looks his apprentice (Carbury) ended up with the somehow playoff-bound Caps.
Might be the case, hopefully not for these angry Pens fans though.
Extra Texture
A new career
That comes down to ownership prioritizing winning over friendship/whatever hero worship they engage in. They dont.
People can come in here and cry about Dubas all they want. On paper the team was better than 2022/23. Better depth. Better goaltending, even if that improvement was from the backup position, That should've translated to more wins. Speaking of which...
Acquiring Karlsson (and moving out a bunch of bad assets in the process) was about rolling the dice and trying to improve the team with another gamebreaker. And for the first 25ish games of the season, the partnership he formed with Pettersson was statistically excellent, and looked like it had been together for years. And then it was broken up because, admittedly bad signing, Ryan Graves looked like a disaster.
The incredible hurry to blame Kyle Dubas for everything, when there are far more obvious culprits, that have been failing for years is insane. He deserves blame for plenty. The line "if you dont have a Sullivan, you're out looking for a sullivan" is cringeworthy. But he showed up one year ago. This team has shown continual decline over the course of three GM tenures, all of whom have been outlived by the head coach. There's a pretty obvious common denominator there.
Oleksiak
Registered User
However, Sullivan had shown he's capable of doing the job. Dubas has never shown any sign that he's qualified to work in hockey ops anywhere he's gone. He made the same mistake in trading for Barrie and extending Rielly; he simply does not understand that defencemen need to be capable of playing like NHLers in their own end.
66-30-33
Registered User
Only a matter of time. Dubas needs to be the puppet master in complete control of the team from top to bottom. With Sully around that will never be possible.
Gurglesons
Registered User
Pens have two major issues. Older stars and unaccountable coaching. Not much Dubas can do with the first as Sid, Geno and Letang will be run out the season next year. After that, Dubas has to move assets for picks and prospects and dump Sullivan. I also think next year Pens can still be OK with a couple smart moves. But no question the franchise has to move on from the all-in approach. Jake being moved was the right call. NO way having a LW at 9 AAV on the Titanic here.
