DarkReign
Registered User
- Jan 30, 2008
- 4,714
- 98
Proposal: The "Trade _______ Right ******* NOW" Thread
- Thread starter RedMenace
- Start date
BinCookin
Registered User
In all truth we are closer to a contender than a bottom feeder.
But that all depends on how our players play. We still have 2 stars that are better than most teams could hope for.
But honestly this lineup could use the addition of a GOOD but OLD (so he will have a low cap hit) UFA addition.
If the '02 team was our strongest team (it would be because we added a CHEAP Hull and Robataille)
It would be interesting if Iginla just left Calgary to sign on the Cheap in Detroit
Or sign Semin to a one year deal. But really the only way to contend quickly is through UFA. The other option of course (less likely to succeed, but still reasonable) is to play Tatar and Nyquist AS IF they were an OLD Hull and Robataille, give them the benefit of the doubt, and play them 16 min a night each. And just see what happens for one season.
I would be ok with either choice.
RedMenace
Registered User
That would be my preference, because I think they're good enough to make an immediate difference (in a regular-length season)... though it would take Holland doing something a bit different in not signing aging vets, but it could happen.
Vladdy84
L-O-Y-A-L-T-Y
mindfly
Happy camper!
Can't believe Sammy will be making 3M next year with a NTC.
I can, KH is the GM after all.
RedMenace
Registered User
Can't believe Sammy will be making 3M next year with a NTC.
Buyout candidate number one, step RIGHT up!
The Zetterberg Era
Ball Hockey Sucks
Tatar for McBain or Ellerby. We might even get a draft pick from Florida. I see them both as outstanding buy low candidates, and one where we can actually offer Tatar and not feel like we are insulting either team. Even with a lack of NHL track record, I think Tatar could return one of these players.
JmanWingsFan
Your average Jman
The Zetterberg Era
Ball Hockey Sucks
Undersized center, I like his game but don't know where he fits in as I think he is marginally better on the wing. If we won't give Tatar or Nyquist a shot why give it to him? Would not be upset to get him, but like I said from a fit standpoint I don't know where he plays and how this changes his anger of being stuck in a bad role.
JmanWingsFan
Your average Jman
He's 5'11''. Hardly undersized. I don't know either. Nice fourth liner, would add depth... Who knows.
The Zetterberg Era
Ball Hockey Sucks
His problem to date is he cannot play in a depth role, he is Tatar two years ago before Tatar rounded out his game. I don't see him as a fourth liner at all, if they are high on him go for it, but don't see the fit currently.
mindfly
Happy camper!
SoupNazi
Serenity now. Insanity later.
- Feb 6, 2010
- 26,510
- 15,047
For next year:
The Wings have ten forwards, four defensemen, and one goaltender signed for a total cap hit of just over $45m. Notable players not included in that number are RFAs Gustav Nyquist, Jakub Kindl, and Brendan Smith or UFAs Valtteri Filppula, Jimmy Howard, Ian White, and Damien Brunner.
Let's start by adding Tatar to the roster and increasing it to 11/4/1, and about $46m.
Buyout Bertuzzi and CC. Re-sign White for $3.75m; trade Quincey for a pick/prospect (maybe we'll get a 1st?). Filppula at $4.5m, Howard at $4m. Brunner at $2.5m. Nyquist re-signs for $1.25m, as do Kindl and Smith. Lashoff comes back for $750k. At this point, the Wings are 13/6/2 and they have ~$14.5m in cap space, and add one or more top-six forwards, and one defenseman (maybe even Huskins, who knows). Maybe Ladislav Smid @$3.5m, and $4m for Stephen Weiss (how's that for a third line center?), Ryane Clowe, or Nathan Horton. Weiss being the most likely. Alternatively, sign Robyn Regehr for $4.5m and nab Mason Raymond for $3m. Does less for the offense, but the PK (Helm/Raymond) would be ridiculous. It also forces the situation where either Helm or Filppula has to play third-line center (Weiss would have had that job in the first example), which realistically neither "should" be playing.
I see it like this if everything goes right (if FA prices are cheaper, even better).
[FIELDSET="Potential 2013-14 Wings roster"]FORWARDS
Johan Franzen ($3.955m) / Henrik Zetterberg ($6.083m) / Damien Brunner ($2.500m)
Valtteri Filppula ($4.500m) / Pavel Datsyuk ($6.700m) / Tomas Tatar ($0.840m)
Gustav Nyquist ($1.250m) / Stephen Weiss ($4.000m) / Mikael Samuelsson ($3.000m)
Justin Abdelkader ($1.800m) / Darren Helm ($2.125m) / Jordin Tootoo ($1.900m)
Cory Emmerton ($0.533m) / Patrick Eaves ($1.200m)
DEFENSEMEN
Niklas Kronwall ($4.750m) / Ian White ($3.750m)
Brendan Smith ($1.250m) / Ladislav Smid ($3.500m)
Jakub Kindl ($1.250m) / Jonathan Ericsson ($3.250m)
Brian Lashoff ($0.750m)
GOALTENDERS
Jimmy Howard ($4.000m)
Jonas Gustavsson ($1.500m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,386,212; BONUSES: $160,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $73,788[/FIELDSET]
The Wings have ten forwards, four defensemen, and one goaltender signed for a total cap hit of just over $45m. Notable players not included in that number are RFAs Gustav Nyquist, Jakub Kindl, and Brendan Smith or UFAs Valtteri Filppula, Jimmy Howard, Ian White, and Damien Brunner.
Let's start by adding Tatar to the roster and increasing it to 11/4/1, and about $46m.
Buyout Bertuzzi and CC. Re-sign White for $3.75m; trade Quincey for a pick/prospect (maybe we'll get a 1st?). Filppula at $4.5m, Howard at $4m. Brunner at $2.5m. Nyquist re-signs for $1.25m, as do Kindl and Smith. Lashoff comes back for $750k. At this point, the Wings are 13/6/2 and they have ~$14.5m in cap space, and add one or more top-six forwards, and one defenseman (maybe even Huskins, who knows). Maybe Ladislav Smid @$3.5m, and $4m for Stephen Weiss (how's that for a third line center?), Ryane Clowe, or Nathan Horton. Weiss being the most likely. Alternatively, sign Robyn Regehr for $4.5m and nab Mason Raymond for $3m. Does less for the offense, but the PK (Helm/Raymond) would be ridiculous. It also forces the situation where either Helm or Filppula has to play third-line center (Weiss would have had that job in the first example), which realistically neither "should" be playing.
I see it like this if everything goes right (if FA prices are cheaper, even better).
[FIELDSET="Potential 2013-14 Wings roster"]FORWARDS
Johan Franzen ($3.955m) / Henrik Zetterberg ($6.083m) / Damien Brunner ($2.500m)
Valtteri Filppula ($4.500m) / Pavel Datsyuk ($6.700m) / Tomas Tatar ($0.840m)
Gustav Nyquist ($1.250m) / Stephen Weiss ($4.000m) / Mikael Samuelsson ($3.000m)
Justin Abdelkader ($1.800m) / Darren Helm ($2.125m) / Jordin Tootoo ($1.900m)
Cory Emmerton ($0.533m) / Patrick Eaves ($1.200m)
DEFENSEMEN
Niklas Kronwall ($4.750m) / Ian White ($3.750m)
Brendan Smith ($1.250m) / Ladislav Smid ($3.500m)
Jakub Kindl ($1.250m) / Jonathan Ericsson ($3.250m)
Brian Lashoff ($0.750m)
GOALTENDERS
Jimmy Howard ($4.000m)
Jonas Gustavsson ($1.500m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,386,212; BONUSES: $160,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $73,788[/FIELDSET]
How about trade them Nick Jensen or Mitchell Callahan for Komi and a pick?
We're not buying out Bertuzzi.
He's the only big forward we have with even a smidge of toughness.
You're gonna pay more than $4M for howard and more than $3.5 for Smid.
Smid is another lefthanded defenseman.
Weiss isn't the kind of center we need.
I don't think Helm ever goes back to line 4.
Everyone here is making the assumption that Datsyuk is returning to Russia after 13-14. The roster I posted would be the 13-14 roster. Meaning that Weiss (who turns 30 in April) would CONTINUE TO BE ON THE ROSTER after that season. That gives the Wings another legit right now top-six center for 14-15 and means that Flip can play on the wing.
And sure, Smid is LH. He's also really damn good defensively. I don't care if he uses his teeth to hold his stick if he's going to play really good defense. There are times when it simply doesn't matter.
I figured that was the why behind Weiss. Holland has to start gauging Datsyuk's interest in staying beyond his next contract and look to make a move on that sooner rather than later. If he doesn't, he'll get stuck with another Suter situation where it's Player X or Bust.
Is there a specific buyout period in the summer or can a player be bought out at any time? I can't see Holland buying a guy out without a backup plan already in place, but if he's able to go out and sign a guy, I can see him making a move then. Or just going into camp and waiting to see if someone got hurt.
Henkka
Registered User
Yeah, buying out Bertuzzi out with that good caphit would be a pretty stupid move.
Even if we could get Horton from free agency, I'd still keep Bertuzzi in the team to just have that huge body there. We need to add size, not lose it, just like you said.
Bertuzzi doesn't have a good cap hit. Case in point: Last year, Dan Cleary put up almost as many points while playing with Darren Helm and Drew Miller. Cleary is paid slightly more. Helm put up almost as many points as Bertuzzi. Both played significant PK duty, which Bertuzzi did not. Bertuzzi played with Datsyuk and Franzen, who both scored more ES points than he did TOTAL points. Cleary led his line in production. Yet Cleary has been considered overpaid for years.
If we were to add Horton or Clowe, Bertuzzi becomes irrelevant. Why? Because Bertuzzi has only ever been useful when playing with Datsyuk, and even then he's been less useful than many other players (such as Nyquist, Franzen, Filppula, or Cleary). There's no SANE reason to play Bertuzzi in the top six ahead of Samuelsson if it comes to that decision, and playing him ahead of Clowe or Horton is just ridiculous. The other wingers (based on a minor alteration of my Weiss lineup) would obviously include Franzen, Brunner, and (if Horton/Clowe is bumped to line 3) Tatar. That's assuming the only lineups change that's made between what I posted is one with Clowe/Horton plus Bertuzzi on the top two are a) Flip centering line 3, b) Eaves/Emmerton gone, and c) Smid replaced by someone else who costs somewhere between $1m-$2m (Huskins?).
And I will reiterate again; having Bertuzzi in the top six hurts the team because he's ineffective offensively compared to other options. Having him in the bottom six hurts the team because he's a defensive black hole. He could be the size of Chara and play (physically) like the love child of Bob Probert and Joey Kocur. If we had 2002 Todd Bertuzzi at $2m, I'd be all for keeping him. But we don't, and won't. Some people here don't get that just because he's more physical than Darryl Laplante was.
I don't think Weiss is any better than putting Flip back at center. I'd rather put another smallish/softish center in his natural position and spend the money on a big winger or big defenseman,
There are times when it does. And when you've got 5 Lefties and your only righty is 5'10, it's one of those times.
kuick
Tatar Sauce
It's important but you don't pass up an opportunity to improve the blueline solely because of handedness. Sign Smid if possible and cut an inferior d-man like Kindl, Quincey, Huskins, Cola. We can attempt to add a righty through other means. Bottom line is we need to get better.
Horton is interesting. I can't see Boston letting him go, and they're currently in a comfortable cap situation for the offseason. Top 6 right hand shooter with good size. Not afraid to use it unlike Mule. Hopefully he's long past his injury/concussion issues.
RedMachine87
Registered User
I'd buy out Franzen and Samuelsson. While I like Franzen and think he is a decent player for the cap hit, given the new CBA rules, his contract seems risky.
I like the idea of adding Clowe or Horton, although I think both are unlikely to hit free agency unless their teams are in a cap crunch. Smid would also be a nice addition. 2013/2014 team:
Filppula Zetterberg Brunner
Horton Datsyuk Nyquist
Tatar Jarnkrok Bertuzzi
Abdelkader Helm Tootoo
Andersson
Kronwall Big Rig
Smith Smid
CC Quincey
Kindl/Lashoff (or Dekeyser)
Howard
Monster
Just spitballing...
I like the idea of adding Clowe or Horton, although I think both are unlikely to hit free agency unless their teams are in a cap crunch. Smid would also be a nice addition. 2013/2014 team:
Filppula Zetterberg Brunner
Horton Datsyuk Nyquist
Tatar Jarnkrok Bertuzzi
Abdelkader Helm Tootoo
Andersson
Kronwall Big Rig
Smith Smid
CC Quincey
Kindl/Lashoff (or Dekeyser)
Howard
Monster
Just spitballing...
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