Speculation: The R.F.A.'s

[RedWingsNow*]

What will they sign for

Andersson:
Nyquist:
Kindl:
Smith:

Bonus
Word is Jonny Ericsson wants an extension.
How much do you pay Ericsson, and for how long?


My take
Andersson - Seemed to earn a spot in the lineup. If Helm is ready, then what? Production was nothing special. His faceoffs were much improved. IMO, he seems like he's on the ice for a lot of goals -- even if a lot of that is because of the PK.
I think he could have some value. I don't see much upside to this guy. Disappointed by his lack of willingness to be physical. But he does play a rather bland but effective two way game and has some size and heft I can see him being a third line center topping out at 15 goals and 25 assists (which isn't too far from Filppula's regular numbers). He also has a good chemistry with Nyquist and Tatar and might work well with either or both for a couple years before they graduate to the top lines.
3 years, $1.1M a year.

Nyquist - After a rather disappointing regular season, Nyquiist found his gear in the playoffs. Two things stick out. 1) This kid creates great chances. 2) This kid misses the net from the slot more than anyone I've seen. That said, after being underwhelmed, I'm sold on his ability. I wish he was a center, because his game seems to make more sense there than along the wall, where I don't ever imagine he'll be that effective. I can see him putting up 18-20 goals and 50 points this year on a scoring line with regular powerplay time. The Red Wings might be tempted to offer one of those "pay more now, save in the future contracts" but I think they are still a bit too early for that. In two years...maybe.
2 years, $1.6M a year.

Kindl - After starting the year in the press box and later slipping to #8 on the Defensive depth chart, Kindl finally got a regular shift and looked good doing it. He looked exceptionally good when playing with offensively skilled forwards. He is probably the best suited defenseman for the PP and looks Lidstrom-esque at times from the blueline in. What isn't very Lidstrom-esques are Kindl's panic attacks in his own end. Nor does he have very good defensive awareness (though it's not awful, either.). This is a contract, because I think Kindl will be a UFA in just a year if he signs a one-year deal, and I'm not sure how much either party wants to commit to each other. I always feel like Kindl's a bad game away from the press box, and Kindl might be better off with a different head coach. Also, the Wings have a ton of kids coming up. And since I don't see Kronwall, Ericsson, Smith or Dekeyser going anywhere anytime soon, the roster spots need to come from somewhere.
2 Years, $1.7M a year.

Smith - Struggled mightily at times this year and there weren't many lifelines on the Wings defense to bail him out. The Red Wings and Babcock have held Smith in high regard, and my guess is they still do So I expect one of those Kronwall/Flip type deals where Smith makes too much too early, but is a bargain later. If he signs a short deal, it could be a sign that something's up.
5 years, $3,2M a year.

Bonus
Ericsson - A lot of people like him more than I do. I think he's not worth more than $3.5M, but I'd be willing to go as high as 3 years, $12.75M

Click to read more...

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Really like the Smith deal, was thinking 5 years 15 million on him. Also locking him up on that should they ever want to entertain offers because of prospect development, would also make him an interesting trade asset. I don't want him traded, but there is that factor which I think makes this kind of extension even better.

The others make a lot of sense as well.

Think Ericsson gets about four million per for four years.

Really wish the organization had more faith in Kindl, but agree with your logic. Would only give Andersson two years.

Would entertain Nyquist or Tatar (next year) getting a similar deal with the same thinking on Smith and because I think it makes them better trade assets.

 

[RedWingsNow*]

Really like the Smith deal, was thinking 5 years 15 million on him. Also locking him up on that should they ever want to entertain offers because of prospect development, would also make him an interesting trade asset. I don't want him traded, but there is that factor which I think makes this kind of extension even better.

The others make a lot of sense as well.

Think Ericsson gets about four million per for four years.

Really wish the organization had more faith in Kindl, but agree with your logic.

Would entertain Nyquist or Tatar (next year) getting a similar deal with the same thinking on Smith and because I think it makes them better trade assets.

I was thinking they might do one of those deals with Nyquist -- but he's got very little NHL experience. Seems a bit premature.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

I was think they might do one of those deals with Nyquist -- but he's got very little NHL experience. Seems a bit premature.

Yeah there is a big chance there and the Wings don't really sign guys to shore up their trading asset part of the equation. They pay guys they think will help them. But not against those three guys getting those kinds of deals.

I still think one of Nyquist and Tatar winds up being traded eventually and I think they are more attractive in that respect with those kind of deals in place.

I see the point of doing either to be honest, a bridge wouldn't be a bad idea. I think they should invest in Smith full systems ahead though.

 

[Frk It]

Yeah there is a big chance there and the Wings don't really sign guys to shore up their trading asset part of the equation. They pay guys they think will help them. But not against those three guys getting those kinds of deals.

I still think one of Nyquist and Tatar winds up being traded eventually and I think they are more attractive in that respect with those kind of deals in place.

I see the point of doing either to be honest, a bridge wouldn't be a bad idea. I think they should invest in Smith full systems ahead though.

Why just them? Why not any of our other forward prospects? Why trade away your two closest prospects that have some offensive upside when you have the most shallow forward corps you have had in a long time?

Doesn't really make a whole lot of sense to me, but I know you feel this is the case.

Maybe see some incentive to move Tatar since they maybe question his character, and seem to rate Nyquist higher. See pretty much zero incentive to trade Nyquist unless they get a top pairing D man back of a power forward. Odds of that happening are probably pretty close to zero.

 

[joe89]

I would try to give Nyquist three years at $1.5M per, but willing to go $1.8M per.

Andersson, four years around a million per. He gets stability not many guys of his calibre gets, Wings get a young player they're confident having around with a tradable contract. There's some upside to the deal, but overall little risk little upside.

Kindl, two years just below two million sounds about right to me. I don't think they will throw him the one year deal, and I don't think they're looking to lock him up for longer either.

Smith, four years, $2.5M per. It shows they have faith in him, and I think Wings could get something good out of it the last two years as a trade-off. The alternative is the two years, $1.5M per bridge deal. But that's a gamble for both sides.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Why just them? Why not any of our other forward prospects? Why trade away your two closest prospects that have some offensive upside when you have the most shallow forward corps you have had in a long time?

Doesn't really make a whole lot of sense to me, but I know you feel this is the case.

Maybe see some incentive to move Tatar since they maybe question his character, and seem to rate Nyquist higher. See pretty much zero incentive to trade Nyquist unless they get a top pairing D man back of a power forward. Odds of that happening are probably pretty close to zero.

Well that is the kind of player I am talking about them targeting.

The other guys have some value, but I am curious to see which ones they move out. They seem to view Nyquist and Tatar in a similar light, with Nyquist having a slight edge in terms of what we can gather from what Management says. I have to think they have some value to other teams as well. If we target big players they are going to want NHL ready prospects with their kind of upside, one of those two is probably going to have to go, most of us have stated pretty openly which option we prefer to keep if it comes to that. Hopefully they both workout as homeruns and go nowhere, but I still can see one of the two getting traded.

All I can say is I am really glad they didn't trade Sheahan, Jurco and a second for JayBo, that would have been horrendous.

 

[Frk It]

Well that is the kind of player I am talking about them targeting.

The other guys have some value, but I am curious to see which ones they move out. They seem to view Nyquist and Tatar in a similar light, with Nyquist having a slight edge in terms of what we can gather from what Management says. I have to think they have some value to other teams as well. If we target big players they are going to want NHL ready prospects with their kind of upside, one of those two is probably going to have to go, most of us have stated pretty openly which option we prefer to keep if it comes to that. Hopefully they both workout as homeruns and go nowhere, but I still can see one of the two getting traded.

All I can say is I am really glad they didn't trade Sheahan, Jurco and a second for JayBo, that would have been horrendous.

I'm not worried about it because I view the likelihood of them pulling off the kind of trade you are referring to as almost certainly zero. Nyquist or Tatar and someone else for Bobby Ryan. Hell yes, I'd do it. But I'm sure Anaheim has gotten a better offer than that before and already said no. I think these guys are more valuable to us with our group of forwards, than they would be to most other teams.

 

[Frk It]

I was thinking they might do one of those deals with Nyquist -- but he's got very little NHL experience. Seems a bit premature.

Nyquist has shown more promising than Smith has to date, so I think it would be a good idea to give both of them those deals where they grow into their value and we lock them up fairly long-term.

 

[RedWingsNow*]

Why just them? Why not any of our other forward prospects? Why trade away your two closest prospects that have some offensive upside when you have the most shallow forward corps you have had in a long time?

Doesn't really make a whole lot of sense to me, but I know you feel this is the case.

Maybe see some incentive to move Tatar since they maybe question his character, and seem to rate Nyquist higher. See pretty much zero incentive to trade Nyquist unless they get a top pairing D man back of a power forward. Odds of that happening are probably pretty close to zero.

Wow. You guys are determined to make this a thing, eh?

We've got 3 small/skilled wingers

Tatar. Nyquist. Brunner.
We can make that work. There's no need to trade any of them.

 

[Frk It]

Wow. You guys are determined to make this a thing, eh?

We've got 3 small/skilled wingers

Tatar. Nyquist. Brunner.
We can make that work. There's no need to trade any of them.

I said maybe twice

I have no idea if it is an issue or not. Wouldn't be surprised either way.

I'm not in favor of trading them. TZE seems to think they are trying to keep that option open in case they want to. I don't think either one of them will fetch a good enough return, and we would be better off keeping them.

edit- if we traded Nyquist I would be super pissed off/bitter

 

[sarcastro]

I would try to give Nyquist three years at $1.5M per, but willing to go $1.8M per.

Andersson, four years around a million per. He gets stability not many guys of his calibre gets, Wings get a young player they're confident having around with a tradable contract. There's some upside to the deal, but overall little risk little upside.

Kindl, two years just below two million sounds about right to me. I don't think they will throw him the one year deal, and I don't think they're looking to lock him up for longer either.

Smith, four years, $2.5M per. It shows they have faith in him, and I think Wings could get something good out of it the last two years as a trade-off. The alternative is the two years, $1.5M per bridge deal. But that's a gamble for both sides.

Nyquist and Andersson shouldn't cost that much. They have no leverage and don't have enough time in to warrant big contracts. You should be able to get Nyquist for closer to a mil a year, and Andersson should come in at closer to 800k. They don't appear to have a desperate need to keep the prices down right now but you start handing out more money than you need to for your no-leverage RFAs and pretty soon you end up with a cap problem.

Your proposal for Kindl seems about right to me.

There's no way I'd give Smith a 4/$10m deal. Worst case scenario, you sign him for a year or two for peanuts and make him prove he can actually play NHL defense. So far, he hasn't. Personally I wouldn't be willing to give him a 4 year deal of any kind unless it's dirt cheap, and I doubt he'd be interested in such a deal. This kid scares the hell out of me and I don't in any way like the way he plays most nights. And for an offensive defenseman, he appears to have terrible offensive instincts at the NHL level.

 

[RedWingsNow*]

Nyquist has shown more promising than Smith has to date, so I think it would be a good idea to give both of them those deals where they grow into their value and we lock them up fairly long-term.

Like it or not, Smith played 20 minutes a night. He played the entire season.

I'm not really sure it's even accurate to say Nyquist showed more promise than SMith at the NHL level.
While I'm impressed Nyquist's skill set, it hasn't amounted to all that much yet.
Given his size and weakness, I think there may be some questions about him yet.

But the real reason I don't see it as likely is from Nyquist's point of view. Why should he sign for more than a year or two. The Wings need him to produce. If he fires in 18 goals and 50 points next year. what does that do to his value?
If he fires in 22 goals and 55 points next year, how much is he worth?

Nyquist and Tatar have the ability to dramatically increase their value over the next 1-2 years. Long term deals don't make much sense for them.

 

[joe89]

Nyquist has shown more promising than Smith has to date, so I think it would be a good idea to give both of them those deals where they grow into their value and we lock them up fairly long-term.

Hard to compare forwards and defensemen. Smith was playing 20 hard minutes a night, Nyquist was more comfortable/consistent in his role but playing 12-13 rather sheltered minutes.

I think it's gonna be hard to screw up the deals because they're very promising players, but it's a risk/reward calculation. Go for the easy bridge deal, or bank on the next step being taken with a bigger deal.

 

[RedWingsNow*]

Nyquist and Andersson shouldn't cost that much. They have no leverage and don't have enough time in to warrant big contracts. You should be able to get Nyquist for closer to a mil a year, and Andersson should come in at closer to 800k. They don't appear to have a desperate need to keep the prices down right now but you start handing out more money than you need to for your no-leverage RFAs and pretty soon you end up with a cap problem.

Your proposal for Kindl seems about right to me.

There's no way I'd give Smith a 4/$10m deal. Worst case scenario, you sign him for a year or two for peanuts and make him prove he can actually play NHL defense. So far, he hasn't. Personally I wouldn't be willing to give him a 4 year deal of any kind unless it's dirt cheap, and I doubt he'd be interested in such a deal. This kid scares the hell out of me and I don't in any way like the way he plays most nights. And for an offensive defenseman, he appears to have terrible offensive instincts at the NHL level.

We resigned Abdelkader at 4 years, $1.7M a year and he's bunk.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

I said maybe twice

I have no idea if it is an issue or not. Wouldn't be surprised either way.

I'm not in favor of trading them. TZE seems to think they are trying to keep that option open in case they want to. I don't think either one of them will fetch a good enough return, and we would be better off keeping them.

edit- if we traded Nyquist I would be super pissed off/bitter

I like both guys, they just aren't protected guys for me, if the right deal presented itself I would be there.

Will be pretty angry though depending on what the deal is. For instance I want no part of Yandle which has been floating around for a while with the Wings interested. He actually sort of fits in terms of what people would say we were targeting. But for me he isn't a number one so I would be disappointed.

But I think they should have their options open on them, especially if they are going to extend Babcock. He has a certain way of doing things so it concerns me to give him a bunch of players he is pretty much philosophically against. I think there is a way to carry all three, we will see if Babcock does, because I will get sick of watching him only punish the three smaller players with a ton of skill.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

There's no way I'd give Smith a 4/$10m deal. Worst case scenario, you sign him for a year or two for peanuts and make him prove he can actually play NHL defense. So far, he hasn't. Personally I wouldn't be willing to give him a 4 year deal of any kind unless it's dirt cheap, and I doubt he'd be interested in such a deal. This kid scares the hell out of me and I don't in any way like the way he plays most nights. And for an offensive defenseman, he appears to have terrible offensive instincts at the NHL level.

Smith played #3 role on our team last year. He got some awfully tough matchups too. As for his offensive feel he makes some pretty heady plays and is basically the only guy we have on the blueline that can actually read Datsyuk which says something.

I will be curious to see what he does with this summer, but I remain pretty high on him. Think people get a little too caught up in some of his clunker performances, he was pretty good for a rookie D-man basically being told to play D first and stuck on the PK. For his long-term development I think it was huge as was checking some of the bigger forwards that he did in the post-season run.

But really the most significant factor on him would be the organization and Babcock have not left his camp. That is important to the kind of contract you can expect.

 

[joe89]

Nyquist and Andersson shouldn't cost that much. They have no leverage and don't have enough time in to warrant big contracts. You should be able to get Nyquist for closer to a mil a year, and Andersson should come in at closer to 800k. They don't appear to have a desperate need to keep the prices down right now but you start handing out more money than you need to for your no-leverage RFAs and pretty soon you end up with a cap problem.

Your proposal for Kindl seems about right to me.

There's no way I'd give Smith a 4/$10m deal. Worst case scenario, you sign him for a year or two for peanuts and make him prove he can actually play NHL defense. So far, he hasn't. Personally I wouldn't be willing to give him a 4 year deal of any kind unless it's dirt cheap, and I doubt he'd be interested in such a deal. This kid scares the hell out of me and I don't in any way like the way he plays most nights. And for an offensive defenseman, he appears to have terrible offensive instincts at the NHL level.

Give some, take some. Nyquist and Smith aren't Emmerton and Ericsson coming up the system, taking the stability unknown if they will ever become regulars. This is closer to Filppula and Kronwall coming up the system. They already are regulars and will be playing top9 and top4 roles respectively next season.

Nyquist isn't likely to sign for three years at one million, there's nothing in it for him. If he puts up 45 points next season he's gonna be worth thrice that and he knows it. Same with Smith. He was playing 20 minutes per game in the playoffs and he's likely gonna be playing something similar to start next season. 20 minute defensemen soon earn their paycheck, especially if they put up some points. The shorter deal now, the earlier you pay the significant bucks. It's one thing if you don't like the player at all ofc, but be sure Detroit management are high on Smith.

800k fits with what I said for Andersson.

 

[Detroit Sports*]

How on earth can Smith make more than Kindl?

 

[odin1981]

Don't get me wrong kindl isn't great but he isn't horrible. And 1.75 or whatever he will laugh at and go elsewhere. I don't think you have to overpay but if you give him 3rd pair + pp minutes he would probably stick for 2 years somewhere at 2-2.5 million. But thinking he will get less than 2 is way too wishlisting.

Andersson wouldn't suprise me to get 2-3 years @ 1 million. Good 3-4th line center. Not physical but good two way skill with decent/good faceoffs.

Nyquist: think he will get a ericcson type contract (not same term but structured like) probabley 1.5 first year, 2 mill next, and 2.5 last year. I don't think you would question that amount and it mwill be a bargain by the second year for what he brings.

I would rather for smith get a 2 year deal at 1.75 and then 2.25. He still has problems in his own end but if we get him for 2 years it shapes him. Also believe after those 2 years if he develops well we can then pay him 3-4 mil multi year because he would still be a rfa (unless i've missed something).

I like E. I'd love to extend him for somewhere between 3.5-4.5 for 2-4 years. He does just fine as a off wing def-d. And he would be good to look up at somewhere in that rate to give time to the youngsters to develope.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Kindl is an RFA, he cannot go elsewhere unless somebody makes a bid on him.

 

[SportsballChic]

I think you keep your trade options open on Tatar and Nyquist because unless both players break out perfectly; they're probably competing for the same roster spot.

I know others people seem less concerned by Tatar's attitude but honestly he's not super thrilled with all this waiting. I know even Slovak fans think he's got a bit of an ego problem but I think it's more that he wants to get on a top line as fast as possible, start scoring goals and get paid.

Can you blame him? Now accepting that Dats and Hank are staying, Nyquist seems to have the inside track on "winger of the future" and we have a whole line worth of prospects (a couple of them elite imho; Jarnkrok and Jurco) in the system why exactly would Tatar think the Wings are his best path to that desired result? He's been waiting 4 years in the minors, do you really think he's gonna play on the 3rd line for another 3 if someplace else offers more money and opportunity?

Maybe everyone turns into a superstar and we find a way to make it work, but realistically there's no reason to automatically assume that either. I legitimately fear for Tatar's long term desire to stay with the team.

 

[mindfly]

Is Detroit not going to carry any player under 1million anymore? err?

 

[Henkka]

People are totally missin Kindl's and Smith's value. Kindl is going to get more, that's the starting point.

1.000 for Andersson
1.400 for Nyquist
1.800 for Smith
2.250 for Kindl

Bonus: Ericsson for 4.000

That's pretty easy, more than Quincey, less than Kronwall.

 

[SoupNazi]

Is Detroit not going to carry any player under 1million anymore? err?

That's becoming the nature of the NHL.