Post-Game Talk: The Pre-Season Review Thread; Ft. Chris Earneditz

xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

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Sep 5, 2008
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Forget the scores/results, let's focus on player evaluations and coaching decisions.

Overwhelming positives;

Sprong: Really acquitted himself. The dude looks ready to play in the NHL, no questions asked. Does he look ready to contribute big production? No, but the kid can play. He was easily our best forward for several games, including ones that had roster staples. Give him his nine games, give him 3rd line minutes alongside Bonino and Bennett.

Bennett: Was great on a near shift-by-shift basis. Great play along the boards, great play with and without the puck. No lack of accountability as far as defense goes. His skating also looked a lot better. It's gonna be a shame to see him getting 4th line minutes until he's traded for ridiculously below his value.

Plotnikov: Also acquitted himself very well. He's got a nose for the net, can hit extremely well, his skating's looked good considering all the question marks surrounding it. As time moves on, he gets more comfortable with this team/the NA game/NA ice, I think he'll turn out to be a steal.

Pretty good;

Sid+Kessel: Didn't light the world on fire on a consistent basis, but had flashes of "Holy ****, these guys are gonna be unreal." Anyone thinking that their third linemate doesn't matter is simply wrong. They have the potential to be the best line in the league, easily, and Sid+Kessel could hover between 180-200pts.

Maatta+Letang: Again, weren't out of this world incredible, but I think they'll get better as time goes on. They have to, since they're our only legit defensemen that are capable of more than bottom pairing minutes/responsibility.

Murray: Taking into account the defense in front of him at any given moment, I think Murray played extremely well. He showed flashes of what lead to an incredible season last year in the AHL. He's by no means ready for full time NHL duty, but he's shown an incredible amount of poise, patience, calmness, and an impressive dedication to fundamentals. He's gonna be a really, really good goalie in a couple more years.

Decent;

Sundqvist: I didn't expect him to make the big club, but there were definitely hints of "He could be a very good bottom-6 player for us for a long time." He's got a bunch to work on, and he could stand to get stronger to fully take advantage of his frame, but he's got tons of time to develop.

Dupuis: The speed, puck-hounding, and defensive responsibility are all still there. I don't think he's good enough for top-6 duty, and I wouldn't sacrifice Bennett/Sprong's development to put him on the third line, but Duper showed he can still be a very effective 4th liner/PK specialist. Hope his health holds up, for his sake and ours.

Cole: Again, maybe it's a situation of "He looks better because he's surrounded by garbage," but Cole didn't really look out of place back on the blueline. I am still not sold on him being an effective 2nd pairing defenseman, but we've got no other choice. In my eyes, he's a good bottom pairing guy.

Clendening: Much like with Cole, I don't really know how to evaluate him. He didn't look disastrous, which is like saying he was phenomenal with regard to a lot of those around him. Hopefully he can continue to improve and impress us a la Niskanen.

Downright atrocious;

Gonchar: Should've hung 'em up years ago. Looked excruciatingly slow, and horrendous on the defensive side of the puck. Take the last shreds of dignity you've got, retire, and take a job with the the team in a coaching position. Lord knows guys like Maatta, Letang, Dumoulin and Pouliot could learn an immeasurable amount from an all-time great offensive d-man like Gonch.

Scuderi: Big surprise. Just as embarrassingly bad as we all knew he'd be.

Pouliot: Didn't impress me last season, and looked to take several steps back this camp/pre-season. I don't know if it's a mental thing, a "not ready yet, but on the way" thing, or he's just not nearly as good as we'd all hoped, but it's concerning to see him play at such a piss-poor level with and without the puck, and in all three zones.

Zatkoff: Thank god Murray looked phenomenal, because it's gonna be a situation of the sooner the better as far as Zatkoff being off the team. Hopefully we only have two years of bad backups before Murray's able to make the jump and challenge Fleury for split duties.

Kunitz: Looked just as lazy, slow, complacent, and downright bad as he did last season. He's gotta go. Not simply because he's bad, but because MJ won't tell him to **** himself and put him on the 4th line, and because he's directly responsible for screwing several better, more deserving guys over (Perron, Bennett).

MJ: More evidence to support the idea that MJ is indeed nothing more than Bylsma with an absurd toupee and a mask. Idiotic personnel decisions, ******** rationale for said decisions, and a continuance of seemingly intentionally sabotaging the team before it even hits the ice with line combos.
 
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Asuna

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Apr 27, 2014
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Sid+Kunitz: Didn't light the world on fire on a consistent basis, but had flashes of "Holy ****, these guys are gonna be unreal." Anyone thinking that their third linemate doesn't matter is simply wrong. They have the potential to be the best line in the league, easily, and Sid+Kunitz could hover between 180-200pts.

Maybe in 2009, pal ;)
 

drpepper

Registered User
Dec 10, 2013
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Good Things & People

Sprong
sprong9.22.15.gif


Clendening
tumblr_nvgubjVKwR1skgd7ao1_500.gif


Also Matt Murray, Kessel with anyone, players being mostly healthy, center depth, Sestito not getting a one-way contract

Disappointing Things & People

490706118-derrick-pouliot-of-the-pittsburgh-penguins-gettyimages.jpg


Also Perron as a RW, coaching staff, Pittsburgh media's obsession with Farnham, Lovejoy, Scuderi, Gonchar, Kunitz

And a big **** you to whoever is responsible for preseason scheduling (3 games in 3 days limited the utility of preseason for the actual NHL team) and viewing options.
 

66-30-33

Registered User
Jan 24, 2006
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I'm all for giving Sprong 9 games. Weird seeing a 2nd round pick ready RIGHT away. But once the 9 games are over they need to send him back to get better as a player, then to dominate his league. No need to rush him, the guy is going to be pretty awesome for us down the line.
 

xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

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Sep 5, 2008
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I still don't get where this "rushing him" idea comes from. Rushing him is throwing him on Sid or Geno's line from the start, giving him 20 minutes a night, and asking/expecting 50+ points out of him.

Playing him in a relatively insulated line/role, on the 3rd with Bonino and (hopefully) Bennett isn't rushing him. And he'll learn a Hell of a lot more and develop more efficiently in the NHL as opposed to an offense-only junior league. He'll also have access to better trainers/facilities to train, and he can watch Sid, Geno and Kessel every night and learn from them every day in practice.

/shrug Maybe I'm just thirsty as ****, but Sprong looks ready now and I don't think keeping him up has any negative affects on him or his development whatsoever. All I see are positives. To send him down "just because" is the wrong choice, in my opinion.
 

xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

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Sep 5, 2008
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Rushing his developement. We can take our time with him and use him down the line.

No. I understand what "rushing him" means. I just think the sentiment holds no water.

It's a baseless opinion, founded simply on the fear based on the organizations ability to develop young guys in the past. That doesn't come in to play, because we haven't had a forward of Sprong's caliber or readiness since Staal.
 

Mr Jiggyfly

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Jan 29, 2004
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I still don't get where this "rushing him" idea comes from. Rushing him is throwing him on Sid or Geno's line from the start, giving him 20 minutes a night, and asking/expecting 50+ points out of him.

Playing him in a relatively insulated line/role, on the 3rd with Bonino and (hopefully) Bennett isn't rushing him. And he'll learn a Hell of a lot more and develop more efficiently in the NHL as opposed to an offense-only junior league. He'll also have access to better trainers/facilities to train, and he can watch Sid, Geno and Kessel every night and learn from them every day in practice.

/shrug Maybe I'm just thirsty as ****, but Sprong looks ready now and I don't think keeping him up has any negative affects on him or his development whatsoever. All I see are positives. To send him down "just because" is the wrong choice, in my opinion.

It won't hurt him I'd imagine. You have to worry about him not being physically mature enough to handle playing agt men, but he looks to be able to handle it so far.

The real concerns are if he is a liability in his own end, if he will wear down by the end of the season like we saw with Maatta, and if it's worth burning a season of his ELC now and letting him hit UFA earlier. Those are the issues I imagine they will focus on if he keeps progressing through the next nine games.
 

Darth Vitale

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Aug 21, 2003
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Forget the scores/results, let's focus on player evaluations and coaching decisions.

Overwhelming positives;

Sprong: Really acquitted himself. The dude looks ready to play in the NHL, no questions asked. Does he look ready to contribute big production? No, but the kid can play. He was easily our best forward for several games, including ones that had roster staples. Give him his nine games, give him 3rd line minutes alongside Bonino and Bennett.

Bennett: Was great on a near shift-by-shift basis. Great play along the boards, great play with and without the puck. No lack of accountability as far as defense goes. His skating also looked a lot better. It's gonna be a shame to see him getting 4th line minutes until he's traded for ridiculously below his value.

Plotnikov: Also acquitted himself very well. He's got a nose for the net, can hit extremely well, his skating's looked good considering all the question marks surrounding it. As time moves on, he gets more comfortable with this team/the NA game/NA ice, I think he'll turn out to be a steal.

The other stuff is par for the course, expected, but these three points are really good news for us in general terms. Ironically now our D (which we all thought was going to be our strength when it came time) is going to blow, evidently. :laugh:
 

xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

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Sep 5, 2008
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It won't hurt him I'd imagine. You have to worry about him not being physically mature enough to handle playing agt men, but he looks to be able to handle it so far.

The real concerns are if he is a liability in his own end, if he will wear down by the end of the season like we saw with Maatta, and if it's worth burning a season of his ELC now and letting him hit UFA earlier. Those are the issues I imagine they will focus on if he keeps progressing through the next nine games.

Legit concerns, for sure. From what I understand, the junior league he comes from is pretty defensively barren to begin with (I don't know anything about the QMJHL), so I doubt he'd learn anything or improve to any degree defensively down there.
 

888 98 twins

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Feb 12, 2008
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I watched Sprong back checking tonight and picking the pocket of a forward in the D zone. He is constantly in the right place to gain possession of the puck and his hands are outstanding enough to be able to maintain it in traffic. He will never be a physical player, so if he's able to play with the speed, hockey sense, and skill that he is already displaying, why not give him a shot if he continues to prove it during the 9 games? Looked a little like a young Hossa-lite out there on some of those back checks.
 

Mr Jiggyfly

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Jan 29, 2004
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Legit concerns, for sure. From what I understand, the junior league he comes from is pretty defensively barren to begin with (I don't know anything about the QMJHL), so I doubt he'd learn anything or improve to any degree defensively down there.

No I don't think their concern is him going back to learn to play defense/two way game. That can be taught when he is in the A.

Their concern is will he be a liability on the ice now and hurt the team. I watched him closely and he was doing the right things without the puck. Some mistakes here and there, but the effort and understanding of his assignments were there. He also back checks hard... reminds me a little of a young Jagr in that respect. Jagr was an animal though at that age and just dogged the puck until he got it back, so I may be exaggerating here...
 

xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

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Sep 5, 2008
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No I don't think their concern is him going back to learn to play defense/two way game. That can be taught when he is in the A.

Their concern is will he be a liability on the ice now and hurt the team. I watched him closely and he was doing the right things without the puck. Some mistakes here and there, but the effort and understanding of his assignments were there. He also back checks hard... reminds me a little of a young Jagr in that respect. Jagr was an animal though at that age and just dogged the puck until he got it back, so I may be exaggerating here...

It's just gonna come down to whether or not the team is ready and willing to allow him to develop, progress and play through the inevitable growing pains. I'm sure there'll be some, but the learning and development he'll gain at the NHL level far surpasses the downside, in my eyes.
 

Mr Jiggyfly

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Jan 29, 2004
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It's just gonna come down to whether or not the team is ready and willing to allow him to develop, progress and play through the inevitable growing pains. I'm sure there'll be some, but the learning and development he'll gain at the NHL level far surpasses the downside, in my eyes.

I guess if they believe his talent and speed make the team more dynamic and dangerous, they may consider it.

Capp said JR wants him to go back and doesn't want to rush him like BB. I have no idea where JR came up with that idea. BB was never rushed, he was ready, but just ran into injury problems again. As I said before, he got hurt in college and the A. He would of most likely gotten hurt in the A again because he has crap luck. I don't see in what manner he was rushed.
 

madinsomniac

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Jul 3, 2012
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I guess if they believe his talent and speed make the team more dynamic and dangerous, they may consider it.

Capp said JR wants him to go back and doesn't want to rush him like BB. I have no idea where JR came up with that idea. BB was never rushed, he was ready, but just ran into injury problems again. As I said before, he got hurt in college and the A. He would of most likely gotten hurt in the A again because he has crap luck. I don't see in what manner he was rushed.

What are you talking about... they never had the time to get Bennet accustomed to the 4th line role they envisioned in the minors...lol :sarcasm:
 

WayneSid9987

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Nov 24, 2009
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Yea, i'd give him the 9 and send him back down as well:

Theres enough wingers now to get by if the injury bug hits. ie. Perron, Bennett, Bonino can play wing, so can Fehr. All of these guys aren't even in the top 6 currently.

If this was last year, i'd keep him up for sure.
 

Farnham4top6

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Mar 6, 2011
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It won't hurt him I'd imagine. You have to worry about him not being physically mature enough to handle playing agt men, but he looks to be able to handle it so far.

The real concerns are if he is a liability in his own end, if he will wear down by the end of the season like we saw with Maatta, and if it's worth burning a season of his ELC now and letting him hit UFA earlier. Those are the issues I imagine they will focus on if he keeps progressing through the next nine games.
Burning a year of the elc will also mean that he will be a year younger when it's time for his second contract and it will be easier to get longterm pens friendly contract.
 

Mr Jiggyfly

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Jan 29, 2004
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Burning a year of the elc will also mean that he will be a year younger when it's time for his second contract and it will be easier to get longterm pens friendly contract.

There are a couple of different schools of thought there. If he becomes a good player like we all hope, he could take a small bridge contract and then look for a big payday. Or he could sign a long term deal with term and a cap friendly hit.

Subban took I think a two year bridge, then landed a massive payday.

ROR is probably the best comparison being a very rare second rounder that made the team his draft year. He was a contract nightmare every season it seemed.
 

AjaxTelamon

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Jul 8, 2011
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I don't expect the D to blow at all unless they have a long term injury to any of Letang, Maatta, Cole or Dumo. We have the pieces and parts to make up a reasonable 3rd pairing (I'm glad Oleksy made it through waivers, though i expected he would). If we do sustain a big injury, we'll need to make a move or hope Pouliot has come around enough to give us some games. Not to mention we've got Fleury and a very legit looking tender pushing him in Murray.

In any case, if our #1 or #2D go down in the post season, we're as screwed as most other contenders would be.

Not sure why everyone is willing to write our defense off based on watching guys who won't be on it this year.
 

Asuna

Lvl 94 Sub-Leader
Apr 27, 2014
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I don't expect the D to blow at all unless they have a long term injury to any of Letang, Maatta, Cole or Dumo. We have the pieces and parts to make up a reasonable 3rd pairing (I'm glad Oleksy made it through waivers, though i expected he would). If we do sustain a big injury, we'll need to make a move or hope Pouliot has come around enough to give us some games. Not to mention we've got Fleury and a very legit looking tender pushing him in Murray.

In any case, if our #1 or #2D go down in the post season, we're as screwed as most other contenders would be.

Not sure why everyone is willing to write our defense off based on watching guys who won't be on it this year.

Yeah I don't think it'll be that bad either. Mostly throughout the preseason when the defense looked like total ass, Scuderi/Gonchar/Lovejoy/Pouliot were on the ice. And most likely 3/4 of those players won't be playing every night.
 

WayneSid9987

Registered User
Nov 24, 2009
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When do the final cuts usually come?

All rosters have to be cut to 23 max/cap compliant by Monday.
Pens can easily carry 8 D - 13 F if they want to which they said they were thinking about doing.
 

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