TV: The Orville - Seth MacFarlane's Star Trek

[Blender]

If you're worried about that then I think you're taking the show way too seriously.

I actually thought him being blown away and changed by Rudolph, then referencing it later, was a highlight of the episode. It was supposed to be ridiculous.

 

[johnjm22]

I thought episode 3 was the best and most well produced episode yet. It flowed well. It didn't have the awkward silence and flat patches of the previous episodes. The jokes were a little more seamless.

I just wish it were funnier and didn't take itself so seriously. It would also benefit if there was a charismatic actor playing the lead role instead of MacFarlane.

 

[ThePhoenixx]

I thought episode 3 was the best and most well produced episode yet. It flowed well. It didn't have the awkward silence and flat patches of the previous episodes. The jokes were a little more seamless.

I just wish it were funnier and didn't take itself so seriously. It would also benefit if there was a charismatic actor playing the lead role instead of MacFarlane.

Who is the better actor?

MacFarlane or Shatner?

 

[Blender]

Who is the better actor?

MacFarlane or Shatner?

Easily Shatner. His "bad acting" is really overstated and more of a running joke than reality.

 

[Leafsdude7]

Episode 3 was classic Trek. Taking a modern issue and putting it into their fantastical world. The ethics of the story, as the show points out, are pretty cut and dry in our society, but in the case of a race like Moclans, it gets a little more muddy. One can only hope Discovery can pull off an episode like this.

As for being early and the idea of making us feel for Bortus, I think that misses the point here. It's not about the emotional impact of the characters, it's the emotional, and moreso the intellectual, impact of the story itself. Considering the ethics of the events and even the history behind it is just as satisfying for me as a viewer as emotional impacts of characters, whether 3 or 300 episodes into the series. The subject matter is bold and was handled very well (for the most part). I think one also has to note that it's probable that Fox executives might have had as much or more say for the order of airing as the creators, so there's that to consider as well.

That said, I will still offer a couple of my own criticisms: the reasoning and events in the court room were fairly problematic. For one, there was no exposition on the Moclan's legal system, so figuring out what was legitimate courtroom behaviour and what was not was hard to figure out unless you assume it is near analogous to our own modern legal system (in which case, it was horribly done). There was a lot of poor argumentation from both Kelly and the Moclan prosecutor/plaintiff that stuck out for even someone like myself with some but not extensive knowledge of legal procedure.

The one thing I will unashamedly state is that Bortus and Klyden's interactions throughout the episode, whether with each other or Bortus talking to other crew-members, was very well-written.

I do wonder how much this will be brought up again, not to mention how involved the child will be in the series. It does bring up not only a lot of questions as a viewer, but a lot more possible options for the creators and writers.

 

[johnjm22]

Easily Shatner. His "bad acting" is really overstated and more of a running joke than reality.

Agree. There's a lot of dramatic moments in the Star Trek movies that he pulls off really well. The "bad acting" stigma I think comes from the silly moments of The Original Trek Series where he's hamming it up.

Even if Shatner wasn't a good actor, he still has a certain charisma about him. A type of presence on the screen that successful actors have. He's memorable. MacFarlane doesn't have "it".

I don't know how good of an actor Tim Allen is, but he's naturally funny in Galaxy Quest. MacFarlane just doesn't bring anything to the screen.

 

[Blender]

Agree. There's a lot of dramatic moments in the Star Trek movies that he pulls off really well. The "bad acting" stigma I think comes from the silly moments of The Original Trek Series where he's hamming it up.

Even if Shatner wasn't a good actor, he still has a certain charisma about him. A type of presence on the screen that successful actors have. He's memorable. MacFarlane doesn't have "it".

I don't know how good of an actor Tim Allen is, but he's naturally funny in Galaxy Quest. MacFarlane just doesn't bring anything to the screen.

I can't ever imagine MacFarlane putting in the kind of performance Shatner gave in The Wrath of Khan for example. He just isn't on the same level at all.

 

[Jumptheshark]

can see why this episode noise dived in ratings

 

[Blender]

can see why this episode noise dived in ratings

It was on Thursday instead of Sunday after the NFL?

 

[ThePhoenixx]

It was on Thursday instead of Sunday after the NFL?

It also wasn't very funny or feel good at all.

 

[Blender]

It also wasn't very funny or feel good at all.

Yes, but how does anyone know that before watching it? Dislike of this episode could cause a rating drop next week.

 

[ThePhoenixx]

Yes, but how does anyone know that before watching it? Dislike of this episode could cause a rating drop next week.

People in the west read the easterners. I can see your point as well. Perhaps the drop due to the move will continue because of this stinker. I don't need to be "taught" by a show when all I want is a good chuckle and some entertainment.

I will still watch though. It looks like episode 4 returns to the original 2.

 

[Led Zappa]

People in the west read the easterners. I can see your point as well. Perhaps the drop due to the move will continue because of this stinker. I don't need to be "taught" by a show when all I want is a good chuckle and some entertainment.

I will still watch though. It looks like episode 4 returns to the original 2.

Nothing I've read is stopping me from watching it. Not buying that ratings dropped because of what people were saying on Twitter. I watched the 9ers and have it queued for tonight.

 

[ThePhoenixx]

Nothing I've read is stopping me from watching it. Not buying that ratings dropped because of what people were saying on Twitter. I watched the 9ers and have it queued for tonight.

I guess we will see next week. I'm hoping it doesn't tank.

 

[montreal]

I'm shocked at how much I like this, didn't think it would be good but have really enjoyed it so far.

 

[Guardian17]

can see why this episode noise dived in ratings

Seth MacFarlane's space dramedy entered the 9 o'clock hour with a predictably smaller live draw*—*averaging a 1.1 rating among adults 18-49 and 4 million viewers.

That's a significant drop from the previous two episodes, though both of those posted significant improvements with time-shifting.

Multiplatform views with live-plus-seven day returns give the premiere episode a 3.7 rating among adults 18-49 and 12.2 million viewers to date.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/li...-sees-live-draw-dip-thursday-premiere-1042171

 

[Jumptheshark]

This is no longer a spoof

 

[Holden Caulfield]

I can't ever imagine MacFarlane putting in the kind of performance Shatner gave in The Wrath of Khan for example. He just isn't on the same level at all.

I mean I love Shatner, but he is simply not that great an actor. He improved greatly as he aged (thinking more really later like some Boston Legal stuff) but he has never really been that good. Idk maybe just me but even Wrath of Khan he is still typical Star Trek Kirk with the overracting and odd pauses. MacFarlane is no amazing actor, but I don't Shatner level is a tough bar to reach for him and I could see it.

Episode 3 was classic Trek. Taking a modern issue and putting it into their fantastical world. The ethics of the story, as the show points out, are pretty cut and dry in our society, but in the case of a race like Moclans, it gets a little more muddy. One can only hope Discovery can pull off an episode like this.

As for being early and the idea of making us feel for Bortus, I think that misses the point here. It's not about the emotional impact of the characters, it's the emotional, and moreso the intellectual, impact of the story itself. Considering the ethics of the events and even the history behind it is just as satisfying for me as a viewer as emotional impacts of characters, whether 3 or 300 episodes into the series. The subject matter is bold and was handled very well (for the most part). I think one also has to note that it's probable that Fox executives might have had as much or more say for the order of airing as the creators, so there's that to consider as well.

That said, I will still offer a couple of my own criticisms: the reasoning and events in the court room were fairly problematic. For one, there was no exposition on the Moclan's legal system, so figuring out what was legitimate courtroom behaviour and what was not was hard to figure out unless you assume it is near analogous to our own modern legal system (in which case, it was horribly done). There was a lot of poor argumentation from both Kelly and the Moclan prosecutor/plaintiff that stuck out for even someone like myself with some but not extensive knowledge of legal procedure.

The one thing I will unashamedly state is that Bortus and Klyden's interactions throughout the episode, whether with each other or Bortus talking to other crew-members, was very well-written.

I do wonder how much this will be brought up again, not to mention how involved the child will be in the series. It does bring up not only a lot of questions as a viewer, but a lot more possible options for the creators and writers.

Most of the reason I do love Sci-Fi, good Sci-Fi that is, is that it can take modern issues and expose them. I felt this episode was a little bit too much "White Man's Burden" for me. I didn't like the way the issue was treated. Imposing someone else's morals on another culture.

I still see lots of potential in this show but I don't think they have quite found it just yet. It's hit at times with some good jokes (still like soda jokes, the anti-banana ray, the crew talking behind MacFarlane's back, etc), hit with some good character development (sec chief puking at command decisions, reveal of First Officer behind promotion, etc) and missed badly on others (Urination joke, Sec Chief change of heart, etc). But it has not yet come together with solid writing and or developing the characters, IMO. However with series like this it generally does take time. I love the premise of Star Trek with real people instead of utopian perfect people, I am hoping they manage to hit their stride soon because nowadays they won't get to 3rd/4th season without that like TNG managed to (to me TNG doesn't become a show to take seriously at all until then). I think they've gone a little bit too much focused having episodes focused on certain characters too early (MacFarlane ep1, Sec Chief Ep 2, 2nd Officer Ep 3) before we really know the crew.

 

[KirkOut]

seemed like a 2nd rate Star Trek plot that never made the cut. Not a great episode IMO. The guy on the previous page hit on the absurdities pretty well.

Though to be fair, keep in mind that the 3rd episode of TNG was "Code of Honor". So it's not like this show can't recover from a weak episode.

 

[Jumptheshark]

for me it is taken itself too serious

 

[Blender]

seemed like a 2nd rate Star Trek plot that never made the cut. Not a great episode IMO. The guy on the previous page hit on the absurdities pretty well.

Though to be fair, keep in mind that the 3rd episode of TNG was "Code of Honor". So it's not like this show can't recover from a weak episode.

Oh man Code of Honor is terrible. This episode of The Orville not even close to that bad.

 

[Mimsy]

I agree that "About a Girl" plays like one of the more disposable episodes of TNG. Were this a Rick Berman produced Star Trek episode, I suspect the Starfleet crew would have persuaded the Moclans to embrace human values on this particular issue and spare Bortus's daughter from the medical procedure. In this respect, MacFarlane flipped the script.

The writing is sometimes sketchy, but it's early going and I'm still sold on the feel of show. The captain's ready room and crew quarters almost lull me into thinking I'm watching Star Trek.

I gave the pilot another glance. I'm not sure which prosthetic job I prefer on Alara. Each has its own advantage. She's more conventionally attractive now, but the pronounced brow made her more obviously alien. I think I prefer the updated look.

 

[chicagoskycam]

I agree that "About a Girl" plays like one of the more disposable episodes of TNG. Were this a Rick Berman produced Star Trek episode, I suspect the Starfleet crew would have persuaded the Moclans to embrace human values on this particular issue and spare Bortus's daughter from the medical procedure. In this respect, MacFarlane flipped the script.
.

I don't, TNG would not have interfered with another species customs, at least Picard would not have. There would have to be another voice of opposition similar to the episode with Troi's mother and the custom of the scientist and his forced suicide at a certain age. For the Moclans to even be in the federation, this topic must have come up before and there was probably a policy already.

This episode was not done well at all. It's like they were trying to be a serious show, failed. Also, it wasn't that funny. What is the show trying to be.

 

[offkilter]

Guys the TNG episode allegory you're looking for is "The Outcast".

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Outcast_(Star_Trek:_The_Next_Generation)

In it an androgynous species contacts the enterprise for help. Along the way Riled ends up getting into a relationship with one and its revealed any type of display sexual orientation or activity is considered a perversion that is eliminated by medical procedures and mental conditioning.

Yes Hawksfan74 is right Picard and the federation ttake a stance of non interference but that doesn't stop Riker from Trying to escape with his lover with it ending up being too late.

The Orville on the other hand isn't attempting to portray the perfect society Star Trek's federation. If anything you could argue Orville is trying to attempt a little subversion by showing people who are portrayed as being supposedly morally superior end up coming off as heavy handed and closed minded.

 

[chicagoskycam]

Guys the TNG episode allegory you're looking for is "The Outcast".

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Outcast_(Star_Trek:_The_Next_Generation)

In it an androgynous species contacts the enterprise for help. Along the way Riled ends up getting into a relationship with one and its revealed any type of display sexual orientation or activity is considered a perversion that is eliminated by medical procedures and mental conditioning.

Yes Hawksfan74 is right Picard and the federation ttake a stance of non interference but that doesn't stop Riker from Trying to escape with his lover with it ending up being too late.

.

Yeah good comparison, I watched that episode recently. Riker went rogue but it was kind of a wink wink from Picard as well. One of the few times in the series we see anything like this.

That's what kind of bothered me about the episode if they were being serious. You can't really force human values on another species, it was almost like they had no clue about their own crew member's belief's and background. Obvious tie in with current events.