The new and improved concussion thread

[dechire]

So 59% of a tiny sample suffer from those issues.

In the US population:

7% suffer from depression
18% suffer from anxiety
18% have alcohol issues
8% have drug issues

So 51% of the US population has issues that 59% of a small NHL sample population has?

..doesn't sound like anything outside the norm.

You should probably look into things like co-morbidity and dual diagnosis

 

[Llama19]

Four junior hockey players diagnosed with CTE, researcher says

To quote:

"A researcher at Boston University says she has diagnosed chronic traumatic encephalopathy, or CTE, in the brains of four former junior hockey players.

Neuropathologist Dr. Ann McKee made the diagnoses over the past two years. Each of the four former junior players – none of whom advanced to the National Hockey League – committed suicide before the age of 30, she said."

Source: http://www.tsn.ca/four-junior-hockey-players-diagnosed-with-cte-researcher-says-1.730445

 

[LadyStanley]

https://www.thestar.com/sports/hock...cussions-yields-surprising-early-results.html

In a new study by Toronto researchers, ex-NHL players showed no significant cognitive impairment, regardless of how many concussions they’d suffered. But the findings don’t match how some players say they feel.
...
On objective tests of cognitive functions such as memory, attention and processing information, the NHL alumni do about as well as the study’s comparison group, and it doesn’t matter how many concussions they had during their careers or whether they have the APOE4 allele, a type of gene that has been associated with increased dementia.
...
The study, published in the Journal of Neurology, Neurosurgery & Psychiatry this month, seeks to expand concussion research beyond the popular focus on the degenerative brain disease chronic traumatic encephalopathy (CTE), which can be diagnosed only after death, by detailing how living NHL alumni fare over time.

But what’s also interesting is that the study’s generally positive main finding doesn’t jibe with how players say they feel. In subjective questionnaires, they reported high levels of behavioural and emotional problems.
...
On the subjective questionnaires, followed up with medical diagnosis, the NHL alumni had elevated rates of psychiatric complaints from depression and mood disorders to alcohol and substance abuse — and those were not related to the number of concussions they suffered.

Fifty-nine per cent of the former players reported problems with depression, anxiety, alcohol and substance abuse — well above the 19 per cent found in the control group. The figure is also higher than medical estimates that 50 per cent of the general population will experience a psychiatric disorder at some point during their lifetime, Levine said.

Memory losses when you can't recall family conversations, or the name of a guy you played with for years = scary.

The study continues and is increasing in # of participants.

 

[Llama19]

Lawsuit against NHL over concussions heating up

To quote:

"“The National Hockey League has made some great strides,†Stuart said. But the Mayo Clinic has concluded that all head hits and fights should be banned from hockey.

That’s not likely to happen in the NHL. “We sell and promote hate,†Colin Campbell, a top NHL executive, said in a 2015 deposition, acknowledging an intra-league e-mail saying the same. “We do sell rivalries.â€"

Source: http://m.startribune.com/lawsuit-against-nhl-over-concussions-heating-up/420199203/

 

[Llama19]

NHL loses bid to force CTE researchers to hand over data

To quote:

"A U.S. federal court judge in Minneapolis late Wednesday denied an attempt by the NHL to force Boston University to hand over reams of medical data related to its research on chronic traumatic encephalopathy (CTE), saying that task would be “staggering.â€

The NHL also wanted the school to hand over any communications that discussed whether there was any variation in CTE diagnoses in the brains of former boxers, football players and athletes from other sports compared with those of hockey players, as well as digitized photos of the microscopy slides of brain tissue samples.

Judge Susan R. Nelson denied the NHL’s request in a decision released Wednesday night. Judge Nelson did order the university to produce to the NHL any public statements to the press regarding their research involving NHL donors.

“…The sheer effort in physically locating and preparing the requested information is staggering,†Judge Nelson wrote in her 31-page order. “In balancing need versus burden, the tremendous burden to non-party BU outweighs the NHL’s need for the requested information.â€"

Source: http://www.tsn.ca/nhl-loses-bid-to-force-cte-researchers-to-hand-over-data-1.736195

 

[Llama19]

 

[Llama19]

Interesting take on the NHL breeding a culture of slashes and cross-checks (leading to concussions)...

Source: https://puckit.wordpress.com/2017/0...that-makes-head-shots-and-slashes-acceptable/

 

[LadyStanley]

http://www.tsn.ca/league-points-finger-at-union-in-nhl-concussion-case-1.739833

The National Hockey League says the NHL Players’ Association has repeatedly interfered with its attempts to introduce rules over the past 50 years to limit staged fighting, better safeguard players and bolster penalties for dangerous head hits.
...
In the latest twist in the high-stakes concussion case, the NHL asked the court to not certify the case as a class-action suit. Daly’s affidavit was filed in connection with that request.
If Judge Susan R. Nelson certifies the case, it would mean more than 5,000 former players, and the families of some deceased players, would automatically become plaintiffs in the case, drastically driving up the potential liability for the league.
If the court rejects the class-action motion, individual players would have to hire their own lawyers and pursue claims. The court could decide on certification as early as this summer.

So, the league is pointing fingers at the union for not cracking down on staged fighting, etc. (Lots of specific examples not quoted from article.)

And trying to eliminate major liability by not being class action suit.

But looks like it'll be a few months before a decision comes.

 

[Killion]

http://www.tsn.ca/league-points-finger-at-union-in-nhl-concussion-case-1.739833


So, the league is pointing fingers at the union for not cracking down on staged fighting, etc. (Lots of specific examples not quoted from article.)

And trying to eliminate major liability by not being class action suit.

But looks like it'll be a few months before a decision comes.

Man they are just ducking, diving & dodging, taking everyone for a ride down every excuse for a rabbit hole that they can find, dream up. Way to go NHL. Expected nothing less. This leagues track record when it comes to litigation is absolutely appalling. Unconscionable and they do not care one whit.

 

[Tom ServoMST3K]

http://www.tsn.ca/league-points-finger-at-union-in-nhl-concussion-case-1.739833


So, the league is pointing fingers at the union for not cracking down on staged fighting, etc. (Lots of specific examples not quoted from article.)

And trying to eliminate major liability by not being class action suit.

But looks like it'll be a few months before a decision comes.

been waiting for this shoe to drop for a while. I remember questioning at the very beginning, as to why the pa was not included in this.

didnt the pa fight against helmets?

 

[cbcwpg]

https://sports.yahoo.com/news/concu...hockey-play-excuses-cte-stance-171638388.html

Concussion expert slams NHL's ‘hockey play’ excuses, CTE stance

 

[LadyStanley]

And now, a few words from Bob McKenzie

 

[Llama19]

Panthers doctor: 'Turf war' keeping neurologists off NHL study group

To quote:

"Since 1997, the subcommittee has been advising the league on how best to treat players who suffer head injuries and brain trauma.

Yet since at least 2010 when he began working with the Panthers, the subcommittee’s membership has not included a neurologist, says Dr. Frank Conidi.

“We would be a valuable asset and this makes no sense, other than being about politics and turf. It's straightforward. If you were dealing with heart problems among players, you would want to have a cardiologist on the panel, wouldn't you?""

Source: http://www.tsn.ca/panthers-doctor-turf-war-keeping-neurologists-off-nhl-study-group-1.718259

 

[Teemu]

 

[Killion]

Panthers doctor: 'Turf war' keeping neurologists off NHL study group

To quote:

"Since 1997, the subcommittee has been advising the league on how best to treat players who suffer head injuries and brain trauma.

Yet since at least 2010 when he began working with the Panthers, the subcommittee’s membership has not included a neurologist, says Dr. Frank Conidi.

“We would be a valuable asset and this makes no sense, other than being about politics and turf. It's straightforward. If you were dealing with heart problems among players, you would want to have a cardiologist on the panel, wouldn't you?""

.... not if your trying to cover it up you wouldnt. Follow the JFK Assassination's Warren Commission model of appointee's. First rig then ignore autopsy reports, attack the credibility of neurologists in a smear campaign marginalizing their opinions. All "VooDoo Science" see? Irrelevant.

That is just mind-blowing. Orwellian.

 

[LadyStanley]

Guessing the Crosby rule to be added to concussion protocol this summer.

Hitting the boards with shoulder should not be cause to pull.

 

[Llama19]

 

[Killion]

^^^ oh boy. all too typical of the NHL's legal stratagems. theyve been pulling stuff like this for decades, be it the recent Moyes BK case including their civil litigation vs Moyes Family Trust or the NHL Pension Fund suit of 20yrs ago... going way back to the Eddie Livingstone case of 1916/17 through the 30's and some of the comments levelled at the league from the bench by various sitting Judges when faced with such a defendants or plaintiffs total lack of ethical behaviour beyond damning.

 

[WildGopher]

^^^ oh boy. all too typical of the NHL's legal stratagems. theyve been pulling stuff like this for decades, be it the recent Moyes BK case including their civil litigation vs Moyes Family Trust or the NHL Pension Fund suit of 20yrs ago... going way back to the Eddie Livingstone case of 1916/17 through the 30's and some of the comments levelled at the league from the bench by various sitting Judges when faced with such a defendants or plaintiffs total lack of ethical behaviour beyond damning.

The more you see about this concussion issue and the more you read these quotes in many posts above - Bettman's denials sounding eerily like the tobacco industry; NHL trying to make it look like the players association blocked their efforts to improve safety; NHL saying it won't help fund CTE research; Campbell saying "we sell and promote hate" - the more it looks like just the continuation of a line of behavior you've posted many examples of, K: The NHL historically being run by crooked, legally suspect, and ethically challenged leadership.

Seen in that light, this continuity makes sense: the league's leadership are troglodytes. But while they apparently stopped developing ethically, the world keeps evolving. I remember attending a hockey camp where one of the instructors told us Scott Stevens' signature shoulder checks to the head were "perfectly OK," because they were within the rules then. When my nephews started getting old enough that I could see they were going to start using all my season tickets (hey, at least they let me watch the games on TV while they go to the games with my tickets!) I wrote a letter to the Wild's owner. I told him I wasn't comfortable exposing kids to that kind of ethic in sport: that because it was what the pro-players did, it was automatically OK. I was teaching the kids hockey and getting them involved, and watching the NHL's violence at the time was no model for the kids to learn. I wonder how many bantam, high school, and junior players got bad concussions over the years because the NHL was modeling targeted hits to the head as "perfectly OK" because it was "within the rules."

So I wrote to the owner and told him that with my tickets likely to start going to kids who I was trying teach the right way to play hockey and respect the game, I was considering dropping the season tickets. To his credit, he called me and he listened. He didn't need to call; I'm just an upper-deck ticket holder, not someone shelling out big bucks for a suite or with a business. But he suggested some changes might be coming, and when the NHL changed their penalty rules for head shots a few years back, I felt comfortable enough to keep the season ticket. They still need to refine the rule a bit. They're slow, and this current court case shows they're probably going to pay for that.

I still encourage the nephews in their hockey (but not to play football, in which every single play has head contact with multiple kids), and I'll make sure all of them get the clinics in how to check and take a check before they enter bantams. I get it that the NHL doesn't want to be told what to do (and the owner didn't argue with me that what they'd been doing was OK, again to his credit), but I'm guessing they're going to be told what to do anyway when this lawsuit doesn't go well for them. They'd be better off to get out in front of the changes that are going to be forced on them, anyway.

And K, I know you don't think well of that owner. Whatever he did in the other city where he owned a team, I don't know. I know he's done a good job in our market and he actually agreed with me on some things I was surprised by. If things were problematic in that other city, maybe he's turned a new leaf. Lord knows this league needs some open eyes and enlightened leadership. I'd rather see the NHL come around to protecting players on their own, but if it takes it to protect something as precious as the human brain, maybe they need to lose this lawsuit big in order to straighten out, maybe ironically "knocking some sense into them!"

 

[cbcwpg]

http://nypost.com/2017/05/12/sidney-crosby-is-the-battered-face-of-the-nhls-concussion-failure/

“Depending on the mechanism of injury, ‘slow to get up’ does not trigger mandatory removal,†NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly told USA Today. “The protocol has to be interpreted literally to mandate a removal. ‘Ice’ as compared to ‘boards’ is in there for a reason. It’s the result of a study on our actual experiences over a number of years. ‘Ice’ has been found to be a predictor of concussions — ‘boards’ has not been.â€

***

I would like to see this study. So if I hit my head on the ice or a player hits me in the head the concussion protocol is in place, but if I crash into the boards and hit my head.. it's not .

 

[Killion]

And K, I know you don't think well of that owner. Whatever he did in the other city where he owned a team, I don't know. I know he's done a good job in our market and he actually agreed with me on some things I was surprised by. If things were problematic in that other city, maybe he's turned a new leaf. Lord knows this league needs some open eyes and enlightened leadership. I'd rather see the NHL come around to protecting players on their own, but if it takes it to protect something as precious as the human brain, maybe they need to lose this lawsuit big in order to straighten out, maybe ironically "knocking some sense into them!"

Interesting post.... that was decent of the Wilds' owner to take the time to call you & discuss your concerns. No ones "all bad", no ones perfect least of all I and far be it for me to Judge. I do have issues with the guy over how he handled things in Nashville however he was desperate at the time & desperate times often call for desperate measures that under normal circumstances one wouldnt contemplate, ever consider. So he struck a deal with Bettman & the NHL, re-joined the rank & towed the corporate line, rewarded with Minnesota for doing so. That he ever crossed that line however, that things did unravel under his watch to the extent that they did, well, lets just say Im still a bit wary, cautious, and sure, maybe he's turned over a new leaf..... Regardless, back to the topic at hand yes absolutely, he who procrastinates will have decisions made for him & this situation a clear example of that age old axiom.

http://nypost.com/2017/05/12/sidney-crosby-is-the-battered-face-of-the-nhls-concussion-failure/

“Depending on the mechanism of injury, ‘slow to get up’ does not trigger mandatory removal,†NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly told USA Today. “The protocol has to be interpreted literally to mandate a removal. ‘Ice’ as compared to ‘boards’ is in there for a reason. It’s the result of a study on our actual experiences over a number of years. ‘Ice’ has been found to be a predictor of concussions — ‘boards’ has not been.â€

***

I would like to see this study. So if I hit my head on the ice or a player hits me in the head the concussion protocol is in place, but if I crash into the boards and hit my head.. it's not .

Right, and how bizarre is that? Or if you fall, trip or get checked into a post or the boards head making first contact then what? Direct shot or deflected puck to the face, temple or head that too doesnt qualify? Meet the standard? See, this has always been the problem with the NHL, hockey at its highest professional level whereby talent is afforded little more respect than entirely dispensable Livestock by some but not all ownership. Its gotten a lot better over the past few decades sure enough, obviously the League fighting a rear guard action of past regimes and a very difficult position to be thrust into, almost indefensible however you see with comments like the above from Daly that they still either dont entirely get it & or are being deliberately disingenuous, obfuscous... and really, what choice do they have in defending what is an indefensible situation & case? The lengths to which they are prepared to go in delaying the inevitable not surprising.

 

[LadyStanley]

http://buffalonews.com/2017/05/12/o...sion-reportedly-sent-icu-medication-reaction/

Okposo had a concussion in April and landed in ICU from reaction to the concussion medication.

Scary.

 

[Llama19]

Comparing Health-Related Policies & Practices in Sports: The NFL and Other Professional Leagues

Most common NHL injuries were head (16.8%), thigh (14%) and knee (13%) - page 87

Source (PDF): https://footballplayershealth.harva...rvard-Comparative-League-Analysis-5.15.17.pdf

 

[LadyStanley]

https://www.theplayerstribune.com/marc-savard-bruins-hell-and-back/

Marc Savard shares his experiences post-concussion

 

[LadyStanley]

http://www.tsn.ca/lawyers-in-nhl-co...ague-teams-to-hand-over-drug-records-1.756489

According to a transcript of a May 12 U.S. Federal Court hearing in Minneapolis, lawyers for plaintiffs in the NHL concussion lawsuit asked the league on April 27 to produce records related to the administration of drugs.
Elaborating on the transcript, a lawyer working with the plaintiffs told TSN that they are pursuing copies of league and team drug policies and protocols, as well as records related to drugs and dosage levels prescribed to individual players. The lawyer said if the plaintiffs are able to obtain specific player records, identifying information would have to be redacted before they could be used in court.

Of course the league doesn't wanna.