Speculation: Tavares Tells Toronto, "I'm YOUR Huckleberry Now". Fans leaguewide mourn.

[Michael Scarn]

What Blues reclamation project has turned out lately? And no Schenn isn’t a reclamation project.

I think reclamation project is a bit of a stretch with Galchenyuk.
Age 20: 20g 26a 46p
Age 21: 30g 26a 56p
Age 22: 17g 27a 44p. But he only played in 61 games last year.

He’s just 23 and this is is his first “down” year. Clearly he’s unhappy and it’s affecting his play. I get your argument of chemistry and the risk it brings. That’s valid. But I think reclamation project is a bit of a stretch.

 

[Dbrownss]

You're talking about spending assets to acquire a player at a higher salary (on a later contract) than what they can do with just a little bit of patience internally with one of the several promising young forwards that are on the cusp. It nullifies some of the salary cap benefit of having guys on ELC. And it is a gamble in terms of team chemistry. All I'm saying is that this board throws out trade proposals like candy, and a real GM would need to have a very strong reason to pull the trigger on something like that. We've seen multiple examples in recent history of things not panning out. We should ignore that when discussing acquiring talented players?

At no point have i indicated this is a must. Ive said that it would be a situation you look into. Trust the scouts and watch tape on the kid. What attributed to his old success and why is he failing now. Is it missue, or what? Ive watched some of him lately, by no means have I shift to shift watched him though. I dont understand why he's struggling this much. If I we're DA, I'd task the scouts to put together a report on him and go from there. No way would I send a top asset unless Montreal at some of that contract. Because thats a big hold up for me. He's young so its not like we'r coughing up futures for an aging vet. He can just as easily fit into the core.


So to sum it up from my perspective.

Do some scouting on him, and if he's a viable option....proceed to fleece Bergevin

 

[Brian39]

What Blues reclamation project has turned out lately? And no Schenn isn’t a reclamation project.

If Schenn isn't a reclamation project than I'm not sure Galchenyuk is either. Galchenyuk was on pace for 59 points last year and had 55 the year before. Schenn had 55 last year and 59 the year before. In 14/15, the two players had 46 and 47 points. There wasn't a public animosity between Schenn/Philly like there is in Montreal, but it was pretty clear the Flyers didn't trust Schenn at center and we clearly went into camp hoping we could make him work at center. Schenn is a better defensive player by a long shot, but he is also two and a half years older and wasn't producing offensively nearly as much as Galchenyuk has in his early 20s.

We acquired Schenn clearly hoping that he would be better for us than he was in Philly, but assuming that he wasn't going to get worse. How is that different from Galchenyuk? Outside of this season, Galchenyuk's status was a 45-60 point guy who is terrible defensively. That's a ton closer to Schenn than it is the failed reclamation projects like Yakupov. I'm not sure he is a good fit on the Blues given our LW surplus and his contract, but I think it's disingenuous to say that we have had a bad track record with reclamation projects if that label doesn't apply to Schenn.

If your definition of reclamation project is limited to guys like Yak and Paajarvi, than Galchenyuk shouldn't be included in that group. Those two players were on the cusp of being out of the league based on multiple bad seasons. Galchenyuk might not be the star Montreal thought they drafted, but he's still a long way away from being out of the NHL. Galchenyuk has had a brutal start to the year, but he is currently on pace to have his first sub 40 point pace season (on pace for about 30 points). Yak and Paajarvi each had multiple sub-40 point seasons before getting acquired as a reclamation project. We're talking about a 22 game sample vs 200+ game samples.

 

[Dbrownss]

If there was a trade to he made contingent on the Blues having a talk with Galchenyuk with him being strictly a winger this season....I dont think Armstrong could pry Alex off his leg when trying to leave.


Also I think he can play all 3 forward positions. Id try him with Stastny and Sobota with sliding Steen down with Berglund and some other guy

 

[2 Minute Minor]

I dont' want to get hung up on the vernacular here. I was only using 'reclamation project' as a reply to Dbrownss use of the term. Call it whatever you want.

Its a guy having a disappointing career trying to turn it around. Agreed?

I never got the impression Schenn was viewed that way.

 

[Meatball]

If there was a trade to he made contingent on the Blues having a talk with Galchenyuk with him being strictly a winger this season....I dont think Armstrong could pry Alex off his leg when trying to leave.


Also I think he can play all 3 forward positions. Id try him with Stastny and Sobota with sliding Steen down with Berglund and some other guy

I'd be tempted to run:

Schwartz-Schenn-Tarasenko
Steen-Stastny-Galchenyuk

And then your third line is anchored by Sobotka and Berglund (pretty much any plug in the 3rd line RW would work, Jaskin, Paajarvi, etc.).

Not sure we have what Montreal is looking for, though.

 

[Dbrownss]

I dont' want to get hung up on the vernacular here. I was only using 'reclamation project' as a reply to Dbrownss use of the term. Call it whatever you want.

Its a guy having a disappointing career trying to turn it around. Agreed?

I never got the impression Schenn was viewed that way.

I honestly used it loosely. Im looking to acquire a young player thats trending down and hoping for a bounce back.

 

[Vincenzo Arelliti]

As this is the Tavares thread, I’m going to try and bring it back home by saying that Galchenyuk has to be okay with playing RW for us if Tavares is in the picture. Unless he’s coming cheap and is okay at RW, getting Galchenyuk will be the end of this thread’s speculation.

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

Simmond's next contract was one of the factors why Philly wanted to shed Schenn's contract. Wayne is as much of a core player in Philly as anyone else. They will make every possible effort to resign him. If he decides to hit the open market and Blues have Tavares locked up, I don't see how they will have the space to get Wayne as well.

Not to criticize your opinion, but Philly has a boatload of cap space when Simmonds is due his raise and it had no bearing on schenn trade what so ever. However it's true that with current management in place looking at Simmonds is a pipe dream. Also Simmonds isn't cerebral player per se, but scores mostly due to his skill. Banging the bodies and intangibles are just extras that would drive his value crazy high once chiarellis and burkes of the world would find out he is available.

Also I very much dislike nyquist, always given pp time and spot in Zetterberg line, who drives play like crazy at es. Overall nyquist is perimeter guy who barely moves a needle in post season.

 

[Stealth JD]

Isles don't look to be sellers, since they're actually relatively decent this season. The only chance of Tavares being traded is if the club senses that he could walk at year-end and that the franchise couldn't afford to let that happen. If Snow doesn't feel good about his chances of signing Tavares, does he take the best package that he can get, or instead will he head down the path towards Yzerman/Stamkos situation, or rather a Armstrong/Backes situation?

Isn't there a December 1 deadline for re-signing your own pending UFA, otherwise you cannot do so until June? All of this drama could come to a sudden end if the Isles announce an arena-plan and the extension of the Captain in the next day and a half. (not that I'd expect that)

Edit: December 1 date only refers to Group 2 free agents.

 

[Brian39]

Isles don't look to be sellers, since they're actually relatively decent this season. The only chance of Tavares being traded is if the club senses that he could walk at year-end and that the franchise couldn't afford to let that happen. If Snow doesn't feel good about his chances of signing Tavares, does he take the best package that he can get, or instead will he head down the path towards Yzerman/Stamkos situation, or rather a Armstrong/Backes situation?

Isn't there a December 1 deadline for re-signing your own pending UFA, otherwise you cannot do so until June? All of this drama could come to a sudden end if the Isles announce an arena-plan and the extension of the Captain in the next day and a half. (not that I'd expect that)

Edit: December 1 date only refers to Group 2 free agents.

That would be a hell of a gamble with Tavares. Yzerman had the huge luxury of Kucherov /Hedman as secondary franchise guys and a cap situation he could point to in order to justify not overpaying. What can the Isles point to if they are unable to sign Tavares? There was a bakcup plan if Stamkos left. There was still a good group there to build around. Same thing here with Backes. We had a good group and a cap structure that justified a firm monetary cutoff for Backes. That doesn't really exist with Tavares. Who on that roster can Snow point at to justify drawing a financial line in the sand with Tavares?

I think everyone knows that if tavares is gone, it is purely his choice and not because the team felt that refusing to match X demand was better for the long term health of the franchise. Given that, I just don't see how they can lose him for nothing. I know that they are playing very well right now, but does anyone think that their roster is a true contender? Best case scenario, does anyone give them more than a 10% chance of winning the Cup this year if they keep Tavares? I just don't see how they justify the risk of losing him for nothing with those kinds of odds.

 

[stl76]

( ? )

 

[Stealth JD]

( ? )

It's a real discussion that the Isles brass is going to have to have. It's an understatement to call it a huge gamble for Garth Snow and the Islanders to hang onto an unsigned franchise player past the trade-deadline, if there's a realistic chance of Tavares walking for nothing. It's definitely worthy of a discussion, regardless of whether Tavares ultimately comes here or not. That itself has nothing to do with Blues fans hoping for him to become available. But the skeleton is still funny, yes...even on the 300th time it's been posted.

 

[stl76]

It's a real discussion that the Isles brass is going to have to have. It's an understatement to call it a huge gamble for Garth Snow and the Islanders to hang onto an unsigned franchise player past the trade-deadline, if there's a realistic chance of Tavares walking for nothing. It's definitely worthy of a discussion, regardless of whether Tavares ultimately comes here or not. That itself has nothing to do with Blues fans hoping for him to become available. But the skeleton is still funny, yes...even on the 300th time it's been posted.

I think the pic is humorous and haven't seen it posted before, but oh well.

I thought Snow was in the record saying the Islanders would not trade Tavares at the TDL no matter what their record/season looks like? Now that I'm looking for the report, can't locate it, but I could've sworn Snow has been quoted as saying he will not trade Tavares at the TDL. Regardless, what's the gamble for Snow if Tavares walks for nothing? Realistically, if Tavares leaves, Snow is gone as GM. Even if he got a pretty good return in a trade, I really doubt Snow would keep his job.

There's nothing wrong with wanting to discuss the possibility of Tavares coming to Saint Louis. But part of that discussion ought to be the fact that there is little if any chance of it actually happening. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Majorityof1]

There's nothing wrong with wanting to discuss the possibility of Tavares coming to Saint Louis. But part of that discussion ought to be the fact that there is little if any chance of it actually happening. Just my 2 cents.

Of the 390 posts in this thread, I'd say at least 75-100 were people pointing out the unlikeliness of Tavares coming here, or someone else acknowledging the unlikeliness they brought up. Do we need to put it in the thread title? Or maybe put the standard small print disclaimer in every post in this thread. Here, as a public service, I will write one up for everyone to use.

*****DISCLAIMER: The opinions represented in this post are those of the poster alone. They do not represent the opinions of HF Boards, the Blues forum, Midwesterners, residents of the city of St. Louis or any other group or entity named or unnamed. The poster acknowledges that the chances of Tavares being traded are slim, and landing on the Blues even slimmer. This is wishful thinking on the part of the poster and in no way constitutes a prediction of the likelihood of an event actually occurring. If you are offended by speculation on such an unlikely event, understand that is the exact nature of this thread and you have the ability to not read a thread that specifically outlines an area of discussion you may not enjoy. Enacting these measures is simple. DO NOT CLICK ON THE THREAD LINK. Follow that one step and you will no longer be subjected to "baseless speculation", "fantasy", "wishful thinking" or any other reductive term you would otherwise use in a useless post to belittle those who want to discuss said topic. If you accidentally broke that one rule and find yourself here through no fault of your own, take a deep breath. Before you point out for the 101st time the unlikeliness of Tavares becoming a Blue, follow this corollary rule: PRess the back button on the browser and leave the thread. This rule even has a handy acronym GTFO for ease of remembrance. We understand memory is difficult as you obviously forgot the probably not the first time you have pointed out the unlikeliness of Tavares becoming a Blue. Thank you in advance for your attention and adherence to these rules.********************

Tid bit from JR's Q&A over on The Athletic:

<Redacted: Quote from article discussing unlikeliness of Tavares coming to St.Louis]

Readers: What happens to the Blues' lines when Alexander...

I think it's funny that this has become something of a hot-button issue. Nothing wrong with discussing the possibility of Tavares landing in StL, and I am not trying to dissuade anyone from talking about it...just think it's worth noting that, according to every available source (reliable and otherwise) it's very VERY unlikely to happen.

Not trying to pick on you in particular Stl76, but you can see why it gets old rehashing the same argument when almost everybody has admitted it is unlikely to happen.

 

[Michael Scarn]

There's nothing wrong with wanting to discuss the possibility of Tavares coming to Saint Louis. But part of that discussion ought to be the fact that there is little if any chance of it actually happening. Just my 2 cents.

Bingo. I’d give the blues about a 1% chance. He’s looking at probably $11 mil a year for about 8 years, and that’s before a potential cap increase. As much as I’d love to see it, it’s not realistic

 

[Meatball]

At this point, getting him is a luxury, all things considered.

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

Bingo. I’d give the blues about a 1% chance. He’s looking at probably $11 mil a year for about 8 years, and that’s before a potential cap increase. As much as I’d love to see it, it’s not realistic

Still not as laughable as buttons idea about Tavares to toronto. All the pandering to leafs fanbase, no wonder they are so insufferable.

 

[Xerloris]

If he becomes available I think we have a great shot but I highly doubt the chance ever occurs.

 

[Brian39]

Bingo. I’d give the blues about a 1% chance. He’s looking at probably $11 mil a year for about 8 years, and that’s before a potential cap increase. As much as I’d love to see it, it’s not realistic

I'd put it higher than 1%. I'd say there is about a 75% chance that he remains an Islander. Of the remaining 25%, I think we are one of the top 5-10 most likely destinations. I'd probably ballpark it somewhere in the 5% range. I'd for sure throw down $5 with 20:1 odds that we land Tavares.

 

[Vincenzo Arelliti]

I’ve already made the points that link STL to being at least a top 3 destination for Tavares if he leaves NYI, so I won’t rehash it. I find it comical though that just saying “it’s not likely” is apparently more than just an empty opinion and is somehow fact. Looking at cap, surrounding cast, yada yada yada, I don’t see how there is a strong argument that he would more likely want to sign elsewhere, let alone an apparent ‘public knowledge’ that needs no citation.

 

[BleedBlue14]

I'd put it higher than 1%. I'd say there is about a 75% chance that he remains an Islander. Of the remaining 25%, I think we are one of the top 5-10 most likely destinations. I'd probably ballpark it somewhere in the 5% range. I'd for sure throw down $5 with 20:1 odds that we land Tavares.

Agreed I'm pretty positive the pipe dream is all predicated on the Isles ****ing around finding a new home. If they can't find a permanent place that tavares likes I think our chances are just as good if not better than anyone else's. We can make the cap work and that is something you do for a player of that caliber.

 

[Brian39]

I’ve already made the points that link STL to being at least a top 3 destination for Tavares if he leaves NYI, so I won’t rehash it. I find it comical though that just saying “it’s not likely” is apparently more than just an empty opinion and is somehow fact. Looking at cap, surrounding cast, yada yada yada, I don’t see how there is a strong argument that he would more likely want to sign elsewhere, let alone an apparent ‘public knowledge’ that needs no citation.

If it is a pure hockey decision than the Blues odds are great. However, none of us know exactly what Tavares wants off the ice. Shatty's desire to play for the Rangers was the worst kept secret in hockey, but I think most players have similar ties/attachments to certain teams or markets. Tavares very likely has a team/city or two in mind that could lure him away from a better on ice situation. The question would simply be how much money and on ice fit he is willing to sacrifice to play in the city he wants to be in.

I'm not trying to discredit your post. I agree with you completely. It is silly for any of us to treat any outcome as fact in this situation, because none of us know Tavares.

 

[Majorityof1]

I'm not trying to discredit your post. I agree with you completely. It is silly for any of us to treat any outcome as fact in this situation, because none of us know Tavares.

Except that one guy whose sources told him that Tavares had his back-up choices picked already (without ever talking to a single team) yet wouldn't tell us the teams or how the sources knew or really anything at all except he had unquestionable sources. So who am I to question (he asks in a question)?

 

[stl76]

Not trying to pick on you in particular Stl76, but you can see why it gets old rehashing the same argument when almost everybody has admitted it is unlikely to happen.

You're welcome to pick on me in particular, I probably deserve it after re-hashing Ranksu's jokes. Still think the skeleton pics are funny, but clearly my post was redundant.