The Cory Schneider Trade Revisited

[Lindys Lazy Eye]

Seeing the recent play of Bo Horvat for the Canucks has made me consider this topic more and more. Did the Devils do the right thing by trading for Schneider?

You can say "well, Cory Schneider has been playing wonderfully for the Devils" and that is certainly true. However, Horvat has been unworldly for the Canucks and while I personally see it as a wash of a trade, I think there were some pros and cons here.


PRO: The Devils most likely draft Horvat, Nish or Domi and Marty to STL never happens. We get a top center/forward, Marty retires as a Devil and we either transition to Kinkaid who has been holding his own so far or sign a goaltender like Ryan Miller. Also having Marty would of probably gained us some top draft picks for the pro-tankers and he probably ends up at 700 wins as well.


CON: We have no way in ever knowing if Kinkaid as starter would be any less than a giant bust, much less if the Devils would of drafted Horvat, Domi or Nish. If they went off the board and the trade NEVER happened? We could of been set back for ages.

Barring the results of the potential Kinkaid experiment, I could have seen a situation where the Devils could of signed Niemi in this coming offseason or another goalie (such as Ryan Miller) earlier on.

There are a lot of variables with not trading for Cory though. I'm not saying we didn't make the right call, but the "what ifs" are interesting. We would of probably been more in the McEchiel race if we took Domi or Horvat, I would imagine and having one of those two plus a def top 5 pick would of solved the forward prospect issue.

We all talk about "heinsight" or "what ifs" but I think this certainly a fun one to look over. What does everyone think of the Schneider trade looking back? Do you think the Devils made the better choice for their club by trading the pick away for Cory? Do they get better in the long run by NOT doing so?

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[Mad Brills*]

both teams did well. Only part that was bad was the gillis screw up of the luongo situation.

 

[Lindys Lazy Eye]

both teams did well. Only part that was bad was the gillis screw up of the luongo situation.

I think if Gillis kept Luongo and went with Luongo/Lack going forward then he would of kept his job. There was no reason to trade both. However, Luongo was the one that was meant to be traded because of the salary hit he has.

I can't get out of my mind though that if the Devils take Horvat or Domi, that they are in the running for McEchiel or at the very least Marner/Strome. The team could be 4 points out of the playoffs if they win tonight so they are very well not tanking anytime soon, and with the lack of forward depth that would of been a wonderful outcome.

However, as I said, who knows what Lou does if he doesn't trade the pick. He could of picked ****ing Fucale for all we know.

 

[Soundgarden]

They got a young starting goalie who hasn't hit his prime. That's a major building block a lot of teams neglect when they are starting a rebuild. I don't think they made the wrong choice even if Vancouver got a good player, I think it furthers their team more than it hinders it.

 

[Viktri]

Horvat has been great and a treat to watch but so was Cory when he broke into the league.

This trade was basically: good young goalie for potentially good young forward. The Canucks took the risk that the pick would pan out and Devils went with a more conservative view (the proven player). Even at the time that the trade was made, the goal market was what it is now - fairly saturated. So as a fan you can regret the trade but I think as a hockey executive this is a trade with no surprises - both teams knew what they were giving up and getting. Sometimes the conservative pick done early, which gives the team a solid foundation, is a precursor to more risky plays down the line.

 

[Ishdul]

In any of his seasons where he's played more than a few games, Schneider's save percentages have been .929, .937, .927, .921 and now .926. His current season features him doing it while taking the highest workload in the league for a team that doesn't have much else going for it besides him. He has a career .926 save percentage, which even in this age of record high save percentages is a nutso number. Obviously he's still early into his career and the progression of goalies is unpredictable but he looks like an all-time great so far.

I think New Jersey won it handily and Horvat would have to bulldoze expectations for it to equalize.

 

[IComeInPeace]

Good trade for both teams.

I know it's not a popular opinion, but Gillis did the right thing in moving Louie, even after Schneider had already been moved.

The biggest mistake the Nucks organization has made in recent years involving our goaltending didn't involve either of the Schneider or Luongo trades...it was signing Miller for 3 years at $6mill.

I like Miller, but that contract was questionable.

NJ is set in goal for the foreseeable future.
The Canucks have their next team Captain and team leader for the foreseeable future.

 

[RandV]

I think if Gillis kept Luongo and went with Luongo/Lack going forward then he would of kept his job. There was no reason to trade both. However, Luongo was the one that was meant to be traded because of the salary hit he has.

I can't get out of my mind though that if the Devils take Horvat or Domi, that they are in the running for McEchiel or at the very least Marner/Strome. The team could be 4 points out of the playoffs if they win tonight so they are very well not tanking anytime soon, and with the lack of forward depth that would of been a wonderful outcome.

However, as I said, who knows what Lou does if he doesn't trade the pick. He could of picked ****ing Fucale for all we know.

How do you figure that? Keeping Luongo wasn't going to get the Canucks in the playoffs that season, and from a public view Gillis was primarily fired as a bait & switch tactic to appease season ticket holders when the renewal rates weren't looking good. A secondary reason for the firing could be that the working relationship between Gillis and ownership went sour, as there was a good bit of smoke about who actually hired Tortorella and that 'the family' vetoed a Kesler trade to Anaheim.

And it's funny about your latter point about what if the Devils never traded for Schneider, as while I love Luongo I sometimes wonder the same thing here. Great trade by Nonis, but in hindsight considering Schneider was just a couple seasons away. Well that's sort of my opinion to, I've always thought Schneider's development time was needlessly dragged out with Luongo in the way.

 

[sr edler]

As a Cory fan I'm happy he's got a team now where he's the go to guy, so he can play regularly for a change. It would have been ridiculous if the Devils kept Brodeur for one more year, with granted interchangeable starts. It kind of sucks for him though that the team is so inept offensively. If he would drag that team to the playoffs, which wont happen, it would be more than Hart worthy.

Schneider is a top 5 goalie in the league.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

do people really actually believe gillis bungled the luongo situation?

almost no one was willing to take on luongo's long contract after the cap recapture rule came into effect, and the one rumoured suitor (toronto) was only wiling to give garbage. and there's another rumour that luongo was asked during trade negotiations and he said he'd refuse to waive his NMC to go to toronto anyway. so what is gillis supposed to do?

all along, luongo was set on florida. his wife had moved back there and hadn't lived in vancouver since year one or two. his kids were there. until florida was sold in fall of 2013, there was no possible luongo trade. at that point, schneider was already gone.

so gillis keeps luongo and rolls with him and lack, because he has no starting goalie otherwise. until the coach gillis didn't want, that ownership hired and forced on him, didn't dress luongo for the outdoor game and luongo pulls a patrick roy.

i think gillis blinked a few times where he could have been more patient: maybe you keep schneider and wait for the florida sale (which obviously wasn't certain to produce an ownership group willing to spend), maybe you don't trade luongo immediately and wait for florida to up its offer in the off-season (perhaps even less certain than an agreeable florida sale). but you have to understand the very unique situation gillis was dealing with.


all that said, schneider is a top 5 goalie in the world. bo horvat has been wonderful and i love the kid, but cory schneider is a top 5 goalie in the world. horvat would have to become jonathan toews (i.e., way way above his ceiling) for it to have been a bad trade for the devils. but i tend to think gillis did the best he could given the circumstances.

 

[Hobnobs]

I think if Gillis kept Luongo and went with Luongo/Lack going forward then he would of kept his job. There was no reason to trade both. However, Luongo was the one that was meant to be traded because of the salary hit he has.

I can't get out of my mind though that if the Devils take Horvat or Domi, that they are in the running for McEchiel or at the very least Marner/Strome. The team could be 4 points out of the playoffs if they win tonight so they are very well not tanking anytime soon, and with the lack of forward depth that would of been a wonderful outcome.

However, as I said, who knows what Lou does if he doesn't trade the pick. He could of picked ****ing Fucale for all we know.

I rather have done the Schneider trade. You got that goalie you need for a rebuild and avoided a "Oilers"-situation.

 

[Burner Account]

The Devils make that trade every time simply because it guaranteed them a quality starting goaltender for 2014/15. No telling who their starter would be if they didn't.

He's faced more shots than any goaltender in the league this year. There's definitely room for improvement in his save percentage, but with someone less talented in net the Devils are probably level with Buffalo and Carolina.

 

[Brooklanders*]

I think the Devils won the trade but not by much. Thing is goalie is the least position of need.

Guys like Cory aren't easily available but I wouldn't call him elite either. I think he's better than Miller but not by a lot and yes the Devuls could have signed Miller themselves.
Now this is the problem with the trade. Goalies are replaceable. Many interchangeable. And Cory is a top 10 one but gets paid that way also.
The Devils are rebuilding. Having a top 10 + guy hurts your tank meter.

 

[Hockeyville USA]

Apparently, the Canucks were close to trading Schneider to the Oilers and wanted the 7th overall pick, a 2nd, and a good young player. IIRC, it didn't happen due to not being able to agree on the package going back to Vancouver and the Canucks preferred to not trade him within the division.

If Schneider is on the Oilers in 2013-14 and 2014-15, there's a damn good chance they finish significantly higher in the standings and don't get Draisaitl and McDavid. I love the butterfly effect

 

[Neutrinos]

I disagree it was a win-win deal for both teams

It was intended to be a win-now deal for New Jersey, but Schneider played just 4 playoff games for the Devils

 

[Hockeyville USA]

I disagree it was a win-win deal for both teams

It was intended to be a win-now deal for New Jersey, but Schneider played just 4 playoff games for the Devils

The Devils hadn't drafted well in awhile at that point and were on the precipice of falling off a cliff as a team. The 2012 Cup Final run, the overration of Adam Larsson, and need to keep going for it as they couldn't tank in 2013-14 due to the Kovalchuk contract penalty forced the Devils into the Schneider trade. Once Parise left, it was always going to be tougher to be a playoff team.