Stamkos Yay or Nay - Pro and Cons ??

[piikerr]

But maybe Stamkos would like to be a rental player on a good team? Make a run at the cup for a year and then sign wherever he wants with no obligation? Teams could get stammer at a discount as he won't resign, and tampa lets him go easier as it could be that or nothing if he has no intention to sign.

Stammer goes to a team like the islanders and makes a good playoff run, with no obligation to resign on either part? Tampa lets him go for cheapish as he tells them he will not resign. Islanders get an excellent player to make a run, and stamkos moves on his own way after? I could see that playing a part if he doesn't intend to resign in tampa.

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[Kurisu]

I'm just gonna say that if Lou, Shanny, Dubas, Babcock think Stamkos fits the big picture and can be a piece that helps them towards cup contention in the future, they're attempt to sign him. I don't see the benefit of throwing Marner and Nylander in the wolves and putting them in positions to fail.

 

[thewave]

I'm just gonna say that if Lou, Shanny, Dubas, Babcock think Stamkos fits the big picture and can be a piece that helps them towards cup contention in the future, they're attempt to sign him. I don't see the benefit of throwing Marner and Nylander in the wolves and putting them in positions to fail.

It looks highly unlikely you could possibly put either of those players into a position to fail.

 

[Mess]

But maybe Stamkos would like to be a rental player on a good team? Make a run at the cup for a year and then sign wherever he wants with no obligation? Teams could get stammer at a discount as he won't resign, and tampa lets him go easier as it could be that or nothing if he has no intention to sign.

Stammer goes to a team like the islanders and makes a good playoff run, with no obligation to resign on either part? Tampa lets him go for cheapish as he tells them he will not resign. Islanders get an excellent player to make a run, and stamkos moves on his own way after? I could see that playing a part if he doesn't intend to resign in tampa.

There is actually a gigantic loophole in the CBA.

The best thing Stamkos (or any star player on expiring contract) could do is agree to waive his NTC to allow his team to get the greatest return at the TD and then re-sign with TB his original team.

This allows a star player to help build up his own team and his support system.

 

[TheRexman]

What if Lou, Shanahan and Babcock decide they don't want Stamkos? Is that going to change peoples opinions of the management team?

 

[WTFMAN99]

What if Lou, Shanahan and Babcock decide they don't want Stamkos? Is that going to change peoples opinions of the management team?

Not really to be honest. I can see different viewpoints on this, they may think they are too early into the rebuild to sign him.

 

[Stephen]

It's not exactly the same no, but it could ultimately end up being that. Like that's my thing. We're hoping Nylander, Marner and company all hit. But my thing is what if they all don't hit? Like again, Stephen goes on about things running like a train schedule, but from what I've seen - most "not sucking anymore more." plans take about 2 ELC cycles, on an average. Chicago took 10, Florida is 13 and counting, LA was roughly 7-9 years.

So in my head.
We sign Stamkos. and then we have an uber talented, goal scorer (forget everything else that people brought up for a moment, his WOWY, or how he does in the playoffs, or that Marty made him better, all of that). just the fact. that we have a Centre/Winger of Stamkos calibre.

And 1/2 a team that we still need to remove, another 1/2 we should really be upgrading.

year one, we're dealing with a minimum of five rookies, and even though Stamkos can shelter them and it's not "here, welcome to Toronto, be amazing, Marner/Nylander" people are making it sound like it will just work.

It . might. not. Not right away. maybe not ever.

And we're going to assume that the reason why we got Stamkos (because it's not for his defensive prowess, or anything else) is his offense-ive capabilities, which could take a dip here.

Now. to be fair. I trust the Shanagement a lot, and I think regardless of what they do/don't do will be for the betterment of this team. So if they DO get Stamkos - that will be fine, but I just have this thing it's entering the same situation. 26 is not 33 no matter how people want to spin this around. We'll be wasting soo many of his prime years if this doesn't all come together as fast as we see it.

And we have a star player who can't do anything, and we can't do anything because he's taking up 1/4 of our cap. It just makes me itchy.

The rebuild didn't start in 2015.

We have youngish pieces dating back to about 2007-2008, which is JVR, Gardiner, Kadri era, plus the second ELC that Rielly is on, plus the fresh batch of Marner and Nylander and Kapanen and the 2016 firsts that are primed to be big building blocks.

 

[Mess]

What if Lou, Shanahan and Babcock decide they don't want Stamkos? Is that going to change peoples opinions of the management team?

Leafs management has put themselves in an ideal situation here.

If they don't go after Stamkos they can simply sell Leaf Nation on what they have been preaching of patience and no shortcuts and stay true to their word from the start. If some fans don't like it they can show how past shortcuts didn't work and are not prepared to repeat past mistakes and go down that road again.

If they do go after Stamkos and sign him he is an easy sell to the public as a star player and still say they plan on continuing to draft and develop as planned but owe it to Leaf Nation to put the best product on the ice they can. Stamkos simply too good to turn away if he wants to play for the Leafs.

Its a no lose situation for management.

 

[MSG*]

Why Steven Stamkos will likely bolt from the Tampa Bay Lightning

By James Mirtle

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/hockey/why-steven-stamkos-will-likely-bolt-from-the-tampa-bay-lightning/article27741879/?cmpid=rss1&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Mirtle and Stiegal are not trustworthy. Their jobs are predicated on the Leafs. It's impossible to listen.

 

[Daisy Jane]

The rebuild didn't start in 2015.

We have youngish pieces dating back to about 2007-2008, which is JVR, Gardiner, Kadri era, plus the second ELC that Rielly is on, plus the fresh batch of Marner and Nylander and Kapanen and the 2016 firsts that are primed to be big building blocks.

oh my god. that's not what I'm saying.
they are PRIMED to be.

but they can also NOT be.

that's the point. Do you not think Chicago thought way back when they drafted Cam Barker & Jack Skille, that they had primed big building blocks? It doesn't matter if it started from 2007 or tomorrow. the thing is is that it could take longer than you account it for.

Even if you look at when Towes/Kane were drafted - it still took them five years (Towes) before the won the cup.


but whatever. it doesn't really matter, truly. We'll see what happens.

 

[Drew75]

Are you saying Yzerman is potentially facing a Muskoka 5 scenario like the Leafs faced in the past when star player refuses to waive a no trade to help his team?

Maybe Stamkos doesn't want to be a rental player and since he has full control he could certainly force TB in getting nothing when he leaves.

He could - so I'm wondering how people would feel if he did that?

I know it's completely in his right to do so - but after the sour taste the Muskoka 5 left me, I'm not sure how I'd feel about him if he did that to Tampa.

I don't think he should lie about his desire to test the market - and yes, that may hurt his value slightly, and I don't see him accepting a deal to a place like Edmonton - but I'm of the old school who wants my star players to be good, loyal, team players with passion for the game. He's had a good run in Tampa, and I'd like to see him work with them to ensure they get something back for him rather than screwing them (which he could) and walking away for nothing.

 

[masarume]

Has a player of Stamkos' impact ever agreed to waive their NTC only to resign with the original team?

Please leave all Winnik jokes aside.

 

[Daisy Jane]

He could - so I'm wondering how people would feel if he did that?

I know it's completely in his right to do so - but after the sour taste the Muskoka 5 left me, I'm not sure how I'd feel about him if he did that to Tampa.

I don't think he should lie about his desire to test the market - and yes, that may hurt his value slightly, and I don't see him accepting a deal to a place like Edmonton - but I'm of the old school who wants my star players to be good, loyal, team players with passion for the game. He's had a good run in Tampa, and I'd like to see him work with them to ensure they get something back for him rather than screwing them (which he could) and walking away for nothing.

he's earned the right to his NMC, and he's earned the right not to waive it. he doesn't HAVE to to make life easier for the organization. Yzerman had up until 11:59, June 30th to make a move to guarantee him some assets. Didn't. (for obvious reasons)

It's not his job to create a parting gift package.

 

[Stand Witness]

Has a player of Stamkos' impact ever agreed to waive their NTC only to resign with the original team?

Please leave all Winnik jokes aside.

Antoine Vermette last season.

 

[Joey Hoser]

Has a player of Stamkos' impact ever agreed to waive their NTC only to resign with the original team?

Please leave all Winnik jokes aside.

I think Doug Weight, or Tkachuk, or Guerin, or some now-retired American did it a few times. Cant exactly remember who it was. That'd be the closest I think.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Antoine Vermette last season.

Keith Tkachuk?

 

[Stephen]

oh my god. that's not what I'm saying.
they are PRIMED to be.

but they can also NOT be.

that's the point. Do you not think Chicago thought way back when they drafted Cam Barker & Jack Skille, that they had primed big building blocks? It doesn't matter if it started from 2007 or tomorrow. the thing is is that it could take longer than you account it for.

Even if you look at when Towes/Kane were drafted - it still took them five years (Towes) before the won the cup.


but whatever. it doesn't really matter, truly. We'll see what happens.

Actually, when Chicago drafted Kane, Kane made the NHL that same year and they won a cup within the duration of his ELC.

During the Hawks lean years, they continually spent big money on free agents, including Khabibulin to reinforce their goaltending, Martin Havlat to give them scoring punch, and eventually, Marian Hossa the year they won a cup.

If Marner and Nylander both bust, *knock on wood, why will it even matter if we have Stamkos? We won't have to worry about paying the kids at that point.

 

[ACC1224]

Here is a curious thought.

If Stamkos knows he is going to test the market, how do you feel if he then prevents Tampa from moving him at the deadline to get anything for him at all?

I'm not suggesting he should go anywhere, but if he's a good team guy character wise, I'd like to see him at least work with them and try to help them get something if he already knows he's no longer going to resign there.

Just my 2 cents.

Is it "good Team guy character" to leave your Teammates if they are fighting for a playoff spot? Hopefully Stamkos is more like a Sundin and wants to battle it out with his teammates.

 

[AustonMitchWilly]

I think Stammer makes sense. Marner and Willy Nilly dont have to be "The Guy". Brings cup contending experience. A good role model. Etc.

Marner and Nylander will impact the leafs positively next year, and right away. We arent that far away considering we wouldve been on like a 110 point pace (without the games Bernier started).

 

[Mess]

New Stamkos thread continues..

 

[thewave]

Make it a poll. Do you want him yes or no.

 

[ULF_55]

Tampa might be in trouble.

Look at all the RFA's http://stats.nhlnumbers.com/teams/TBL?year=2016

 

[Paradoc]

I would offer him a long term contract if he decides to sign with us, but it all depends on whether the management thinks he's a good fit for the core and have enough to sign Marner, Nylander, Rielly to long term contract.

 

[egd27]

Make it a poll. Do you want him yes or no.

I think the question is at what price range would be ok with the Leafs signing him at.

5-7 Million
7-9 Million
9-11 Million
11+ Million

 

[piikerr]

There is actually a gigantic loophole in the CBA.

The best thing Stamkos (or any star player on expiring contract) could do is agree to waive his NTC to allow his team to get the greatest return at the TD and then re-sign with TB his original team.

This allows a star player to help build up his own team and his support system.

Winnik, Vermette etc..
I think Stamkos' position is more the coaching, and competing with other players more than anything else. He played better when he was the go-to guy.